If diplomacy fails to end the unfolding humanitarian catastrophe in Nagorno-Karabakh, what’s next for the troubled region? Turkey escalated the conflict; now can it be the one to deescalate it? And will Turkey’s intervention affect Russian-Turkish cooperation in other parts of the world? Podcast host Alexander Gabuev discusses these questions and more with Tom de Waal, a senior fellow with Carnegie Europe and expert on the Nagorno-Karabakh conflict, and Sinan Ülgen, a visiting scholar at Carnegie Europe.