In this episode, Larry sits down with Mary to break down one of the biggest problems facing the United States today: the chronic pain epidemic. Even with over a million personal trainers, hundreds of thousands of clinicians, and countless medical institutions, people are still falling through the cracks — stuck between incomplete medical discharge and a fitness industry unprepared to handle their limitations. Mary and Larry explain how this “gray zone” traps millions, leaving them unsure where to turn next. 

They discuss why so many people are told “this is as good as it gets,” and why that message is almost never true. From painkillers to braces, orthotics to modified gym routines, they outline how tools meant to be temporary often become permanent when there is no professional capable of guiding people out of pain. The pair break down the Active Life view that chronic pain resolution requires active participation — physical, mental, and environmental changes that create adaptations, not dependency. 

Finally, Mary shares the larger vision: a world in which people understand that living with chronic pain is a choice — but only when supported by professionals trained to guide the full journey. They explore the need for thousands more ALPs (Active Life Professionals), the gap after physical therapy where most people regress, and how Active Life’s dual mission (education + brick-and-mortar locations) will reshape the future of pain resolution.