Welcome back to the second half of this powerful conversation with Jay Stringer. Building on the foundation of his book, "Desire,"Jay moves us deeper into one of the most provocative ideas of the conversation:

Sometimes our desires must disrupt and even destroy something in order to make way for something more true.

This isn't destruction for destruction's sake. Iconoclasm is the breaking of false structures, identities, and "provisional selves" that no longer serve us. And as Jay explores, when we don't have wise guides or meaningful rites of passage, that disruption often shows up as self-sabotage—affairs, addictions, burnout, or relational breakdown.

But instead of dismissing those moments as failure, Jay invites us to see them as honest signals—clues pointing back to our story, our unmet longings, and the deeper work our soul is trying to initiate.

Listen in to a conversation that is rich with story and grounded in research as they also explore:

• why community is essential for making sense of our desires (and why we can't do this work alone)

• how to interrogate your desires in a healthy, curious way—not with shame, but with wisdom

• and how our desires are often shaped by forces we don't even realize, yet can be reshaped over time

Desire has the power to both build and break. The question is not whether disruption will come—but whether we'll have the courage, support, and curiosity to let it lead us somewhere good.

Order your copy of Jay's new book, "Desire: The Longings Inside Us and the New Science of How We Love, Heal, and Grow," now at: https://jay-stringer.com/books/

About the Allender Center Podcast:

For over a decade, the Allender Center Podcast has offered honest, thoughtful conversations about the deep work of healing and transformation. Hosted by Dr. Dan Allender and Rachael Clinton Chen, MDiv, this weekly podcast explores the complexities of trauma, abuse recovery, story, relationships, and spiritual formation. Through questions submitted by listeners, stories, interviews, and conversations, we engage the deep places of heartache and hope that are rarely addressed so candidly in our culture today. Join the Allender Center Podcast to uncover meaningful perspectives and support for your path to healing and growth.

At the Allender Center, we value thoughtful dialogue across a wide range of voices, stories, and lived experiences. In that spirit, our podcast features guests and hosts who may hold differing perspectives. The perspectives shared on this podcast by guests and hosts reflect their own experiences and viewpoints and do not necessarily represent the views, positions, or endorsements of the Allender Center and/or The Seattle School of Theology & Psychology.

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