After the Season 10 episode with Sam Brown, AKA Mrs AuDHD, was released in the summer, a lovely listener got in touch to share their feelings about being disappointed by some of the comments Sam and I made about how we felt about having ADHD.

Sam and I thought it was worth discussing our responses and reflections to the email, as it raised some really interesting questions around internalised ableism, and where any unconscious negative bias may have come from.

This is our unedited conversation about it.

If you missed the original episode with Sam, you might want to listen to that first - it's episode 129 (Season 10 Episode 1).

Sam is late-diagnosed AuDHD, a trustee of the ADHDadultUK charity and co-presenter of The ADHD Adults podcast, that deals with a different ADHD related topic each episode. Sam loves to collect hobbies, adores animals and inanimate objects and is ridiculously over-enthusiastic about almost everything apart from the sound of people eating, the feeling of someone breathing on any part of her, and anything gelatinous that isn't jelly.

Squarepeg is a podcast in which I talk to other late identified autistic women and nonbinary people about their lives, their autism journeys, and what they've learned along the way.

I'm Amy Richards, and I was diagnosed autistic in 2016, when I was 37. I've been sharing my conversations with other autistic adults since 2020.

I hope you'll find these conversations inspiring and thought provoking, and that they'll help you feel more connected to a worldwide community of people with similar experiences.

➡️LISTEN AD-FREE WHEN YOU BECOME A PATREON SUPPORTER https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast

EPISODE LINKS

Sam's original Squarepeg episode: https://squarepeg.community/129-s10-e1-i-thought-i-was-just-disorders-navigating-autistic-and-adhd-traits-and-challenges-with-mrs-audhd/

Sam's personal Instagram https://www.instagram.com/mrs_audhd_/

Her podcast website https://theadhdadults.uk/

Podcast Instagram https://www.instagram.com/theadhdadults

Facebook https://www.facebook.com/theadhdadults

ADHD Adult charity website http://adhdadult.uk/

Charity Instagram https://www.instagram.com/adhdadultuk/

If you think you may be autistic or have ADHD, these online tests can give an initial indication:

AQ50 quiz https://psychology-tools.com/test/autism-spectrum-quotient

ADHD quiz https://psychology-tools.com/test/adult-adhd-self-report-scale

If you'd like to connect with me, get in touch or follow Squarepeg, you can find me on:

Website: https://squarepeg.community/

Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/squarepeg.community/

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/squarepegautism/

THANK YOU TO MY PATRONS!

A HUGE thank you to my amazing patrons, who support my work on the podcast:

Abi Hunter, Alex Lee, Alice Kemp, Amy Adler, Anika Lacerte, Anna Grojec, Annette, Annie, Anya Nebl, Aubrey Brand, B Martinez, Barbara, Basia, Becca Lee, Becky Beasley, Ben Davies, Beth Kelly Herbert, Caprice, Carly, Caroline, Cat Preston, Cathy Oliver, Charlotte Keen, Claire Gerard, Corinne Cariad, Corrine L. McDermid, Dana, Dana Bradley, Danielle Warby, Danielle Wrench, Daphna Epstein, Deaborah, Deanna M. Counts Goldy, Dennis McNulty, E, Eleanor Goulding, Em, Emma Franks, Erica Kenworthy, Erin Mazow, Evgeniia Pupysheva, Ewan McNeill, Frederike, Galina, George Cole, Hannah Breslin, Heather Peake, Helen Anne Hooker, Helen Delaney, Helen Horgan, Helen White, Holly Knight-Smith, India, Jackie Allen, Jane, Jaqueline Coursey, Jayne Hutchinson, Jenn W, Jo, Jennifer Romanello, Joanna McKnight, Julie, Julie Goldberg, Karen, Karin Parker, KatF, Kate and Kathryn, Katharine Richards, Katherine, Katherine Meizel, Katie, Ken K, Kim Mortstock, Laura, Laura, Laurin Aman, Lilli Simmons, Lisa, Lisa Joy Powley, Lisa Williams, Liz, Lizzie, Lula Cork, Mandy Allen, Marjory Webber, Meg c, Melissa Shaw, Meredith L. Freyre, Mindy Wigzell, Monica Toohey, N, NC, Nicola Neil, Rebecca, Rebecca Biegel, Sadie Slater, Sandra Carey, Sandra Chapman, Sandra Rensman, Sandy Klarsten, Sandy Ladkin, Sarah Jeffrey, Sarah LW, Sarah Musgrave, Sarah Raine, Shelia Smith, Siobhan, Sophie King, Talia's Nature,Tris, Vicki Temple, Victoria Jeffrey and Zans McLachlan.

If you're enjoying the Squarepeg podcast and would like to help me carry on making new episodes, you can become a member of the Squarepeg community on Patreon from £3 per month: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast

Kara Nash is a registered nurse and autism consultant who focuses on creating positive change in how the healthcare system treats people on the spectrum.

Kara has over twenty years' experience working in the field of autism and mental health. Now 50, she was diagnosed autistic herself at 37.

During her career Kara has supported autistic people across the lifespan in hospitals, residential programs, schools, and community settings, and she now runs a private consulting practice in Western North Carolina.

She is also a public speaker, writer, and educator, creating practical resources for families and professionals and sharing insights about autism, neurodiversity, and the intersection of mental health and everyday life on YouTube and other platforms.

In this conversation Kara shares her personal experience with autism-centred therapy, why she was drawn to working in mental health and why she loves her work, and some of the frustrating aspects of being an autistic patient. She also talks about new drug therapies for autistic people, aimed at creating pro-social behaviour, and how we can advocate for ourselves better in medical scenarios. And the joy of learning to love our stims and give ourselves grace to let go of the things we're not organically wired to do.

Squarepeg is a podcast in which I talk to other late identified autistic women and nonbinary people about their lives, their autism journeys, and what they've learned along the way.

I'm Amy Richards, and I was diagnosed autistic in 2016, when I was 37. I've been sharing my conversations with other autistic adults since 2020.

I hope you'll find these conversations inspiring and thought provoking, and that they'll help you feel more connected to a worldwide community of people with similar experiences.

➡️LISTEN AD-FREE WHEN YOU BECOME A PATREON SUPPORTER https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast

EPISODE LINKS:

Website: https://www.theautisticautismconsultant.com

YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@theautisticautismconsultant

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/autisticautismconsultant/

The Curious Incident of the Dog in the Night-time (book mentioned in this episode): https://www.amazon.co.uk/Curious-Incident-Dog-Night-time/dp/0099450259

If you'd like to connect with me, get in touch or follow Squarepeg, you can find me on:

Website: https://squarepeg.community/

Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/squarepeg.community/

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/squarepegautism/

THANK YOU TO MY PATRONS!

A HUGE thank you to my amazing patrons, who support my work on the podcast:

Abi Hunter, Alex Lee, Alice Kemp, Amy Adler, Anika Lacerte, Anna Grojec, Annette, Annie, Anya Nebl, Aubrey Brand, B Martinez, Barbara, Basia, Becca Lee, Becky Beasley, Ben Davies, Beth Kelly Herbert, Caprice, Carly, Caroline, Cat Preston, Cathy Oliver, Charlotte Keen, Claire Gerard, Corinne Cariad, Corrine L. McDermid, Dana, Dana Bradley, Danielle Warby, Danielle Wrench, Daphna Epstein, Deaborah, Deanna M. Counts Goldy, Dennis McNulty, E, Eleanor Goulding, Em, Emma Franks, Erica Kenworthy, Erin Mazow, Evgeniia Pupysheva, Ewan McNeill, Fiona Connor, Frederike, Galina, George Cole, Hannah Breslin, Heather Peake, Helen Anne Hooker, Helen Delaney, Helen Horgan, Helen White, Holly Knight-Smith, India, Jackie Allen, Jane, Jaqueline Coursey, Jayne Hutchinson, Jenn W, Jo, Joanna McKnight, Julie, Julie Gillespie, Julie Goldberg, Karen, Karin Parker, KatF, Kate and Kathryn, Katharine Richards, Katherine, Katherine Meizel, Katie, Ken K, Kim Mortstock, Laura, Laura, Laurin Aman, Lilli Simmons, Lisa, Lisa Joy Powley, Lisa Williams, Liz, Lizzie, Lula Cork, Mandy Allen, Marjory Webber, Meg c, Melissa Shaw, Meredith L. Freyre, Mindy Wigzell, Monica Toohey, N, NC, Nicola Neil, Rebecca, Rebecca Biegel, Sadie Slater, Sandra Chapman, Sandra Rensman, Sandy Klarsten, Sandy Ladkin, Sarah Ivinson, Sarah Jeffrey, Sarah LW, Sarah Musgrave, Sarah Raine, Shelia Smith, Sophie King, Talia's Nature,Tamsen Staniford, Tris, Vicki Temple, Victoria Jeffrey and Zans McLachlan.

If you're enjoying the Squarepeg podcast and would like to help me carry on making new episodes, you can become a member of the Squarepeg community on Patreon from £3 per month: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast

Hassani Turner is an executive coach for neurodivergent professionals and the founder of MyNeuroCompass, a coaching service and app that helps neurodivergent people understand how their brains work, identify their strengths, stop masking and start leading authentically – as Hassani puts it, 'finding space to show up without shrinking'.

Hassani has spent 15 years in the corporate world. She was formally recognised as autistic at age 36, and her work is influenced by both her lived experience and her role as a corporate leader, where she helps organisations recognise and value their neurodivergent people.

She's also a speaker, writer, and advocate for inclusive leadership and accessibility – and creating workplaces where neurodivergent talent isn't just accommodated, but genuinely valued.

Hassani is 40 years old and lives in New York with her beloved little dog, Lola.

In this conversation Hassani talks about her childhood experience of internalised meltdowns and masking, being the 'uncool' kid at school and taking her social cues from the shows she watched on TV. And she shares the workplace experiences that led her to create the app she had always wanted to have – using frameworks she created for herself that she is now using to help other autistic people navigate work.

Squarepeg is a podcast in which I talk to other late identified autistic women and nonbinary people about their lives, their autism journeys, and what they've learned along the way.

I'm Amy Richards, and I was diagnosed autistic in 2016, when I was 37. I've been sharing my conversations with other autistic adults since 2020.

I hope you'll find these conversations inspiring and thought provoking, and that they'll help you feel more connected to a worldwide community of people with similar experiences.

➡️LISTEN AD-FREE WHEN YOU BECOME A PATREON SUPPORTER https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast

EPISODE LINKS:

Website: MyNeuroCompass.com

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/myneurocompass

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassani-turner-a70a667/

If you'd like to connect with me, get in touch or follow Squarepeg, you can find me on:

Website: https://squarepeg.community/

Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/squarepeg.community/

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/squarepegautism/

THANK YOU TO MY PATRONS!

A HUGE thank you to my amazing patrons, who support my work on the podcast:

Abi Hunter, Alex Lee, Alice Kemp, Amy Adler, Anika Lacerte, Anna Grojec, Annette, Annie, Anya Nebl, Aubrey Brand, B Martinez, Barbara, Basia, Becca Lee, Becky Beasley, Ben Davies, Beth Kelly Herbert, Caprice, Carly, Caroline, Cat Preston, Catherine, Cathy Oliver, Charlotte Keen, Claire Gerard, Corinne Cariad, Corrine L. McDermid, Dana, Dana Bradley, Danielle Warby, Danielle Wrench, Daphna Epstein, Deaborah, Deanna M. Counts Goldy, Dennis McNulty, E, Eleanor Goulding, Em, Emma Franks, Erica Kenworthy, Erin Mazow, Evgeniia Pupysheva, Ewan McNeill, Fiona Connor, Frederike, Galina, George Cole, Hannah Breslin, Heather Peake, Helen Anne Hooker, Helen Delaney, Helen White, Holly Knight-Smith, India, Jackie Allen, Jane, Jaqueline Coursey, Jayne Hutchinson, Jenn W, Jo, Joanna McKnight, Julie, Julie Gillespie, Julie Goldberg, Karen, Karin Parker, KatF, Kate and Kathryn, Katharine Richards, Katherine, Katherine Meizel, Katie, Ken K, Kim Mortstock, Laura, Laura, Laurin Aman, Lilli Simmons, Lisa, Lisa Joy Powley, Lisa Williams, Liz, Lizzie, Lula Cork, Mandy Allen, Marjory Webber, Meg c, Melissa Shaw, Meredith L. Freyre, Mindy Wigzell, Monica Toohey, N, NC, Nicola Neil, Rebecca, Rebecca Biegel, Sadie Slater, Sandra Chapman, Sandy Klarsten, Sandy Ladkin, Sarah Ivinson, Sarah Jeffrey, Sarah LW, Sarah Musgrave, Sarah Raine, Shelia Smith, Sophie King, Talia's Nature,Tamsen Staniford, Tris, Vicki Temple, Victoria Jeffrey and Zans McLachlan.

If you're enjoying the Squarepeg podcast and would like to help me carry on making new episodes, you can become a member of the Squarepeg community on Patreon from £3 per month: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast

Lara Schaeffer taught high school English for 28 years until her autism identification at age 47 - and her school's resistance to her being open about her autism to her students. She waited three years for them to change their stance, before eventually leaving the secure, well paying job she thought she would one day retire from.

Now in her early 50s, these days Lara works as a counselor to autistic adults and young adults. She is a twice divorced mother of an autistic daughter, and describes herself as having 'lots of life rockiness' - which she has no doubt has a lot to do with her previously unidentified autism. She lives in Charlottesville, Virginia, USA.

In our conversation Lara shares some of her experiences of an undiagnosed childhood and adolescence, always seeming to be on a different track to her peers, thinking or acting differently and never sticking with the pack. She talks about her strongly held belief in self identification - and her journey from established high school teacher to finding new purpose, fulfilment and a new sense of self advocating for other late identified autistics. She explains the guided self assessment process, and also tells me about her psychological service dog.

Squarepeg is a podcast in which I talk to other late identified autistic women and nonbinary people about their lives, their autism journeys, and what they've learned along the way.

I'm Amy Richards, and I was diagnosed autistic in 2016, when I was 37. I've been sharing my conversations with other autistic adults since 2020.

I hope you'll find these conversations inspiring and thought provoking, and that they'll help you feel more connected to a worldwide community of people with similar experiences.

➡️LISTEN AD-FREE WHEN YOU BECOME A PATREON SUPPORTER https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast

EPISODE LINKS:

https://autism-discovery.com/

https://findyourwaytoday.com/

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/lara.schaeffer.2022

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/autism.discovery

YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@LaraSchaeffer

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/laraschaeffer/

If you'd like to connect with me, get in touch or follow Squarepeg, you can find me on:

Website: https://squarepeg.community/

Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/squarepeg.community/

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/squarepegautism/

THANK YOU TO MY PATRONS!

A HUGE thank you to my amazing patrons, who support my work on the podcast:

Abi Hunter, Alex Lee, Alice Kemp, Amy Adler, Anika Lacerte, Anna Grojec, Annette, Annie, Anya Nebl, Aubrey Brand, B Martinez, Barbara, Basia, Becca Lee, Becky Beasley, Ben Davies, Beth Kelly Herbert, Caprice, Carly, Caroline, Cat Preston, Catherine, Cathy Oliver, Charlotte Keen, Claire Gerard, Corinne Cariad, Corrine L. McDermid, Dana, Dana Bradley, Danielle Warby, Danielle Wrench, Daphna Epstein, Deaborah, Deanna M. Counts Goldy, Dennis McNulty, E, Eleanor Goulding, Em, Emma Franks, Erica Kenworthy, Erin Mazow, Evgeniia Pupysheva, Ewan McNeill, Fiona Connor, Frederike, Galina, George Cole, Hannah Breslin, Heather Peake, Helen Anne Hooker, Helen Delaney, Helen White, Holly Knight-Smith, India, Jackie Allen, Jane Galloway. Jaqueline Coursey, Jayne Hutchinson, Jenn W, Jo, Joanna McKnight, Julie, Julie Gillespie, Julie Goldberg, Karen, Karin Parker, KatF, Kate and Kathryn, Katharine Richards, Katherine, Katherine Meizel, Katie, Ken K, Kim Mortstock, Laura, Laura, Laurin Aman, Lilli Simmons, Lisa, Lisa Joy Powley, Lisa Williams, Liz, Lizzie, Lula Cork, Mandy Allen, Marjory Webber, Meg c, Melissa Shaw, Meredith L. Freyre, Mindy Wigzell, Monica Toohey, N, NC, Nicola Neil, Rebecca, Rebecca Biegel, Sadie Slater, Sandra Chapman, Sandy Klarsten, Sandy Ladkin, Sarah Ivinson, Sarah Jeffrey, Sarah LW, Sarah Musgrave, Sarah Raine, Shelia Smith, Sophie King, Talia's Nature,Tamsen Staniford, Tris, Vicki Temple, Victoria Jeffrey and Zans McLachlan.

If you're enjoying the Squarepeg podcast and would like to help me carry on making new episodes, you can become a member of the Squarepeg community on Patreon from £3 per month: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast

Marian Schembari is an author and essayist whose first byline was at age eleven. It was a poem about dragons. Since then, her essays about travel, friendship, money, and love have appeared in many well known publications, including The New York Times and Marie Claire. Marian was formally recognised as autistic at 34, and spent the next couple of years writing a memoir about it, A Little Less Broken, which came out last year.

Marian grew up in an Italian/Puerto Rican family and has lived all over the world, including in New Zealand and Germany. She now lives in Portland, Oregon with her husband and daughter, where she now writes full time.

In this conversation Marian talks about the positive impact of her diagnosis on her relationships, and learning to express her needs; her experience of living abroad, being seen as the 'quirky, charming foreign friend'; and the contradictions of different facets of ourselves, and how our capacities and needs evolve and change over time.

Marian also shares her writing process and how writing a memoir prompted some honest conversations about past events and relationships.

She also gives a unique and beautiful answer to the 'go back in time to your former self' question, which might just be my favourite so far (if I'm allowed to have a favourite!).

Squarepeg is a podcast in which I talk to other late identified autistic women and nonbinary people about their lives, their autism journeys, and what they've learned along the way.

I'm Amy Richards, and I was diagnosed autistic in 2016, when I was 37. I've been sharing my conversations with other autistic adults since 2020.

I hope you'll find these conversations inspiring and thought provoking, and that they'll help you feel more connected to a worldwide community of people with similar experiences.

➡️LISTEN AD-FREE WHEN YOU BECOME A PATREON SUPPORTER https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast

EPISODE LINKS:

https://www.marianschembari.com/

If you'd like to connect with me, get in touch or follow Squarepeg, you can find me on:

Website: https://squarepeg.community/

Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/squarepeg.community/

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/squarepegautism/

THANK YOU TO MY PATRONS!

A HUGE thank you to my amazing patrons, who support my work on the podcast:

Abi Hunter, Alex Lee, Alice Kemp, Amy Adler, Anika Lacerte, Anna Grojec, Annette, Annie, Anya Nebl, Aubrey Brand, B Martinez, Barbara, Basia, Becca Lee, Becky Beasley, Ben Davies, Beth Kelly Herbert, Caprice, Caroline, Cat Preston, Catherine, Cathy Oliver, Charlotte Keen, Claire Gerard, Corinne Cariad, Corrine L. McDermid, Dana, Dana Bradley, Danielle Warby, Danielle Wrench, Daphna Epstein, Deaborah, Deanna M. Counts Goldy, Dennis McNulty, E, Em, Emma Franks, Erica Kenworthy, Erin Mazow, Evgeniia Pupysheva, Ewan McNeill, Fiona Connor, Frederike, Galina, George Cole, Hannah Breslin, Heather Peake, Helen Anne Hooker, Helen Delaney, Helen White, Holly Knight-Smith, India, Jackie Allen, Jane Galloway. Jaqueline Coursey, Jayne Hutchinson, Jenn W, Jo, Joanna McKnight, Julie, Julie Gillespie, Julie Goldberg, Karen, Karin Parker, KatF, Kate and Kathryn, Katharine Richards, Katherine, Katherine Meizel, Katie, Ken K, Kim Mortstock, Laura, Laura, Laurin Aman, Lilli Simmons, Lisa, Lisa Joy Powley, Lisa Williams, Liz, Lizzie, Lula Cork, Mandy Allen, Marjory Webber, Meg c, Melissa Shaw, Meredith L. Freyre, Mindy Wigzell, Monica Toohey, N, NC, Nicola Neil, Rebecca, Rebecca Biegel, Sadie Slater, Sandra Chapman, Sandy Klarsten, Sandy Ladkin, Sarah Ivinson, Sarah Jeffrey, Sarah LW, Sarah Musgrave, Sarah Raine, Shelia Smith, Sophie King, Talia's Nature,Tamsen Staniford, Tris, Vicki Temple, Victoria Jeffrey and Zans McLachlan.

If you're enjoying the Squarepeg podcast and would like to help me carry on making new episodes, you can become a member of the Squarepeg community on Patreon from £3 per month: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast

Shazzy Tharby is a Disability & Neurodiversity Leader, Mental Health & Neurodivergence Consultant, counsellor and psychotherapist, the Founder of Positively Living, a worldwide therapeutic service, and Vice President of the Australian Clinical Supervision Association.

Shazzy describes herself as "Autistic, disabled, a wheelchair user, and Muslim". They are 49, the parent of two autistic children, and they live in Perth in Western Australia, where their mental health leadership is transforming people's understanding of neurodiversity, trauma, and inclusion.

A multicultural and multilingual neurodivergent Muslim woman, Shazzy sees disability and neurodivergence not as deficits, but as powerful forms of human diversity. Guided by lived experience, anti-colonial practice, and liberation psychotherapy and care, her aim is to ensure that advocacy, services and leadership reflect our realities, and help shape a more just and inclusive future.

In our conversation we talk about how neurodivergent people are treated in crisis and medical situations, and the changes that are needed; the need for distinct clinical supervision for neurodivergent clinicians; how autism is viewed among the medical profession, and the idea of autistic culture. Shazzy also shares the delightful concept of autism birthdays!

Although there are difficult topics in this episode, the fact that people like Shazzy exist and are working in these spaces fills me with hope for us all.

CONTENT WARNING:

There is mention and discussion of suicide at various points throughout this episode, so if this is a topic that's difficult for you, you might want to give this one a miss.

Squarepeg is a podcast in which I talk to other late identified autistic women and nonbinary people about their lives, their autism journeys, and what they've learned along the way.

I'm Amy Richards, and I was diagnosed autistic in 2016, when I was 37. I've been sharing my conversations with other autistic adults since 2020.

I hope you'll find these conversations inspiring and thought provoking, and that they'll help you feel more connected to a worldwide community of people with similar experiences.

➡️LISTEN AD-FREE WHEN YOU BECOME A PATREON SUPPORTER https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast

EPISODE LINKS:

Website: www.positivelyliving.com.au

Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/shazzy-t-23752b9

If you'd like to connect with me, get in touch or follow Squarepeg, you can find me on:

Website: https://squarepeg.community/

Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/squarepeg.community/

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/squarepegautism/

THANK YOU TO MY PATRONS!

A HUGE thank you to my amazing patrons, who support my work on the podcast:

Abi Hunter, Alex, Alex Lee, Alice Kemp, Amy Adler, Anika Lacerte, Anna Grojec, Annette, Annie, Anya Nebl, Aubrey Brand, B Martinez, Barbara, Basia, Becca Lee, Becky Beasley, Ben Davies, Beth Kelly Herbert, Caprice, Caroline, Cat Preston, Catherine, Cathy Oliver, Charlotte Keen, Claire Gerard, Corinne Cariad, Corrine L. McDermid, Dana, Dana Bradley, Danielle Warby, Danielle Wrench, Daphna Epstein, Deaborah, Deanna M. Counts Goldy, Dennis McNulty, E, Em, Emma Franks, Erica Kenworthy, Erin Mazow, Evgeniia Pupysheva, Ewan McNeill, Fiona Connor, Frederike, Galina, George Cole, Hannah Breslin, Heather Peake, Helen Anne Hooker, Helen Delaney, Helen White, Holly Knight-Smith, India, Jackie Allen, Jane Galloway. Jaqueline Coursey, Jayne Hutchinson, Jenn W, Jo, Joanna McKnight, Julie, Julie Gillespie, Julie Goldberg, Karen, Karin Parker, KatF, Kate and Kathryn, Katharine Richards, Katherine, Katherine Meizel, Katie, Ken K, Kim Mortstock, Laura, Laura, Laurin Aman, Lilli Simmons, Lisa, Lisa Joy Powley, Lisa Williams, Liz, Lizzie, Lula Cork, Mandy Allen, Marjory Webber, Meg c, Melissa Shaw, Meredith L. Freyre, Mindy Wigzell, Monica Toohey, N, NC, Nicola Neil, Rebecca, Rebecca Biegel, Sadie Slater, Sandra Chapman, Sandy Klarsten, Sandy Ladkin, Sarah Ivinson, Sarah Jeffrey, Sarah LW, Sarah Musgrave, Sarah Raine, Shelia Smith, Sophie King, Talia's Nature,Tamsen Staniford, Tris, Vicki Temple, Victoria Jeffrey and Zans McLachlan.

If you're enjoying the Squarepeg podcast and would like to help me carry on making new episodes, you can become a member of the Squarepeg community on Patreon from £3 per month: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast

My guest this week is Clara Törnvall, an author and journalist who lives in Stockholm, Sweden with her two children. Clara was diagnosed autistic five years ago at age 42, leading her to write her first book, The Autists - Women on the Spectrum, a personal essay and cultural history of autism, which has been sold to 13 countries. In 2023, she published a second book, The Autist's Guide to the Galaxy, which places autistics as the 'normal' ones and neurotypicals as the outsiders.

Clara's background is in radio and TV presenting and she has also been the editor of several Swedish national TV shows. Since 2021 she has worked as a cultural journalist for television, radio and newspapers, covering literature, music and film.

She also lectures on autism and inclusion.

Clara shares her experience of growing up undiagnosed in Sweden, a 'silent, too intense' child, feeling 'out of step' with others and filled with ever-present anxiety. We talk about Swedish attitudes to neurodivergence and equality, masking, the communication differences that can cause autistics so much trouble - despite our best intentions - reactions to Clara's books from autistic and neurotypical readers, and why it's never too late to get an autism diagnosis.

Squarepeg is a podcast in which I talk to other late identified autistic women and nonbinary people about their lives, their autism journeys, and what they've learned along the way.

I'm Amy Richards, and I was diagnosed autistic in 2016, when I was 37. I've been sharing my conversations with other autistic adults since 2020.

I hope you'll find these conversations inspiring and thought provoking, and that they'll help you feel more connected to a worldwide community of people with similar experiences.

➡️LISTEN AD-FREE WHEN YOU BECOME A PATREON SUPPORTER https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast

EPISODE LINKS:

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/claratornvall

Website: https://www.claratornvall.com/

If you'd like to connect with me, get in touch or follow Squarepeg, you can find me on:

Website: https://squarepeg.community/

Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/squarepeg.community/

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/squarepegautism/

THANK YOU TO MY PATRONS!

A HUGE thank you to my amazing patrons, who support my work on the podcast:

Abi Hunter, Alex, Alex Lee, Alice Kemp, Amy Adler, Anika Lacerte, Anna Grojec, Annette, Annie, Anya Nebl, Aubrey Brand, B Martinez, Barbara, Basia, Becca Lee, Becky Beasley, Ben Davies, Beth Kelly Herbert, Caprice, Caroline, Cat Preston, Catherine, Cathy Oliver, Charlotte Keen, Claire Gerard, Corinne Cariad, Corrine L. McDermid, Dana, Dana Bradley, Danielle Warby, Danielle Wrench, Daphna Epstein, Deaborah, Deanna M. Counts Goldy, Dennis McNulty, E, Em, Emma Franks, Erica Kenworthy, Erin Mazow, Evgeniia Pupysheva, Ewan McNeill, Fiona Connor, Frederike, Galina, George Cole, Hannah Breslin, Heather Peake, Helen Anne Hooker, Helen Delaney, Helen White, Holly Knight-Smith, India, Jackie Allen, Jane Galloway. Jaqueline Coursey, Jayne Hutchinson, Jenn W, Jo, Joanna McKnight, Julie, Julie Gillespie, Julie Goldberg, Karen, Karin Parker, KatF, Kate and Kathryn, Katharine Richards, Katherine, Katherine Meizel, Ken K, Kim Mortstock, Laura, Laura, Laurin Aman, Lilli Simmons, Lisa, Lisa Joy Powley, Lisa Williams, Liz, Lizzie, Lula Cork, Mandy Allen, Marjory Webber, Meg c, Melissa Shaw, Meredith L. Freyre, Mindy Wigzell, Monica Toohey, N, NC, Nicola Neil, Rebecca, Rebecca Biegel, Sadie Slater, Sandra Chapman, Sandy Klarsten, Sandy Ladkin, Sarah Ivinson, Sarah Jeffrey, Sarah LW, Sarah Musgrave, Sarah Raine, Shelia Smith, Sophie King, Talia's Nature,Tamsen Staniford, Tris, Vicki Temple, Victoria Jeffrey and Zans McLachlan.

If you're enjoying the Squarepeg podcast and would like to help me carry on making new episodes, you can become a member of the Squarepeg community on Patreon from £3 per month: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast

** We're taking a 2-week mid-season break – new episodes will start again on Saturday 27 September **

Leighanne Stephens is a fitness and lifestyle coach for neurodivergent women and non binary people. Now 27, she was diagnosed autistic two years ago, with as she puts it, 'a surprise addition of ADHD'.

Leighanne lives in London and has been self employed since leaving college, niching down to work exclusively with neurodivergent folk last year.

In our conversation we talk about the effects of burnout, how Leighanne has come to accept her spiky profile, the relationships between dyspraxia, coordination, rhythm and auditory processing, how she has gradually built a business that works for her and meets her needs, and why neurodivergent people need a different approach to fitness coaching.

Leighanne also shares some interesting and useful thoughts and tips for anyone wanting to get fitter but facing some barriers due to autistic or ADHD traits.

Squarepeg is a podcast in which I talk to other late identified autistic women and nonbinary people about their lives, their autism journeys, and what they've learned along the way.

I'm Amy Richards, and I was diagnosed autistic in 2016, when I was 37. I've been sharing my conversations with other autistic adults since 2020.

I hope you'll find these conversations inspiring and thought provoking, and that they'll help you feel more connected to a worldwide community of people with similar experiences.

➡️LISTEN AD-FREE WHEN YOU BECOME A PATREON SUPPORTER https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast

EPISODE LINKS:

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/projectyouacademy/

TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@projectyouacademy

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/leighanne-stephens-aa3b19194/

If you'd like to connect with me, get in touch or follow Squarepeg, you can find me on:

Website: https://squarepeg.community/

Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/squarepeg.community/

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/squarepegautism/

THANK YOU TO MY PATRONS!

A HUGE thank you to my amazing patrons, who support my work on the podcast:

Abi Hunter, Alex, Alex Lee, Alice Kemp, Amy Adler, Anika Lacerte, Anna Grojec, Annette, Annie, Anya Nebl, Aubrey Brand, B Martinez, Barbara, Basia, Becca Lee, Becky Beasley, Ben Davies, Beth Kelly Herbert, Caprice, Caroline, Cat Preston, Catherine, Cathy Oliver, Charlotte Keen, Claire Gerard, Corinne Cariad, Corrine L. McDermid, Dana, Dana Bradley, Danielle Warby, Danielle Wrench, Daphna Epstein, Deaborah, Deanna M. Counts Goldy, Dennis McNulty, E, Em, Emma Franks, Erica Kenworthy, Erin Mazow, Evgeniia Pupysheva, Ewan McNeill, Frederike, Galina, George Cole, Hannah Breslin, Heather Peake, Helen Anne Hooker, Helen Delaney, Helen White, Holly Knight-Smith, India, Jackie Allen, Jaqueline Coursey, Jayne Hutchinson, Jenn W, Jo, Joanna McKnight, Julie, Julie Gillespie, Karen, Karin Parker, KatF, Kate and Kathryn, Katharine Richards, Katherine, Katherine Meizel, Ken K, Kim Mortstock, Laura, Laura, Laurin Aman, Lilli Simmons, Lisa, Lisa Joy Powley, Lisa Williams, Liz, Lizzie, Lula Cork, Mandy Allen, Marjory Webber, Martha Everett, Meg c, Melissa Shaw, Meredith L. Freyre, Mindy Wigzell, Monica Toohey, NC, Nicola Neil, Rebecca, Rebecca Biegel, Sadie Slater, Sandra Chapman, Sandy Klarsten, Sandy Ladkin, Sarah Ivinson, Sarah Jeffrey, Sarah LW, Sarah Musgrave, Sarah Raine, Shelia Smith, Sophie King, Talia's Nature,Tamsen Staniford, Tris, Vicki Temple, Victoria Jeffrey and Zans McLachlan.

If you're enjoying the Squarepeg podcast and would like to help me carry on making new episodes, you can become a member of the Squarepeg community on Patreon from £3 per month: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast

Dr Michelle McQuaid is a wellbeing researcher in her early 50s. She lives and works in Melbourne, Australia, where she is an honorary fellow at Melbourne University's Center for Wellbeing Science. Michelle was diagnosed autistic nearly ten years ago, after her then five year old son was diagnosed.

By then, Michelle's autistic brain had turned perfectionism into an all-consuming mission, and by 34 this relentless intensity ended in burnout. She had assumed a 'good girl' persona - perfect performance, constant people-pleasing, and protecting others at any cost - and, as she puts it, turning herself into "a human ATM of generosity".

For Michelle, an autism diagnosis wasn't just an explanation – it was liberation. Understanding her autistic brain helped her recognise that her patterns weren't personal failings, but the result of trying to force her neurodivergent brain into a neurotypical world. This realisation transformed how she navigates both her autism and the 'good girl' expectations, by uncovering evidence-based practices we can all use.

In this conversation we talk about burnout, masking and self-compassion. We explore the impact of societal expectations on autistic women, the concept of the 'good girl' and how Michelle learned to embrace her autistic traits and developed strategies for understanding her neurodiversity and practices that can transform the way we see ourselves and the lives we build.

Squarepeg is a podcast in which I talk to other late identified autistic women and nonbinary people about their lives, their autism journeys, and what they've learned along the way.

I'm Amy Richards, and I was diagnosed autistic in 2016, when I was 37. I've been sharing my conversations with other autistic adults since 2020.

I hope you'll find these conversations inspiring and thought provoking, and that they'll help you feel more connected to a worldwide community of people with similar experiences.

➡️LISTEN AD-FREE WHEN YOU BECOME A PATREON SUPPORTER

https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast

EPISODE LINKS:

Good Girl resources: https://www.thegoodgirlgamechangers.com

Website: https://www.michellemcquaid.com/

The Perfectly Imperfect Little Girl: https://michellemcquaid.substack.com/p/buy-now-the-perfectly-imperfect-books

The Ordinary Princess: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Ordinary-Princess-Puffin-Book/dp/0141361166

Character strengths: https://www.viacharacter.org/

If you'd like to connect with me, get in touch or follow Squarepeg, you can find me on:

Website: https://squarepeg.community/

Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/squarepeg.community/

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/squarepegautism/

THANK YOU TO MY PATRONS!

A HUGE thank you to my amazing patrons, who support my work on the podcast:

Abi Hunter, Alex, Alex Lee, Alice Kemp, Amy Adler, Anika Lacerte, Anna Grojec, Annette, Annie, Anya Nebl, Aubrey Brand, B Martinez, Barbara, Basia, Becca Lee, Becky Beasley, Ben Davies, Beth Kelly Herbert, Caprice, Caroline, Cat Preston, Catherine, Cathy Oliver, C B, Charlotte Keen, Claire Gerard, Corinne Cariad, Corrine L. McDermid, Dana, Dana Bradley, Danielle Warby, Danielle Wrench, Daphna Epstein, Deaborah, Deanna M. Counts Goldy, Dennis McNulty, E, Em, Emma Franks, Erica Kenworthy, Erin Mazow, Evgeniia Pupysheva, Ewan McNeill, Frederike, Galina, George Cole, H Arena, Hannah Breslin, Heather Peake, Helen Anne Hooker, Helen Delaney, Helen White, Holly Knight-Smith, India, Jackie Allen, Jaqueline Coursey, Jayne Hutchinson, Jenn W, Jo, Joanna McKnight, Julie, Julie Gillespie, Karen, Karin Parker, KatF, Kate and Kathryn, Katharine Richards, Katherine, Katherine Meizel, Ken K, Kim Mortstock, Laura, Laura, Laurin Aman, Lilli Simmons, Lisa, Lisa Joy Powley, Lisa Williams, Liz, Lizzie, Lula Cork, Mandy Allen, Marjory Webber, Martha Everett, Meg c, Melissa Shaw, Meredith L. Freyre, Mindy Wigzell, Monica Toohey, NC, Nicola Neil, Pete Burke, Rebecca, Rebecca Biegel, Sadie Slater, Sandra Chapman, Sandy Klarsten, Sandy Ladkin, Sarah Ivinson, Sarah Jeffrey, Sarah LW, Sarah Musgrave, Sarah Raine, Shelia Smith, Sophie King, Talia's Nature,Tamsen Staniford, Tris, Vicki Temple, Victoria Jeffrey and Zans McLachlan.

If you're enjoying the Squarepeg podcast and would like to help me carry on making new episodes, you can become a member of the Squarepeg community on Patreon from £3 per month: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast

Kirsty Cullen-Campanelli is Head Of People Ops, Comms And Employee Engagement at Apple. She was diagnosed autistic two years ago at 38.

Kirsty's story began on a council estate in southern England, where she grew up in a working-class family alongside foster siblings from the age of three. Her journey into mental health and self-understanding began early - navigating life with a narcissistic, psychologically-abusive mother, and losing her father to suicide at 18. She left school with modest grades, worked multiple jobs to put herself through community colleges and university, and left England at 21 to begin again in the Middle East.

In 2017, she took a leap of faith, moved to the U.S, and now lives in the Californian mountains with her husband.

Kirsty is passionate about creating space for neuroinclusivity and acceptance, particularly for those who've ever questioned where or whether they belong: as women, as leaders, or simply as human beings in the world. Kirsty's lived experience sits at the heart of everything she does. Her story is one of resilience, humility, and hope, and shows how, with intention, effort, and compassion, it's possible not only to find your place, but to help build one where others can belong too.

In our conversation Kirsty shares her diagnosis journey and the complex emotional landscape of late diagnosis, the impact of her childhood experiences, and how understanding her neurodivergence has reshaped her self-perception. Kirsty talks about her 'spiky' cognitive profile, and her approach to leadership as an autistic professional. We talk about self-compassion, therapy, workplace dynamics, and the ongoing process of self-discovery.

Squarepeg is a podcast in which I talk to other late identified autistic women and nonbinary people about their lives, their autism journeys, and what they've learned along the way.

I'm Amy Richards, and I was diagnosed autistic in 2016, when I was 37. I've been sharing my conversations with other autistic adults since 2020.

I hope you'll find these conversations inspiring and thought provoking, and that they'll help you feel more connected to a worldwide community of people with similar experiences.

➡️LISTEN AD-FREE WHEN YOU BECOME A PATREON SUPPORTER https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast

EPISODE LINKS:

Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kirstycullencampanelli/

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/jetson_zero/

If you'd like to connect with me, get in touch or follow Squarepeg, you can find me on:

Website: https://squarepeg.community/

Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/squarepeg.community/

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/squarepegautism/

THANK YOU TO MY PATRONS!

A HUGE thank you to my amazing patrons, who support my work on the podcast:

Abi Hunter, Alex, Alex Lee, Alice Kemp, Amy Adler, Anika Lacerte, Anna Grojec, Annette, Annie, Anya Nebl, Aubrey Brand, B Martinez, Barbara, Basia, Becca Lee, Becky Beasley, Ben Davies, Beth Kelly Herbert, Caprice, Caroline, Cat Preston, Catherine, Cathy Oliver, C B, Charlotte Keen, Claire Gerard, Corinne Cariad, Corrine L. McDermid, Dana, Dana Bradley, Danielle Warby, Danielle Wrench, Daphna Epstein, Deaborah, Deanna M. Counts Goldy, Dennis McNulty, E, Em, Emma Franks, Erica Kenworthy, Erin Mazow, Evgeniia Pupysheva, Ewan McNeill, Frederike, Galina, George Cole, H Arena, Hannah Breslin, Heather Peake, Helen Anne Hooker, Helen Delaney, Helen White, Holly Knight-Smith, India, Jackie Allen, Jaqueline Coursey, Jayne Hutchinson, Jenn W, Jo, Joanna McKnight, Julie, Julie Gillespie, Karen, Karin Parker, KatF, Kate and Kathryn, Katharine Richards, Katherine, Katherine Meizel, Ken K, Kim Mortstock, Laura, Laura, Laurin Aman, Lilli Simmons, Lisa, Lisa Joy Powley, Lisa Williams, Liz, Lizzie, Lula Cork, Mandy Allen, Marjory Webber, Martha Everett, Meg c, Melissa Shaw, Meredith L. Freyre, Mindy Wigzell, Monica Toohey, NC, Nicola Neil, Pete Burke, Rebecca, Rebecca Biegel, Sadie Slater, Sandra Chapman, Sandy Klarsten, Sandy Ladkin, Sarah Ivinson, Sarah Jeffrey, Sarah LW, Sarah Musgrave, Sarah Raine, Shelia Smith, Sophie King, Talia's Nature,Tamsen Staniford, Tris, Vicki Temple, Victoria Jeffrey and Zans McLachlan.

If you're enjoying the Squarepeg podcast and would like to help me carry on making new episodes, you can become a member of the Squarepeg community on Patreon from £3 per month: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast