Join Jen Kamel as she sits down with physician scientist and VBAC calculator researcher Dr. Nicholas Rubashkin, MD, PhD, an Associate Professor at UC San Francisco, to discuss the historical and cultural implications of the VBAC calculator, a tool used to predict vaginal birth after cesarean (VBAC) odds.

The conversation uncovers how the calculator has propagated racist assumptions that Black and Hispanic bodies are less capable of vaginal birth, the consequences of those assumptions on maternal care, and the problematic "60% threshold."

They explore how to shift the conversation from risk-based to goal-oriented, how problems remain even after race and ethnicity were removed from the tool, recent research out of Sweden, and the fundamental ethical issues at the root of the calculator.

The episode also addresses the concept of "controlling risk in advance," ethical implications of using surgery as a default solution, why some midwives don't use the calculator, and provides insights into future research and practices aimed at increasing equitable access to VBAC.

02:11 His Training and Background

09:25 How He Decided to Study the VBAC Calculator

11:25 Is VBAC a Political Issue?

13:38 New Limitations on Research Grants

16:48 The Many VBAC Calculators

20:37 How to Define Uterine Rupture

21:45 Race as a Risk Factor

23:28 The Power of Lived Experience in Research

25:55 It's Not Race, It's Racism

27:56 How Race & Racism Were Built Into the Calculator

29:28 Race & Ethnicity Removed from the VBAC Calculator

32:13 A New Form of Scientific Racism

33:03 Removing Race, Problems Remain

35:34 Response to VBAC Calculator Critique

38:34 Reader Q: Validate Prior FTP Cesarean

42:27 Swedish Study: 10cm FTP Diagnosis & Future VBAC Odds

43:36 Script for Using the Calculator

44:44 Reader Q: Psychosocial Elements of FTP

47:07 Science Beyond VBAC Calculator Comes From Oncology!

47:59 Calculator Contributes to Informed Consent?

51:04 Where to Start: VBAC Calculator & Informed Consent

54:01 Controlling Risk in Advance

01:01:02 The Fundamental Ethical Issue

01:03:16 The 60% Threshold

01:08:02 The "Necessity" of The 40/41-Week Scheduled Cesarean

01:10:28 Goal Oriented Conversations

Have a comment or question for the podcast? Want to suggest a guest we should interview or a topic we should discuss? Go to https://vbacfacts.com/podcast to give us your feedback!

• Contribute to the VBAC Facts® BIPOC Scholarship Fund | VBAC Facts®
• Vaginal Birth After Cesarean Calculator (MFMU)
• Episode 6 Decoding the VBAC Calculator: Science, Bias, and Decision Making | The VBAC Facts® Podcast - Apple Podcasts
• Study finds that VBAC calculators underpredict VBAC odds. They are also racially biased. | VBAC Facts®
• Sign up for your copy of the VBAC Planning Checklist! | VBAC Facts®
• Consulting for Parents, Professionals, Legal & Policy Teams │ VBAC Facts®
• Professional Speaking with Jen Kamel │ VBAC Facts®
• Sign up for your copy of the Top Three VBAC Myths! | VBAC Facts®
• Sign up for your copy of the Uterine Rupture Report! | VBAC Facts®
• The Truth About Vaginal Birth After Cesarean™ for Families | VBAC Facts® Educational Course for Parents
• VBAC Facts® Professional Membership | VBAC Facts® Continuing Education

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In the latest episode of The VBAC Facts® Podcast, Dr. Chris Stroud OB/GYN of Fort Wayne, Indiana considers his 30 year career and shares why offering VBAC is so important to him, including his reasoning for supporting community midwives who attend home and birth center VBAC. We discuss the concept of "acceptable complications," which may provide some insight as to why many OBs in the United States recommend repeat cesareans for everyone regardless of their medical history, their current clinical scenario, or VBAC candidacy. He also shares his vulnerable and authentic reflections on being sued after a uterine rupture related fetal demise and why he continues to attend VBACs. Key topics covered include his practice's secret sauce, how working with community midwives has made him a better obstetrician, what he calls the four pillars of VBAC success, and a special message for physicians who don't attend VBAC and hospital administrators who maintain VBAC bans.

00:00 Upcoming VBAC Facts® Events

01:35 Join Our Email List to Learn More About VBAC

02:16 How To Book Jen to Speak at Your Next Event

03:01 What We Will Talk About Today

08:24 When VBACs Were Required

13:21 His VBAC Philosophy

14:39 Why His Believes Offering VBAC is Important

16:28 How He Counsels Patients on VBAC vs Repeat Cesarean

19:19 The Concept of "Acceptable Complications"

24:06 Avoiding VBAC Bait & Switch

26:46 Does He Worry About VBAC Safety?

28:27 When He Induces Planned VBACs

30:06 What "Immediately Available" Means to Him

31:16 Why Aren't All Hospitals Attending VBAC?

33:53 On Not Giving Up

35:48 Voting with Your Feet

36:55 Administrative, Hospital, & Legal Challenges

40:23 Don't Leave Those with Primary Cesareans in the Dust

42:32 Questions for Non-VBAC Providers

45:42 It's the Lawsuit

47:37 His Practice's Secret Sauce

50:47 On Collaborating with Community Midwives

52:54 What He Has Learned From Community Midwives

56:00 Longest Second Stage

57:34 On Being Sued After a Uterine Rupture

59:50 Processing Trauma After a Uterine Rupture & Fetal Demise

01:03:43 On Advocating for His Patients

01:05:47 Advice: Reversing VBAC Bans

01:07:26 Four Pillars of VBAC Success

01:10:16 Parents: Most Important Thing for Them to Consider

01:11:11 A Message for Physicians Who Don't Attend VBAC

01:12:26 Message to Hospital Administrators with VBAC Bans

Have a comment or question for the podcast? Want to suggest a guest we should interview or a topic we should discuss? Go to https://vbacfacts.com/podcast to give us your feedback!

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Email Dr. Chris Stroud: [email protected]

• Home - International Cesarean Awareness Network - Learn more about ICAN's April 21, 2025 Q&A with Jen Kamel
• WARM | Washington Alliance for Responsible Midwifery | Birth is the most fundamental human rights issue. Safe and successful childbirth options are the strong foundation upon which every healthy society grows. - Register for the April 24 - 26, 2025 WARM Conference in Wenatchee, Washington and attend Jen's 3 hour training, "The VBAC Imperative: How to Improve VBAC Access and Outcomes While Decreasing Litigation Risk"
• Learn more about VBAC telemedicine with Dr Chris Stroud: Fertility & Midwifery Care Center - Fertility & Midwifery Birth Center
• Sign up for your copy of the VBAC Planning Checklist! | VBAC Facts®
• Consulting for Parents, Professionals, Legal & Policy Teams │ VBAC Facts®
• Professional Speaking with Jen Kamel │ VBAC Facts®
• Sign up for your copy of the Top Three VBAC Myths! | VBAC Facts®
• Sign up for your copy of the Uterine Rupture Report! | VBAC Facts®
• The Truth About VBAC™ for Families | VBAC Facts® Course for Cesarean Parents
• VBAC Facts® Professional Membership | VBAC Facts® Continuing Education

It's a podcast mix-up! Join VBAC Facts® Founder Jen Kamel as she is interviewed on All Things Women's Health with Dr. Chris Stroud. She will share why birth experiences matter, the impact of her births on her life, what it was like to experience a contraction for the first time, why it is so important for people to have access to VBAC after one cesarean, and her favorite VBAC myth. They also discuss recovery from a cesarean versus a vaginal birth, the concept of "acceptable risk," how shifts in physician employment can impact VBAC access, as well as what makes a cesarean hysterectomy different than a hysterectomy in the absence of pregnancy. Plus, Jen responds to some reader comments on episode 11 where we discussed a community's 10 year fight against a VBAC ban. This episode provides valuable insights for parents, healthcare professionals, and anyone interested in women's health and birthing options.

• 01:26 Reader Comments: Episode 11
• 11:07 Dr. Chris Stroud introduces Jen
• 13:38 Jen's Story
• 17:17 Baby is Transverse, What Now?
• 24:12 The Time Before Social Media
• 25:15 VBAC vs. Cesarean Postpartum
• 26:50 Abdominal Hysterectomy vs. C-Section
• 28:37 Why Jen Founded VBAC Facts®
• 31:40 "Acceptable Risk"
• 36:56 Getting into Medical Research
• 43:43 Misquoting Research
• 47:03 One Prior Cesarean is Not High Risk
• 47:46 Why Does Birth Experience Matter?
• 53:08 Transformation Through Birth
• 54:36 Where is VBAC Headed?
• 56:40 Shift of Physician Employment
• 01:02:48 What is a C-Section Hysterectomy?
• 01:05:34 Pregnant After One Cesarean? This is Your Best Shot
• 01:10:16 Favorite VBAC Myth
• 01:12:22 Advice for Parents, Nurses, and Providers

Have a comment or question for the podcast? Want to suggest a guest we should interview or a topic we should discuss? Go to https://vbacfacts.com/podcast to give us your feedback!

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• E7 40+ VBAC Myths Busted! Plus Hospital VBA2C After Uterine Defect - The VBAC Facts® Podcast - Apple Podcasts
• "Three times the risk?:" What the large Canadian VBAC study really says | VBAC Facts®
• 13 persistent myths about vaginal birth after cesarean | VBAC Facts®
• Sign up for your copy of the VBAC Planning Checklist! | VBAC Facts®
• Consulting for Parents, Professionals, Legal & Policy Teams │ VBAC Facts®
• Professional Speaking with Jen Kamel │ VBAC Facts®
• International Cesarean Awareness Network
• Sign up for your copy of the Top Three VBAC Myths! | VBAC Facts®
• Sign up for your copy of the Uterine Rupture Report! | VBAC Facts®
• The Truth About Vaginal Birth After Cesarean™ for Families | VBAC Facts® Educational Course for Parents
• VBAC Facts® Professional Membership | VBAC Facts® Continuing Education
• Vaginal birth after two cesareans (VBA2C): An overview of the evidence - VBAC Facts® Article
• Vaginal birth after three or more cesareans (VBA3C/VBAMC): An overview of the evidence - VBAC Facts® Article

What do you do when your local hospital bans vaginal birth after cesarean (VBAC) and leads people to believe that their only option there is a repeat cesarean? What about when they start to withhold pain relief to anyone who "insists" on laboring after a cesarean? When this happened in Santa Barbara, California, local activists and mothers took action. Come learn what is possible when you know the facts, know your rights, don't comply and be persistent. It's a lesson from a small beachy town that can be applied to so many other social issues. Sit down with VBAC Facts® Founder Jen Kamel and birth activist Anastasia Stone as Anastasia shares her community's 10 year journey to reverse a VBAC ban and ensure everyone had access to respectful, evidence based care. "Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world; indeed, it's the only thing that ever has." - Margaret Mead

• 01:56 How She Got Involved with Birth Work
• 02:50 Creating Relationships, Building Bridges
• 06:56 "Everyone Gets an Epidural." Why?
• 11:03 The Hospital Banned VBAC Because...
• 11:58 Educate the Community
• 18:02 Refusing a Cesarean at a VBAC Ban Hospital
• 19:31 Pushback: Denying People Epidurals
• 27:30 Most Effective Strategies
• 31:53 Free Resources
• 32:47 Biggest Challenges
• 36:35 When the VBAC Ban was Reversed
• 38:25 What Every Provider Should Do
• 40:33 The Worst Place to Labor
• 41:23 "Just Find Another Provider?"
• 43:28 Research on Provider Preference
• 45:25 "But My Doctor Won't Let Me"
• 47:50 "Wow, Something's Got to Change"
• 50:49 What She Wishes She Knew at the Beginning
• 52:16 Our Kids Are Watching Us
• 53:53 Know Your Sphere of Influence
• 56:17 Advice for Reversing VBAC Bans
• 57:58 What Birth Professionals Should Know About Reversing VBAC Bans

Have a comment or question for the podcast? Want to suggest a guest we should interview or a topic we should discuss? Go to https://vbacfacts.com/podcast to give us your feedback!

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Instagram: @prod.analogue

• Sign up for your copy of the VBAC Planning Checklist! | VBAC Facts®
• Consulting for Parents, Professionals, Legal & Policy Teams │ VBAC Facts®
• Professional Speaking with Jen Kamel │ VBAC Facts®
• Metz (2013). How do good candidates for trial of labor after cesarean (TOLAC) who undergo elective repeat cesarean differ from those who choose TOLAC? American Journal of Obstetrics & Gynecology - PubMed
• Santa Barbara Cottage Hospital Reverses Stance on VBACs, July 14, 2022 - The Santa Barbara Independent
• Protest Over Cottage Hospital's VBAC Ban, March 19, 2017 - The Santa Barbara Independent
• International Cesarean Awareness Network
• Sign up for your copy of the Top Three VBAC Myths! | VBAC Facts®
• Sign up for your copy of the Uterine Rupture Report! | VBAC Facts®
• The Truth About VBAC™ for Families | VBAC Facts® Course for Cesarean Parents
• VBAC Facts® Professional Membership | VBAC Facts® Continuing Education

Less than 3% of people labor after two cesareans in the US. Laura Stimson was one of those people. After having her first cesarean for twins and an elective repeat cesarean during COVID, she really wanted to experience a vaginal birth after two cesareans (VBA2C). A chance conversation with a midwife at a dinner party opened her eyes to what was possible. She learned that hospital midwives in her area of Downriver Detroit, Michigan attended VBA2C and made her plan. Laura shares with us what she learned along the way as she navigated gestational diabetes and a suspected big baby including her top tips for parents, what she wishes she knew, and how her births transformed not only how she viewed herself and her body, but how she engages with healthcare. She says, "After 2 caesareans (which I never wanted) I was finally able to have a successful VBA2C! I would love to share my journey, ups and downs, and how I finally was listened too!" There is power in sharing our birth stories. Join us for Laura's.

Want to suggest a guest we should interview, topic we should discuss, or share your birth story? You can at https://vbacfacts.com/podcast!

Source for 3% statistic: Dombrowski, M., Illuzzi, J. L., Reddy, U. M., et al. (2020). Trial of labor after two prior cesarean deliveries: patient and hospital characteristics and birth outcomes. Obstetrics & Gynecology, 136(1), pp.109-117.

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• What is the Evidence for Induction or C-section for a Big Baby? | Evidence Based Birth®
• The Truth About VBAC™ for Families | VBAC Facts® Course for Cesarean Parents
• VBAC Facts® Professional Membership | VBAC Facts® Continuing Education
• Dombrowski, M., Illuzzi, J. L., Reddy, U. M., et al. (2020). Trial of labor after two prior cesarean deliveries: patient and hospital characteristics and birth outcomes. Obstetrics & Gynecology, 136(1), pp.109-117.
• Vaginal birth after two cesareans (VBA2C): An overview of the evidence - VBAC Facts® Article
• The Truth About VBA2C: Risk, Rates, & Outcomes - VBAC Facts® Continuing Education Training

This episode of The VBAC Facts® Podcast features Amber Vayo, a maternal health and politics researcher and her work on medical mistrust and the importance of birth stories in shaping health policies. Vayo shares insights on the role of trust, the impact of institutional betrayal, and the significance of listening to women's experiences. The discussion highlights various facets of medical mistrust, the importance of soft skills for clinicians, and how the healthcare system can improve by better addressing grievances. Plus Jen shares a victorious hospital VBA2C story after CPD from Emilie in Alberta, Canada.

Watch for Amber's upcoming book "Birthzillas and Madwives: The Politics of Childbirth" at a store near you and listen to her podcast, Birthzillas: The Podcast.

Have a comment or question for the podcast? Want to suggest a guest we should interview or a topic we should discuss? Go to https://vbacfacts.com/podcast to give us your feedback!

Resources Mentioned

• Consulting for Parents, Professionals, Legal & Policy Teams │ VBAC Facts®
• Professional Speaking with Jen Kamel │ VBAC Facts®
• The Truth About Vaginal Birth After Cesarean™ for Families | VBAC Facts® Educational Course for Parents
• State Medical Boards: Last Week Tonight with John Oliver
• How to File a Complaint for Obstetric Violence or Mistreatment in Birth - Birth Monopoly
• VBAC Facts® Professional Membership | VBAC Facts® Continuing Education

Made with Descript!

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In this episode of The VBAC Facts® Podcast, Jen Kamel, founder of VBAC Facts®, discusses the feasibility and evidence surrounding vaginal birth after two cesareans (VBA2C). Drawing from real-life birth stories, Jen emphasizes the importance of informed decision-making and patient autonomy. She covers critical points such as the evidence supporting VBA2C, the psychological implications, the risks associated with repeat cesareans, and the barriers to accessing VBA2C. The episode also reviews recent studies (including twins after two cesareans!), ethical considerations, and the challenges faced by those seeking VBA2C. Whether you are a parent or a birth professional this comprehensive discussion offers valuable insights and resources to support informed and ethical childbirth choices.

Have a comment or question for the podcast? Want to suggest a guest we should interview or a topic we should discuss? Go to https://vbacfacts.com/podcast to give us your feedback!

Music produced by (Analogue)/(prod. Analogue).

Instagram: @prod.analogue

In this episode of The VBAC Facts® Podcast, host Jen Kamel delves into various myths and facts surrounding vaginal birth after cesarean (VBAC). Jen highlights critical information about VBAC safety, risks, and the support provided by national health organizations. She addresses common misconceptions about uterine rupture, perinatal and maternal mortality, midwives, and the risks associated with repeat cesareans. The episode features emails from listeners sharing their experiences including a reader who had a hospital vaginal birth after two cesareans and a uterine defect discovered during her first cesarean. Jen emphasizes the importance of informed decision-making, patient autonomy, and the role of evidence-based practices in improving VBAC outcomes.

Have a comment or question for the podcast? Want to suggest a guest we should interview or a topic we should discuss? Go to https://vbacfacts.com/podcast to give us your feedback!

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Learn more:

• The Truth About VBAC™ for Families | VBAC Facts® Course for Cesarean Parents
• O'Neill, S. M., Agerbo, E., Khashan, A. S., et al. (2017). Trial of labour after caesarean section and the risk of neonatal and infant death: a nationwide cohort study. BMC Pregnancy and Childbirth, 17(1).
• Vandenberghe, G., Bloemenkamp, K., Berlage, S., et al. (2018). The International Network of Obstetric Survey Systems study of uterine rupture: a descriptive multi-country population-based study. BJOG.
• Is VBAC illegal? Is homebirth illegal? - VBAC Facts® Article
• Vaginal birth after two cesareans (VBA2C): An overview of the evidence - VBAC Facts® Article
• Vaginal birth after three or more cesareans (VBA3C/VBAMC): An overview of the evidence - VBAC Facts® Article
• Single vs Double Layer Suturing: Is One Method Superior? - VBAC Facts® Continuing Education Training
• The Truth About VBA2C: Risk, Rates, & Outcomes - VBAC Facts® Continuing Education Training
• The Limited Evidence on VBA3+C: Decision Making in the Midst of Uncertainty - VBAC Facts® Continuing Education Training
• What birthing families need to know about vaginal birth after a classical or T/J incision - VBAC Facts® Article
• Too Bad We Can't Just "Ban" Accreta-The Downstream Consequences of VBAC Bans - VBAC Facts® Article
• Catastrophic uterine rupture: The risk of fetal death during planned VBAC - VBAC Facts® Article
• Landon, M. (2004). Maternal and perinatal outcomes associated with a trial of labor after prior cesarean delivery. The New England Journal of Medicine, 351(25), 2581-2589.
• Birth intervals & uterine rupture aka how long to wait to VBAC - VBAC Facts® Article
• VBAC Facts® Professional Membership - The most comprehensive VBAC curriculum for birth professionals
• "Hospitals offering VBAC are required to have 24/7 anesthesia" is false - VBAC Facts® Article
• Vaginal birth after classical incision: The true story behind the 4-9% uterine rupture rate - VBAC Facts® Article
• The Truth About VBAC™ Fetal Monitoring - VBAC Facts® Continuing Education Training
• Decoding Classical, T/J, and Low Vertical VBAC: Navigating Limited Knowledge and Unknown Risk - VBAC Facts® Continuing Education Training
• The Truth About VBAC™ Induction: How to Decrease Uterine Rupture Risk and Maximize VBAC Odds - VBAC Facts® Continuing Education Training
• Decoding Maternal Deaths: Why Birthing People Die and How We Can Turn the Tide - VBAC Facts® Continuing Education Training
• "How to Keep House While Drowning" by KC Davis - Purchasing through this link will support a Black-owned bookstore
• Consulting - VBAC Facts®
• Speaking & Training - VBAC Facts®
• California Maternal Quality Care Collaborative Toolkits

This episode with VBAC Facts® Founder Jen Kamel dives into the accuracy and impact of VBAC calculators. Jen discusses a variety of factors influencing predicted VBAC odds as well as actual VBAC rates, including race, BMI, reason for prior cesarean, bias, provider preference, and VBAC bans. Key research, such as Harris 2019, Nguyen 2020, and most recently Ledbetter 2024, reveal that VBAC calculators often underpredict VBAC odds. Hear lived experiences from readers and the challenges they face with the application of these calculators. Learn more about the strengths and limitations of VBAC calculators and their impact on informed decision-making in birthing choices. Access additional resources and training at VBACfacts.com.

• 00:22 Introduction to VBAC Calculators
• 02:30 Study Questions VBAC Accuracy: Harris 2019
• 05:47 The Role of a Prior Failure to Progress (FTP) Cesarean
• 07:31 ACOG's Labor Arrest/ FTP Definitions
• 09:48 On Calibrating VBAC Calculators Before Use
• 11:19 Impact of Race & Racism on VBAC Odds
• 14:59 Readers Share Their VBAC Calculator Experiences
• 19:27 BMI, Bias, and VBAC Calculators
• 21:20 Limitations and Misuse of VBAC Calculators
• 26:13 VBAC Calculator Latinx Accuracy: Nguyen 2020
• 27:36 VBAC Calculator Hispanic BMI Accuracy: Ledbetter 2024
• 33:50 BMI & the VBAC Calculator: A Reader's Story
• 39:17 Relevant Factors the VBAC Calculator Doesn't Consider
• 40:53 ACOG: Recruit me for the VBAC Practice Bulletin Committee
• 42:27 Questions to Ask Yourself Before You Use the VBAC Calculator
• 43:06 Final Thoughts and Resources

Mentioned on the show

• Read the companion article, see the first three VBAC calculators, and download the handout for this episode.
• Birth Monopoly's How to File A Complaint for Mistreatment in Maternity Care.
• The Maternal-Fetal Medicine Network VBAC calculator.
• "In an effort to reduce the number of primary cesareans, ACOG released new labor arrest definitions in 2014." American College of Obstetricians & Gynecologists and the Society for Maternal-Fetal Medicine. (2014). Safe prevention of the primary cesarean delivery. Obstetric Care Consensus No. 1. Obstetrics & Gynecology, 123, 693-711.
• Collins, J. W., David, R. J., Handler, A., et al. (2004). Very low birthweight in African American infants: The role of maternal exposure to interpersonal racial discrimination. American Journal of Public Health, 94(12), 2132-2138.
• Harris, B. S., Heine, P. H., Park, J., Faurot, K., Hopkins, M., Rivara, A., . . . Jelovsek, E. (2019). Are prediction models for vaginal birth after cesarean accurate? American Journal of Obstetrics & Gynecology, 220, 492.e1-7.
• Ledbetter, A., Wandtke Herrmann, T., Lupa, K., & Graupe, M. (2024). Observed Versus Predicted Vaginal Birth After Cesarean for Patients of a Community Health Center. Journal of Midwifery & Women's Health.
• Metz, T. D., Stoddard, G. J., Henry, E., et al. (2013). How do good candidates for trial of labor after cesarean (TOLAC) who undergo elective repeat cesarean differ from those who choose TOLAC? American Journal of Obstetrics & Gynecology, 208(6), 458.e1-6.
• Nguyen, M. T., Hayes-Bautista, T. M., Hsu, P., Bragg, C., Chopin, I., & Shaw, K. J. (2020). Applying a Prediction Model for Vaginal Birth after Cesarean to a Latina Inner-City Population. American Journal of Perinatology Reports, 10(02), e148-e154.
• "One study reported that half of those who had a cesarean for FTP after labor induction were not even 6 centimeters." Zhang, J., Troendle, J., Reddy, U.,et al. (2010). Contemporary cesarean delivery practice in the United States. The American Journal of Obstetrics & Gynecology, 203(4), 326.e1-326.e10.
• The Truth About VBAC™ for Families
• The Truth About VBAC™ for Professionals
• VBAC Facts® Professional Membership
• VBAC Facts® Speaking: Schedule an in-person training in your community
• VBAC Facts® Consulting: Schedule a consulting call with Jen

Have a comment or question for the podcast? Want to suggest a guest we should interview or a topic we should discuss? Go to https://vbacfacts.com/podcast to give us your feedback!

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Jen Kamel, founder of VBAC Facts®, discusses the principles of informed decision making in the context of vaginal birth after cesarean (VBAC) versus repeat cesarean. Emphasizing the ethical obligations in healthcare, Jen explores ACOG's Committee Opinion on respecting a pregnant woman's autonomy and decision-making rights. Real-life testimonials from petite readers who had successful VBACs highlight the possibilities and challenge common misconceptions. The episode also addresses ethical dilemmas, coercion, and the importance of respectful and supportive communication between healthcare providers and birthing people, especially when recommended treatments are refused.

Have a comment or question for the podcast? Want to suggest a guest we should interview or a topic we should discuss? Go to https://vbacfacts.com/podcast to give us your feedback!

VBAC Facts® resources

• Petite readers share their VBAC story on Facebook and Instagram
• American College of Obstetricians and Gynecologists. (2016). Refusal of medically recommended treatment during pregnancy. Committee Opinion No. 664. Obstetrics & Gynecology, 127, e175-82.
• Article: Vaginal birth after two cesareans (VBA2C): An overview of the evidence
• Article: Vaginal birth after three or more cesareans (VBA3C/VBAMC): An overview of the evidence
• VBAC Facts® professional membership: where we house a library of continuing education trainings including The Truth About VBAC™ for Professionals, The Limited Evidence on VBA3+C: Decision Making in the Midst of Uncertainty, and The Truth About VBA2C: Risk, Rates, & Outcomes.
• Our course for people with prior cesarean(s): "The Truth About VBAC™for Families"
• Schedule an in-person training in your community
• Schedule a consulting call with Jen

Studies mentioned

• "One study found that over half of the people who had a cesarean for FTP, failure to progress, were not six centimeters, which is one of the criteria they need to meet in order to receive that diagnosis." Zhang, J., Troendle, J., Reddy, U.,et al. (2010). Contemporary cesarean delivery practice in the United States. The American Journal of Obstetrics & Gynecology, 203(4), 326.e1-326.e10. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20708166

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