Ken "Magma" Marshall and David Bain discuss how rather than focusing on SEO, you should focus on HEO. "Human Engagement Optimization"Discussion points include:What is "Human Engagement Optimization"?How do you focus on creating web content with the user intent and needs in mind?Show should you use AI / ML?How do you know what your user or customer expects?How do you ensure that you are delivering excellent experiences?Why will Keyword data matter less?How do you get more sophisticated around attribution?How do you know which keywords have made a company most profitable?How do you measure "Human Engagement Optimization"?

Ken "Magma" Marshall and David Bain discuss how rather than focusing on SEO, you should focus on HEO. "Human Engagement Optimization" Discussion points include: What is "Human Engagement Optimization"? How do you focus on creating web content with the user intent and needs in mind? Show should you use AI / ML? How do you know what your user or customer expects? How do you ensure that you are delivering excellent experiences? Why will Keyword data matter less? How do you get more sophisticated around attribution? How do you know which keywords have made a company most profitable? How do you measure "Human Engagement Optimization"?

Rather than SEO, focus on HEO. "Human Engagement Optimization" - with Ken "Magma" Marshall

SEO is continuing to change at an alarming pace. And yet, in some sense, the principles of good SEO remain the same.
Hello, and welcome to SEO in 2025 – a significant repository of current thinking from many of the world’s leading SEOs.
We're pleased to be able to welcome you to the fourth book and fourth series in this podcast, now well and truly an annual tradition, brought to you by Majestic.

“Consider this book the Bible of SEO—a comprehensive, fresh, and highly actionable resource that sets the standard in the industry each year.”
PAM AUNGST CRONIN
President/Owner, PamAnnMarketing.com

“SEOin2025 is the best up-to-date, comprehensive resource out there to understand the main SEO trends and how to stay ahead next year.”
ALEYDA SOLIS
International SEO Consultant & Founder, Orainti

“I’ve been participating in this series for years now and have found the value to be consistently high!”
KEVIN INDIG
Growth Consultant, Kevin-Indig.com

“The ‘SEO in’ series has become my annual touchstone to get an overview of what some of the best in the industry are thinking.”
MARK WILLIAMS-COOK
Director, AlsoAsked/Candour

“The SEO in 2022, 2023, 2024 and now 2025 is by far my favorite way to refresh my SEO knowledge and get some inspiration before the new year. It is also super helpful for planning priorities or things to test in the following year. That's the book for December! Thank you for this initiative. I don't think this is definitely the best of the best books with SEO tips.”
OLGA ZARR
SEO Consultant at SEOSLY

“David's annual edition where the world’s leading SEOs share their number 1, actionable tip is an essential book for any digital marketer who wants to create actionable and valuable strategies for the year ahead and am honoured to be part of 2025's edition. The different skillsets of selected SEOs mean you'll be spoilt for choice on the different approaches to SEO and how they are valuable to you, your business and you clients.”
ALEX MOSS
Principal SEO, Yoast & Co-Founder, FireCask

“Once again, David has brought together some of the brightest minds in the industry and squeezed them together to produce raw, distilled insight. This is a must-read for anybody wanting to get ahead online.”
JONO ALDERSON
Independent Technical SEO Consultant

“The annual SEO book by Majestic and David is truly the ultimate SEO cheat code of the year! It's packed with timeless strategies and smart approaches—no shortcuts here, just solid insights for sustainable success. Whether you're a beginner or a seasoned pro, this book has something for everyone. I'm honoured to be part of a community of elite SEOs sharing our knowledge to help others succeed. This is a must-read!”
DRE DE VERA
Host/Producer, SEO Video Show

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SEO is continuing to change at an alarming pace. And yet, in some sense, the principles of good SEO remain the same. Hello, and welcome to SEO in 2025 – a significant repository of current thinking from many of the world’s leading SEOs. We're pleased to be able to welcome you to the fourth book and fourth series in this podcast, now well and truly an annual tradition, brought to you by Majestic. “Consider this book the Bible of SEO—a comprehensive, fresh, and highly actionable resource that sets the standard in the industry each year.” PAM AUNGST CRONIN President/Owner, PamAnnMarketing.com “SEOin2025 is the best up-to-date, comprehensive resource out there to understand the main SEO trends and how to stay ahead next year.” ALEYDA SOLIS International SEO Consultant & Founder, Orainti “I’ve been participating in this series for years now and have found the value to be consistently high!” KEVIN INDIG Growth Consultant, Kevin-Indig.com “The ‘SEO in’ series has become my annual touchstone to get an overview of what some of the best in the industry are thinking.” MARK WILLIAMS-COOK Director, AlsoAsked/Candour “The SEO in 2022, 2023, 2024 and now 2025 is by far my favorite way to refresh my SEO knowledge and get some inspiration before the new year. It is also super helpful for planning priorities or things to test in the following year. That's the book for December! Thank you for this initiative. I don't think this is definitely the best of the best books with SEO tips.” OLGA ZARR SEO Consultant at SEOSLY “David's annual edition where the world’s leading SEOs share their number 1, actionable tip is an essential book for any digital marketer who wants to create actionable and valuable strategies for the year ahead and am honoured to be part of 2025's edition. The different skillsets of selected SEOs mean you'll be spoilt for choice on the different approaches to SEO and how they are valuable to you, your business and you clients.” ALEX MOSS Principal SEO, Yoast & Co-Founder, FireCask “Once again, David has brought together some of the brightest minds in the industry and squeezed them together to produce raw, distilled insight. This is a must-read for anybody wanting to get ahead online.” JONO ALDERSON Independent Technical SEO Consultant “The annual SEO book by Majestic and David is truly the ultimate SEO cheat code of the year! It's packed with timeless strategies and smart approaches—no shortcuts here, just solid insights for sustainable success. Whether you're a beginner or a seasoned pro, this book has something for everyone. I'm honoured to be part of a community of elite SEOs sharing our knowledge to help others succeed. This is a must-read!” DRE DE VERA Host/Producer, SEO Video Show

SEO is continuing to change at an alarming pace. And yet, in some sense, the principles of good SEO remain the same.
Hello, and welcome to SEO in 2025 – a significant repository of current thinking from many of the world’s leading SEOs.
We're pleased to be able to welcome you to the fourth book and fourth series in this podcast, now well and truly an annual tradition, brought to you by Majestic.

“Consider this book the Bible of SEO—a comprehensive, fresh, and highly actionable resource that sets the standard in the industry each year.”
PAM AUNGST CRONIN
President/Owner, PamAnnMarketing.com

“SEOin2025 is the best up-to-date, comprehensive resource out there to understand the main SEO trends and how to stay ahead next year.”
ALEYDA SOLIS
International SEO Consultant &amp; Founder, Orainti

“I’ve been participating in this series for years now and have found the value to be consistently high!”
KEVIN INDIG
Growth Consultant, Kevin-Indig.com

“The ‘SEO in’ series has become my annual touchstone to get an overview of what some of the best in the industry are thinking.”
MARK WILLIAMS-COOK
Director, AlsoAsked/Candour

“The SEO in 2022, 2023, 2024 and now 2025 is by far my favorite way to refresh my SEO knowledge and get some inspiration before the new year. It is also super helpful for planning priorities or things to test in the following year. That's the book for December! Thank you for this initiative. I don't think this is definitely the best of the best books with SEO tips.”
OLGA ZARR
SEO Consultant at SEOSLY

“David's annual edition where the world’s leading SEOs share their number 1, actionable tip is an essential book for any digital marketer who wants to create actionable and valuable strategies for the year ahead and am honoured to be part of 2025's edition. The different skillsets of selected SEOs mean you'll be spoilt for choice on the different approaches to SEO and how they are valuable to you, your business and you clients.”
ALEX MOSS
Principal SEO, Yoast &amp; Co-Founder, FireCask

“Once again, David has brought together some of the brightest minds in the industry and squeezed them together to produce raw, distilled insight. This is a must-read for anybody wanting to get ahead online.”
JONO ALDERSON
Independent Technical SEO Consultant

“The annual SEO book by Majestic and David is truly the ultimate SEO cheat code of the year! It's packed with timeless strategies and smart approaches—no shortcuts here, just solid insights for sustainable success. Whether you're a beginner or a seasoned pro, this book has something for everyone. I'm honoured to be part of a community of elite SEOs sharing our knowledge to help others succeed. This is a must-read!”
DRE DE VERA
Host/Producer, SEO Video Show

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Rather than SEO, focus on HEO. "Human Engagement Optimization" - with Ken "Magma" Marshall

Rather than SEO, focus on HEO. "Human Engagement Optimization" - with Ken "Magma" Marshall

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