In Episode 4 of The Copywriter Club podcast, Kira and Rob interview former HotJar copywriter, Brian Lenney. Since we recorded the show, Brian has left HotJar for the world of freelancing. And though he didn't know he would be leaving when we spoke, you can hear Brian almost talking himself into the decision during our discussion. Take a listen by clicking the play button below, or scroll down for a full transcript.

The people and stuff we mentioned on the show:

Inbound.org

HotJar

Ry Schwartz

Winsome Writing

Joel Klettke

Bob Hoffman | The Ad Contrarian

Brian’s Controversial Inbound Discussion

Google Docs

The Cult of Copy

Copyhackers Mastermind

The Copywriter Club Facebook Group

David Darmanin

Gary V—How We Make the Sausage

The Brothers Karizmozov

Brian Dean

Copyhackers

Cormack McCarthy’s The Road

C.S. Lewis

David McCullough

Kira’s Horror Podcasts

Brian’s Twitter

Intro: Content (for now)

Outro: Gravity

Kira’s website

Rob’s website

The Copywriter Club Facebook Group

Full Transcript:

RM: Hey this is Rob. When Kira and I recorded this episode our guest Brian Lenney was working as a copywriter at Hotjar, but a few days after we rapped Brian left his cushy cooperate job and went back to freelancing. We didn't know he would be quitting when we spoke with him. You can tell Brian is wrestling with his decision as you listen to him talk about his career. It's probably not best copywriter practice to close the loop before we've even opened it, but now you know the rest of the story, so let's get on with the show.

KH: What if you could hang out with really talented copywriters and other experts, ask them about their successes and failures, their work processes and their habits, then steal an idea or two to inspire your own work? That's what Rob and I try to do every week at the Copywriter Club podcast.

RM: You're invited to join the club for episode four as we chat with Hotjar copywriter Brian Lenney about the pros and cons of writing for a startup, why copywriters should consider using a product like Hotjar, and his thoughts about freelancing before he went in-house.

BL: Hey Kira, you ready?

KH: Hey guys.

BL: Howdy, happy to be here.

RM: We're excited to have you Brian.

KH: Yeah, thanks for being here. We should probably start with some context. We met Brian through the CopyHacker Mastermind. I feel like that's how we've met everyone here so far. We got to hang out with him in Sonoma in September, and really get to know Brian.

RM: It was funny, because once we got to Sonoma even after being in the Mastermind for several months with Brian it dawned on me that Brian had done writing at Inbound, because I had seen so much of the stuff that he had done at Inbound.org. Suddenly I'm like wait a second, Brian is Winsome Writing. Then maybe there was a controversial post or two there, and I was like okay that's the guy. It all kind of came together.

BL: I had the same thing Rob, because when we started ... I don't go on there as much as I use to, but I'm like oh yeah we've actually like, yeah, I had the same kind of ah ha moment. I'm like that's the Rob, I know Rob from Inbound. Cool.

RM: It's kind of funny we all sort of know each other, but we don't really know each other.

BL: Yeah, but we got to hang out, and drink wine [Rob drank Coke Zero], and talk about business, and copywriting in Sonoma wine country, so it was fun.

RM: It was a good time.

KH: I think to start Brian, you have background. You've spent years freelancing as a copywriter, and you're currently at a startup, Hotjar like we mentioned, and then you've worked with Inbound. Can you just kind of give us a brief background on the worlds that you've been hanging out in?

BL: Yeah, because it's kind of unique. I think it's one of those things like banking for instance, I look at banking like if you're a banker I'm like who wants to be a banker. Banking is just something you kind of fall into,