The Fertility Podcast

Kate and Natalie discuss the Frozen Embryo Transfer, explaining what it means when it happens and how it feels when cycles don’t work.

The pair discuss how there is research to show that the success of the frozen cycle is as high as a fresh, so do not worry if you do have to freeze your embryos. With a frozen transfer, your body isn’t full of all the medication, so you’re embarking on a more natural cycle so there is also the thinking that you’re putting those previous embryos back in a more natural environment.

Amber Woodward is a brilliant blogger and former book reviewer on The Fertility Podcast.

How to prepare?

Amber talks about how she learnt about nutrition to help her get pregnant as it wasn’t happening and she had read a lot about the impact of your nutrition. Her medical records state unexplained infertility, underpinned by PCOS, Amber has had issues with her insulin and she discusses how it can make a real difference to your nutrition.

After 12 months of changing her diet, she got regular cycles and talks about how much of a difference it can make for conceiving naturally and preparing IVF. Try to improve egg quality, keep your hormones balanced which she found very difficult and food has a big impact on her emotions.

What about Eastern medicine - Chinese herbs?

Amber talked about trying eastern medicine. Chinese medicine in particular despite her partner Joe’s concerns and the disgusting taste. She said it also made her cycles go crazy. She didn’t leave herself enough space between starting it and then doing IVF as it’s not recommended when you start treatment.

Amber talked about how the pair of them had forgotten how all-consuming ‘trying again’ was and also how the treatment felt, as well as other people announcing 2nd siblings.

Working and going through FET

She was at work when she had another FET, her nutrition wasn’t great and she wasn’t really exercising, so she didn’t feel very prepared. She went into it feeling like she should have put more effort in and they had 2 embryos left and the pair had decided they weren’t doing any more fresh cycles.

What about when it doesn’t work?

When it didn’t work - the clinic said ‘it's just one of those things about 70% don’t take. You can do everything and it doesn't work and you can do the opposite and not prepare.

On the final FET, she wanted to give it her best shot and have no regrets. They didn’t need to wait very long after the failed cycle as you don’t need to treat it like an IVF cycle as you aren't’ stimulated. They were due to have the treatment in April as Covid took hold of the world. She describes how it was the best thing for them to have some time to adjust. Her clinic reopened the day before her birthday.

How long does it take?

Covid changed how the clinic did the down-regulation. In January when she cycled failed, they had 1 month of downregulation and then the oestrogen for 3-4 weeks. Then you’d have a couple of scans and then the progesterone.

During Covid, the clinics wanted to limit the number of times you went there. Instead, she was posted the oestrogen (which increased womb lining) Amber was on this for approx 3 weeks and then 4 days later she had the transfer and two weeks later she had the pregnancy result. So a 5-week process.

What if it doesn’t work and how having that conversation about ‘what if’ helped

Amber had shared on her socials about how the pair of them had talked about alternative life plans if it didn’t work. They had prepared themselves for the FET to be their last treatment. They talked about just being able to put it all...

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This week we’re talking about the TWW which is that period of time from embryo transfer to when you can do a pregnancy test. Natalie has been through it once, having had success on her first attempt at IVF however we know, for many of you it can be something of a Groundhog Day experience and we wanted your thoughts on how to cope with it.

Kate talked about how she tells her clients to set an intention for the 14 days in terms of what they want with their family and friends, so you’re in control of how the tww goes, which is sound advice.

We also spoke with author and former fertility patient and Midwife, Sheila Lamb about her experience of the TWW and her book ‘This is the Two Week Wait

Sheila curated over 30 accounts from people willing to share their experiences, Natalie was one of them, talking about how she made a point of going away to the coast, which did her the world of good. Sheila talks about one thing that stuck out was people talking about how ‘on your own ‘ you are, after all the put from the clinic, it just stops.. it’s like tumbleweed.

We talk about how best to keep busy and how you need to think wisely about who you spend time with. People talked about symptom spotting and how for example their boobs were ‘buzzing’ Sheila talked about how

her experience and how she didn’t want to test during the wait.

after four cycles she was very aware of what worked and what didn’t work for her. Her fourth cycle was 6 years later and was with donor egg, and additional medication after a miscarriage and she was abroad, which made it nicer as they were away and able to keep busy. She talked about doing visualization which she hadn’t done previously as she hadn’t learnt about it in the earlier days.

We’re all so different which is why we wanted to get your thoughts and had you record them for us using our exciting new software, so if you want to get in touch for future episodes we’ll be reminding you of how to do it.

We had some amazing and varied comments from you. Elyse talked about how it is so important to expect and accept that your emotions will be all over the place, if you need to shout, cry, call your friend for a bitch do what you feel, and don’t feel guilty. She advised you to keep things to yourself if you want to, you don’t have to share with family and friends. Also to Keep reminding yourself you’ve done your best and the next stage is out of your hands and your brain goes a bit wild - uf it gets too loud try and takes control back.

When it comes to testing the consensus was to not drive yourself mad with early testing!!

Bilitis shared how she picked up a new hobby, during her TWW, which was during the lockdown. So she learned to sew using a sewing machine which kept my mind occupied, which she said stopped her dwelling.

Sophie talked about how she and her partner, blocked out the two weeks for themselves to go away and see something new. Or if that’s not possible just get away from every day, or go for a walk along with the coast, anything to get away from the norm. She also talked about how they treated themselves to something nice, a massage, a nice meal and focused on themselves rather than being with family, or friends. Her go-to activities were yoga, meditation, baking, and eating. Nice!

Susanne shared her wisdom, after having five cycles. She highlighted how you come to realize there are no hard and fast rules. There’s no ‘if you do this it will work’. She said to follow your gut and do what feels right which we’re big fans of. You know you ultimately.

Susanne said how in the past taken 2 weeks off work, which helped her have nothing to blame, but wasn’t right, as she also worked which then gave her something to blame. Ultimately, she says to stay...

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This week we’re talking about egg collection and embryo transfer with former podcast guest Alpesh Doshi. 

We discuss how it all works and how the hormones are used to stimulate the ovary to produce follicles. 

Do numbers matter? 

We discuss the importance of managing your expectation in terms of what it all means, what size means, what % of follicles will result in an egg, and what stage an egg can be at. 

Alpesh explains how patients need to be informed at every stage of scans with how many follicles are in each ovary, what size are they, how many are they expected to grow, at the last scan, when they are ready for trigger - the patient should have more details chat about what to expect. 

Did you know 80% of follicles result in eggs? Typically follicles that are over 14mm in diameter 

What if I don’t get enough eggs? 

There is often a lot of disappointment that can come because patients aren’t sure how to interpret numbers. But it’s important to remember that 15 follicles don’t mean 15 eggs. Alpesh explains how important it is that patients shouldn’t fixate on a number = it could be a number of eggs and the number of embryos. The journey from the egg to the embryo is a funnel as the numbers come down. More important to focus on the embryo number.

How long does egg collection take and does it hurt? 

It can take 15 minutes to 45 minutes depending on the number of follicles. 

The procedure takes place under a general anesthetic, meaning you will have been nil by mouth since the night before. Alpesh explains the procedure of draining the follicles and how once it is done, and you have one round from the anesthetic you will be monitored to make sure everything is OK before you can go home. All in all about 2 hours. 

When will you hear from the clinic after egg collection? 

The embryologist has a conversation straight after once you are awake to explain what will happen next eg. IVF or ICSI 

There will then be a call the next day to update

Day 3 call - assessment 

Day 5 - to let you know how many have developed into Blastocyst 

Have a listen to a previous episode with Embryologist Rachel Cutting about ‘What an embryologist does’ 

What to do on the day of embryo transfer? 

If you have no complicated history of ET - no sedation will be needed, it’s like a smear test. You will need a full bladder, and a catheter will be passed into the cervix, using ultrasound and the embryologist will pass another catheter to release the embryo in the middle of the uterus. 

It takes about 20 minutes. You will be at the clinic for about 30 mins and then can go home. Hormones continued and then dealing with the two-week wait and talking to the clinic as much as you like. 

How to deal with the Two Week Wait #TWW

Natalie talked about how important it is to give yourself things to look forward to, and how she and her husband went away for a few days, so they’d done something nice even if the outcome wasn’t what they’d wanted. Alpesh talks about the importance of the emotions between couples being supported and managed. 

We will be making an episode about how you cope with the TWW, so if you’ve read this far and would like to tell us please email

The outcome - what if it’s not successful? 

What to expect from your clinic. Alpesh talks about how they manage a... 

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This week we’re talking about the drugs teach, which in normal terms means - how the hell do you do your injections when going through IVF, especially if you’re scared of needles. 

We’re joined by Kate Pleace who is a lovely lady and part of Kate’s team of nurses at Your Fertility Journey. 

Kate talks us through how it all works when it comes to taking your drugs for IVF. Unfortunately, the majority are injections and you following a plan and dosages. Kate explained how important it was to talk through the different injections how they work when you need to do them, how to draw them up and prepare them, and they have mock ones to practice with 

How it all works? 

You get to practice with a fake skin pin cushion which is good to know if you have a fear of needles, you get to feel more and get to see the needle, which is tiny. 

If you’re scared, it’s important to spend time with your fertility nurse, have a look ad practice and find out what works, you can get your partner and have them shown. Kate mentioned breathing techniques and meditations. 

It may sound terrifying for people but you soon get the hang of it, Natalie certainly did after being so worried on day 1, by day 3 she was in the loo doing it, as she was hosting an event!

Where should you inject? 

In your tummy, where your trousers sit - either side of your belly button. 

It’s really important to rotate around your tummy, to give the areas a break, you will get brushing as it’s a side effect of the treatment, which is why it’s good to rotate the area you inject. 

What about if you miss your injection? 

If it’s a few hours, Kate advises you do it, if it’s the next day, Kate advises you to call your clinic. 

What about air bubbles? 

There is a little air bubble on the pen ( there’s minimal evidence it will make any damage ) always give a little tap before injection, make sure fluid is at the top, pre-loaded pens are ready to go. 

Ways to help partners feel more involved? 

Natalie talked about how she and hubby named the two injections after film/cartoon characters 

What about nose sprays? 

There is a nose spray for the down-regulation, but they are mainly injectables, depending on your protocol. Your clinic can reduce the time you have to take them. 

Side effects of drugs? 

Depends - long protocol and down-regulation, can put you into temp menopause, people may report headaches, night sweats, difficulty sleeping, but these pass when on stimulation drugs. 

Stimulation drugs - These can make you feel bloated and fatigued

Cetrotide - can make you feel like there is a bee sting when you do the injection but it disappears in about 30 min.. 

Natalie mentioned her own experience. You will need to listen to the bizarre side effect Natalie experienced… if you had the same experience, do let Natalie know. 

Kate says if you do have any weird sound effects, do let your clinic know. 

Kate talks about ways to tick off the injections on the calendar, Natalie talked about treating it like a science experiment. Think about how it’s not forever… Kate talks about how she helps patients celebrate their last injection with patients. 

The Trigger Injection - what if you can’t do it in time? 

If you’re having any problems or struggling to take it, use the videos - talk to the nurse at your scan before it. If it comes to trigger time and there is a problem, contact your clinic as soon as you can, and they can advise you on what to do... 

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In this episode, we’re talking about what to expect in IVF which we hope you take as an overview as everyone’s experience is different. Of course, there will be some commonalities in terms of treatment plans, which is what our expert Dr. James Nicopollus will be explaining. 

First up we discuss a conversation from social media that has been front of mind and that is about the latest data on the safety of the Covid Vaccine. Here’s Kate’s post that we discuss. 

Your initial visit to the fertility clinic

James talks about what to expect after you have an initial referral for a series of 2 or 3 diagnostic tests and how there should be a plan for you put in place. 

We discuss: 

• What information should people bring with them? 
• How clinics will have a questionnaire, including info like the previous history ( how long you’ve been trying ) any previous pregnancies, as much info as possible about your menstrual 
• Any other info, surgical, gynecological, medical
• Important to identify any other risks complications that need to be made aware of. 
• If you’ve had treatment elsewhere - bring all the info

What about delays due to COVID: 

In terms of key investigations markers of egg reserve, transvaginal scan, AMH blood tests - if done within last 6 months Semen analysis within last 6 months - unless significant abnormality, it might need to be repeated. Other tests for IVF include HIV, Hep B, Hep C - within the first 3 months of treatment 

James gives his opinion on home blood tests and whether he accepts them and he explains how it depends on where they’ve been done and who they’ve been done through. As long as he can see where they’ve come from and ascertain how accurate they are, there should be no need to repeat them. 

How often should you expect to see the same Dr? 

James explains how you will have a point person - you will have direct access to people via email. However due to the nature of the treatment with your embryos being ready when they are ready, so it might mean that your collection or transfer might not be at a time the Dr is available. He explains how you will have continuity with your Dr, but it won’t always be just with him. 

Kate shared a great post on Insta about what questions to ask about IVF 

Workup is key

Once you have had the tests, then you get ready for the treatment itself - so what should you expect. James talks about the treatment and explains what it is going to be doing - FSH hormone in higher doses, with a daily injection ( on average this is about 12-14 days ) in the same time it takes for one egg to grow, we’re trying to get more. 

In almost every cycle, it starts just after your period, then for 2 weeks you take an injection to make your eggs grow with 3/5 scans, to see when you are ready for egg collection. You may have blood tests. All help to decide when you are ready for egg collection. The second medication is to stop your body from releasing the eggs. The main difference between long and short protocol is when the medication is changed. A long and a short protocol from period to egg collection is the same, it’s just different by the medication. 

Approx 2 weeks of intensive monitoring/estrogen goes up, it tends to make you feel good. It’s more likely that post embryo transfer the homes can make you feel a bit gritty. 

The hardest thing is the logistics. James talks about stress and the importance... 

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So what is the Postcode lottery? 

Well we’ve been talking about it here on the podcast for years ( since we started to be honest ) and if you’d like to hear previous episodes on it here is Susan Seenan the former CEO of Fertility Network in 2015

Then we spoke about it in 2017 when Fertility Network launched its Right to Try campaign.

So you can see, this issue has been impacting our access to treatment for a long time. 

What is going on is that your postcode impacts how many rounds of NHS funded treatment you are eligible, despite the NICE guidelines being that you SHOULD have 3 rounds of IVF treatment Natalie was fortunate to be living in an area where she did have this and had her son Phoenix, with the help of NHS funding.

Sadly this isn’t the case for a lot of you. 

Our first guest is Amber Izzo, a fertility patient advocate, blogger, and campaigner, founder of Fight for IVF and Innovation Fertility. We spoke to Amber on 6th July, ahead of her hearing from the CCG in Cambridgeshire and Peterborough who had been reviewing their IVF policy about whether they were going to reinstate funding 

Amber started it due to not having any access to NHS-funded treatment.. when she started there were 6 that didn’t offer any, now there are 3. 

Have a listen here to a previous episode we shared in 2020, where another listener Laura had success lobbying her CCG

The issue is that over 80% of CCGs don’t adhere to the NICE Guidelines which is why the Fight for Ivf campaign picked up a lot of momentum. Amber’s local MP’s in Cambridge was on board as he had personal experience )had a cross-party letter to the CCG, which secured a meeting in 2021 to secure the review. She had gained great exposure with media coverage on Sky and BBC and the petition is currently on 30k signatures. You can sign it here 

People are being refused to fund because the CCG has put in their own criteria, such as if your partner has a child already. You can appeal this. Amber has asked her GP to put on her notes if he refuses any of the tests she asks for, so there is proof of what she has requested and she can find out more about why they said no. 

Watch Amber and her husband Marco hearing about the CCG’s decision here.

So what other options are there for treatment? We spoke with Marta Jansa Perez, Director of Embryology at BPAS Fertility, who are launching their BPAS FERTILITY later in 2021

Please note we do talk about Implantation failure in this episode. 

Marta joined BPAS as she always felt strongly there was a need to help people and she joined BPAS to help create their not for profit service as they felt there was a gap in the market for people who can’t access NHS... 

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Hope.. and what it means to you

This week’s podcast episode is a little different as it’s Kate and I sharing our thoughts on what we’re doing for the rest of the year. 

We relaunched this podcast in February as we were really keen to try and map out what we thought you would want to know if you were just starting to try for a baby. 

I felt quite strongly that the podcast lacked a bit of structure and wanted to revisit topics. We also knew the by going over this information and signposting you to other episodes we’d already shared, it would be really useful if you were already trying and at different stages as we’ve shared updated info as well as recapping things that might help. 

So now we’ve reached the point in our content where we are about to head through the clinic door and it felt right to stop and reflect. 

Our aim with The Fertility Podcast is to educate, empower and support you at every stage and if we can help you to conceive naturally by sharing the insights of our experts, which may then to you asking more questions to your medical professionals, then we’ve done what we set out to do.. to help. 

Alongside the education, Kate and I are both dedicated to supporting your mental health. 

I feel like my own personal journey with infertility has affected my life much more than I realised or admitted and have done a lot of self-development ( and continue to ) to discover ways to work through certain feeling and understand myself better. 

 We want to create something really special and powerful for you over the coming months and talk about Hope. 

What we hope to do, is to share with you some fascinating ways in which we feel you can find hope alongside you. We'd love to hear your ways to find it and how to hold on to it as we know how much it helps for everyone who listens to this pod, to hear relatable stories. 

So if you would like to share what hope looks like in your life and pay it forward to anyone coming into this TTC space, who needs to find a way to find hope, please do get in touch. 

Just email and use the subject matter: Hope

SOCIALS:

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In this week’s episode, we talk to fertility consultant Rami Wakim. Rami, among other areas of expertise, specializes in Intrauterine Insemination (IUI).

We wanted to chat with Rami to find out if these days IUI is really worth it or should you go straight to IVF. Kate mentioned that, in her opinion, she has seen fewer and fewer IUI procedures performed over recent years. Is IUI on the decline?

Rami starts off by giving us a really interesting insight into the history of IUI. Did you know that the first successful IUI took place in 1953? It then became more popular as a fertility treatment in the ’70s and ’80s. However, only 35 countries consider IUI as a method of Assisted Reproductive Technology (ART) and only 30 consider it an appropriate treatment for single women.

So, is it worth it or is it just sex in a clinical room?

Rami spoke about how there isn’t any data about the success of IUI in the Middle East, Canada, and Australia and how

Europe only started offering data in 2002. There is currently not enough studies of IUI

Did you know that only 35 countries consider IUI as an ART technique?

When it comes to the NICE Guidelines, the suggestion for people who have not conceived after 6 cycles of donor sperm, should be offered a further 6 cycles ( 2013). You can read more here

In 2016 patients with unexplained or mild endometriosis or mild male factor should NOT be offered routine IUI, but should be advised to try naturally for 2 years before IVF considered

Rami highlighted the parameters for success with IUI are: 

1. Good sperm quality
2. Treatment has to be well-timed with the cycle, either using ovulation induction or based on the LH surge.
3. Double insemination seems more effective for the malefactor

As some people are very scared of IVF,  IUI is more accessible especially in communities where there is a lot of stigma around ART. People have the conviction to go for IVF after they have tried IUI, if they have been scared about the idea of it, at least they tried it.

You may be offered IUI if:

1.     you're unable to have vaginal sex – for example, because of a physical disability or psychosexual problem

2.     you have a condition that means you need specific help to conceive. For example, if 1 of you has HIV and it's not safe to have unprotected sex

3.     you're in a same-sex relationship and have not become pregnant after up to 6 cycles of IUI using donor sperm from a licensed fertility unit (the Stonewall website has more information about IUI for same-sex couples)

Bear in mind that the waiting list for IUI treatment on the NHS can be very long in some areas.

Costs range from about £700 to £1,600 for each cycle of IUI treatment.

Source NHS

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Earlier in June, a hugely important review by the Competition and Markets Authority (CMA) was published. This review produced guidance to help fertility clinics comply with their consumer law obligations but also provides guidance for you when considering purchasing IVF treatment. The word ‘purchasing’ there is massively significant because as well as being a patient, you are also a consumer and it’s very likely that you haven’t thought about fertility treatments in that way. It’s important that fertility clinics are fair and that you know your rights when it comes to consumer law.

In this episode, we’re delighted to talk to two guests who have been actively involved in assisting the CMA in producing this guidance – Clare Ettinhauser Director of Strategy and Corporate Affairs at the HFEA, and Patient Advocate and founder of @uberbarrensclub - Katy Linderman. Later we’re also joined by the chair of the British Fertility Society, consultant gynecologist Raj Mathur, to share his views on the CMA review.

Whilst we had Clare with us, we also asked her how best for women and couples to go about choosing a fertility clinic. Clare recommends checking out the Choose A Clinic function on the HFEA website. Kate uses this with her patients and finds it super useful in narrowing down your choices and finding the best clinic for you. She also mentioned paying attention to the individual clinics Live Birth rates on the HFEA website, these are collated and ratified by the HFEA every 2 years but are unlikely to differ very much in that time. Clare also talked about the benefits of attending, either in person or virtually, clinic open days.

Now on to the CMA review: Katy worked as a patient advisor to the CMA and it’s really obvious from reading the review that the patients’ best interests are at the center of every aspect. Katy talked about the need for patients to have accurate and timely information to help them make the right treatment choices and that there is a lot of work clinics need to do to adhere to this new guidance.

Here is what you should now expect to fully understand when choosing a clinic and treatments:

• a) Details about what the consultation consists of;(b) The cost of the consultation and any diagnostic tests and scans;
• (c) The possibility that additional diagnostic tests, and costs, maybe necessary once the results of the first tests are known;
• (d) Whether the results of any tests and scans already undertaken will be accepted; and
• (e) Details of any cancellation charges if they fail to attend the consultation appointment.

Claire talked about the HFEA’s involvement with the CMA review. Sadly, currently, the HFEA does not have any legal powers to ensure that clinics follow and adhere to the CMA guidance. We asked her if the HFEA had received any feedback from clinics since the review was published. As yet they have not but this is probably because clinics have been aware for some time that this review was happening, and that the guidance would be published.

As well as publishing information for clinics, the CMA has provided guidance for patients too. This also includes an informative video voiced by Lorraine Kelly and we urge you to watch this to understand your rights. Katy talks about the need to clinics to take considered action and make the legally required changes to their website, brochures, and any patient information so that there is treatment price transparency (among many of the other requirements) and a good understanding of what is and isn’t included, from the outset.

Katy also states that it is your legal right to have access to this information and if it’s not there, be your own advocate and persist in asking for it. By having this information you’ll feel more empowered on your fertility journey.

Next up we get Raj’s clinical opinion on the CMA guidance. He starts by stating that the British Fertility Society welcomes... 

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Dr. Zeynep Gurtin, a Lecturer in Women’s Health at the Institute for Women’s Health at UCL, and holds an Affiliate Lectureship at the University of Cambridge Sociology Department.

In 2020 - spoke to a sample of 457 women to find out their experience of fertility treatment whose treatment has been delayed due to clinic closures. The questionnaire was live for 6 weeks during May-June 2020

The focus was to talk about the issues from lockdown stopping treatment. It was monitored by a multidisciplinary team of 6 - clinicians, counselor, psychologist

The survey was an anonymous online long questionnaire - some quantitative, other questions asked for people to tell in their own words about the impact.

For many people, it was underlined with a sense of how important the treatment was. Dominant responses were that they were much less concerned about covid than their declining fertility.

People scared about how long this is going to last. How at the start there was such little clarity

People were saying ‘I don’t want to look back and say that this virus is what robbed me of my last chance to become a parent.

People who were essential workers, such as nurses, had a priority of wanting to undertake treatment, yet they were very aware they had to expose themselves to the virus.. and at the time we had no idea of the impact it might have on pregnancy.. and of course, it became impossible for them to take time off - issues of there not being enough clarity on what people should do when it came to having the vaccine initially.

On the other side, people who became furloughed or jobs were precarious, which made it even more difficult. People feeling anxious about how secure their employment was and what impact that would have on them having a family.

Words used to describe feelings :

Powerless, helpless, frustrated, anxious, intense feelings

‘when i heard the clinic was going to close I was completely devastated, my partner isn’t getting any younger and further delays to our treatment was beyond belief. It was a particularly bitter pill to swallow with all the jokes about lockdown baby boom’

‘i was so heartbroken to be so close to making it happen and then it was wiped away from us’

‘i find the uncertainty of the wait unbearable ‘

People talked about it as ‘yet another disruption’ people having to halt treatment in the past due to losses, for financial reasons, to stop caring for a family member - and now there was this

Patients having to undergo surgery for fibroids and just at the point when they could start treatment, it was put on halt… ‘a feeling like the world is against us.’

When will we get over the Covid crisis and when will we understand the impact it is having on the TTC community

People found it really difficult to receive support - many stories of people with young children/friends or work colleagues being insensitive ‘ at least your lucky you don’t have to home school’

How the clinics let people down - lack of communication such as timelines, lack of access to staff, and also a perceived lack of care and empathy. People getting letters with black lines

When clinics did offer updates - zoom meetings, webinars were really appreciated.

Having a counselor or patients supporter is an enormous help and reassurance, helps them feel connected, they have a place to check-in.

Hopefully, the message will be to the sector that better communication should be implemented. Some clinics have said they’ve been using the findings. It’s so important we put these mechanisms in place if some other form of disruption is to... 

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