Getting pulled over is one of the most common interactions Americans have with police, but do routine traffic stops make our communities safer?

In this episode, we explore the real impact of traffic enforcement through powerful personal stories, expert insight, and new data from cities rethinking how policing works.

Alexander Landau shares the traffic stop that nearly cost him his life and how it led him to advocate for reform. Valerie Castile reflects on the killing of her son, Philando Castile, and the pattern of stops that preceded his death. Meanwhile, law enforcement leaders and researchers weigh-in on whether reducing low-level traffic stops can improve safety, reduce racial disparities, and protect officers.

Original airdate: August 21, 2023

GUESTS

Alexander Landau, founder and Director of Community Relations for Denver Justice Project (https://www.denverjusticeproject.org/).

Valerie Castile, mother of Philando Castile and President of the Philando Castile Relief Foundation (https://www.philandocastilefoundation.org/).

Officer Mark Ross, St. Paul police officer and President of the St. Paul Police Federation (https://sppdfederation.com/).

Dr. Thaddeus Johnson, Professor of Criminal Justice and Criminology at Georgia State University, Senior Fellow at the Council on Criminal Justice, and former Memphis police officer (https://time.com/6252760/reducing-fatal-police-encounters-traffic-stops/).

Chief Axel Henry, current Chief of Police for the Saint Paul Police Department (https://www.stpaul.gov/departments/police/administration-office-chief).

CHAPTERS

(0:00) Introduction

(0:54) Landau Stop Turns Violent

(11:49) Philando Castile Pattern

(19:22) St Paul Cuts Low Level Stops

(22:13) A Friendly Equipment Stop

(24:07) Warnings and Compliance

(25:58) Officer Safety Mindset

(26:42) Worst Case Traffic Stop

(29:02) Officer Conduct

(33:20) Low Level Stops and Staffing Crunch

(36:46) Chief Henry's Mind Change

(39:44) Reform Evidence from Fayetteville

(42:51) Incentives and AI Risks

(51:13) Trauma Informed Policing