Service Design Show

By Service Design ShowBusiness

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Service Design Show episodes

March 30, 2023 The Importance of Career Frameworks in Scaling Service Design / Doug Powell / Episode #172
How do you scale service design from 10 to 100 inside an organization? That’s what you’ll hear in this conversation with Doug Powell.
But first, let me tell you a personal story.
My car was leaking oil. It started with small drips but got worse over time. The idea of having to take the entire engine apart wasn’t something I was looking forward to. So we tried to “solve” the issue by tightening nuts, double-checking every seal, and adding fresh oil.
As you might have guessed, the problem of course didn’t go away. The car still drove, but my driveway was getting messier by the day, and the fact that I knew that I wouldn’t want to take it for a long drive didn’t sit well with me.
So after putting up with the band-aid solutions for a while, it was time to do the unavoidable and take the engine apart. It was messy, it wasn’t cheap, but it had to be done. The good news is that I’m still driving that car today.
Similarly, many organizations have “leaking engines” in the form of career frameworks that have grown organically over time and don’t account for the role of service design.
And before you say that those are just documents HR likes to look at, let’s not underestimate how important these career frameworks are. They determine salaries, promotions, and responsibilities.
So while it’s tempting to keep improvising and avoid the hassle of updating career frameworks, this approach only works for so long. Eventually, you’ll need clarity and structure to scale your team and attract new talent. That’s where Doug comes in.
In our conversation, he shares lessons from standardizing and formalizing design roles, responsibilities, and titles at IBM and Expedia.
You’ll also hear about HR's role in this process and how you can turn this seemingly unsexy task into a design challenge that excites everyone.
Regardless of whether you’re a small or a big team, the insights Doug shares will help you be one step ahead when trying to scale service design… rather than having to fix things when they eventually break down.
For me, this conversation was a good reminder that the success of service design within an organization isn’t so much about knowing how to get the most out of our tools and methods. Instead, it’s about making it part of the organizational operating system.
Enjoy the conversation and keep making a positive impact :)
- Marc
P.S. If you’re open to sharing (parts of) your career framework, I’d love to collaborate and grow the maturity of our practice. Just reach out to me!
--- [ 1. GUIDE ] ---
00:00 Welcome to episode 172
06:00 Rapid fire question round
10:00 Topic of today
12:00 The backstory
19:00 What is a career framework
24:00 Where can we improve
26:30 Partnering with HR
31:00 It's up to us
33:30 Designer career playbook
39:30 Connecting to existing systems
44:30 Things that need fixing
48:15 Being the outsiders
50:15 From 10 to 100
51:30 Sharing knowledge
55:30 Lessons learned
58:15 The opportunity
59:30 How might we
1:01:15 Closing thoughts
--- [ 2. LINKS ] ---
* https://www.linkedin.com/in/douglaspowell330/
* Notes on an Execution (book) - https://amzn.to/3Zt5g0I
* Design Career Frameworks: The Messy Plumbing of Scaled Design Programs (article) - https://go.servicedesignshow.com/mubuc
--- [ 3. CIRCLE ] ---
Join our private community for in-house service design professionals.
https://servicedesignshow.com/circle
1 hr 3 min
March 16, 2023The rise of Service Design at Spotify / Niamh Parsley / Episode #171
I almost can't believe it... Colleagues for the entire org are lining up and asking for service design.
That's what Niamh Parsley said when I asked her about the biggest change that happened in the last two years.
Niamh is the Senior Design Manager at the world's #1 music streaming service, Spotify. When Niamh joined Spotify, only she and one colleague were waving the service design flag. But today, over 50 design professionals across every area of the company are spreading the practice.
How did they do it without hiring an army of service designers?
In this episode, Niamh shares how they grew service design inside Spotify, the challenges they faced, and their goals for the upcoming years.
You'll learn about the critical role of the internal community, the breakthrough caused by the career framework, and surprising tactics that made service design famous.
If you're on a similar journey to grow demand for service design within your organization, you'll definitely want to hear Niamh's insights!
I'm grateful to Niamh for sharing her story with us so openly and providing a peek behind the curtains of a high-profile company that impacts our daily lives.
Enjoy the conversation and keep making a positive impact :)
- Marc
--- [ 1. GUIDE ] ---
00:00 Welcome to episode 171
04:30 Who is Niamh
05:30 Lightning round
07:15 Niamh's journey
12:15 The article
15:30 How is SD organized
18:30 Internal guild
24:30 Career framework
30:15 Challenges
36:00 Impact on staffing
37:30 Biggest win
42:00 What's next
46:15 One piece of advice
47:30 Closing thoughts
--- [ 2. LINKS ] ---
https://www.linkedin.com/in/niamhmp/

https://spotify.design/article/backstage-tickets-to-the-world-of-service-design-at-spotify

Mismatch: How Inclusion Shapes Design (book) - https://amzn.to/42jAWby
--- [ 3. SELLING SERVICE DESIGN WITH CONFIDENCE ] ---
Learn how to get buy-in for service design from your clients, stakeholders and co-workers.
https://servicedesignshow.com/confidence
49 min
March 02, 2023How Rituals Can Transform Your Services / Ted Matthews / Episode #170
I'm sure you know them. Services that made you smile, made you feel special, made you feel... human. Unlike the bland and ordinary services that quickly fade from our memory, they are the services that we remember and look forward to.
The secret behind these exceptional services is the emotional connection they create with their users. But creating this emotional connection isn't easy.
Luckily, there's a proven "tool" that can help you do it - rituals.
Think for a moment about the rituals in your life, whether it's your morning coffee or your weekly dinner club. These moments are important to us, big or small. And our lives are filled with these moments.
So, why not design our services with these moments in mind? But how...
In today's episode, we're joined by Ted Matthews, a researcher, and expert in rituals as a tool for service design. Ted believes that rituals offer us the opportunity to design memorable services that make a lasting impact on the lives of our users. In this episode, we explore the power of rituals and how you can leverage them in your design process to create unforgettable experiences.
Whether you're a seasoned service designer or just starting out, seeing the power of rituals is something that you can't unsee. So, let's embrace it as a community and keep making a positive impact.
Thanks for your time, and enjoy the conversation :)
- Marc
--- [ 1. GUIDE ] ---
00:00 Welcome to episode 170
06:00 Who is Ted
08:00 Lightning round
13:00 Rituals as a design material
17:30 Habits, routines, and habits
22:00 Rituals in the context of services
28:00 Crafting experiences
34:30 Designing for the collective
39:00 Extraordinary ordinary experiences
42:30 How much is too much
46:00 Ethical questions
49:30 Is it different
51:30 Most common questions
54:00 Recommended resources
56:00 Closing thoughts
--- [ 2. LINKS ] ---
Ted's PhD (in=depth and difficult) - https://aho.brage.unit.no/aho-xmlui/handle/11250/2758408

Chapter 9 of this book (easier overview but reductive) - http://www.experience-centric.com

Rituals for Work (book) - https://amzn.to/3y7QIbz

Rituals for Virtual Meetings (book) - https://amzn.to/3yksE5L

Ritual design tool kit - https://interactionfoundry.com/rdt

On consumption rituals - https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0195666318302496
--- [ 3. SELLING SERVICE DESIGN WITH CONFIDENCE ] ---
Learn how to get buy-in for service design from your clients, stakeholders and co-workers.
https://servicedesignshow.com/confidence
59 min
February 16, 2023Designing services for EVERYBODY / Sally Halls / Episode #169
Okay, take a guess... Which services are probably the most challenging to design?
I argue that it's the services that your users don't explicitly ask for.
Wait, what?! Who designs services that their users don't ask for? Well, your government does. A lot.
Think of public services like collecting taxes, keeping your street clean, and providing quality education, and helping to alleviate poverty.
These are often the "forgotten" services that are so important in order to maintain the wellbeing of our cities and countries.
It’s one thing to make sure these services are available, but a completely different challenge to improve the experiences of these forgotten services.
Our guest, Sally Halls, has taken on this challenge and is using service design to bridge the gap between citizens and policy-makers.
In this episode, we'll explore how to design services that people haven’t explicitly asked for, how to bring the public's voice into policy-making, and the impact service design professionals can have on the public sector. Sally also shares her experience with service design and how it can be used to benefit the public sector.
The insights from this episode can be used in any sector. If you're dealing with abstract or high-level goals in your work, then you'll surely pick up a few nuggets of wisdom from this conversation.
Enjoy!
- Marc
--- [ 1. GUIDE ] ---
00:00 Welcome to episode 169
06:00 Who is Sally
07:00 60 second rapid fire
09:30 Three types of services
14:30 Preventative service misconceptions
18:30 Specific challenges
23:00 Taking the first step
25:30 How to find fulfillment
28:00 Evidencing services
30:45 What are arms length services
35:00 Is this still our work
37:45 What is the most difficult
40:15 Mistakes and pitfalls
44:30 What do you wish you had known
46:30 Recommended resources
47:15 Closing thoughts
--- [ 2. LINKS ] ---
https://www.linkedin.com/in/sally-halls-a3715417/

https://publicpolicydesign.blog.gov.uk

https://openpolicy.blog.gov.uk/category/skills-tools-and-techniques/

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/open-policy-making-toolkit
--- [ 3. BOOKS ] ---
Hello World by Hannah Fry - https://amzn.to/3EcDZYH

How to Make Sense of Any Mess by Abby Covert - https://amzn.to/3IqWI5k

Why We Get the Wrong Politicians by Isabel Hardman - https://amzn.to/3XzLwYt

Good Strategy Bad Strategy by Richard P. Rumelt - https://amzn.to/3RZRZKZ
--- [ 4. SELLING SERVICE DESIGN WITH CONFIDENCE ] ---
Learn how to get buy-in for service design from your clients, stakeholders and co-workers!
https://www.servicedesignshow.com/confidence
51 min
February 09, 2023How to get buy-in for service design? From your clients, stakeholders and colleagues.
What is the secret... How do you get non-designers to appreciate the value of service design?
It’s also a question that keeps coming back over and over again. And I get it.
Clients hold budgets, internal stakeholders have decision-making power, and you need your colleagues to pull projects off.
If you don't get these people on board with your work, you risk paying a high price. However, when you know how to play the game well, you increase your chance of doing more meaningful and fulfilling work.
Fortunately, selling service design to those around you isn’t some form of dark magic. It's simply a skill that can be learned and mastered. There are repeatable processes, proven frameworks, and dozens of practical tools to help you.
Helping you get up to speed with all these tools, frameworks, and processes is what the Selling Service Design with Confidence program does.
Recently, a group of service design professionals completed the program, and I invited them to share their key takeaways with you on the Show.
In this episode, you’ll hear how it helped them to:
Position service design in a tech-led environment.

Get clients to invest in user research.

Find clients when you’re just starting out.

Establish your role inside a multinational.

And much more...
This is a great episode for anyone who wants better, more productive conversations with non-designers, whether that’s your clients, stakeholders, or colleagues. It not only makes your work more enjoyable but also helps you to become a more mature professional.
Enjoy, and as always, keep making a positive impact.
- Marc
--- 1. GUIDE ---
00:00 Welcome to the episode
03:30 The graduates
04:30 Caroline (agency)
12:00 Halyna (agency)
21:00 Sapna (freelancer)
29:00 Andy (agency)
39:15 Yulia (founder)
47:00 Daniel (in-house)
55:00 Closing thoughts
--- 2. Selling Service Design with Confidence ---
For more information and instructions on how to apply head over to:
https://servicedesignshow.com/confidence
58 min
February 02, 2023 How to manage 100+ journeys effectively? / Florian Vollmer / Episode #168
Journey Mapping is, without a doubt, one of the most important tools we use. We spend a lot of time and effort to create the most impactful maps we can.
It’s all part of the job:
* Dozens of workshops
* Hours doing user research
* And weeks of sensemaking.
The perfect journey map. Success! But what comes after the map?
Unfortunately, in most cases, it’s used... and then stowed away. The map becomes single-use artifacts, forgotten. Used once, then too difficult to keep updated for when a new design challenge comes along. But it doesn’t have to be that way.
And this brings us to our guest for this week's episode: Florian Vollmer. I dare to say that Florian has cracked the code when it comes to managing journeys on a large scale. How large? His team works with 100+ journey maps and 500+ innovation opportunities globally.
I couldn’t imagine it was possible when I first heard that. But today, Florian not only brings our stowed-away journeys back to life but integrates them with a hundred more. Effectively breaking down silos and fueling collaboration. Avoiding rework and overcoming internal resistance. No easy task. Florian needed to find the connection – something that tech, business, CX, and every other department would embrace.
In this episode, you'll hear how Florian transitioned from journeys as (very useful) single-use artifacts to being the backbone of ongoing CX innovation. We’ll learn about:
- How you can build a repository of journeys even when you don’t get the explicit task to do so.
- What the key criteria are for selecting the right journey management tool?
- And how you need to tweak the service design process when you want to reach 100% journey coverage.
No matter where you are in your service design journey (no pun intended), this conversation has the potential to take it to the next level! I really enjoyed the pragmatism in Florian's stories. Sometimes you need to let go of common practices and just do whatever it takes.
Enjoy the conversation.
- Marc
--- [ 1. GUIDE ] -—
00:00 Welcome to episode 168
03:45 Who is Florian
06:45 Lightning round
09:45 Operating at scale
13:15 What do you manage
14:30 Who is the team
16:00 How did it start
21:00 Finding broader adoption
26:00 Where do you find the time
28:15 What is the brief
31:15 Beyond service designers
34:00 Importance of tools
40:15 Crossing the tipping point
42:45 Simplifying complexity
46:45 Lessons learned
49:00 Taking more time
50:45 Meets sustainability
52:15 Big questions
55:15 Closing thoughts
--- [ 2. LINKS ] ---
* https://www.linkedin.com/in/florianvollmer/
* Thinking in Systems (book) - https://amzn.to/40lcJAB
* DMI article - https://www.dmi.org/page/ADMC2022proceedings (pdf - page 254)
--- [ 3. SELLING SERVICE DESIGN WITH CONFIDENCE ] ---
Get your clients, colleagues, managers and CEOs as excited about service design as you are.
https://servicedesignshow.com/confidence
1 hr
January 26, 2023From journey mapping to journey management / Jochem van der Veer / Episode #167
Journey mapping is reaching its limits. Sure, journey maps and mapping work fine at a small project or team level.
But it quickly breaks down when you want to organize around the journey, at a bigger company scale. In order to do this, you need something that goes beyond mapping. But before we dig into what that is, let's look at why journey mapping breaks down:
Everyone has their way of doing it; there is no standard.

It's hard to get an overview across multiple journeys.

Identifying and prioritizing opportunities is a challenge.

Tracking progress and impact isn't part of the process.

Adoption slows down as most tools aren't made for business users.

And many other things...
Now, this might sound strange, but I think these are good challenges to have.
The fact that these challenges are becoming more pressing is a sign. A sign that the demand for a journey-centric way of working is growing inside companies. Something that we've been hoping and advocating for all these years. So what is the next step...
How do you take your journey mapping game to the next level?
Well, that's what Jochem van der Veer and I explore in this week's episode. As you'll hear, Jochem has a unique close-up view of how companies use journeys inside their business.
Want to help your company organize around the journey, beyond a single project or team? This conversation will get you heading in the right direction.
What I found interesting is that we're seeing the contours of a new business approach and philosophy emerging. Makes me excited!
Enjoy the conversation and keep making a positive impact :)
- Marc
--- [ 1. GUIDE ] ---
00:00 Welcome to episode 167
04:45 Who is Jochem
06:00 Lightning round
08:30 Partnership with TheyDo
12:00 What is Journey Management
13:30 Mapping vs. management
17:15 Journey management stack
19:30 What is the problem
21:00 Product or service-centric
26:15 Maturity levels
32:00 Role of TheyDo
36:15 Governance
38:15 What is the right time
43:00 Journey Management Index
47:45 Closing thoughts
--- [ 2. LINKS ] ---
https://www.linkedin.com/in/jochemvanderveer/

https://www.theydo.com
--- [ 3. JOURNEY MANAGEMENT INDEX ] ---
Assess your journey excellence maturity level. Find opportunities for growth. Benchmark yourself against your colleagues and competitors.
https://www.servicedesignshow.com/index
50 min
January 19, 2023What makes a community of service designers work? #Circle
Imagine that you'd get the opportunity to join an intimate dinner party. A dinner where you're accompanied by some of the brightest people in our field. And where you'd get the chance to explore a thought-provoking topic.
Would you enjoy the evening?
That question was going through my mind when I was thinking about how the Circle community should feel. Now, almost two years after the first "dinner party" at the Circle, it's time to take score. So I sat down with two members of the Circle for a fun and open-hearted conversation.
In this episode, you'll hear:
How spontaneous conversations help you to become a better professional.

What the value is of exploring the unknown-unknown together.

Why Slack channels don't work, and how this community is different.

What the future has in store for the Circle.
I hope that this episode will inspire you to join, grow or maybe even start your own professional community. Because we all should eat more often together :)
- Marc
--- [ 1. GUIDE ] ---
00:00 Welcome to the Show
02:30 Who is Jeannie Fung
03:00 Who is Veronica Vela
05:30 The Circle in 3 words
07:00 What didn't you expect
09:45 How has it evolved
12:30 Most surprising topic
16:45 What do we agree on
19:30 Value of the Circle
23:00 What makes it different
26:30 Debates and disagreements
31:30 Small wins
34:45 What would you have missed
38:00 The Circle in 5 years
--- [ 2. LINKS ] ---
https://www.linkedin.com/in/jeannie-fung-60218682/
https://www.linkedin.com/in/verovela/
--- [ 3. CIRCLE ] ---
Join our alliance of and for in-house service design professionals.
https://servicedesignshow.com/circle
45 min
January 12, 2023How CX governance helps you win / Kirsikka Vaajakallio / Episode #166
I have a family with two small kids who are quickly growing up. The challenge many parents, including me, encountered was... how do we keep our home somewhat clean and tidy.
My initial and naive strategy was to pick up everything left behind. But this strategy breaks down pretty quickly, as you can imagine. So then I tried to distribute the responsibility to everyone in the family. If everyone does their part, it should be a minor task, right? But of course, it didn't take long before I realized everyone had very different interpretations of what "clean and tidy" meant. At this point, it dawned on me that the only way to solve this challenge once and for all was by putting a clear plan in place that everyone would commit to. Yes, I needed a "house-cleaning governance model" just with a better name of course :)
And this brings us nicely to the topic of this week's episode: CX governance. Many CX initiatives start in small pockets of the organizations. This works well in the beginning, as it allows for speed and quick iteration. But at some point, you will have many CX initiatives going on at the same time. And most likely, by then, because of the lack of alignment and coordination, you're wasting a lot of time and resources. The solution is to put a CX governance model in place. But that's easier said than done...
So in this episode, you'll hear the chat I had with Kirsikka Vaajakallio, where we explored questions like:
What is the right time to implement a CX governance model?

What are the key components of a CX governance model?

What makes a CX governance model effective?

And what is the role of a service design professional?
All in all, a very interesting conversation about a highly underrated topic in our field from my perspective.
I know CX governance is probably not the first thing you think of when you wake up in the morning. But after this episode, you'll hopefully see how useful it is to have a common set of rules when you're playing the CX game.
--- [ 1. GUIDE ] ---
00:00 Welcome to episode 166
05:00 Who is Kirsikka
06:15 Lightning round
08:30 What is governance
12:00 How did it start
16:15 When do you need this
19:45 Taking the leap
22:15 Building interest
29:30 Making it tangible
33:00 What needs to be included
35:30 Who owns the initiative
38:15 Long-term success
41:45 Selling the story
46:30 The key question
50:00 Can you start small
52:30 Asking the right questions
55:00 Closing thoughts
--- [ 2. LINKS ] ---
https://www.linkedin.com/in/kirsikka-vaajakallio-6265554/
--- [ 3. CIRCLE ] ---
Join our alliance of and for in-house service design professionals.
https://servicedesignshow.com/circle
58 min
December 22, 2022How listening is the secret to better services / Indi Young / Episode #165
This can transform your business strategy... That's what I thought during my recent conversation with Indi Young. Indi recently published a book titled Time to Listen.
Here's my summary of the book. It teaches you how to design services that are less harmful, more accessible, and in the end, better for business through the "simple" act of listening. Basically, transforming open and honest conversations with your customers into one of your most valuable assets. But if it's that easy, why isn't everyone doing it?
Well, Indi argues that we first need to become better listeners. So what does that mean, and what is the path to get there? Can anyone do it, or is it a natural-born talent? You'll get all the answers in this episode.
By the way, if you fear business stakeholders will disregard qualitative research through listening as subjective and anecdotal, you're in for a surprise!
Enjoy the conversation.
--- [ 1. GUIDE ] ---
00:00 Welcome to episode 165
05:45 Who is Indi
07:00 Lightning round
11:15 Origin of the title
17:15 It's time for listening
20:30 Who is the book for
26:00 What do we need to do
29:45 A concrete example
33:30 The magic of listening
40:00 Why do patterns matter
43:45 Will our patterns differ
50:45 Natural language processing
54:30 Common mistakes
58:45 A shift in vocabulary
1:02:15 Book giveaway contest
1:03:45 Closing thoughts
--- [ 2. LINKS ] ---
https://www.linkedin.com/in/indiyoung/

https://indiyoung.com/books-time-to-listen/

Braiding Sweetgrass (book) - https://amzn.to/3VgPiVB

Mismatch (book) - https://amzn.to/3PIQr72

Just enough research (book) - https://amzn.to/3jjq4sq
--- [ 3. CONTEST ] ---
To enter the contest, head over to the video version of this conversation on YouTube and leave a comment there to answer the question posed in the episode.
https://go.servicedesignshow.com/episode165
--- [ 4. CIRCLE ] ---
Join our alliance of in-house service design professionals.
https://servicedesignshow.com/circle
1 hr 7 min