Sugar Calling

Cheryl Strayed talks with the poet Joy Harjo about beauty, prophecies and listening to your spiritual council. Joy tells the story of being named the 23rd poet laureate of the United States, and opens up about leaving home to attend a Bureau of Indian Education boarding school in the 1960s. "For the first time, I was in a circle of relatives,” Joy says, “a circle of other students like me who were natives, who had been through a lot of the same stories.”

Unlock full access to New York Times podcasts and explore everything from politics to pop culture. Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify.

Cheryl calls Billy Collins, a former poet laureate of the United States, at his home in Florida. The two reflect on the collective silence — and slowness — that has befallen the world, and they discuss the unexpected comfort in memorizing poetry: "You really internalize this series of lines and bring it into yourself. And it's a part of you then," Billy says.

Unlock full access to New York Times podcasts and explore everything from politics to pop culture. Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify.

Cheryl calls Alice Walker, the poet and novelist, at her home in Mendocino, California. They talk about ancestors, solitude and the time it takes to heal.

Cheryl asks Alice about remembering her dreams, and the two discuss suffering and resilience — via the late boxing world-champion Muhammad Ali.

Unlock full access to New York Times podcasts and explore everything from politics to pop culture. Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify.

Cheryl calls Judy Blume, the beloved young-adult novelist, at her home in the Florida Keys. The two talk about raising teens, losing religion and decades of writing it all down.

Unlock full access to New York Times podcasts and explore everything from politics to pop culture. Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify.

Note: This episode contains descriptions of suicide and sexual violence.

Cheryl phones Amy Tan at her home overlooking Sausalito Bay in California. The two compare notes on family, grief and the long arc of resilience.

Unlock full access to New York Times podcasts and explore everything from politics to pop culture. Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify.

Cheryl calls Pico Iyer, the travel writer and novelist, at his apartment in Japan. Pico tells the story of losing his home to a forest fire in the early ’90s, and the unexpected lessons in that loss.

Cheryl asks Pico about his travels with the Dalai Lama, and the two discuss coming to grips with impermanence, via the fleeting beauty of a cherry blossom.

Unlock full access to New York Times podcasts and explore everything from politics to pop culture. Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify.

Today, Cheryl calls up one of the most prolific writers of our generation, the environmentalist and octogenarian Margaret Atwood. Margaret shares how she’s spending her time in isolation, including sewing masks and fending off squirrels. Cheryl asks Margaret whether she’s afraid for herself — and for the world — and the two reflect on how to stay hopeful.

You can find Margaret's recommended reading list here.

Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts, Spotify and Amazon Music. You can also subscribe via your favorite podcast app here https://www.nytimes.com/activate-access/audio?source=podcatcher. For more podcasts and narrated articles, download The New York Times app at nytimes.com/app.

Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

On the first episode of “Sugar Calling,” Cheryl calls author George Saunders, her old friend and mentor from graduate school, to chat through the uncertainties of this moment. Today, we listen in on their conversation.

Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts, Spotify and Amazon Music. You can also subscribe via your favorite podcast app here https://www.nytimes.com/activate-access/audio?source=podcatcher. For more podcasts and narrated articles, download The New York Times app at nytimes.com/app.

Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Cheryl Strayed, who is also known as Sugar, says writing taught her how to give advice. In this moment of uncertainty, she’s turning to the writers who inspire her for courage and insight.

Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts, Spotify and Amazon Music. You can also subscribe via your favorite podcast app here https://www.nytimes.com/activate-access/audio?source=podcatcher. For more podcasts and narrated articles, download The New York Times app at nytimes.com/app.

Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.