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Nicholas P. Money is Professor of Biology and Western Program Director at Miami University in Oxford, Ohio. He is an international expert on fungal biology and author of popular science books that celebrate the microbial world including his most recent, Molds, Mushrooms, and Medicines: Our Lifelong Relationship with Fungi (2024)

He joins us on the podcast to deep dive into the biology, ecology, and intelligence of fungi. We discuss the body and life cycle of mushrooming fungi; the shape and behaviour of mycelium; how fungi are more similar to humans than they are to plants; and even a critical take on the efficacy of so-called "functional mushrooms".

We also explore the thesis he put forth in his 2021 paper, Hyphal and mycelial consciousness: the concept of the fungal mind. With that, we discuss fungi consciousness; the conscious intelligence of mycelium; how all organisms have consciousness; why science and society needs to NOT recognize the consciousness of non-human life; and whether our psilocybin experiences encounters with a fungal mind. We even get into debating the value of the human species on the other side of climate change.

Enjoy!

Full Show Notes, Links, and a Video Version of This Episode Can Be Found at Jameswjesso.com

FULL TOPICS BREAKDOWN BELOW

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Episode Breakdown

• (00:00) Opening
• (03:13) Interview Begins
• (04:03) If you want to make your way through crisis, align yourself with the mushrooms
• (07:25) Debating the value of the human species
• (10:34) The value of humanity
• (12:09) Being able to experience happiness, even in the midst of ecological collapse
• (14:36) Humans as beauty sense organs for the earth
• (16:12) Is there such a thing as objective "good"?
• (19:20) The body and life cycle of mushrooming fungi
• (22:14) The many other forms of fungi
• (26:10) The shape of mycelium
• (29:56) The different between fungal hyphae and plant roots
• (34:34) One main difference between fungi and plants
• (36:26) How fungi are more similar to humans than they are to plants
• (40:37) Why fungal infections are so hard to treat without harming ourselves
• (41:38) A critical take on functional mushrooms
• (45:16) Defining "conscious" and "consciousness"; all organisms have consciousness
• (55:29) Patreon Thanks
• (58:30) Science and Society needs to NOT recognize the consciousness of non-human life
• (01:06:09) Fungal hyphae are conscious; here's how
• (01:10:20) Can an organism be conscious and lack the capacity of intent?
• (01:18:39) "Is a mycelium more than a sum of its parts? Can it be regarded as an integrated conscious entity?"
• (01:21:12) Our visual identification informs our empathy? Finding Religions through science
• (01:26:46) Our psilocybin experiences encounters with the mind of the fungi?
• (01:34:28) A short story about what Prof Money hasn't experienced psilocybin
• (01:36:57) Maybe psilocybin is evolutionarily meant for us in some way
• (01:45:06) Follow up links and info on Prof Money's new book
• (01:46:50) Outro

 

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