In her recent book, Black Wave: Saudi Arabia, Iran, and the Forty-Year Rivalry That Unraveled Culture, Religion, and Collective Memory in the Middle East, Emmy-winning journalist and New York Times bestseller Kim Ghattas examines the unraveling of the modern Middle East and why it started with the pivotal year of 1979.

Kim joins Jen to discuss how the relationship between Saudi Arabia and Iran has changed over the last forty years, how it has impacted other states in the region, and how the U.S. killing of Qasem Soleimani may impact regional tensions.

The World Unpacked will return soon with new episodes breaking down the biggest topics in foreign policy. In the meantime, we’ll continue releasing pre-recorded episodes every two weeks. Stay safe and healthy!