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Critiques
Episode 10: Critiques
Critiques can be the wind beneath your wings that help you grow in incredible ways; or they can be the source of many tears, hurt feelings, and stomps out of classrooms. In this episode we will cover why you need critiques and critique groups, where to get them, how to prepare for a critique and what to avoid.
[00:00:49] What have you been working on?
We used to do this but got out of the habit and wanted to bring it back!
What projects are each of us working on?
Lee: Currently working on writing two books, and is trying to create a dummy book for both books, and trying to sell a two book deal, or at least have two options for publishers to choose from.
Will: Working with four other teachers to create classes for SVS, working on character designs for a board games and a sequel to Bonaparte Falls Apart.
Jake: Working on a figure drawing class for SVS that will be pulling the best from all of the figure drawing books to make the best class possible, on a sequel to “The Little Snowplow”, Jake and an author he worked with earlier wanted to do a sequel together and their agents were able to create a deal (stay tuned, we’re not able to announce it yet!). and sent the files for Skyheart
to the printer in China. Wahoo!
[00:06:10] Why art might not be right for your job?
We wanted to briefly touch on this subject because of a letter that we received from an artist named, Mike, in response to Episode 03: Ship Happens. Mike brought up the fact that maybe for a lot of artists out there, art is better as a hobby than a career. Mike went through all the steps and got his first art job… and he hated it. After he finished a couple of art jobs he was wondering why he didn’t want to apply for any other art jobs and didn’t know why he had such little drive and motivation. He realized that for him, and he imagines a lot of other artists making art their job isn’t the best option for them. He is does a weekly webcomic, does art for a board game company, and engages with his audience and is super happy with his art. He thought it would be nice to share with the followers of this podcast that to kill yourself to flounder in the shallow end of the professional artist career isn’t always going to pay off and doesn’t equate to success or happiness. Mike realized that he needed to have his own personal goals and stick to them. Also, that he wouldn’t be happy working on other people’s stuff. He realized that his dream was to have a stable income outside of the art industry and then have the freedom to do whatever he wanted to do with his art.
Mike brings up some good points, and essentially hit on the plight on an illustrator; that is, we spend a lot of time working for other people and helping them accomplish their dreams, while sometimes letting our own dreams stagnate.
Super successful illustrators do one or both of these things well:
Stop advertising for, stop looking for, or stop accepting work from clients that take them in the wrong direction.
Or they start doing their own projects, or a combination of the two.
To help see the perspective you can compare this to becoming a professional tennis player.
With each level of progression there are nuances and changes that need to be made, and it sometimes becomes less about the fun, sometimes you just have to practice because you need to improve.
You need to find art jobs that match who you are. Think about your skill level and what makes you happy.
That’s a side note that we wanted to hit, now time to jump into today’s episode!
[00:15:15] What are the benefits to a critique?
You need to see things from the perspective of another and that’s what critiques help us do.
Critiques are for students and professionals, alike. We all need feedback and critique. That’s how we grow. Jake was working on Skyheart and decided to redo the cover and when he posted it online he got a lot of feedback telling him that the original was better.
[00:17:17] Why you might not get an honest critique?
Sometimes we don’t get honest critiques because we don’t create the right atmosphere for the critiquer to feel comfortable giving us feedback. If they think that you want validation and not a real critique then often they’ll just tell you what you want to hear.
[00:18:29] How to find a good critique?
There are many people you can reach out to for good critiques such as previous teachers, professional artists, critique groups, small social media groups or pods, and artists at art conventional or art shows.
Art students have their previous teachers as a resource but this relationship needs to be set up when they were in school. Have you created a positive relationship for them to want to critique you later? Be a good student and be involved, it will pay dividends.
Like it or not we live in a transactional society. It helps if there is an exchange of time i.e. buying a print, helping to update their website, handle their social media posts, etc. Time is precious, see if there is something you can do for them.
Maybe you only have a critique group of your peers: be the person that gives critiques and set the foundation of a give and take relationship with your peers. On the SVS forum it is great to ask for a critique but people will be a lot more willing to give you a critique if you are also spending time to give others critiques.
You can also ask artists at conventions and art shows for feedback. Be courteous, and respectful of their time. It always helps to buy a print or something to compensate them for their time;)
[Society of
Children's Book Writers
and Illustrators] (https://www.scbwi.org/)
[00:28:22] Are you personally ready for a good critique?
How can you prepare for a good critique? You can approach critiques with a vision and a direction. Think about what your purpose for the piece is, and that will help your critiquer point you in the right direction. Provide a frame a references.
[00:30:31] Know what you need
Understand what you are asking for. Maybe you just want to be validated or maybe you really need to level up the piece you are working on. Know what you need and ask for it.
[00:31:15] Mel Milton's critique method
Mel Milton has a critique method where he only praises people when they ask for a critique, unless they really push him to give a critique and really ask for it. If they really want a critique then the flowery praise won’t be enough and they’ll push for more feedback. Showing that you really want feedback allows the critiquer to take you seriously and tell you what they really think.
Mel Milton
[00:32:30] You never know how people will react to your critique.
People sometimes cry, get angry or defensive and this is a sign that they are not ready for a critique.
[00:34:08] What not to do during a critique
Critique Repellent:
Talking too much: cutting off their comments or not letting the critiquer actually critique.
Getting upset
Being distracted and unplugged from the critiques
Arguing
[00:36:00] What to do before and during a critique
Know what you want the piece to accomplish- set a vision for where you want your piece to go
Be specific- you can ask them, “what did I nail?”, “what did I get wrong?”, etc.
Have more than one option open for critique- this helps provide a point of reference for critique and is extremely helpful
Set limitations: "What are three things I could do to improve this?" This really helps the critiquer feel open to give you three things you can improve.
Open the door for a total critique by saying “I’m willing to start this piece over”
In contrast to the “repellant” above, these things really create a positive atmosphere for receiving a critique.
[00:41:46] Break your critique into components
Lee liked to use a rubric to help provide specific critique to his students. Maybe they nailed it with the rendering and perspective but the concept was weak, or maybe they had a great concept but the values could use some work, etc.
Some fundamental things Jake looks at when giving a critique:
Gesture
Composition
Design
Volumes
Rendering
Understand your objective.
[00:46:11] How to prepare for a hard critique
When Jake worked at Blue Sky, his entire job was critiques. You would constantly draw and receive critiques. Sometimes character designs would have to go through 50 iterations before they ever settled on a final.
Come into the critique being malleable and bendable. It will free you from feeling too attached to your work.
Recognize that if you are making this a career there will be good drawings and bad drawings. Sometimes we are too invested in the time that we spent creating a single piece. Realize that one peace is a drop in the bucket of your lifetime of work. They say everyone has 10,000 bad drawings in them and so if you do a bad one, you’re like, “Sweet, I got one of those out of the way.” Then you can move onto the next drawing.
Don’t spend so much time worrying about the one brick rather than the entire wall. Go into it knowing that this isn’t the last thing you are going to create.
Don't rely on feedback from one single person, but if multiple people tell you the same thing, pay attention. You can start to understand the trends of your critique.
[00:53:23] How to participate in or find a critique group
Try to find in your area 3-5 people with the same goals as you do. As a group you will help each other achieve your goals. They could be in person or online and be composed of different creatives. Within your critique group find people who are at your level or higher, (preferably, you’re the least skilled in the group). Be accountable to this group.
Warning: if the group gets too big they become more of a cheerleading group and people will feel less impelled or comfortable to give honest critique.
Professionals need critique groups to level up and receive the feedback necessary to make work on that higher level. Try to find a local group with people who have similar goals.
[01:00:08] 5 Things to Avoid Doing In a Critique Group
Don’t show with work, but dish out critique
Take without giving
Being disrespectful
Being late: it shows selfishness
Not be overly negative
[01:03:47] Quick note about posting online
Your posts online can also be a source of critique. Based on what people commenting and also what is getting a lack of comments.
If your art doesn't get any responses that is a form of a critique. It means that you can keep at it and make something remarkable (worthy of remark).
[01:04:55] Giving a critique
Knowing your biases in your artistic tastes. For example, Lee doesn’t really love symmetrical work or anime, so he has to take that into account when he is giving a critique.
These things influence your critique and how objective it will be.
Also, reach out to certain people for different types of critique. Any critique from anyone is helpful, and a fellow artist can give you a good general critique. However, if you want a critique on your watercolor techniques then you should talk to someone else who does watercolors and they will be able to give you a more specific critique. You can get more general and more specific critiques, and both are valuable.
[01:08:17] Trust you gut.
Sometimes, you will get critiques that don’t sit right, and ultimately you need to trust your gut. Don’t change your whole style based on someone’s critique if it doesn’t feel right. However, if you want work from someone and they are asking you to change something then you probably should if you want work from that person.
Knowing what you want out of the critique will influence what you take away from it, and also the number of people giving you similar critiques.
Get critiques and be wise, what can we say more?
LINKS
svslearn.com
Jake Parker, http://mrjakeparker.com. Instagram: @jakeparker, Youtube: JakeParker44
Will Terry, http://willterry.com. Instagram: @willterryart, Youtube: WillTerryArt
Lee White, http://leewhiteillustration.com. Instagram: @leewhiteillo
forum.svslearn.com
Podcast production and editing by Aaron Dowd.
Show notes by Tanner Garlick.
3 Point Perspective Podcast is sponsored by SVSLearn.com, the place where becoming a great illustrator starts!
Click here for this episode’s links and show notes.
View all episodes
By SVSlearn.com
4.9
720720 ratings
Episode 10: Critiques
Critiques can be the wind beneath your wings that help you grow in incredible ways; or they can be the source of many tears, hurt feelings, and stomps out of classrooms. In this episode we will cover why you need critiques and critique groups, where to get them, how to prepare for a critique and what to avoid.
[00:00:49] What have you been working on?
We used to do this but got out of the habit and wanted to bring it back!
What projects are each of us working on?
Lee: Currently working on writing two books, and is trying to create a dummy book for both books, and trying to sell a two book deal, or at least have two options for publishers to choose from.
Will: Working with four other teachers to create classes for SVS, working on character designs for a board games and a sequel to Bonaparte Falls Apart.
Jake: Working on a figure drawing class for SVS that will be pulling the best from all of the figure drawing books to make the best class possible, on a sequel to “The Little Snowplow”, Jake and an author he worked with earlier wanted to do a sequel together and their agents were able to create a deal (stay tuned, we’re not able to announce it yet!). and sent the files for Skyheart
to the printer in China. Wahoo!
[00:06:10] Why art might not be right for your job?
We wanted to briefly touch on this subject because of a letter that we received from an artist named, Mike, in response to Episode 03: Ship Happens. Mike brought up the fact that maybe for a lot of artists out there, art is better as a hobby than a career. Mike went through all the steps and got his first art job… and he hated it. After he finished a couple of art jobs he was wondering why he didn’t want to apply for any other art jobs and didn’t know why he had such little drive and motivation. He realized that for him, and he imagines a lot of other artists making art their job isn’t the best option for them. He is does a weekly webcomic, does art for a board game company, and engages with his audience and is super happy with his art. He thought it would be nice to share with the followers of this podcast that to kill yourself to flounder in the shallow end of the professional artist career isn’t always going to pay off and doesn’t equate to success or happiness. Mike realized that he needed to have his own personal goals and stick to them. Also, that he wouldn’t be happy working on other people’s stuff. He realized that his dream was to have a stable income outside of the art industry and then have the freedom to do whatever he wanted to do with his art.
Mike brings up some good points, and essentially hit on the plight on an illustrator; that is, we spend a lot of time working for other people and helping them accomplish their dreams, while sometimes letting our own dreams stagnate.
Super successful illustrators do one or both of these things well:
Stop advertising for, stop looking for, or stop accepting work from clients that take them in the wrong direction.
Or they start doing their own projects, or a combination of the two.
To help see the perspective you can compare this to becoming a professional tennis player.
With each level of progression there are nuances and changes that need to be made, and it sometimes becomes less about the fun, sometimes you just have to practice because you need to improve.
You need to find art jobs that match who you are. Think about your skill level and what makes you happy.
That’s a side note that we wanted to hit, now time to jump into today’s episode!
[00:15:15] What are the benefits to a critique?
You need to see things from the perspective of another and that’s what critiques help us do.
Critiques are for students and professionals, alike. We all need feedback and critique. That’s how we grow. Jake was working on Skyheart and decided to redo the cover and when he posted it online he got a lot of feedback telling him that the original was better.
[00:17:17] Why you might not get an honest critique?
Sometimes we don’t get honest critiques because we don’t create the right atmosphere for the critiquer to feel comfortable giving us feedback. If they think that you want validation and not a real critique then often they’ll just tell you what you want to hear.
[00:18:29] How to find a good critique?
There are many people you can reach out to for good critiques such as previous teachers, professional artists, critique groups, small social media groups or pods, and artists at art conventional or art shows.
Art students have their previous teachers as a resource but this relationship needs to be set up when they were in school. Have you created a positive relationship for them to want to critique you later? Be a good student and be involved, it will pay dividends.
Like it or not we live in a transactional society. It helps if there is an exchange of time i.e. buying a print, helping to update their website, handle their social media posts, etc. Time is precious, see if there is something you can do for them.
Maybe you only have a critique group of your peers: be the person that gives critiques and set the foundation of a give and take relationship with your peers. On the SVS forum it is great to ask for a critique but people will be a lot more willing to give you a critique if you are also spending time to give others critiques.
You can also ask artists at conventions and art shows for feedback. Be courteous, and respectful of their time. It always helps to buy a print or something to compensate them for their time;)
[Society of
Children's Book Writers
and Illustrators] (https://www.scbwi.org/)
[00:28:22] Are you personally ready for a good critique?
How can you prepare for a good critique? You can approach critiques with a vision and a direction. Think about what your purpose for the piece is, and that will help your critiquer point you in the right direction. Provide a frame a references.
[00:30:31] Know what you need
Understand what you are asking for. Maybe you just want to be validated or maybe you really need to level up the piece you are working on. Know what you need and ask for it.
[00:31:15] Mel Milton's critique method
Mel Milton has a critique method where he only praises people when they ask for a critique, unless they really push him to give a critique and really ask for it. If they really want a critique then the flowery praise won’t be enough and they’ll push for more feedback. Showing that you really want feedback allows the critiquer to take you seriously and tell you what they really think.
Mel Milton
[00:32:30] You never know how people will react to your critique.
People sometimes cry, get angry or defensive and this is a sign that they are not ready for a critique.
[00:34:08] What not to do during a critique
Critique Repellent:
Talking too much: cutting off their comments or not letting the critiquer actually critique.
Getting upset
Being distracted and unplugged from the critiques
Arguing
[00:36:00] What to do before and during a critique
Know what you want the piece to accomplish- set a vision for where you want your piece to go
Be specific- you can ask them, “what did I nail?”, “what did I get wrong?”, etc.
Have more than one option open for critique- this helps provide a point of reference for critique and is extremely helpful
Set limitations: "What are three things I could do to improve this?" This really helps the critiquer feel open to give you three things you can improve.
Open the door for a total critique by saying “I’m willing to start this piece over”
In contrast to the “repellant” above, these things really create a positive atmosphere for receiving a critique.
[00:41:46] Break your critique into components
Lee liked to use a rubric to help provide specific critique to his students. Maybe they nailed it with the rendering and perspective but the concept was weak, or maybe they had a great concept but the values could use some work, etc.
Some fundamental things Jake looks at when giving a critique:
Gesture
Composition
Design
Volumes
Rendering
Understand your objective.
[00:46:11] How to prepare for a hard critique
When Jake worked at Blue Sky, his entire job was critiques. You would constantly draw and receive critiques. Sometimes character designs would have to go through 50 iterations before they ever settled on a final.
Come into the critique being malleable and bendable. It will free you from feeling too attached to your work.
Recognize that if you are making this a career there will be good drawings and bad drawings. Sometimes we are too invested in the time that we spent creating a single piece. Realize that one peace is a drop in the bucket of your lifetime of work. They say everyone has 10,000 bad drawings in them and so if you do a bad one, you’re like, “Sweet, I got one of those out of the way.” Then you can move onto the next drawing.
Don’t spend so much time worrying about the one brick rather than the entire wall. Go into it knowing that this isn’t the last thing you are going to create.
Don't rely on feedback from one single person, but if multiple people tell you the same thing, pay attention. You can start to understand the trends of your critique.
[00:53:23] How to participate in or find a critique group
Try to find in your area 3-5 people with the same goals as you do. As a group you will help each other achieve your goals. They could be in person or online and be composed of different creatives. Within your critique group find people who are at your level or higher, (preferably, you’re the least skilled in the group). Be accountable to this group.
Warning: if the group gets too big they become more of a cheerleading group and people will feel less impelled or comfortable to give honest critique.
Professionals need critique groups to level up and receive the feedback necessary to make work on that higher level. Try to find a local group with people who have similar goals.
[01:00:08] 5 Things to Avoid Doing In a Critique Group
Don’t show with work, but dish out critique
Take without giving
Being disrespectful
Being late: it shows selfishness
Not be overly negative
[01:03:47] Quick note about posting online
Your posts online can also be a source of critique. Based on what people commenting and also what is getting a lack of comments.
If your art doesn't get any responses that is a form of a critique. It means that you can keep at it and make something remarkable (worthy of remark).
[01:04:55] Giving a critique
Knowing your biases in your artistic tastes. For example, Lee doesn’t really love symmetrical work or anime, so he has to take that into account when he is giving a critique.
These things influence your critique and how objective it will be.
Also, reach out to certain people for different types of critique. Any critique from anyone is helpful, and a fellow artist can give you a good general critique. However, if you want a critique on your watercolor techniques then you should talk to someone else who does watercolors and they will be able to give you a more specific critique. You can get more general and more specific critiques, and both are valuable.
[01:08:17] Trust you gut.
Sometimes, you will get critiques that don’t sit right, and ultimately you need to trust your gut. Don’t change your whole style based on someone’s critique if it doesn’t feel right. However, if you want work from someone and they are asking you to change something then you probably should if you want work from that person.
Knowing what you want out of the critique will influence what you take away from it, and also the number of people giving you similar critiques.
Get critiques and be wise, what can we say more?
LINKS
svslearn.com
Jake Parker, http://mrjakeparker.com. Instagram: @jakeparker, Youtube: JakeParker44
Will Terry, http://willterry.com. Instagram: @willterryart, Youtube: WillTerryArt
Lee White, http://leewhiteillustration.com. Instagram: @leewhiteillo
forum.svslearn.com
Podcast production and editing by Aaron Dowd.
Show notes by Tanner Garlick.
3 Point Perspective Podcast is sponsored by SVSLearn.com, the place where becoming a great illustrator starts!
Click here for this episode’s links and show notes.
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