We brought some very sore legs into this great episode! The main topic was a new study on "Zone 2 Training," which gathered a panel of experts to review what Zone 2 means and why it matters. Our theory is that Zone 2 training is interacting with high-carb fueling to drive some of the performance revolution!

We also talked about a new study on heat training. It shows that heat-induced adaptations and fitness improvements seem to mimic one another, but may come from different sources. Thus, stacking them could lead to outsized benefits!

And get a big plate because there was a buffet of great topics! Other topics: leg soreness from downhill running, a follow-up study on trail supershoes, whether athletes without supershoes will be at a disadvantage on trails, weird heart rate zones, weird blood lactate curves, how athletes can vary from population averages, how we try to embrace pressure, pre-workout carbs, going for it at Western States, uphill treadmill workouts, feel v. metrics in harder workouts, joy in dark forests, and peeing in races.

The hottest soundtrack in the club is going to be made up of the whale songs on this episode. Drop it like it's waaoaoooooooooooaoaoo.

We love you all! HUZZAH!

-David and Megan

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We put on some supershoes for an extra boost for this great episode! A main topic was a question we get a lot: whether high-carb fueling during training is healthy in a broader sense. We not only think it's healthy, we think that the question is best asked another way: how much healthier is fueling your training than the alternative of underfueling? It's true that you probably don't want to be slurping a gel at 3 PM for a snack. But around training, try to fuel the work you're doing.

The big science topic was a new study on trail shoes with carbon plates, which theorizes that they won't be helpful for trail runners. We use the study to talk about the risks of broad conclusions from narrow protocols. It's possible that carbon-plated shoes won't take over trail running in the next decade. But we would bet that they do.

And this one was full of fun topics! Other topics: the pursuit of greatness, a Western States 100 training update, sharing vulnerability, the shoe disqualification at the US 100 Mile Championships, individual variation in training, frequency of racing, filming training videos, Zone 2 guidelines, the debate around stretching, building mental toughness, and setting boundaries.

Like Timothée Chalamet, we're really in pursuit of greatness. Actually, scratch that. We are really in pursuit of not getting sued by energy bar companies.

That will make sense soon. We love you all! HUZZAH!

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We bought stock in baking soda before this record-breaking episode! It was a "No Secrets" Q+A, where we lay it all on the line. This one was so fun!

The first big question was on the deluge of world records set in the last week. Our theory is that compound gains are being harnessed from nutrition, supplements, and shoes that are changing how athletes can train and adapt across all endurance sports. We break down the shifts in training theory, and predict what comes next.

Next was a question about Kilian Jornet’s fasted workout and the theory behind it (and why we don’t recommend it). One fascinating wrinkle is how he took high-dose probiotics before the session. We use that as an excuse to dive into the wild world of probiotics science, where research breakthroughs are happening all the time.

Other Q+A topics: health v. performance, roads v. trails, encouraging a partner to fuel more, heart rate zones, visualization, zone 2 training, and more!

We love you all! Huzzah!

-Megan and David

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Our minds were blown this weekend as more records were annihilated on the trails (at the Black Canyon 100k) and the track (at the Millrose Games)! We talk about The Performance Revolution: what's causing it, what we all can learn, and what comes next. The future is here. And the future is wildly fast!

Next up was a new study on strength training for cyclists! We talked about our evolving feelings on strength training, why we encourage athletes to do squats, and why we think single-leg split squats were created by an evil force who hates our glutes.

Then it was a lot of fun topics mixed with a "No Secrets" Q+A! Topics: Riley Brady and Tara Dower reset what's possible at the Black Canyon 100k, the tough decision calculus of how hard to go out at ultras in the modern era, inspiring stories from Black Canyon, Salomon hires one of the top metabolic and performance researchers, the influence of sodium bicarbonate in recent performances, optimism v. realism, adding small amounts of training consistently, dealing with low motivation, building mental toughness, electrolyte consumption, weighted vets, and lots more!

Quote to remember: "The invention of the ship was also the invention of the shipwreck."

Oops we did it again,

-David and Megan

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We embraced the pressure for 2025 before recording this great episode! A concept we disagree with is that "pressure will break down the mind," referring to saying big, scary goals out loud. Our main idea: pressure is a joyful part of sports. We talk about our long journey to get to this point, and why you should want the ball with time running out, your team down by 2, everyone counting on you. Pressure is fun!

The big science topic was one of the strangest parts of human physiology: the repeated bout effect. Just a single, short exposure to steep downhill running causes massive changes in muscle properties and biomechanics on subsequent sessions, even when those sessions are weeks apart. What's happening? We break down the murky science to bring some clarity for what it means for training.

Then it was a "No Secrets" Q+A! Topics: high-carb fueling for mental performance, anxiety in athletes, talent and "long patience," weekly mileage, our evolving thoughts on ketones, workout structure, going all-in, terrain and form for strides, cereal choices, heat training and family planning, and a whole bunch of off-the-cuff hot takes.

The quote to remember: "talent is long patience."

The quote to forget: "those strings are coming out of WHERE?"

It'll make sense soon.

Pulling strings forever,

-Megan and David

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This episode is one of our all-time favorites, diving into tons of the most important (and most frivolous) topics! As always, it’s in the “no secrets” style, where we lift the curtain and show you what people are thinking at the top end of endurance sports, but might not want to say publicly. Plus, there were so many laughs mixed with serious moments. This one is a JOURNEY.

Topics this week: the “Trial by Miles” video, going to dark places in workouts, dealing with brain “panic” when things are hard, fueling in the cycling peloton, how we are evolving on fueling easy days, Stian Angermund’s important story, compassion in drug testing, speed and the “limits” of genetics, going farther than 100 miles, fueling lower intensity efforts, how coaching and confidence interact, why playing a character is sometimes important in developing confidence, VO2 max workouts for athletes of different levels, the culture of alcohol in endurance sports, ferritin and iron levels, blood testing, the iron supplements we are recommending now, and more.

It’s so much fun to get to be a small part of your journeys. Today's Listener Corner is wildly beautiful, and it means everything to us to know that the podcast might help you navigate hard moments. Remember Mary Oliver’s urging:

“Finally, I saw that worrying had come to nothing / And gave it up. And took my old body / and went out into the morning / and sang.”

Singing off-tune,

-David and Megan

Watch the new video "Let's Shock The World" on David's Western States build: https://youtu.be/FSH68lvEez4?si=rtIAQqJ5rOr49Qlg 

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This episode was so fun, and it wasn’t just the cinnamon rolls we used for carb research. The main topic was a new study that took a cool design and extended the conclusions beyond their reach, theorizing that athletes should reconsider high-carb approaches for peak performance. We outline where we think the conclusions missed the mark. It makes us uncomfortable to disagree in this way, but we think it’s important for the health and performance of all athletes.

Next, we dove back into our comfort zone with a “No Secrets” Q+A on the best topics! Other topics: the Road To Western States video series getting a green-light for a full season, Megan’s first bike workout back, music during runs and races, how to structure the Trial of Miles, fear before big events, monitoring and improving bone density, and our theories on heat training!

And the Pain Cave Party playlist is here to give you some motivation for your winter training! Listen, and remember the wise words: “You know, technically / I'm not even really supposed to be here right now / So F it / Might as well make the most of it.”

We love you all! HUZZAH!

Trying to make the most of it,

-Megan and David

Watch the new video "Let's Shock The World" on David's Western States build: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7vpHk6Qoh_g

Listen to the Pain Cave Party Playlist: https://open.spotify.com/playlist/59OkJ1rJv5z7N1hbGqrmw9?si=qYzGe9VFRB-uxPusL5tk-A 

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We brought so much gratitude to this amazing episode! The main topic was the news announced this weekend: David's Leadville 100 performance won the International Trail Performance of the Year. Yes, tears were shed. To everyone who listens, THANK YOU. In ways that go deeper than words...thank you. We reflect on the training, the journey, how our lives have changed, and what's ahead. Shooters shoot.

Next it was a "No Secrets" Q+A! Topics: why hydration recommendations of "drinking to thirst" are often wrong in races and training, fitness apps, early AM training, when training volume hits a saturation point, what weekly volumes might lead to breakthroughs, how love evolves (or doesn't), recovery runs, AI and energy use, gel flavors, adaptations to long-term heat training, the number of workouts we suggest per week, our frustrations with running media, and Listener Corner.

This community kept us going with love and belief through some dark forests this year. This is OUR award. It would not have been possible if it was just us chasing history. But when we have this team lifting us up? Well, we might just F around and make history.

We love you all! Huzzah!

FAFOing forever,

-David and Megan

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The best moment of our lives happened last week. It's not the baby. It's a social media mention from the GOAT Kilian Jornet. And we brought that celebration energy to this awesome episode!

The main study was on the types of training that leads to faster marathon times, looking at 150,000 datapoints. With findings that overlap with other studies, we can start to outline the most direct way to make running faster (and more fun).

The remainder of the episode was in our classic "No Secrets" Q+A style! Topics: what makes David think that he can compete for the win at Western States, our initial review of the Wahoo Run Treadmill, whether high carb fueling is for everyone (hint: yes, mostly), whether VERY high carb approaches might be the next frontier (hint: we hope not), improving Zone 2, heart rate zones in cross training, incorporating cross training for the first time, structuring recovery intervals on strides, our thoughts on SWAP Media expansion, the beer 2-mile record, and a beautiful Listener Corner message.

We're calling this the "You Brought It On Yourself" episode. Listen for a hilariously honest call-out near the end. We love you all! HUZZAH!

Always bringing it on ourselves,

-Megan and David

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We got some very surprising news before recording this celebration episode! This one has it all: complicated training questions, predictions for the future, and a stunning twist to start the episode (and we were in for a lot more stunning twists after we recorded). 

The questions from podcast listeners were on tons of amazing topics: heart rate drift tests to estimate zone 2, how to pace ultras, why we think 2025 will be the year of a hydration emphasis in endurance performance, the sponsorship landscape, returning to training after layoffs, supershoes, protein intake, strides v. workouts, our thoughts about daily nutrition outside of athletics, running form analysis, progressive overload across training cycles, and our big goals for next year.

Our new baby’s name is Ollie Hope Roche, after Megan’s favorite poet, Mary Oliver (and the high point of the Leadville 100, Hope Pass). Remember, Ollie, what your namesake wrote: “Only if there are angels in your head will you ever, possibly, see one.”

We love you all! HUZZAH!

-Megan, David, Leo, and Ollie

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