Sales Gravy: Jeb Blount

On this episode of the Sales Gravy Podcast, Jim Karrh, Ph.D. and Jeb Blount discuss the essentials of sales messaging, how poor communication skills damage your brand, the stories we tell ourselves and our prospective customers, and what the advent of automation tools like Chat GPT means for salespeople. You’ll learn how to translate marketing messages into effective sales conversations, whether in person, virtually, or over the phone.

In today’s market, it’s increasingly difficult to find and take full advantage of precious sales opportunities. That’s why it’s so important to prioritize positioning and lead the conversation to close more deals.

At the University of Alabama, Jim Karrh, Ph.D. teaches coursework around innovative marketing and sales messaging. His curriculum is informed by his background in B2B consulting and his previous experience as a CMO for a private company.

During his time as a CMO, Jim became frustrated with the sales team’s inability to effectively communicate the brand’s core messaging to both their direct sales team and independent distributors.

This experience led Jim to focus on bridging the gap between marketing and sales in his consulting work with B2B sales teams. Now, Jim uses his understanding of communication and psychology to help improve the practical day-to-day realities of salespeople and sales leaders.

Salespeople, even those with a college education, often face challenges with writing. If you’re a leader and observe this trend within your organization, rest assured you’re not alone. Nonetheless, writing and communication skills hold immense value and should be seamlessly integrated into your sales training and coaching efforts.

It’s common for individuals to believe they lack writing ability, but in roles like sales, management, or leadership, writing is an essential skill—and usually an untapped secret weapon.

Writing compels you to structure your ideas coherently, enhancing focus on essential aspects, connecting concepts, establishing sequence, refining structure, and avoiding unnecessary wordiness. This process instills discipline, thereby fostering improved thinking and communication. Sadly, it’s a rare skill and discipline in today’s professional landscape.

The importance of writing extends beyond mere formality; it reflects our value as professionals. Throughout the selling process and in the eyes of customers, how we sound and come across in writing can significantly influence judgments.

Teams often need to revisit this aspect as people may not possess the ability to write naturally due to a lack of prior teaching or experience. By addressing this deficit and incorporating writing development into training, individuals can unlock their full potential as effective communicators and salespeople.

If you’re a Chief Marketing Officer (CMO), your salespeople can damage your brand if you allow them to write poorly. The responsibility for this falls on you and your marketing organization. Marketing should not write everything for salespeople because that approach can be disastrous, but every time a salesperson interacts with a customer, they become the face of your brand, so it’s crucial that marketing monitors what salespeople write.

This is because writing can make or break a deal. Sales are often won or lost by a small margin, and emotions play a significant role in decision-making. If your writing is sloppy, you’ll put yourself in a position to lose the deal. This is no different from showing up to a meeting looking unprofessional.

If you’re a salesperson, leader, or trainer, you should spend time teaching people how to write for business.

Verbal communication is also crucial because you’ll be presenting to customers. However, in most cases, someone else will read your written proposals. This person may be in middle management or have to seek approval from someone else. If they can’t understand your writing, you’ll lose the deal.

CMOs and marketing teams must take ownership of the writing that their salespeople produce. By doing so, they can ensure that their brand is protected and that they have a better chance of winning deals. Salespeople, on the other hand, should focus on improving their writing skills to communicate effectively with customers.

Whether it’s writing or speaking, it’s crucial to be clear and concise in your message. Salespeople, in particular, need to have well-structured messaging that not only gets the point across in the moment but can also be easily retold and shared with others.

Sales messaging needs to be tight and well-structured, as buying teams are generally larger and more complex than ever before. Your message needs to be memorable and easily translated for someone else when you’re not around. This is what sets you apart from the competition and establishes your identity as a problem solver.

Professionals communicate like human beings in an authentic conversation, walking the customer through how they will solve the problem and what the results will be. The ability to stand in front of another human being, tell a story, and connect with them on a personal level is a valuable skill for salespeople. However, relying too much on charisma can lead to suboptimal income and even harm your brand.

As a salesperson, you can control and manage what comes out of your mouth and what you write. It’s important to take the time to structure your message effectively, so it can be easily remembered and shared. This is what will ultimately set you apart and make you a successful problem solver.

Regardless of whether you’re responsible for revenue, on the sales team, a frontline manager, an individual rep, or working on the marketing or product side of things, all those involved in messaging and driving sales face challenges.

Bringing together sales and marketing is consistently viewed as both a goal and a challenge. So what can we do about that? You mentioned the influence of chemicals in the brain and the importance of conversation structure. Let me unpack what you said.

As a training development company, you probably have a conversation with companies that fit your ideal customer profile. You know which companies will be most valuable to talk to, and you focus on those that are committed to developing their people and have a track record of doing so. This means you’re having the right conversation with the right kind of organization.

You also know that certain words can make a difference in that conversation, such as using “because,” “recommend,” and “options.” You’ve developed a discipline around the preparation and tactics of your message, including the stories you share, the questions you ask, and how you actively listen and reflect back to move the conversation forward.

All of this comes together to create a finely honed discipline that everyone in the company needs to think through to make great sales messages and tailored conversations that are memorable, distinctive, and likely to bring value. Over time, this kind of discipline becomes more natural, but it is not our natural state as humans. We are built for comfort and pleasure.

The human brain is wired for stories and follows a pattern throughout history. This applies to sales and messaging too. There are different types of messaging, such as prospecting, creating interest, and getting to the next step. The goal is to create a picture that makes someone feel unique. Messaging also builds your business case, outlining the challenge, recommendation, and outcome.

When organizations don’t understand this, sales and marketing suffer. Simplify messaging to get customers to say yes and move forward. Understand messaging progression and how the human brain operates.

Establish trust at the beginning to get more time with the customer. Follow the hero’s journey pattern, showing the customer a better place. The challenge comes with multiple stakeholders, each with their own outcomes. Tell stories that connect with each stakeholder based on what’s important to them.

It’s important to simplify messaging and understand how the human brain operates to get customers to say yes and move forward. Our brains are not wired for selling conversations focused on the customer or prospect. We are wired for comfort and pleasure, and talking about ourselves. Understand the other person’s perspective based on research and work done. Use empathy and insight to connect with prospects.

Establish trustworthiness through empathy and expertise. Conversation is where empathy is demonstrated, and where language is learned to reflect back in messaging. Listening is vital to make people feel significant. Repeat back what they say in your messaging to make them feel understood and trust you.

In the beginning of a sales conversation, sellers must establish a sense of urgency and determine a need for change. Once they are able to identify what needs to change for the prospect and why now is the right time, they should seek to discover why their product or solution is the right one and why their competitor is not a viable alternative.

However, many sales teams tend to answer that final “why me?” question first without connecting to the problem that the buyer has. This approach can be frustrating for the buyer because they don’t understand the value or use case of the product.

Creating a false sense of urgency, such as cutting prices, bundling products differently, or offering a limited-time offer only exacerbates this issue. It may draw in some buyers, but likely for the wrong reasons and they may not fully commit to the solution.

To avoid this, sales messaging should always focus on the buyer’s problem and the urgency behind it, rather than just promoting a product’s features and benefits.

A structured process led by a leader is necessary for bringing together marketing and sales. This involves creating a framework and sequence for conversations, including the introductory, change, sense of urgency, differentiation, and closing conversations. It’s essential to have discipline in this process due to the turnover of people in sales organizations, role shifts, and territory changes.

Without the right structure, discipline, and practice, there won’t be any improvements as a team or as individuals. Therefore, it’s important to naturally develop a conversational pattern by going through the necessary discipline.

Start by relating to the person and building a bridge to their situation. For instance, for a business owner, it’s essential to take the time to understand who they are. Use a specific pattern of relating first, bridging, and then doing a takeaway. This process removes the reptile brain, which causes people to avoid risky situations.

The issue is not just asking about pain points or presenting a pre-packaged solution. You need to show that you can relate to your prospect’s situation without immediately imposing a product or solution.

Salespeople often struggle with writing, but there are tools available to help. GPT-3 and GPT-4 are examples of brand new tools that are hitting the market and can help you be a better version of yourself if you use them the right way. These tools work from a set of patterns and may not be able to provoke an emotion in readers. Therefore, it’s important to go back and check your work and ensure that your message is authentic, innovative, passionate, and empathetic.

While automation can be effective in raising the quality of writing, it falls short in terms of authenticity, passion, innovation, and empathy. It’s essential to use these tools to enhance your writing ability and become aware of your writing patterns. However, don’t rely solely on robots and make sure to add your own unique perspective and voice to your writing.

In the case of sales teams, Chat GPT can help you find industry patterns and common pain points. However, it’s crucial to remember that no automation can be authentic to you, and verbal communication still holds more value than written communication.

A pro tip for writing is to say the words out loud or have someone else say them to ensure that the writing sounds natural and conversational.

The innovative Sales Gravy University sales training platform gives on the go individuals and entire teams easy, affordable access to the world’s top sales trainers in both live and on-demand courses. Now you can learn how to win in sales anywhere, anytime, and on any device. 

On this episode of the Sales Gravy podcast, Sales Mastermind Group “Awesome” asks Jeb Blount sales questions. If you’ve ever had a question you wanted to ask Jeb then you’ll love this episode. It’s free flowing, insightful, and informative.

There is so much to learn from this episode including:

– How to get more prospecting done in less time.

– Building targeted prospecting lists and leveraging social proof to get engagement.

– Keys to building better prospecting lists.

– How to be more confident with your messaging.

– How to be more consistent with Fanatical Prospecting Sequences.

The sales lessons you’ll learn in this episode are so powerful that you’ll want to listen to it multiple times and share it with your entire team.

A Mastermind Group is a peer-to-peer mentoring group where individuals come together to help each other solve their problems and improve their lives or businesses.

Mastermind Groups are powerful tools for personal and professional growth. They can foster a sense of community and connection, help members overcome challenges, and facilitate significant progress towards their goals.

The concept was popularized by Napoleon Hill in his 1937 book “Think and Grow Rich” who believed that the collective intelligence of a group is far greater than the sum of its parts.

The members of a Mastermind Group are typically successful individuals who are motivated and dedicated to achieving their goals. They meet regularly (either in-person or virtually) to discuss their challenges, set goals, brainstorm ideas, and offer each other advice and support.

In a Mastermind Group, the focus is on collaboration, growth, and mutual support. Each member benefits from the wisdom, experiences, and perspectives of the others. This dynamic leads to fresh insights, new ideas, and powerful motivation. Participants can hold each other accountable for their goals, offer encouragement, and provide honest and constructive feedback.

A Mastermind Group can be focused on various topics, such as prospecting, time management, large account strategies, proposal and presentation skills, account management and retention, and more. They can be informal and self-organized or facilitated by a professional coach or mentor.

Sales Gravy Mastermind Groups are an excellent way to improve your sales skills, become a more effective leader, or solve problems. Our masterminds are facilitated by a Master Sales Trainer and include additional training resources to build on group discussions.

In short, a Sales Mastermind Group, will help you gain a competitive edge, build your knowledge base, advance your skills, and build support network and accountability partners that will help you navigate the many ups and downs of a your sales career.

Looking to go beyond a mastermind group and get one-to-one personalized coaching? Well, we have a free guide to help you identify the right coach for you. Download HERE

Are you tired of feeling defeated by rejection in sales and find yourself avoiding potential opportunities because the fear of hearing “no” holds you back? It’s time to shift your mindset and embrace rejection as a stepping stone to success.

In this episode of the Sales Gravy Podcast, renowned sales experts Richard Fenton and Andrea Waltz share valuable insights from their book When They Say No that will revolutionize your sales approach.

Our fear of rejection is deeply rooted in our evolutionary history.

Throughout human evolution, being accepted by the tribe was crucial for survival. Rejection meant being cast out and left to fend for oneself, facing increased vulnerability to predators and the loss of the collective support and resources provided by the group.

Our brains developed a powerful instinct to avoid rejection at all costs.

However, the good news is that we possess the ability to hack our brains and change our perception of rejection. Instead of automatically equating rejection with death or social isolation, we can actively reframe our thoughts.

By recognizing that rejection in the modern world does not carry the same life-or-death consequences, we can replace our negative thoughts with more productive ones.

We can remind ourselves that rejection is often subjective and influenced by various factors beyond our control. With this shift in perspective, we can approach rejection as a valuable learning experience, an opportunity to grow and improve rather than a definitive judgment of our worth.

Salespeople, in particular, are often vulnerable to a dangerous spiral of negative thoughts following rejection. When faced with a rejection, it is easy to get caught in a downward spiral of worry, anxiety, and self-doubt.

This negative cycle not only hampers our emotional well-being but also impairs our effectiveness in sales. The more we dwell on negative outcomes, the more our confidence wavers, and the less persuasive and motivated we become.

Recognizing this pattern is crucial for breaking free from its grasp. By actively reframing our thoughts, we can disrupt the negative cycle and redirect our focus towards positive outcomes.

Instead of dwelling on what went wrong or personalizing the rejection, we can shift our attention to the lessons learned, the potential for improvement, and the possibilities of future success.

It is essential to understand that rejection is not solely a psychological problem but also a physiological one. The fear of rejection triggers stress responses in our bodies, which further perpetuate the negative thought patterns.

By recognizing this physiological aspect and consciously choosing to reframe our thoughts, we can liberate ourselves from the chains of fear and propel ourselves towards success in sales and beyond.

The opening phase of the sales process is an aspect often overlooked in sales literature. Selling goes beyond pitching product features and freebies. It involves building rapport, asking questions, and understanding the customer’s needs. A strong opening early on in the sales process sets the stage for a successful close.

The opening phase in sales is a critical juncture that is often overlooked or rushed through in the pursuit of closing a deal. However, this initial stage holds immense significance in building rapport, establishing trust, and gaining a deep understanding of the customer’s needs and desires. When sales professionals invest time and effort into creating meaningful connections with their prospects early on, they lay the foundation for a successful and mutually beneficial relationship.

One of the key reasons why establishing connections with prospects during the opening phase is crucial is the building of trust. In any sales interaction, trust forms the bedrock of a successful relationship. By taking the time to truly listen to prospects, showing genuine interest, and demonstrating empathy, sales professionals can cultivate trust and credibility. When prospects feel understood and valued, they are more likely to open up about their challenges, goals, and pain points, which provides invaluable insight for tailoring the sales approach and offering relevant solutions.

Moreover, establishing connections early on helps curb objections that may arise during the sales process. When prospects feel a sense of connection and trust, they are more receptive to the sales professional’s message and less likely to raise objections or barriers.

By investing time in the opening phase to understand the prospect’s motivations, concerns, and preferences, sales professionals can address potential objections proactively.

They can align their pitch with the prospect’s specific needs and present compelling solutions that directly address their pain points. This personalized approach not only minimizes objections but also increases the chances of a successful sale.

Furthermore, the opening phase allows sales professionals to gather vital information about the prospect’s decision-making process and the key stakeholders involved.

By building relationships early on, they can uncover valuable insights into the prospect’s organizational structure, decision-making dynamics, and the specific criteria that influence their purchasing decisions. Armed with this knowledge, sales professionals can tailor their approach, navigate internal challenges, and present a persuasive case that resonates with the prospect and aligns with their unique context.

Recognizing the importance of the opening phase in sales is crucial for building rapport, establishing trust, and gaining a deep understanding of the customer’s needs.

By investing time and effort into creating connections with prospects early on, sales professionals can lay a solid foundation for successful relationships, mitigate objections, and increase their chances of closing deals. The opening phase serves as a valuable opportunity to establish a strong rapport, gather key insights, and pave the way for a fruitful sales journey.

The innovative Sales Gravy University sales training platform gives on the go individuals and entire teams easy, affordable access to the world’s top sales trainers in both live and on-demand courses. Now you can learn how to win in sales anywhere, anytime, and on any device. 

In this podcast, Mike Cabot and Jeb Blount discuss the challenges of sales in the current climate, including the impact of technology and the need for emotional intelligence when dealing with analytical stakeholders. They also emphasize the importance of celebrating small victories and providing feedback to improve performance.

As a child, Mike Cabot and his sister starred in a local cable television show for seven years. Later on, Cabot gained acting experience both in theater and through featuring in commercials.

In his sales career, he has been able to leverage the improv skills he learned from acting at an early age to connect, engage in deep listening, and show empathy to prospects and clients.

The job of a sales professional isn’t just to sell a product or service, it’s to help people. And in order to truly help people, great sales professionals have to be great empathizers.

The same can be said for actors. To tell a story convincingly, an actor must take on the character’s persona. She must step into their shoes and see the world through their eyes. Otherwise, it’s not authentic.

Empathy is a critical skill for sales professionals, and acting is an excellent way to hone this skill by putting yourself in someone else’s shoes.

This is what sets the best salespeople apart. They can quickly and easily see the world through someone else’s eyes and adjust their messaging, style, and strategy accordingly.

Often, people make excuses for why they can’t sell, such as a lack of leads or poor marketing. As sales professionals, we must deliver for the audience in front of us, no matter what. Embracing this idea is crucial in building a strong sales culture.

Mastering the same soft skills that improv actors use is critical because you must listen not only with your ears, but also with your eyes and intuition. On stage, if you weren’t paying attention, you wouldn’t know how to respond when something gets thrown back at you.

Buyers use emotions to make decisions. Tap into their emotions and stories to meet their needs.

Engaging with analytical stakeholders in sales requires a thoughtful and empathetic approach. Understanding the different levels and roles within the stakeholder groups is crucial, as each individual has unique concerns and priorities.

While these stakeholders are analytical by nature, it’s important to recognize that emotions play a significant role in their decision-making process.

By tapping into their emotional needs and sharing relevant stories, sales professionals can connect with them on a deeper level and demonstrate how their product or service can help solve their problems.

Building trust and showing the value of saving time or avoiding negative outcomes are key strategies for engaging with these stakeholders.

Salespeople often encounter challenges when engaging with analytical stakeholders. The lack of immediate emotional response from these stakeholders can sometimes make salespeople feel insecure and lead them to overcompensate by talking too much.

Developing emotional control and patience becomes essential in these situations. Sales professionals should maintain faith in their approach, asking the right questions, and genuinely trying to help.

Over time, as trust is built and the salesperson demonstrates the ability to address the stakeholder’s concerns, these analytical stakeholders can become strong allies, paving the way for successful sales interactions. Mastering the art of engaging with analyzers opens doors to success in various sales scenarios.

Recognizing and celebrating small wins in sales is crucial for both individual salespeople and sales teams. It starts with transparency and setting realistic expectations, acknowledging that success requires effort. While closing deals is important, it’s equally vital to track other metrics like account outreach and pipeline generation.

By highlighting these milestones, individuals are encouraged to keep going and find motivation in the journey. Celebrating every win, no matter how small, creates a positive and supportive environment, fostering desired behaviors and instilling a sense of accomplishment throughout the sales process.

Viewing sales as a series of building blocks and acknowledging the value of each step taken before closing a deal reinforces the idea that consistent effort leads to success. By celebrating incremental achievements and focusing on building a strong foundation, sales professionals can stay motivated, sustain momentum, and achieve greater success.

Feedback plays a crucial role in personal and professional growth, regardless of one’s position within the organization. It’s a two-way street where both sales leaders and their sales team can benefit from open and candid communication.

Offering feedback allows leaders to provide guidance and constructive criticism, while accepting feedback demonstrates a willingness to learn and improve. Feedback is valuable, no matter one’s position or authority.

By creating an environment where feedback is encouraged, leaders can foster a culture of continuous improvement and learning, which benefits the entire organization in the long run.

Another effective practice in sales leadership is the “before and after routine”. This coaching routine involves setting objectives and targets before a sales call, discussing the strengths and successes afterward, and then openly discussing areas for improvement.

By starting with the positives and creating a safe space for team members to voice their opinions, leaders can encourage collaborative conversation where everyone’s input is valued, regardless of their age or experience level.

In the end, feedback is a vital component of growth and development in the sales profession. Both sales leaders and team members can benefit from actively seeking and providing feedback.

By embracing feedback and incorporating it into routine coaching and reflection processes, sales organizations can create a culture of continuous improvement, collaboration, and success.

The innovative Sales Gravy University sales training platform gives on the go individuals and entire teams easy, affordable access to the world’s top sales trainers in both live and on-demand courses. Now you can learn how to win in sales anywhere, anytime, and on any device. 

On this episode of the Sales Gravy podcast, Jeb Blount and Will Yarbrough, VP of Sales at Fleetio, discuss what it means to be a human seller in the age of robots.

Jeb and Will dive into the importance of having organic conversations versus over-engineering the sales process. In this conversation, you’ll learn the value of a good first impression, how to maintain engagement with a prospect following a demo, and why being coachable is a strength in sales.

Industry experience— especially when selling to blue-collar workers out in the field who are more accustomed to turning wrenches than punching buttons on an app — can be a strength or a weakness for new sales professionals.

Most sales organizations seek individuals who are good communicators, curious, and confident, but also have enough industry knowledge to be credible.

And while industry knowledge is important is sales, the ability to deal with people is crucial.

People with industry experience tend to want everything to be perfect before they can close a deal. As a result, they may take longer to ramp up in a sales organization than those without as much experience, but they can still be taught the right questions to ask.

New sales professionals who don’t have much industry experience will be successful if they know how to ask the right questions, find opportunities for ROI, and learn how to close deals in the process.

Taking a more human approach to selling means that experience pales in comparison to the importance of heart and mindset.

Too many sales organizations are guilty of over-engineering the selling process. The most important thing to remember is that you’re a human being having a conversation with another human being. Here are a few ways to simplify the sales process (that don’t require the help of a robot).

Buying is an emotional and deeply human experience. In order to close sales and maintain positive customer relationships, you need to keep in mind that prospects buy the person before they buy the product.

The little things matter. It’s not about the outcome, but the steps that you take to get to that outcome.

So if you choose not to wear a collared shirt on virtual calls, you put on a hat, decide not to shave, or don’t take care in making sure your video presence and audio quality are top-notch, you are taking a series of small risks.

And those risks can greatly impact the velocity of the sale, getting the sale, or the trust that you build with your prospect.

Present yourself in a professional manner, including your appearance, lighting, audio, and video quality. These details may seem small, but they can have a big impact on the trust and velocity of the sale. Remember, the little things matter.

Pilots and brain surgeons implement a checklist for every task they must perform. They aren’t stupid; they have a lot to remember and many high-stakes elements that can slip through the cracks.

Utilizing a checklist throughout the sales process can make it easier to remember and execute on important tasks, something that busy sales professionals often struggle to do.

When you refer to a checklist every time you engage with a prospect, you’re more likely to remember and complete each necessary task to help you advance the sale.

One of the most effortless and foolproof ways to make a lasting impression with your prospect and create competitive differentiation is by sending a handwritten note or a personal video message thanking your prospect for their time after your meeting.

It’s a small, but essential gesture that makes a difference. The best part is, you don’t need a system to write a note. Simply make it a habit to write and send a note right after conversations with your prospects.

It’s a simple way to show gratitude that they will notice, appreciate, and remember.

Especially in the world of data and systems, the human element of selling can get lost. Every sales team these days has five or more systems in their tech stack to support sales acceleration.

With that comes a more robust playbook and guidance on how to sell and use those systems. However, one of the big pitfalls in modern sales is becoming too robotic.

You might think, “I have to follow this process. I’m going to ask this discovery question, and this discovery question, and this discovery question,” and forget that you’re just having a conversation with someone.

In doing so, you put undue pressure on yourself to follow the process and check every box, instead of just having a conversation like two human beings.

Asking questions like, “What is the downstream impact of missing a preventative maintenance activity?” can help humanize the experience and encourage conversation.

We lose credibility when we forget that we’re just talking to somebody and opt for asking a robotic, textbook question that should be on a form or a survey.

It’s easy to take shortcuts, but investing time and effort in doing the little things right increases the chances of success.

As a leader, it’s important to remind and educate sellers about the value of the basics and fundamentals. Athletic coaches understand the importance of drilling the basics and reinforcing muscle memory.

Coaches and leaders must train, drill, and reinforce the basics and fundamentals every day because one bad habit or easy win can undo everything you teach.

Many leaders avoid conflict and fail to address problems because they are afraid to confront bad sales behaviors, which allows them to continue.

In the past, it was not uncommon for sales leaders to directly confront you and tell you to stop doing something that isn’t effective. They would push you to improve.

Today, some leaders lack the courage to lead sales in a more traditional way. Sales is a human endeavor that requires excellence, protection of the brand and the process, and achieving targets. It’s a survival of the fittest. You need to be good at your craft and be willing to learn from your mistakes.

Leaders must have the ability to motivate their sellers when they’re doing well, provide constructive feedback when they’re not, and offer support when they need it.

In his bestselling book, Fanatical Prospecting, Jeb Blount outlines his innovative approach to prospecting that works for real people, in the real world, with real prospects. Download your FREE chapters of Fanatical Prospecting here.

On this episode of the Sales Gravy Podcast, Art Munin, Ph.D. from Liaison International joins guest host Gina Trimarco, Sales Gravy Master Trainer and Director of Coaching Programs, to discuss how he made the transition into a career in sales.

You’ll love the story of how Art talked his way onto the podcast by serenading Gina with a Bon Jovi tune.

This episode is a must-listen for people who are interested in exploring new horizons and sales leaders who may be neglecting non-traditional talent in their recruitment strategies.

There’s a myth that continues to pervade the corporate landscape: you need to pick your lifelong career fresh out of college and stick to it. However, the modern work environment paints a more varied picture, with more people transitioning into entirely different career paths well into their professional lives. One such transition that’s gaining traction is the move into sales from non-sales careers.

Sales is an exciting career, brimming with potential for personal growth, financial success, and professional satisfaction. It offers a dynamic work environment where no two days are alike.

It is also a role where direct, tangible outcomes (like meeting quotas or securing contracts) can lead to immediate rewards.

Furthermore, the advent of technology has made it possible for salespeople to work from diverse locations, offering both flexibility and freedom.

There are various reasons why people choose to transition into sales later in life. Some find their previous jobs unfulfilling or stagnant, some are driven by the desire for higher income potential, and others are enticed by the challenge and competitive spirit inherent in sales.

Moreover, many skills acquired in other professions – such as communication, problem-solving, and relationship building – are directly transferrable to sales roles.

Regardless of their previous career path, professionals transitioning into sales bring a wealth of transferable skills.

For example, educators have exceptional communication and people skills, which are vital for engaging clients and building relationships. Likewise, engineers or technicians might have the technical expertise that’s invaluable for sales in the tech sector. Professionals from financial or consulting backgrounds bring analytical and problem-solving skills, enabling them to understand a customer’s needs and craft appropriate solutions.

Building on these existing skills, many find that they already have the foundation necessary for sales success. The key is to identify these skills and learn how to apply them effectively in a sales context.

Despite the potential advantages, transitioning into sales can also bring its share of challenges.

One of the most significant hurdles is breaking into the field without direct experience. It’s crucial for individuals to leverage their transferable skills effectively during the application and interview process.

Another challenge is adapting to the performance-driven nature of sales, which can be stressful and highly competitive. To overcome this, new salespeople should focus on building resilience and a growth mindset, viewing challenges as opportunities for learning and development.

Finally, newcomers to sales will have to master soft skills and Sales EQ: Sales Specific Emotional Intelligence. This includes learning how to listen effectively, ask the right questions, and present products or services in a way that meets the needs of the potential customer.

Transitioning into a sales career later in life can be an enriching and rewarding experience. With the right mindset, transferable skills, and a willingness to learn and adapt, individuals from non-sales careers can thrive in the dynamic world of sales. It’s never too late to make the leap and embrace the opportunities that a sales career has to offer.

Our Foundations in Selling on-demand learning path is designed to help new sales professionals gain the skills and confidence they need to launch a successful career in Sales. Learn More Here

On this episode of the Sales Gravy Podcast, Jeb Blount (Sales Gravy CEO and author of Sales EQ) and Graham Hooper (CEO of Ellison Technologies) discuss the keys to leading your sales team in uncertain times. You’ll learn how to succeed in volatile economic times by effectively handling decision deferment objections and conducting thorough research during the discovery phase of the sales process.

Many salespeople today are struggling to make the transition from taking advantage of a red hot market to navigating the doldrums of volatile economic times. Some sectors, like real estate, are experiencing the brunt of these changes in the market, where other sectors, like defense are seeing more profit.

Economic swings are cyclical and always will be, but especially in the last twenty four months, sales organizations are moving to a more traditional kind of selling.

Salespeople who know how to get creative, grind it out, and prioritize the fundamentals will see the most success in times like these. However, it’s not easy to make that mindset shift and truly rise to the moment.

For the individual salesperson, the most important thing that you can have in your arsenal to make it out on top in volatile economic times is not above-average intellect or a winning personality— it’s grit.

This is this ability to dig deep and take your career, your future, and your life into your own hands when things are difficult and it seems like there is very little in your control.

Getting up, getting yourself ready for the day, protecting your time and your energy, and making sure that you are putting yourself in front of the right people at the right time with the right message.

Another strength that will set you apart from other salespeople and allow you to break through the noise and truly connect with the right customers is sales-specific emotional intelligence— Sales EQ.

Salespeople aren’t the only ones experiencing tough times. Real human connection matters today more than ever. You must have the ability to see eye to eye with your customers, meet them where they are, and make them comfortable enough to open up and share their toughest business challenges.

When you connect the dots between their biggest problems and how you can help solve them, you build the foundation for trust and create lasting business relationships as a result. Conducting deep discovery is the key to helping your customers close the gaps and see positive change from your solutions.

In today’s world, human-to-human communication is the only trustworthy form of communication. With more AI tools and services than any one person could take full advantage of, it’s not secret that we rely heavily on automation to maintain productivity and be maximally effective.

The downside of this is that written communication can easily be created and distributed by AI, which is often seen as inauthentic or untrustworthy.

So has the role of the salesperson changed in the expanding world of automatic and artificial intelligence? The short answer is yes. The rise and mass adoption of automation has certainly changed the value and responsibility of salespeople to be effective communicators.

In a world where robots are increasingly doing work for us, it is important for sales professionals to have strong communication skills, know how to build genuine trust, and establish close business relationships.

That’s precisely why salespeople should invest about 80% of the time in the sales process in discovery. What are you learning about your buyer? What are you asking them?

Discovery is where salespeople face the most heartache, because when buyers are holding back, sellers don’t have any ammunition to reduce fear because they didn’t ask great discovery questions and do the work upfront.

In times of abundance and prosperity, salespeople skip that crucial step because buyers will decide to buy anyway. Salespeople often let their guard down and get transactional.

Doing deep level discovery is the only way to stay afloat in a down market because buyers are vulnerable, hesitant, and hard to reach. The transactional sale will not get the job done in volatile times.

It’s easy to be complacent when times are good. But things have changed, even in growing industries. The competitive landscape is now much more intense than it used to be.

To succeed in this environment, you need to do your homework. You must have a solid business case for why your product is a good fit for the customer, and that requires a a great deal of research.

Once you have a use case and understand the challenges of the industry, you need to address any concerns that are specific to your buyers’ unique situation, business, or sector and show proven ROI. Doing your homework is fundamental to success, and that homework is done in discovery.

Inevitably, buyers will present salespeople with decision deferment objections. It is imperative that salespeople handle these objections with tact, at both the emotional and rational level. Salespeople can prepare for these objections in a couple of ways.

Ask questions that reveal their hesitation to buy, the perceived risk of purchase or adoption, and what is at stake for them in this relationship.

This will allow you to understand the fundamental reason why they don’t want to buy, and give you insight into how you can help them move forward in their purchasing decision, and ultimately create a sense of trust that reassures your buyer that you know what is most important to them and their company.

Whether this is providing extra training, additional customer support, access to premium features, or other similar benefits, giving your buyer an improved experience at little to no additional cost to you, while drawing their focus away from pricing alone.

Giving them some added benefits or bonus features helps them feel that they are getting value from your product or service that increases the return on their investment.

Sometimes it helps to instill a sense of urgency so that buyers are less likely to pull back from a purchasing decision. In this case, offer pricing that’s only available for a limited time, or offer an add-on that has limited availability.

Of course, this isn’t always possible, but targeting larger companies with more flexible budgets, versus smaller companies that are on a feast or famine cycle will make it easier to prevent facing buying deferment objections in the first place.

Salespeople can navigate the transition from a thriving market to a slow one by staying tough, focused, and innovative. In uncertain times, sales-specific emotional intelligence and authentic human-to-human communication are crucial skills to establish trust and build relationships with buyers.

By dedicating 80% of the sales process to discovery, salespeople can make a compelling case for why their product is a good fit for their buyer and learn what matters most to them, so that decision deferment objections don’t clog up the pipeline.

In this on-demand sales training on Sales Gravy University the world’s most sought-after sales trainer, Jeb Blount, delivers an essential blueprint for staying motivated, keeping your pipeline full, increasing sales, retaining your customers, and advancing your career in times of uncertainty and change. 

On this special episode of the Sales Gravy Podcast, Sales Gravy Senior Master Sales Trainer Brad Adams and bestselling author of Coffee’s for Closers, Tony Morris, dive into the art of great discovery, how to ask questions that build rapport and create engagement, and why better questions set the groundwork for better results.

The two biggest priorities for salespeople are building pipeline through prospecting and discovery. Not expert negotiation, perfect presentation skills, or even closing.

Those steps are integral to the sales process, but not as fundamentally critical as getting in front of as many potential clients as possible, and authentically engaging with as many of them as you can.

Authentic engagement is the result of great discovery, and you can’t conduct bulletproof discovery without deep and active listening.

Listening is one of the most vital skills that a salesperson can hone and develop.

Failure to really listen to your prospect, especially on a discovery call, only sets you up to make more mistakes later on in the sales process, causing you to risk jeopardizing the opportunity.

In discovery conversations, if you’re talking more than your prospect, you are reducing your likelihood of effectively connecting with and engaging them.

Don’t just listen to respond, listen to learn.

Additionally, it’s difficult to do effective discovery without the right questions, and without listening to your prospect, you will ask terrible questions.

If there’s one thing that will doom an opportunity before it even picks up speed is wasting your and your prospect’s time on the wrong questions.

Derailing the focus of the conversation with surface level questions, or misinterpreting your prospect’s answers because you’re too busy thinking of a response to actually listen, will only make your job harder and your prospect feel ignored.

One of the reasons that many salespeople struggle to ask the right questions during the discovery call is that they run on autopilot.

This is a serious problem because instead of approaching the discovery call with proper preparation, confidence, and awareness, they ask questions without thinking about what they’re asking.

And as we know, asking bad questions will reap poor results.

Luckily, the solution to this is preparing before every discovery call. Here are three steps you can take before your next conversation to ensure that you are ready to conduct great discovery.

What are you aiming towards? Is it to set up a demo, meeting, presentation, or is it to make a sale? Have a clear, defined outcome for the conversation, before you even get started. This will help you to get the most value out of the conversation while staying on the right track.

What are the key criteria you need to know by the end of the conversation in order to set the deal up for success? Before a call, determine the right questions to ask to get the information you need.

For example, you might want to know how many stakeholders are involved in the purchasing decision. Prepare questions in advance that will help you to specifically get to that answer.

Every call discovery call should entail different information, but follow a similar path. You, as the salesperson, are in control of where you take the prospect during your conversation. It’s the salesperson’s job to lead, educate, and take them along the established process. 

As you lead your prospect through the discovery process, take the time to really listen, and use the resources you’ve prepared in advance to guide your conversation, here are five questions you should be weaving into every discovery call.

This one is very simple— when your prospect asks a question or shares some information, question them back or ask them about the information they provided. Tag on to what they’ve said to immerse yourself in the conversation and go deeper with them about what matters most.

When your prospect provides you with information related to their business or the problems they are facing, use a statement to imply an area of interest or curiosity. This will prompt them to share some details or context, and takes the interrogative pressure off of your end of the conversation.

For example, they may share some information around a certain market trend they’re seeing. To which you could reply,

“That’s interesting, I haven’t done a lot of research on that. Tell me what impact that’s had on your business.”

As you listen to their responses or the information they provide during your conversation, take note of a few details and circle back to them.

This show that you’re not only listening to them, but what they’re saying is important enough for you to pay attention, make note, remember, and seek more information about the subject. It’s an amazing technique for bridging the connection between you and your prospect.

Prospects will often say things like, “Look, we need this fixed quickly.” This is where you would ask a clarifying question like, “What does quickly mean to you in this case?”

Or, they might say something along the lines of, “We are just looking for an easy to use software.”

You might reply, “So I can understand a little bit more, what does easy to use look like in your world?”

This allows you to get to the heart of what matters to them, why it matters, so you can demonstrate true value.

Instead of asking what immediate outcome they want to see by using your solution, ask them a question like this one:

“Let’s fast forward a year from today. How do you know my product/service has been successful for you?” 

Why? Because it’s thought provoking and it’s a disruption. When you get your prospect thinking differently about their desired future state, you are forcing them to open up and be honest as opposed to firing off a canned response to a question that they already anticipated.

See The World Through Your Customer’s Eyes

99% of salespeople see the world through their own eyes. The top 1% see it through their customer’s lens. The easiest way to connect with your prospect is to simply make them comfortable, match their tone, and use terms and language that they have previously referenced.

Over the telephone, 83% of communication is how you sound. Listen to their tone, their pace, their timber, and their volume. Be a chameleon. Use those clues to inform how you speak and what information is most important to them.

When you frame the conversation and mirror their tone, you show your prospect that you’re listening, you care, you’re like them, and you understand them.

The more you do that, the more connected your prospect will be and the more likely they are to buy from you.

Sales Gravy University features the world’s most sought after sales & leadership trainers, authors, and thought leaders. Brad Adams and Tony Morris are instructors on Sales Gravy University where you can take their courses on prospecting, communication skills, closing, negotiation and more.

On this episode of the Sales Gravy Podcast, Jeb Blount sits down with celebrity chef and entrepreneur Vera Stewart, to learn how persistence and a “never take no for an answer” mindset helped her build a business empire.

Vera’s entrepreneurial journey started back in her undergrad days, baking cakes and pies for her chemistry professor just to get a passing grade. After graduating from the University of Georgia (Go Dawgs!) she taught school for four years before starting her family and becoming a stay at home mom. 

But Vera missed the sense of self-reliance that having an income brought her, and started a catering business out of her home kitchen in Cartersville, Georgia.

The rest of the story is legendary as she leveraged luck, chance meetings, relentless persistence, and an infectious competitive spirit to build a business empire and nationally known brand in hospitality and cooking.  

As her business grew, Vera took advantage of opportunities as they arose. What some might have considered a risk, Vera saw as an area of potential.

From catering the governor’s luncheon, to appearing on Food Network, starting her own TV show, and writing amazing cookbooks, Vera always rose to the challenge, took advantage of every opportunity, and never took no for an answer.

She was able to climb to the next level again and again at different points in her story because she held on to a simple, but powerful mantra: “All they can do is say no.”

Through a stroke of luck and the willingness to say yes in the face of uncertainty, Vera landed a spot on Throwdown With Bobby Flay. It was a pivot point that changed everything. 

Following her appearance with Bobby Flay, a local Augusta, Georgia TV station offered to let Vera record six episodes for her own show. It was an instant hit and she wanted more.

When she was told that it would take five years to get syndicated, Vera was undaunted. She approached a station in Savannah, GA with a pitch to syndicate her new show. 

Vera pitched her show to WSAV, with a crucial mindset—she led with value and focused on what was in it for them. She demonstrated exactly how she could help them sell more advertising.

This is how The VeryVera Show landed its first syndicated market. Today, The VeryVera Show is in 40 markets with over 300 episodes to date and has never had a station cancel. 

Vera’s entrepreneurial journey is as inspiring as it is informative. What we can learn from her story is that resilience, tenacity, and the willingness to face adversity are invaluable to paving the way to a successful business or career.

Sales is a unique profession that affords salespeople the opportunity to essentially work as an entrepreneur within an organization to earn commission.

In many respects, you are your own boss, call your own shots, and have an incredibly high earning potential compared to other lines of work. The only way to take advantage of that potential is to overcome obstacles, take risks, deal with rejection, and not take no for an answer.

Sales professionals who adopt an entrepreneurial mindset can leverage their skills, knowledge, and experience to achieve remarkable success. Entrepreneurs are known for their ability to innovate, take risks, and seize opportunities, and salespeople who embody these traits can excel in their careers. Here are five ways that salespeople can harness an entrepreneurial mindset to be successful.

A growth mindset is the belief that one’s abilities can be developed through hard work and dedication. Salespeople who have a growth mindset are more likely to see challenges as opportunities to learn and grow. They are also more likely to embrace new technologies, methodologies, and sales techniques that can help them improve and achieve their goals.

Entrepreneurs are known for their ability to take initiative and create their own opportunities. Similarly, salespeople who take ownership of their work are more likely to be successful. They should take the initiative to identify new prospects, develop new sales strategies, and take risks when necessary to close deals.

Entrepreneurs are known for their ability to pivot when necessary and adapt to changing market conditions. Salespeople who can adapt to changing customer needs, new sales techniques, and market trends are more likely to succeed. They should be open to feedback, willing to try new approaches, and able to pivot quickly when circumstances change.

Entrepreneurs know that their customers are the key to their success, and salespeople should adopt the same mindset. They should focus on building strong relationships with their customers, understanding their needs and preferences, and delivering value in every interaction. Salespeople who prioritize the customer experience are more likely to build long-term relationships that lead to repeat business and referrals.

Vera attributes much of her success to asking for what she wants with relaxed, assertive confidence. Confidence is key in both sales and the entertainment industry, and Vera’s story reinforces just how important assertiveness is in achieving success.

People lean into relaxed confidence. Assertiveness demonstrates that you expect to win. When you want something— a meeting, a next step, a sale— ask in a way that shows you believe the answer will be yes, rather than in a way that suggests you already expect a no.

Vera Stewart proved doubters wrong and built a food and hospitality empire because she wouldn’t take no for an answer. Take a moment to consider how you can break through barriers that are holding you back by adopting a “never take no for an answer” mindset. 

On this fun episode of the Sales Gravy Podcast, Jeb Blount is joined by the incredible social media influencer and successful real estate agent, Alexander Zakharin. Jeb and Alexander discuss that when the going gets tough in the real estate market, the toughest real estate agents get fanatical about prospecting.

Alexander Zakharin is a New York City real estate guru and a force on TikTok. He emigrated from Russia to the United States in 2017 with a dream to live and work in the greatest city in the world.

When he had visited NYC a few years before, it was love at first sight as he rode a greyhound bus all the way from Chicago into Midtown West. Drawn to the skyscrapers and beautiful buildings he would later rent and sell, Zakharin took the leap after attending college in the UK and moving back to Russia for work.

He arrived in the states without a job or a plan and stumbled into real estate by pure chance— with no real estate experience. He had a background in oil and gas that provided him some sales experience, but he’d never sold real estate. He jokes that his first real estate transaction was renting out his apartment in St. Petersburg the day before he left Russia.

Through a personal connection who rented apartments in Manhattan, Zakharin got an interview as a real estate agent. He then leveraged Fanatical Prospecting, grit, hard work and social media to climb the brutal real estate ladder in New York City.

Since then, Zakharin has sold over 31 million dollars in real estate proving that anything is possible when you set your mind to it. His astronomical success illustrates how the power of relentless prospecting combined with savvy social media strategies have become keys to success in the real estate market, no matter the economic conditions.

Real estate is a highly competitive industry that is constantly influenced by market fluctuations. As a real estate agent, you are essentially your own boss, which means that you have the freedom to control your own earning potential.

This is ultimately what draws so many people into real estate, but it requires a significant mindset shift. You are responsible for your own success and income. In order to thrive in the real estate industry, you must be self-motivated and highly disciplined with a love for competition.

As a real estate agent, you work for yourself, and you are a self-employed entity. You earn exactly what you work for, and it’s up to you to make it happen. This was one of the main reasons that Zakharin saw early success in real estate and decided to stay on that path.

However, it’s important to remember that this success doesn’t come easily. Real estate agents must put in the time and effort to build their network, find leads, and close deals.

Overwhelmingly, your ticket to success, regardless of what business or vertical you’re in (especially if it’s a service business), is meeting people and making connections. The more you focus on the human side of sales or service, the faster you close deals and the longer you hold onto relationships.

High performing professionals understand the value of building networks. Likewise, in real estate, the most successful agents are those who focus on the human aspect of their work and prioritize personal connections with potential clients.

Zakharin explains that the most successful new agents aren’t the one with the fanciest Excel sheets or the perfect messaging, they’re the ones who aren’t afraid to call up people in their network and say, “By the way, I’m doing real estate now. If you’re looking to rent or buy, reach out to me.”

Having conversations with people helps any professional gain practical knowledge and experience through learning by doing. There is no substitute for having real conversations with people and maintaining that personal connection is the key to achieving excellence in any business, but particularly in sales and real estate.

During times of crisis, such as a recession or turbulence, it’s important to go back to basics and fundamentals. Top professionals in various industries practice fundamental skills regularly, regardless of any crisis.

The problem is that many people quit doing the things that work once they start seeing success. This is human nature, and it’s why people struggle during tough times.

In times of abundance, people start believing that they are the ones responsible for their success, and they hit cruise control.

However, when the economy takes a downturn, they’re left wondering what happened and start looking for the next shortcut to success as they fall behind their competitors.

So, during both times of crisis and times of abundance, it’s essential to focus on the basics and not wait for the next opportunity to come to you.

Zakharin discusses the real estate market in New York, mentioning the low inventory of resale apartments and the high demand for new developments.

He suggests that developers are incentivized to sell their inventory and that buyers often try to take advantage of creative financing options like mortgage buyouts to get lower interest rates. He also notes that his agency is seeing more cash buyers and walkaways from contracts.

Zakharin cold calls anywhere from 25 to 50 expired listings each morning, and this technique is highly effective as many people who previously listed their apartments are still trying to sell them.

By building a prospecting routine into his day, Zakharin is able to combat the unpredictable market fluctuations that have been characteristic of the last several years.

Fanatical Prospecting is a sales strategy that involves consistently and proactively reaching out to potential customers or clients.

The goal of fanatical prospecting is to fill the sales pipeline with a steady stream of new leads, so that you can focus on building relationships and closing deals with those who are most likely to convert into customers.

In terms of real estate, by consistently generating new leads and actively pursuing them, agents can create a steady stream of business and avoid the ups and downs of a feast-or-famine cycle.

Fanatical prospecting involves a disciplined approach to identifying potential customers, reaching out to them through various channels – phone, email, social media, and in-person – and building relationships with them over time. This approach requires persistence, dedication, and a willingness to work through rejection and failure.

Alexander Zakharin’s success in New York real estate correlates directly with his persistence in fanatical prospecting and never being afraid to pick up the phone or start a conversation with someone on the street.

Instead of being at the mercy of a volatile economy, Zakharin leverages his connections and constantly seeks out new business so that there’s always another opportunity right around the corner.

In his bestselling book, Fanatical Prospecting, Jeb Blount outlines his innovative approach to prospecting that works for real people, in the real world, with real prospects. Download your FREE chapters of Fanatical Prospecting here.