What happens when a liberal thinker shifts his attention from polarization to economic abundance? Ezra Klein's new book with Derek Thompson, Abundance, argues for an agenda of increased housing, infrastructure, clean energy, and innovation. But does abundance clash with polarization—or offer a way through it?

In this conversation, Ezra and Tyler discuss how the abundance agenda interacts with political polarization, whether it's is an elite-driven movement, where Ezra favors NIMBYism, the geographic distribution of US cities, an abundance-driven approach to health care, what to do about fertility decline, how the U.S. federal government might prepare for AGI, whether mass layoffs in government are justified, Ezra's recommended travel destinations, and more.

Read a full transcript enhanced with helpful links, or watch the full video.

Recorded March 7th, 2025.

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Photo Credit: (c) Lucas Foglia