From The Green Notebook

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Dr. Thais Gibson, founder of the Personal Development School and author of Learning Love, joins Joe to discuss attachment theory and how our early childhood experiences shape our relationship patterns, communication styles, and emotional well-being throughout our lives.

Joe and Dr. Gibson explore what shaped her journey into attachment work—including her own experience as a fearful avoidant individual—and how understanding attachment theory became transformative for her personal relationships and professional practice. They discuss the foundational concept that attachment styles are subconscious "rules" we learn about love, developed primarily in our first 0-8 years of life through repetitive emotional experiences.

Throughout the conversation, they examine how our subconscious mind (responsible for 95% of our beliefs, thoughts, and actions) drives behaviors we don't consciously recognize, and how our "reality lens"—shaped by core wounds and past experiences—filters how we interpret the world around us. They explore the critical distinction between conscious awareness and subconscious programming, using relatable examples of how anxious individuals might catastrophize when a partner doesn't return a call, while dismissive avoidants remain unbothered by the same situation.

They also discuss the four attachment styles in depth: secure attachment (roughly 50% of the population, characterized by the longest-lasting and most fulfilling relationships), anxious attachment (driven by fears of abandonment and rejection), dismissive avoidant (rooted in childhood emotional neglect and fear of emotional vulnerability), and fearful avoidant (combining both anxious and avoidant traits, often stemming from significant childhood trauma or instability).

Joe and Dr. Gibson also discuss:

• The Gibson Integrated Attachment Theory (IAT) Profile
• How attachment styles affect the workplace
• The power struggle stage of relationships
• Core wound reprogramming
• Negative versus positive framing in communication
• Boundary-setting challenges
• The role of emotional literacy

Whether you're navigating a long-distance military relationship, struggling to understand why certain patterns keep repeating across your relationships, or simply curious about why you react the way you do in moments of conflict, this conversation offers lessons on understanding your subconscious programming, recognizing how your past shapes your present, rewiring core wounds at the neurological level, and building the emotional literacy needed for healthier relationships and a more fulfilling life.

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Lee Roberts, Chancellor of the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill, joins Joe to discuss leadership, service, and what it takes to lead a large and complex institution.

Joe and Chancellor Roberts discuss the experiences that shaped his approach to leadership, beginning with growing up as the son of two journalists and continuing through a career that has included business, investment, public service, and now higher education.

Throughout the conversation, they explore what Roberts learned from entering higher education as an outsider, how leaders develop and communicate a vision across organizations with many different stakeholders, and why he places such a premium on getting out of the office, walking around campus, and seeing things for himself.

They also discuss UNC's relationship with the military, Roberts' visit to Fort Bragg, and the university's selection as a partner for the Senior Service College Fellowship. Roberts shares what he believes senior military leaders and university faculty can learn from one another and how that relationship can strengthen both communities.

Joe and Chancellor Roberts also discuss:

• The role fitness plays in managing the demands of leadership
• How artificial intelligence will change higher education
• What universities need to get right about AI
• The books that have influenced the way he thinks about leadership

Whether you're leading a military formation, a business, a university, or any organization with competing priorities and stakeholders, this conversation offers lessons on presence, vision, service, and the responsibility that comes with leading an institution bigger than yourself.

A special thanks to this week's sponsors!

Veteran-founded Adyton. Step into the next generation of equipment management with Log-E by Adyton. Whether you are doing monthly inventories or preparing for deployment, Log-E is your pocket property book, giving real-time visibility into equipment status and mission readiness. Learn more about how Log-E can revolutionize your property tracking process here!

Meet ROGER Bank—a modern, digital bank built for military members, by military members. With early payday, no fees, high-yield accounts, and real support, it’s banking that gets you. Funds are FDIC insured through Citizens Bank of Edmond, so you can bank with confidence and peace of mind. 

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Michael Eck, author of Strike Season, joins Joe to tell the remarkable true story of a high school football team that suddenly found itself without coaches in the middle of a championship season.

When a teachers’ strike pulled the coaching staff off the field, Michael and his teammates faced the possibility of losing not only their season, but also college scholarships and opportunities to play at the next level. So they made an audacious decision: they would coach themselves.

For five weeks, a group of 16- and 17-year-olds ran their own practices, called their own plays, managed their own discipline, and somehow went 5–0 while allowing just one touchdown.

Michael shares what that experience taught him about leadership, trust, adversity, and responsibility—including the complicated example of Coach Walker, who stood with the teachers’ union while refusing to abandon his players.

It’s a story about what happens when the plan falls apart, no one is coming to rescue you, and you have to figure out how to lead before you feel ready.

A special thanks to this week's sponsors!

Veteran-founded Adyton. Step into the next generation of equipment management with Log-E by Adyton. Whether you are doing monthly inventories or preparing for deployment, Log-E is your pocket property book, giving real-time visibility into equipment status and mission readiness. Learn more about how Log-E can revolutionize your property tracking process here!

Meet ROGER Bank—a modern, digital bank built for military members, by military members. With early payday, no fees, high-yield accounts, and real support, it’s banking that gets you. Funds are FDIC insured through Citizens Bank of Edmond, so you can bank with confidence and peace of mind. 

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Olivia Fox Cabane, author of the international bestseller The Charisma Myth, joins Joe to explore the science and practice of charisma—what it really is, why the biggest myths about it persist, and how anyone can deliberately develop it.

This episode dismantles the idea that charisma is an innate, magical quality reserved for a lucky few. Olivia shows that charisma is a set of learned behaviors built on three core elements—presence, power, and warmth—that can be dialed up or down depending on personality, situation, and goals. She explains how these elements work together (much like sugar, fat, and salt) to create the powerful effect we label “charisma,” and why first impressions form in under two seconds largely through body language rather than status symbols or titles.

Olivia also unpacks the internal work required: managing the inner critic, dismantling imposter syndrome, using visualization and gratitude to shift mindset, and practicing self-compassion so confidence (and therefore power) can show up externally. She shares practical tools for presence (from a two-second toe focus to short meditation), warmth, and power, while warning about the real downsides of leaving the “charisma switch” on too long—people oversharing, leaders persuading others of flawed ideas, and the emotional cost of constant high output.

Joe and Olivia also discuss:

• Why presence, power, and warmth must all reach a minimum threshold, yet different “flavors” of charisma (authority, kindness, visionary, etc.) emerge from which element is strongest 
• How body language consistently outweighs titles, cars, or clothing in conveying power 
• Why distraction (especially phones) instantly kills charisma and how even a 17-millisecond delay in facial response registers as inauthentic 
• The role of self-criticism as the biggest inhibitor of power—and why self-compassion and instant self-forgiveness are essential tools 
• Practical ways to combat imposter syndrome: destigmatize it, detach from the feeling, and reframe it as useful fuel 
• Visualization techniques (and gratitude practices) for generating genuine warmth before walking into a room 
• How to accept compliments so the other person feels good for giving them 
• Emotional contagion in leadership and why a leader’s calm under stress can steady an entire team 
• The surprising science of voice, online charisma (bandwidth, camera angle, gesturing even when unseen), and why lower pitch is not inherently more charismatic 
• The darker sides of high charisma: over-persuasion of bad ideas, people getting “hooked,” and the need to sometimes dial it down 
• Why self-regulation is the single most important underlying skill

This episode is for anyone who wants to become more influential, present, and effective—whether in leadership, sales, interviews, or everyday interactions—without relying on status or personality luck. It is also for those who already feel charismatic and want to use the skill more deliberately and responsibly, for founders and managers seeking healthier team dynamics, and for anyone ready to treat charisma as a trainable set of behaviors rather than a fixed trait.

A special thanks to this week's sponsors!

Veteran-founded Adyton. Step into the next generation of equipment management with Log-E by Adyton. Whether you are doing monthly inventories or preparing for deployment, Log-E is your pocket property book, giving real-time visibility into equipment status and mission readiness. Learn more about how Log-E can revolutionize your property tracking process here!

Meet ROGER Bank—a modern, digital bank built for military members, by military members. With early payday, no fees, high-yield accounts, and real support, it’s banking that gets you. Funds are FDIC insured through Citizens Bank of Edmond, so you can bank with confidence and peace of mind. 

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On the fifth anniversary of the U.S. withdrawal from Afghanistan, General (Ret.) Scott Miller, the final commander of U.S. and NATO forces in Afghanistan, joins Joe for a candid conversation about the war, its ending, and what we owe the people who served there.

General Miller reflects on watching Afghanistan collapse after he left the country, the anger he carried afterward, and why he ultimately decided not to let that anger define the rest of his life. He also addresses the questions many veterans still wrestle with: Was it worth it? What should we be proud of? And what lessons must we carry forward?

Joe and General Miller also discuss:

• The habits General Miller believes veterans should carry with them into civilian life
• How watching the fall of Afghanistan affected him personally
• What Task Force Ranger taught General Miller about loss, brotherhood, trust, and learning from combat
• The responsibility veterans have to remember the fallen and stay connected with their families
• Why learning lessons may be more valuable than simply assigning blame
• How repeated rotations and a lack of continuity hurt America’s understanding of Afghanistan
• General Miller’s perspective on the closure of Bagram and the risks involved in keeping it open
• Why senior-leader accountability is essential to maintaining trust in institutions
• The difference between winning tactical battles and achieving strategic objectives
• Why any serious assessment of a war has to begin with the objectives leaders were actually given
• What General Miller believes a successful transition looks like five years after leaving the Army

This episode is for veterans still making sense of Afghanistan, the leaders responsible for learning from it, and anyone who has struggled to reconcile honorable service with a painful outcome. Five years later, the question is not only what happened in Afghanistan, but what we choose to learn from it—and what those who served there choose to carry forward.

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George Barrios, former co-president of World Wrestling Entertainment (WWE), co-founder and co-CEO of Isos Capital Management, and author of Sometimes Wrong, But Never in Doubt, joins Joe to explore leadership, preparation, reinvention, and what it takes to transform an organization.

This episode examines George’s unconventional path from nearly failing out of high school to becoming one of the key executives behind WWE’s evolution into a global media and entertainment company. George reflects on the influence of his Cuban immigrant parents, the people who redirected his life, and the lessons he carried from each stage of his career.

George also explains why conviction should come from preparation rather than bravado. He shares how deep research, systems thinking, and a willingness to understand every part of a business helped him and Michelle Wilson recognize opportunities others could not yet see.

Joe and George also discuss:

• Why life should be viewed as a movie rather than a single photograph
• How George’s parents shaped his approach to work, learning, and adversity
• Why leaders must understand the box before they can think outside of it
• Why a short presentation may require hundreds of pages of preparation
• The difference between confidence and unsupported certainty
• Why people often want the position but not the work required to earn it
• The emotional journey of building something meaningful
• Why reading widely helps leaders connect ideas across industries
• Why experts can explain how a system works but may struggle to imagine how it could change
• What George learned from working alongside Vince McMahon and Michelle Wilson
• How George thinks about failure, reputation, reinvention, and rewriting the ending

This episode is for leaders, entrepreneurs, and problem-solvers who want to think more deeply, prepare more thoroughly, and pursue difficult work with conviction. It is also for anyone whose life has not followed a straight path and needs the reminder that one bad photograph does not define the entire movie.

Watch the full interview on YouTube

A special thanks to this week's sponsors!

Veteran-founded Adyton. Step into the next generation of equipment management with Log-E by Adyton. Whether you are doing monthly inventories or preparing for deployment, Log-E is your pocket property book, giving real-time visibility into equipment status and mission readiness. Learn more about how Log-E can revolutionize your property tracking process here!

Meet ROGER Bank—a modern, digital bank built for military members, by military members. With early payday, no fees, high-yield accounts, and real support, it’s banking that gets you. Funds are FDIC insured through Citizens Bank of Edmond, so you can bank with confidence and peace of mind. 

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Michael Kloepper, former commander of the 173rd Airborne Brigade and current Brigade Tactical Officer at the United States Military Academy, joins Joe to explore leadership, readiness, and the responsibility to pass hard-earned lessons to the next generation.

This episode examines what it means for a generation of leaders shaped by more than two decades of war to “empty the rucksack” before leaving the Army. Michael reflects on the urgency he and many of his peers feel to pass on what they learned through success, failure, command, and combat so future generations do not have to repeat the same mistakes.

Colonel Kloepper also shares how his experiences in battalion and brigade command shaped his views on mental, physical, and spiritual readiness. Rather than simply pointing soldiers toward more resources, he believes leaders and chains of command have a responsibility to create healthier organizations. He explains how programs built around outdoor challenges, shared hardship, reflection, and time with teammates helped reduce high-risk behavior while strengthening trust and readiness.

Joe and Michael also discuss:

• Why learning organizations must do more than collect information
• Why leaders should invest in people before problems occur instead of only responding afterward
• How shared challenges and time outdoors can strengthen teams and reduce destructive behavior
• Why people fight for what they believe in
• Why accessibility matters, especially when information is not moving through the chain of command
• The difference between highlighting problems and becoming a reactionary leader
• Why presence remains one of the most important qualities of leadership
• What lieutenants and captains should understand about character, toughness, command authority, and example
• What Mike has learned from leading and developing cadets at West Point

This episode is for leaders who want to build stronger organizations, invest more deeply in their people, and pass hard-earned lessons forward. It is also for veterans reflecting on what their service meant, commanders trying to create healthier teams, and anyone who believes leadership begins with presence, trust, and the willingness to stand alongside people when things are hard.

Watch the interview on YouTube

A special thanks to this week's sponsors!

Dunedain Systems is a veteran-founded defense technology company building Warmind, an AI platform that accelerates military planning, operations, and document generation. Warmind connects to your unit’s data and learns how your warfighting function operates, delivering outputs tailored to your SOPs and operational context rather than generic AI responses. Whether your team is building OPORDs, running intel workflows, or generating CONOPs, Warmind handles the heavy lift so your staff can focus on decisions, not paperwork. Built by combat veterans who lived the problem firsthand, Warmind is already in use across SOCOM and the broader DoD. The beta is free for anyone with a .mil or .edu email at dunedainsystems.com.

Veteran-founded Adyton. Step into the next generation of equipment management with Log-E by Adyton. Whether you are doing monthly inventories or preparing for deployment, Log-E is your pocket property book, giving real-time visibility into equipment status and mission readiness. Learn more about how Log-E can revolutionize your property tracking process here!

Meet ROGER Bank—a modern, digital bank built for military members, by military members. With early payday, no fees, high-yield accounts, and real support, it’s banking that gets you. Funds are FDIC insured through Citizens Bank of Edmond, so you can bank with confidence and peace of mind. 

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Steven Pressfield, bestselling author of Gates of Fire, the War of Art, A Man at Arms, and The Arcadian, joins Joe to explore writing, resistance, and the soldier’s long search for peace.

This episode examines the story behind The Arcadian, Pressfield’s latest novel featuring Telamon, a warrior cursed to live lifetime after lifetime as a soldier. Steve shares how the seed for the book began with a quote from Empedocles that he carried with him for more than forty years before finally discovering the story it was meant to become.

Steve and Joe discuss why the idea of a cursed soldier resonates so deeply, especially with those who have served. Telamon’s journey is not just a story about war, exile, or violence. It is about the burden many people carry, the search for redemption, and the hope that we can become something more than the roles we have played for so long.

Steve also reflects on losing his home in the Palisades fire while working on the book and how writing became a refuge during that difficult season. What could have become another form of resistance instead became proof of the very ideas he has spent decades teaching: that the work can save us, steady us, and call us back to ourselves.

Joe and Steve also discuss:

• The connection between soldiers, exile, redemption, and the search for peace
• Why “life is warfare and a journey far from home”
• Why animals and children often carry the divine in stories
• Why great stories often begin with the question “What if?”
• What it means to start over, kill the ego, and become an apprentice again
• Why Steve believes nearly every great story is, in some way, a redemption story

This episode is for anyone who has carried a burden longer than they expected, walked away from a life that once defined them, or wondered whether peace is possible after years of fighting. It is also for writers, leaders, veterans, and readers who believe that stories can help us make sense of exile, suffering, hope, and the long road home.

Watch the full interview on YouTube

A special thanks to this week's sponsors!

Dunedain Systems is a veteran-founded defense technology company building Warmind, an AI platform that accelerates military planning, operations, and document generation. Warmind connects to your unit’s data and learns how your warfighting function operates, delivering outputs tailored to your SOPs and operational context rather than generic AI responses. Whether your team is building OPORDs, running intel workflows, or generating CONOPs, Warmind handles the heavy lift so your staff can focus on decisions, not paperwork. Built by combat veterans who lived the problem firsthand, Warmind is already in use across SOCOM and the broader DoD. The beta is free for anyone with a .mil or .edu email at dunedainsystems.com.

Veteran-founded Adyton. Step into the next generation of equipment management with Log-E by Adyton. Whether you are doing monthly inventories or preparing for deployment, Log-E is your pocket property book, giving real-time visibility into equipment status and mission readiness. Learn more about how Log-E can revolutionize your property tracking process here!

Meet ROGER Bank—a modern, digital bank built for military members, by military members. With early payday, no fees, high-yield accounts, and real support, it’s banking that gets you. Funds are FDIC insured through Citizens Bank of Edmond, so you can bank with confidence and peace of mind. 

Send us Fan Mail

Brooke Taylor, author of Healing the Success Wound, joins Joe to explore the hidden pain that comes from mistaking achievement, productivity, and success for self-worth.

This episode examines the “success wound,” the belief that our worth is tied to what we produce, accomplish, or achieve rather than who we are. Brooke shares her own story of growing up in Silicon Valley, chasing gold stars, working at Google, and realizing that external success could not fill the emptiness underneath. What looked impressive on the outside was, internally, driven by a deep need for approval, validation, and belonging.

Brooke explains how high achievers often become trapped in a cycle of striving, proving, pleasing, hiding, or numbing. They keep reaching the next promotion, assignment, title, or milestone, only to find that the satisfaction never lasts. Over time, that pattern can lead to burnout, anxiety, substance abuse, chronic stress, and a distorted sense of identity.

Joe and Brooke also discuss:

• Why achievement can become a substitute for self-worth
• The difference between self-confidence and self-worth
• Why many high performers are only as good as their last piece of feedback
• The five success wound archetypes: the grinder, the hider, the pleaser, the seeker, and the work-hard-play-hard
• How military leaders can confuse identity with rank, role, branch, or assignment
• Why values are essential for making better career and life decisions
• How aligned ambition allows leaders to pursue meaningful work without being driven by fear, scarcity, or the need to prove themselves

This episode is for anyone who has achieved the thing they thought would finally make them feel whole, only to realize the finish line moved again. It is also for leaders, professionals, parents, and high performers who want to understand what is driving their ambition, how to separate their worth from their work, and how to build a life and career from a place of alignment instead of anxiety.

Watch the entire interview on YouTube

A special thanks to this week's sponsors!

Dunedain Systems is a veteran-founded defense technology company building Warmind, an AI platform that accelerates military planning, operations, and document generation. Warmind connects to your unit’s data and learns how your warfighting function operates, delivering outputs tailored to your SOPs and operational context rather than generic AI responses. Whether your team is building OPORDs, running intel workflows, or generating CONOPs, Warmind handles the heavy lift so your staff can focus on decisions, not paperwork. Built by combat veterans who lived the problem firsthand, Warmind is already in use across SOCOM and the broader DoD. The beta is free for anyone with a .mil or .edu email at dunedainsystems.com.

Veteran-founded Adyton. Step into the next generation of equipment management with Log-E by Adyton. Whether you are doing monthly inventories or preparing for deployment, Log-E is your pocket property book, giving real-time visibility into equipment status and mission readiness. Learn more about how Log-E can revolutionize your property tracking process here!

Meet ROGER Bank—a modern, digital bank built for military members, by military members. With early payday, no fees, high-yield accounts, and real support, it’s banking that gets you. Funds are FDIC insured through Citizens Bank of Edmond, so you can bank with confidence and peace of mind. 

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Geoffrey Cain, author of Steve Jobs in Exile, joins Joe to explore one of the most overlooked chapters in Steve Jobs’ life: the twelve years between his fall from Apple and his return to build one of the most influential companies in the world.

This episode looks beyond the familiar story of the iPhone, iPod, and Apple’s second act to examine the wilderness years that shaped Jobs into the leader we remember today. After being pushed out of Apple in 1985, Jobs was forced to confront failure, ego, rejection, and the limits of vision without discipline. What followed was a long and painful period of experimentation, mistakes, personal transformation, and eventual renewal through NeXT and Pixar.

Geoffrey explains why the Steve Jobs who founded Apple was not the same Steve Jobs who returned in 1997. As a young leader, Jobs was brilliant but difficult, convinced of his own vision but often unable to listen to the people around him. At NeXT, that ego led to missed opportunities, broken relationships, and expensive failure. But over time, those same failures began to teach him the lessons he needed most: focus, discipline, humility, execution, and the ability to work within the limits of reality.

Joe and Geoffrey also discuss:

• Why Steve Jobs’ time away from Apple was not wasted, but formative
• How NeXT helped lay the foundation for the Apple products we use today
• Why genius without discipline can end in expensive failure
• How Jobs’ ego hurt NeXT and nearly destroyed his second act
• What Pixar taught Jobs about trust, creative restraint, and letting talented people do their work
• Why failure can become the foundation for future success
• How the “wilderness years” shape leaders before they return stronger
• Why Jobs came back to Apple quieter, more focused, and more willing to listen
• What leaders can learn from Jobs’ journey through failure, reinvention, and return

This episode is for anyone who has ever gone through a hard season and wondered whether it was wasted. It’s also for leaders, builders, creatives, and entrepreneurs who want to better understand how failure, if we are willing to learn from it, can become the preparation for our most important work.

A special thanks to this week's sponsors!

Dunedain Systems is a veteran-founded defense technology company building Warmind, an AI platform that accelerates military planning, operations, and document generation. Warmind connects to your unit’s data and learns how your warfighting function operates, delivering outputs tailored to your SOPs and operational context rather than generic AI responses. Whether your team is building OPORDs, running intel workflows, or generating CONOPs, Warmind handles the heavy lift so your staff can focus on decisions, not paperwork. Built by combat veterans who lived the problem firsthand, Warmind is already in use across SOCOM and the broader DoD. The beta is free for anyone with a .mil or .edu email at dunedainsystems.com.

Veteran-founded Adyton. Step into the next generation of equipment management with Log-E by Adyton. Whether you are doing monthly inventories or preparing for deployment, Log-E is your pocket property book, giving real-time visibility into equipment status and mission readiness. Learn more about how Log-E can revolutionize your property tracking process here!

Meet ROGER Bank—a modern, digital bank built for military members, by military members. With early payday, no fees, high-yield accounts, and real support, it’s banking that gets you. Funds are FDIC insured through Citizens Bank of Edmond, so you can bank with confidence and peace of mind.