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The Locked up Living Podcast: Surviving and thriving in prisons and other challenging environments
The Locked up Living Podcast: Surviving and thriving in prisons and other challenging environments episodes
- Ffyona Campbell (Audio): The Sisters of Mercy: Hidden Abuse Behind a 20,000-Mile Walk
David Jones and Dr Naomi Murphy speak with Ffyona Campbell about her memoir ‘In Black and White’, which recounts the abuse she experienced as a child at the Sisters of Mercy convent boarding school in Midhurst, and the decades-long process of recovering those memories. The conversation explores her efforts to tell her story, find other survivors, and describes the psychological manipulation she says took place at the school.
This is a difficult but important discussion about trauma, memory, and the search for justice. Ffyona, known for her walks across Africa and the USA, also reflects on the girls who offered her support, her life after recovering memories, and why speaking out matters to her.
https://www.amazon.co.uk/stores/author/B09RG9VKHG
https://www.wildfoodwalks.co.uk/
Key topics
Ffyona discusses In Black and White, her memoir about being a junior boarder at Midhurst from age eight, and why she wrote it.
She describes a memory-recall process that brought back memories of abuse, and the difficulties she says followed when she tried to report it.
The conversation focuses on the “black and white” room, which Ffyona says was altered to confuse and condition children before abuse.
She recounts how changes to the room, courtyard, curtains, and furniture contributed to what she describes as a deliberate system of psychological manipulation.
Ffyona remembers George, an older girl who recognized that the nuns were “messing with our minds,” and whose resistance helped spark rebellion among the girls.
She recalls Grania, who gave her a tiny red crayon, as a rare source of kindness and solidarity.
Ffyona reflects on a painful incident involving her sister and why she no longer blames herself for it.
She discusses why some survivors find the book difficult to read and the challenges she sees in seeking justice without more corroborating testimony.
Ffyona says she has medical evidence of injuries she believes are consistent with abuse, and raises questions about the Sisters of Mercy’s financial records and assets.
She calls for scrutiny of the Sisters of Mercy and a wider network of religious institutions, and says she hopes survivors will know they are not alone.
Timestamps
00:00 - Introduction to Ffyona Campbell’s memoir and life’s work
02:16 - What In Black and White is about
05:02 - Why she decided to write the book now
06:56 - Writing as a path toward exposing the convent
08:19 - Recovering after homelessness and trauma
10:53 - The strange black and white room
17:19 - How the room was used to torment and confuse children
19:29 - Realizing George understood the abuse too
23:22 - The role of isolation, fear, and the red crayon
31:31 - George, Grania, and the emotional bonds between the girls
34:36 - George forced to fight Sister Catherine
37:14 - Moving into Bracken and new living arrangements
40:07 - Grania’s promise and the burden of memory
42:21 - Trying to tell her parents and being dismissed
47:47 - Why other survivors struggle to read the book
50:41 - Physical evidence and the injuries she says remain
54:13 - Financial concerns and the Sisters of Mercy’s assets
57:00 - How Ffyona believes the convent fit into a wider abuse network
61:14 - Following the money and demanding accountability
62:28 - Why the book matters even without a prosecution
1 hr 2 min - Rodney King (Audio); Being Human, Mindfulness, and the Cost of Modern Success
Rodney King (Video); Being Human, Mindfulness, and the Cost of Modern Success
Dr. Rodney King joins David Jones and Dr. Naomi Murphy to trace the arc of a life shaped by poverty, violence, reading, martial arts, and a search for meaning. The conversation moves from embodied mindfulness and leadership to philosophical counselling, chronic illness, and why he is sceptical of the idea that individual effort alone explains success.
In this episode, Rodney shares how surviving Johannesburg’s government housing, homelessness, and an abusive home led him toward martial arts, military service, and eventually doctoral research. We also discuss his book, Being a Human, The Courage to Simply Be, and the case for slowing down, breathing, and choosing a more humane way of living.
https://www.coachingphilosophia.org/coach-king
https://www.linkedin.com/in/coachrodneyking/
Timestamps
00:00 - Introduction to Dr. Rodney King and his journey from Johannesburg to mindfulness research
01:10 - Growing up tough in government housing and learning to survive
02:53 - Why appearing weak was dangerous in his environment
05:28 - The thread connecting martial arts, leadership, and philosophical counselling
06:15 - Homelessness at 17 and finding meaning through reading
07:42 - Military service as a turning point for leadership and self belief
10:03 - Fatherhood, support, and the role of being in his sons’ corner
13:01 - Taking his children back to the area where he grew up
14:35 - His aunt, early mindfulness ideas, and the importance of a champion
17:14 - How Thailand and Muay Thai shaped his understanding of mindfulness
18:37 - Designing PhD research around mindfulness and leadership performance
21:47 - Why martial arts offered a better model for mindfulness under pressure
24:06 - Breath, stress, and a practical drill used with airline cabin crew
28:26 - Short breathing, overload, and the calming effect of the exhale
29:33 - What philosophical counselling is and how it differs from therapy
31:53 - A second PhD on the meaning crisis and philosophical counselling
32:16 - Why Rodney is skeptical of modern success narratives and optimization culture
39:30 - AI advice, accessibility, and why human relationships still matter in therapy
43:05 - Why Rodney stepped back from organizational work
46:04 - The premise of Being a Human, The Courage to Simply Be
49:30 - The “walk to nowhere” as a practical antidote to optimization
52:30 - Connection, loneliness, and the loss of community
Notable quotes
“You have always been good enough.”
“The breath tethers you to the present moment.”
“Whatever modernity tells you to do, do the opposite.”
52 min - Rodney King (Video); Being Human, Mindfulness, and the Cost of Modern Success
Dr. Rodney King joins David Jones and Dr. Naomi Murphy to trace the arc of a life shaped by poverty, violence, reading, martial arts, and a search for meaning. The conversation moves from embodied mindfulness and leadership to philosophical counselling, chronic illness, and why he is sceptical of the idea that individual effort alone explains success.
In this episode, Rodney shares how surviving Johannesburg’s government housing, homelessness, and an abusive home led him toward martial arts, military service, and eventually doctoral research. We also discuss his book, Being a Human, The Courage to Simply Be, and the case for slowing down, breathing, and choosing a more humane way of living.
https://www.coachingphilosophia.org/coach-king
https://www.linkedin.com/in/coachrodneyking/
Timestamps
00:00 - Introduction to Dr. Rodney King and his journey from Johannesburg to mindfulness research
01:10 - Growing up tough in government housing and learning to survive
02:53 - Why appearing weak was dangerous in his environment
05:28 - The thread connecting martial arts, leadership, and philosophical counselling
06:15 - Homelessness at 17 and finding meaning through reading
07:42 - Military service as a turning point for leadership and self belief
10:03 - Fatherhood, support, and the role of being in his sons’ corner
13:01 - Taking his children back to the area where he grew up
14:35 - His aunt, early mindfulness ideas, and the importance of a champion
17:14 - How Thailand and Muay Thai shaped his understanding of mindfulness
18:37 - Designing PhD research around mindfulness and leadership performance
21:47 - Why martial arts offered a better model for mindfulness under pressure
24:06 - Breath, stress, and a practical drill used with airline cabin crew
28:26 - Short breathing, overload, and the calming effect of the exhale
29:33 - What philosophical counselling is and how it differs from therapy
31:53 - A second PhD on the meaning crisis and philosophical counselling
32:16 - Why Rodney is skeptical of modern success narratives and optimization culture
39:30 - AI advice, accessibility, and why human relationships still matter in therapy
43:05 - Why Rodney stepped back from organizational work
46:04 - The premise of Being a Human, The Courage to Simply Be
49:30 - The “walk to nowhere” as a practical antidote to optimization
52:30 - Connection, loneliness, and the loss of community
Notable quotes
“You have always been good enough.”
“The breath tethers you to the present moment.”
“Whatever modernity tells you to do, do the opposite.”
52 min - Dr Elly Hanson (Audio ); Porn Is Not About Sex - It’s About Shaping Desire for Profit
This conversation with clinical psychologist Dr Elly Hanson, hosted by Dr Naomi Murphy and David Jones, looks at the commercial and cultural drivers of sexual exploitation, and why regulation matters when profit is shaping sexuality online. It also moves into the emotional cost of doing this work, including burnout, resilience, post-traumatic growth, and how to stay grounded when the subject matter is bleak. Dr Hanson explains the work of CEASE and Fully Human, and makes a case for collective action, stronger safeguards for children, and a clearer language for what it means to be human in a rapidly changing digital world.
https://cease.org.uk/https://www.hydrantprogramme.co.uk/assets/Hanson-2025-Organised-ritual-abuse-and-its-wider-context.-Hydrant-NPCC-NAPAC.pdfKey topics
- Dr Elly Hanson’s role and expertise
- Clinical psychologist
- Strategy director at CEASE, the Centre to End All Sexual Exploitation
- Research lead at Fully Human, a PSHE Association initiative
- Brings both clinical and policy perspectives to the discussion
- What CEASE is trying to change
- CEASE works upstream to tackle the commercial and cultural drivers of sexual violence and exploitation
- The focus is prevention, not just response
- Hanson frames porn as one major commercial driver that shapes harmful sexual scripts
- Pornography as a profit model, not a mirror of sexuality
- Hanson argues the industry does not simply reflect human sexuality
- It incentivizes novelty, objectification, taboo, and violence because those are monetizable
- The point is not just arousal, but the shaping of desire toward corporate profit
- How sexual scripts can shift over time
- The conversation explores how exposure can normalize more extreme material
- Naomi Murphy raises the concern that people may move from ordinary preferences into harmful territory
- Hanson agrees that porn can play a role in that progression, especially where trauma is not the only factor
- Children and young people as a protected group
- Hanson stresses that children have a right to sexual development free from corporate manipulation
- She references progress on age verification and stronger protections
- She argues that society has begun to set a new norm that children should not be exposed to this material
- Working in dark material without becoming numb
- The discussion turns to the emotional burden of forensic and safeguarding work
- Hanson rejects the idea that compassion fatigue is just “getting tired of caring”
- She sees it more as a defensive response to helplessness, under-resourcing, and repeated exposure to harm
- Why collective effort is central to resilience
- Hanson says burnout is often worst when people feel they cannot make a difference
- She returns repeatedly to the importance of teamwork, shared purpose, and “finding your people”
- She says a diverse working week also helps prevent emotional overload
- Sorrow, hope, and philosophical grounding
- Hanson draws on literature, poetry, and philosophy to make sense of suffering
- She argues that sorrow is part of the human condition, not the same thing as depression
- Hope, for her, is an agentic stance: acting without knowing the outcome, rather than optimism or resignation
- Post-traumatic growth and resilience
- Hanson emphasizes that growth does not erase harm
- She describes resilience as surviving impact and still moving through it, not simply hardening oneself
- Her understanding of hope and meaning has deepened through witnessing survivors
- Bureaucracy, neglect, and systems that harm
- Murphy and Hanson discuss how under-resourced systems can produce cynicism and victim blaming
- Hanson argues that bureaucracy can become oppressive and even harmful
- She warns that systems focused only on preventing one kind of abuse can become neglectful in other ways
- Ritual abuse research and the need for acknowledgement
- Hanson discusses research published with police and NAPAC on ritual abuse
- She explains that disbelief and dismissal have long harmed survivors
- The report matters because it acknowledges the issue, summarizes evidence, and challenges the culture of denial
- Fully Human and the question of what it means to be human
- Fully Human takes a step back from narrow policy issues to ask broader questions about flourishing
- Its focus includes technology, sexual ethics, objectification, and the impact of digital life on young people
- Hanson sees this as a place for deeper thought at a time of rapid technological change
- Hope for the next decade
- Hanson is encouraged by growing recognition that the internet is a human space that needs regulation
- She sees resistance building against tech libertarianism and “the horse has bolted” thinking
- She believes society is becoming better at naming what is valuable about human connection, embodiment, and care
Timestamps
00:00 - Welcome and introduction to Dr Elly Hanson
01:01 - What CEASE does and why it works upstream02:31 - Pornography as a business model that shapes desire04:46 - “Porn is fundamentally not about sex, but about money”05:26 - Why age verification and child protection matter06:22 - How exposure can shift sexual interests and behavior08:41 - Freud, rules, and what happens when boundaries break09:43 - What originally drew Hanson into the work13:30 - How psychologists bear witness to darkness16:10 - Burnout, helplessness, and staying part of the collective18:14 - How the work changes your worldview and values19:40 - Literature, sorrow, and the emotional truth of the work22:22 - A deeper definition of resilience23:47 - Compassion fatigue, defensiveness, and victim blaming26:22 - Bureaucracy, neglect, and harmful systems28:44 - Post-traumatic growth and an agentic view of hope31:33 - Hope, compassion, and the power of shared intention32:57 - Avoiding overwhelm while still staying accountable34:52 - A self-written poem about building anyway37:40 - Signs of progress on pornography regulation41:03 - Ritual abuse, disbelief, and the role of research44:31 - Advice for people working in disillusioning fields45:34 - What Fully Human is and why it exists48:34 - The most promising shifts in regulation and cultural pushback50:43 - AI, therapy, and becoming better at being human47 min - Dr Elly Hanson’s role and expertise
- Dr Elly Hanson (Video); Porn Is Not About Sex - It’s About Shaping Desire for Profit
This conversation with clinical psychologist Dr Elly Hanson, hosted by Dr Naomi Murphy and David Jones, looks at the commercial and cultural drivers of sexual exploitation, and why regulation matters when profit is shaping sexuality online. It also moves into the emotional cost of doing this work, including burnout, resilience, post-traumatic growth, and how to stay grounded when the subject matter is bleak. Dr Hanson explains the work of CEASE and Fully Human, and makes a case for collective action, stronger safeguards for children, and a clearer language for what it means to be human in a rapidly changing digital world.
https://cease.org.uk/https://www.hydrantprogramme.co.uk/assets/Hanson-2025-Organised-ritual-abuse-and-its-wider-context.-Hydrant-NPCC-NAPAC.pdfKey topics
- Dr Elly Hanson’s role and expertise
- Clinical psychologist
- Strategy director at CEASE, the Centre to End All Sexual Exploitation
- Research lead at Fully Human, a PSHE Association initiative
- Brings both clinical and policy perspectives to the discussion
- What CEASE is trying to change
- CEASE works upstream to tackle the commercial and cultural drivers of sexual violence and exploitation
- The focus is prevention, not just response
- Hanson frames porn as one major commercial driver that shapes harmful sexual scripts
- Pornography as a profit model, not a mirror of sexuality
- Hanson argues the industry does not simply reflect human sexuality
- It incentivizes novelty, objectification, taboo, and violence because those are monetizable
- The point is not just arousal, but the shaping of desire toward corporate profit
- How sexual scripts can shift over time
- The conversation explores how exposure can normalize more extreme material
- Naomi Murphy raises the concern that people may move from ordinary preferences into harmful territory
- Hanson agrees that porn can play a role in that progression, especially where trauma is not the only factor
- Children and young people as a protected group
- Hanson stresses that children have a right to sexual development free from corporate manipulation
- She references progress on age verification and stronger protections
- She argues that society has begun to set a new norm that children should not be exposed to this material
- Working in dark material without becoming numb
- The discussion turns to the emotional burden of forensic and safeguarding work
- Hanson rejects the idea that compassion fatigue is just “getting tired of caring”
- She sees it more as a defensive response to helplessness, under-resourcing, and repeated exposure to harm
- Why collective effort is central to resilience
- Hanson says burnout is often worst when people feel they cannot make a difference
- She returns repeatedly to the importance of teamwork, shared purpose, and “finding your people”
- She says a diverse working week also helps prevent emotional overload
- Sorrow, hope, and philosophical grounding
- Hanson draws on literature, poetry, and philosophy to make sense of suffering
- She argues that sorrow is part of the human condition, not the same thing as depression
- Hope, for her, is an agentic stance: acting without knowing the outcome, rather than optimism or resignation
- Post-traumatic growth and resilience
- Hanson emphasizes that growth does not erase harm
- She describes resilience as surviving impact and still moving through it, not simply hardening oneself
- Her understanding of hope and meaning has deepened through witnessing survivors
- Bureaucracy, neglect, and systems that harm
- Murphy and Hanson discuss how under-resourced systems can produce cynicism and victim blaming
- Hanson argues that bureaucracy can become oppressive and even harmful
- She warns that systems focused only on preventing one kind of abuse can become neglectful in other ways
- Ritual abuse research and the need for acknowledgement
- Hanson discusses research published with police and NAPAC on ritual abuse
- She explains that disbelief and dismissal have long harmed survivors
- The report matters because it acknowledges the issue, summarizes evidence, and challenges the culture of denial
- Fully Human and the question of what it means to be human
- Fully Human takes a step back from narrow policy issues to ask broader questions about flourishing
- Its focus includes technology, sexual ethics, objectification, and the impact of digital life on young people
- Hanson sees this as a place for deeper thought at a time of rapid technological change
- Hope for the next decade
- Hanson is encouraged by growing recognition that the internet is a human space that needs regulation
- She sees resistance building against tech libertarianism and “the horse has bolted” thinking
- She believes society is becoming better at naming what is valuable about human connection, embodiment, and care
Timestamps
00:00 - Welcome and introduction to Dr Elly Hanson
01:01 - What CEASE does and why it works upstream02:31 - Pornography as a business model that shapes desire04:46 - “Porn is fundamentally not about sex, but about money”05:26 - Why age verification and child protection matter06:22 - How exposure can shift sexual interests and behavior08:41 - Freud, rules, and what happens when boundaries break09:43 - What originally drew Hanson into the work13:30 - How psychologists bear witness to darkness16:10 - Burnout, helplessness, and staying part of the collective18:14 - How the work changes your worldview and values19:40 - Literature, sorrow, and the emotional truth of the work22:22 - A deeper definition of resilience23:47 - Compassion fatigue, defensiveness, and victim blaming26:22 - Bureaucracy, neglect, and harmful systems28:44 - Post-traumatic growth and an agentic view of hope31:33 - Hope, compassion, and the power of shared intention32:57 - Avoiding overwhelm while still staying accountable34:52 - A self-written poem about building anyway37:40 - Signs of progress on pornography regulation41:03 - Ritual abuse, disbelief, and the role of research44:31 - Advice for people working in disillusioning fields45:34 - What Fully Human is and why it exists48:34 - The most promising shifts in regulation and cultural pushback50:43 - AI, therapy, and becoming better at being human47 min - Dr Elly Hanson’s role and expertise
- Richard Buckworth (Audio); Why Feeling “Normal” Can Be the Biggest Lie After Adoption
In this interview, Dr Naomi Murphy and David Jones speak with Richard Buckworth about adoption, identity, and the long shadow of unprocessed trauma. Richard shares how his experience as an adoptee shaped his upcoming book, One Voice, and the therapeutic work he now does with family constellations, journey therapy, shamanic healing, and the Enneagram. The conversation explores belonging, self-worth, secrecy, people-pleasing, inherited trauma, and the importance of facing difficult truths with patience and self-awareness.
https://familyconstellationstherapy.com/
https://www.linkedin.com/in/richard-buckworth-11503966/
Key topics
- Why Richard wrote One Voice and challenged the belief that adoption had not affected him.
- The childhood feeling that something was “off,” including depression, disconnection, and not belonging.
- Emotional shutdown, dissociation, and survival strategies.
- Adoption-related vulnerabilities, including not looking like anyone in the family and feeling disconnected from one’s lineage.
- The complexity of the adoption triad: adoptees, biological parents, and adoptive parents.
- Discovering what “adopted” really meant at around age seven.
- Secrecy, identity confusion, and the experience of having two mothers and two fathers in different senses.
- Family constellation therapy and its focus on generational patterns and blocked family connections.
- How Richard combines constellation work with journey therapy, shamanic healing, and the Enneagram.
- Why truth, patience, and emotional honesty are central to healing.
Timestamps
- 00:00
Introducing Richard Buckworth
- 02:33
Why Richard wrote One Voice
- 05:05
Childhood feelings of not belonging
- 07:28
Emotional shutdown and dissociation
- 08:41
Coping with bullying and avoidance
- 10:24
Adoption, identity, and belonging
- 14:35
Separation at birth and adult mental health
- 17:13
The adoption triad
- 18:35
Understanding adoption at age seven
- 20:46
The confusing story of being “chosen”
- 23:34
Secrecy and having two mothers
- 25:24
What might have changed with earlier awareness
- 29:10
Epigenetics and intergenerational trauma
- 37:39
What family constellation therapy is
- 43:51
Somatic healing and listening to the body
- 47:50
Combining multiple therapeutic modalities
- 53:57
Advice for people disconnected from their roots
- 54:18
“The truth will set you free”
- 57:02
Honesty, family, and the next generation
Notable quotes
“It takes more effort to not feel than to actually feel.”
“The truth will set you free.”
“I was so good at lying to myself.”
Key frameworks
- Family constellation therapy:
Exploring present issues through family systems and generational patterns.
- Journey therapy:
Releasing emotional blocks and accessing feelings that were shut down.
- Shamanic healing:
Exploring ancestral patterns beyond a traditional seven-generation framework.
- The Enneagram:
Understanding motivation, avoidance, and behavioral patterns
57 min - Richard Buckworth (Video}; Why Feeling “Normal” Can Be the Biggest Lie After Adoption
In this interview, Dr Naomi Murphy and David Jones speak with Richard Buckworth about adoption, identity, and the long shadow of unprocessed trauma. Richard shares how his experience as an adoptee shaped his upcoming book, One Voice, and the therapeutic work he now does with family constellations, journey therapy, shamanic healing, and the Enneagram. The conversation explores belonging, self-worth, secrecy, people-pleasing, inherited trauma, and the importance of facing difficult truths with patience and self-awareness.
https://familyconstellationstherapy.com/
https://www.linkedin.com/in/richard-buckworth-11503966/
Key topics
- Why Richard wrote One Voice and challenged the belief that adoption had not affected him.
- The childhood feeling that something was “off,” including depression, disconnection, and not belonging.
- Emotional shutdown, dissociation, and survival strategies.
- Adoption-related vulnerabilities, including not looking like anyone in the family and feeling disconnected from one’s lineage.
- The complexity of the adoption triad: adoptees, biological parents, and adoptive parents.
- Discovering what “adopted” really meant at around age seven.
- Secrecy, identity confusion, and the experience of having two mothers and two fathers in different senses.
- Family constellation therapy and its focus on generational patterns and blocked family connections.
- How Richard combines constellation work with journey therapy, shamanic healing, and the Enneagram.
- Why truth, patience, and emotional honesty are central to healing.
Timestamps
- 00:00
Introducing Richard Buckworth
- 02:33
Why Richard wrote One Voice
- 05:05
Childhood feelings of not belonging
- 07:28
Emotional shutdown and dissociation
- 08:41
Coping with bullying and avoidance
- 10:24
Adoption, identity, and belonging
- 14:35
Separation at birth and adult mental health
- 17:13
The adoption triad
- 18:35
Understanding adoption at age seven
- 20:46
The confusing story of being “chosen”
- 23:34
Secrecy and having two mothers
- 25:24
What might have changed with earlier awareness
- 29:10
Epigenetics and intergenerational trauma
- 37:39
What family constellation therapy is
- 43:51
Somatic healing and listening to the body
- 47:50
Combining multiple therapeutic modalities
- 53:57
Advice for people disconnected from their roots
- 54:18
“The truth will set you free”
- 57:02
Honesty, family, and the next generation
Notable quotes
“It takes more effort to not feel than to actually feel.”
“The truth will set you free.”
“I was so good at lying to myself.”
Key frameworks
- Family constellation therapy:
Exploring present issues through family systems and generational patterns.
- Journey therapy:
Releasing emotional blocks and accessing feelings that were shut down.
- Shamanic healing:
Exploring ancestral patterns beyond a traditional seven-generation framework.
- The Enneagram:
Understanding motivation, avoidance, and behavioral patterns.
57 min - Joseph Millson (Video); How Abuse Shapes a Life—and How Stories Help Us Survive
In this conversation Naomi Murphy and David Jones are joined by Joseph Millson, actor, writer, filmmaker and singer, currently appearing in The Phantom of the Opera in London’s West End. He’s also the author of Miller Rose Roberts, a novella that moves between psychological realism and something more mysterious while exploring trauma, memory, identity, love, and recovery. In this conversation, Joseph talks about why creativity matters to wellbeing, how writing became a kind of journaling for him, and why he prefers ambiguity over neat explanations. They also discuss resilience, grief, anger, motherhood, and the role storytelling can play in making sense of painful experience.
Key topics
- In this episode, Joseph argues that creativity is not reserved for artists, because everyone uses creative thinking in some form, from mechanics to doctors to chefs.
- He shares the “right hand and left hand” idea: one side of life handles rent, family, and responsibilities, while the other side protects creative expression and imagination.
- Joseph explains why actors often feel the urge to move into writing and directing, because acting is usually interpreting someone else’s story rather than telling their own.
- We discuss how writing, especially journaling, can function as emotional processing even when no one else ever reads it.
- Joseph describes Miller Rose Roberts as a seven chapter novella built around seven year cycles, with the protagonist revisited at ages 7, 14, 21, 28, and beyond.
- He shares how the book blends realism with magical realism, including the recurring ringing in Miller’s ears that becomes an instruction to walk away.
- They talk about ambiguity in art and why Joseph prefers not to over explain mental health, grief, or the meaning of Miller’s experiences.
- Joseph reflects on writing female characters, saying he is fascinated by women’s experiences and by people who carry pain privately rather than sharing it.
- The conversation also touches on anger management, emotional numbness, and the idea that people need an outlet for grief and pain instead of suppressing it.
- Joseph closes by explaining how actors can access deep emotion safely through imagination, scaffolding, and play, without relying on unhealthy emotional recall.
Timestamps
00:00 - Introducing Joseph Milson and the themes of creativity and wellbeing
00:37 - Why creative work and day jobs often coexist01:37 - The “right hand and left hand” model of creative life03:33 - Why acting is a uniquely difficult art form04:32 - Writing as mental health support between auditions05:57 - Creativity as something everyone does07:47 - Why Signs of Life emerges from struggle08:13 - How Joseph moved from acting into writing and directing09:14 - Work and Other Four Letter Words and the value of self-reflection10:33 - Lockdown, screenwriting, and the start of Signs of Life11:33 - Grief, kindness, and the idea behind the film12:58 - Why actors eventually want to tell their own stories15:41 - Journaling as a form of creative processing18:42 - Writing from a woman’s perspective22:30 - The caravan park, the name Miller Rose Roberts, and the book’s origin23:55 - Seven year cycles and the structure of the novella24:49 - Tinnitus, the desert, and the magical realist premise26:51 - Leaving space for multiple interpretations29:29 - Grief, psychosis, and privacy as a defense mechanism30:36 - Anger management and the need for emotional outlets32:15 - Plant medicine, journaling, and looking at what hurts33:39 - Writer’s block and finding the ending35:08 - Why Joseph chose to write a novella rather than a full novel37:02 - Stephen King’s influence and Joseph’s admiration for novella length38:12 - Why resilience is hard to explain and impossible to reduce41:12 - Motherhood, loss, and the book’s emotional core44:08 - The deliberate use of “the mother” as a distancing device46:46 - Researching the 1980s, cigarettes, and period detail48:24 - Storytelling as a way of healing and narrating our lives50:42 - How actors protect themselves when working in deep emotional territoryNotable quotes
“The mistake are mistake. Something a lot of creatives do is put their creative life over here and everything else over there.”
“I believe my creative work is my journaling.”
“Art is a question mark.”
52 min - Joseph Millson (Audio); How Abuse Shapes a Life—and How Stories Help Us Survive
In this conversation Naomi Murphy and David Jones are joined by Joseph Millson, actor, writer, filmmaker and singer, currently appearing in The Phantom of the Opera in London’s West End. He’s also the author of Miller Rose Roberts, a novella that moves between psychological realism and something more mysterious while exploring trauma, memory, identity, love, and recovery. In this conversation, Joseph talks about why creativity matters to wellbeing, how writing became a kind of journaling for him, and why he prefers ambiguity over neat explanations. They also discuss resilience, grief, anger, motherhood, and the role storytelling can play in making sense of painful experience.
Key topics
- In this episode, Joseph argues that creativity is not reserved for artists, because everyone uses creative thinking in some form, from mechanics to doctors to chefs.
- He shares the “right hand and left hand” idea: one side of life handles rent, family, and responsibilities, while the other side protects creative expression and imagination.
- Joseph explains why actors often feel the urge to move into writing and directing, because acting is usually interpreting someone else’s story rather than telling their own.
- We discuss how writing, especially journaling, can function as emotional processing even when no one else ever reads it.
- Joseph describes Miller Rose Roberts as a seven chapter novella built around seven year cycles, with the protagonist revisited at ages 7, 14, 21, 28, and beyond.
- He shares how the book blends realism with magical realism, including the recurring ringing in Miller’s ears that becomes an instruction to walk away.
- They talk about ambiguity in art and why Joseph prefers not to over explain mental health, grief, or the meaning of Miller’s experiences.
- Joseph reflects on writing female characters, saying he is fascinated by women’s experiences and by people who carry pain privately rather than sharing it.
- The conversation also touches on anger management, emotional numbness, and the idea that people need an outlet for grief and pain instead of suppressing it.
- Joseph closes by explaining how actors can access deep emotion safely through imagination, scaffolding, and play, without relying on unhealthy emotional recall.
Timestamps
00:00 - Introducing Joseph Milson and the themes of creativity and wellbeing
00:37 - Why creative work and day jobs often coexist01:37 - The “right hand and left hand” model of creative life03:33 - Why acting is a uniquely difficult art form04:32 - Writing as mental health support between auditions05:57 - Creativity as something everyone does07:47 - Why Signs of Life emerges from struggle08:13 - How Joseph moved from acting into writing and directing09:14 - Work and Other Four Letter Words and the value of self-reflection10:33 - Lockdown, screenwriting, and the start of Signs of Life11:33 - Grief, kindness, and the idea behind the film12:58 - Why actors eventually want to tell their own stories15:41 - Journaling as a form of creative processing18:42 - Writing from a woman’s perspective22:30 - The caravan park, the name Miller Rose Roberts, and the book’s origin23:55 - Seven year cycles and the structure of the novella24:49 - Tinnitus, the desert, and the magical realist premise26:51 - Leaving space for multiple interpretations29:29 - Grief, psychosis, and privacy as a defense mechanism30:36 - Anger management and the need for emotional outlets32:15 - Plant medicine, journaling, and looking at what hurts33:39 - Writer’s block and finding the ending35:08 - Why Joseph chose to write a novella rather than a full novel37:02 - Stephen King’s influence and Joseph’s admiration for novella length38:12 - Why resilience is hard to explain and impossible to reduce41:12 - Motherhood, loss, and the book’s emotional core44:08 - The deliberate use of “the mother” as a distancing device46:46 - Researching the 1980s, cigarettes, and period detail48:24 - Storytelling as a way of healing and narrating our lives50:42 - How actors protect themselves when working in deep emotional territoryNotable quotes
“The mistake are mistake. Something a lot of creatives do is put their creative life over here and everything else over there.”
“I believe my creative work is my journaling.”
“Art is a question mark.”
52 min - Dr Beverley Samways (Audio); Why Self-Injury in Non-Speaking People Is Often Misread. Trauma Gets Missed in Learning Disability Care
This conversation explores Dr Beverley Samways work with people with learning disabilities who have experienced trauma and use little or no spoken communication. The discussion focuses on how self-injury has often been misunderstood through behavioural frameworks, and why a more relational, trauma-informed approach can reveal what people are actually trying to communicate. It also covers the role of grief, culture, power, and co-regulation in care.Beverley Samways, founder of Unique Connections and author of Unspoken Stories, shares findings from her PhD and years of frontline work. Naomi Murphy and David Jones bring in their own clinical reflections, especially around psychodynamic practice, person-centred care, and the importance of really seeing the person in front of you.
Unspoken Stories: Learning to Listen to People with Intellectual Disabilities who are Non-Speaking. https://pavpub.com/health-and-social-care/health-autism/unspoken-stories-learning-to-listen-to-people-with-intellectual-disabilities-who-are-non-speakingKey topics
- In this episode, Beverley explains how Unspoken Stories grew out of her PhD research with three teenagers who had learning disabilities, little or no speech, and histories of self-injury.
- She challenges the long-standing tendency to interpret self-injury in learning disability services mainly through applied behavioural analysis and “challenging behaviour.”
- Beverley argues that distress is often rooted in trauma, grief, attachment, and adverse experiences, not just immediate environmental triggers.
- She describes how, in her research, all three participants had trauma histories and all three eventually communicated more than they had on paper, despite being labelled non-verbal.
- Naomi reflects on her own shift from a behavioural placement into person-centred and sensory motor psychotherapeutic work, connecting Beverley’s account to Valerie Sinason’s influence.
- Beverley shares how communication happened differently with each young person, including drawing and writing with Cassie, and silent co-regulation and bodily attunement with Owen.
- The conversation returns repeatedly to the idea that people who do not speak still have a unique voice, and that listening long enough can reveal it.
- Beverley explains that many experiences become traumatic more easily for non-speaking people, especially hospital procedures, restraint, repeated transitions, and hidden grief.
- The episode also examines why care systems can become harmful, including the role of institutional culture, power, fear of emotion, and the pressure to keep people “happy.”
- Beverley describes how the sector is shifting slowly toward therapeutic and trauma-informed models, and how Unique Connections is trying to support that change one school and one team at a time.
Timestamps
(00:00) Introduction to Dr Beverly Samways and her work with trauma, learning disabilities, and non-speaking communication(01:30) How Unspoken Stories emerged from PhD research with three teenagers and their histories of self-injury(05:14) Why self-harm research shows similar patterns across geography and time(05:52) Beverley’s background in children’s social care, residential settings, and therapeutic training(08:47) The traditional behavioural approach to self-injury and why it can miss emotional meaning(14:08) How trauma exposure is much more common for people with learning disabilities, especially non-speaking people(17:09) Research methods that relied on time, presence, and psychodynamic attunement rather than words alone(19:11) How communication emerged differently with Cassie and Owen through drawing, silence, and co-regulation(21:08) Psychodynamic influences from Valerie Sinason, Anne Alvarez, and Frances Tustin(23:21) Naomi’s reflection on person-centred work and the surprise of what the research revealed(24:20) The most striking surprise: all three participants spoke in some form when given enough space and listening(27:09) Trauma in everyday care settings, including hospitals, restraint, transitions, and repeated moves(30:07) Why grief is often mistaken for trauma, and why emotional expression is frequently discouraged in care(32:34) Institutional history, deprivation of liberty, and the long shadow of segregation(34:59) How recovery depends on being seen, heard, and understood rather than treated as a behaviour problem(38:28) Bad actors, harmful systems, and why “bad apple” explanations are not enough(42:44) The emotional impact of the research on Beverley, including sustained sadness and changed assumptions(45:35) Unique Connections’ aims and the gradual move from behavioural models toward trauma-informed practice(48:20) How Beverley stays well through relationships, laughter, prayer, presence, and ordinary self-care
Notable quotes
“If we listen long enough, people will speak. Not necessarily with words, but everybody has something to say.”
“We’re cutting out an enormous chunk of ordinary human functioning from the way that we are understanding somebody simply because they have a learning disability.”
46 min
About The Locked up Living Podcast: Surviving and thriving in prisons and other challenging environments
From the publisher's feed
Can institutional culture challenge your mental health? What if your job makes you feel shame, sadness, grief, disgust and fear? What if you are expected not to feel? Or you are expected to be…
relentlessly competitive? What it’s like to live or work in a prison? Does working with people who commit murder, child abuse and rape affect people who work in prisons and the wider criminal justice system?
How do people survive and thrive when facing significant challenges to our emotional health over a lengthy period? How do we protect ourselves and stay compassionate, loving and trusting? Importantly, how do we find and preserve hope?
Fyodor Dostoevsky wrote that “The degree of civilisation in a society can be judged by entering its prisons”. In this weekly podcast ,your hosts, David Jones (Forensic psychotherapist) and Dr Naomi Murphy (Consultant Clinical & Forensic Psychologist) hope that exploring less visible aspects of prisons will help listeners see that prisons are a window into society and let us see people not only at their worst but also at their best. We feature a rich range of guests sharing snap shots of life in prisons and take a look at hospitals, schools, sport and the police in order to learn from other institutions. We learn about challenges to human integrity and hear important lessons and heart-warming stories about survival and growth when facing adversity in harsh places. We hope that sharing our conversations can help you make changes to your own relationship with institutions that might challenge your emotional health and well-being.
Follow and connect with us and give us feedback. Let us know what you think works, and also what doesn’t. We want you to look forward to the podcast each week. We’ll also be extremely grateful for any reviews that you give us. A simple star or two or a thumbs up will do.
Email: [email protected] or connect with us on:
Substack: https://lockedupliving.substack.com
Twitter: https://twitter.com/LockedUpLiving
Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/naomimurphypsychologist/
https://www.linkedin.com/in/david-jones-41910b12/
Insta: https://www.instagram.com/lockedupliving/
How do people survive and thrive when facing significant challenges to our emotional health over a lengthy period? How do we protect ourselves and stay compassionate, loving and trusting? Importantly, how do we find and preserve hope?
Fyodor Dostoevsky wrote that “The degree of civilisation in a society can be judged by entering its prisons”. In this weekly podcast ,your hosts, David Jones (Forensic psychotherapist) and Dr Naomi Murphy (Consultant Clinical & Forensic Psychologist) hope that exploring less visible aspects of prisons will help listeners see that prisons are a window into society and let us see people not only at their worst but also at their best. We feature a rich range of guests sharing snap shots of life in prisons and take a look at hospitals, schools, sport and the police in order to learn from other institutions. We learn about challenges to human integrity and hear important lessons and heart-warming stories about survival and growth when facing adversity in harsh places. We hope that sharing our conversations can help you make changes to your own relationship with institutions that might challenge your emotional health and well-being.
Follow and connect with us and give us feedback. Let us know what you think works, and also what doesn’t. We want you to look forward to the podcast each week. We’ll also be extremely grateful for any reviews that you give us. A simple star or two or a thumbs up will do.
Email: [email protected] or connect with us on:
Substack: https://lockedupliving.substack.com
Twitter: https://twitter.com/LockedUpLiving
Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/naomimurphypsychologist/
https://www.linkedin.com/in/david-jones-41910b12/
Insta: https://www.instagram.com/lockedupliving/
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