With Pace

Even by the standards of WorldTour racing, Dennis van Winden’s career has seen a lot of highs and lows. Starting out on the legendary Rabobank development team as a teenager, he landed a spot on the WorldTour team and was starting to distinguish himself as a promising new talent when a catastrophic health incident changed his trajectory. He returned to Rabobank (then LottoNL–Jumbo) through 2016, but eventually stepped away from road racing and began focusing on the U.S. gravel scene. Now, he coaches a long roster of American talents through Orange Seal Academy, including Cole Paton and World Cup rider Savilia Blunk. 

Payson sat down with Dennis in Girona this week to talk about his 13 years in the pro peloton and his transition into coaching. Dennis discusses the mistakes he made as an overly-disciplined young racer, the surgery he had in his early 20s that was meant to improve his cycling career but nearly ended it, and how his “Dutch directness” ultimately led to his current role at Orange Seal Academy. He also reflects candidly on what it was like to enter road racing on the tail-end of the doping era, and how he’s coaching young cyclists to approach their training in exactly the opposite way that he did.

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In this final episode of the year, Payson answers your questions about training, the 2023 season, UCI points, mustaches, and much more. 

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This week, cycling trainer Derek Teel returns to answer more questions about strength training for endurance cyclists. He goes over the importance of mobility, how to do a proper push-up, and the equipment-free exercises everyone should be incorporating into their pre-ride routine. He also talks about some of his own endurance efforts, including double Everesting, in which he climbed over 58,000 feet in 27 hours, Everesting Roam, in which he climbed over 29,000 feet over 326 miles. 

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Derek Teel began his career as a downhill mountain biker, only to pivot toward personal training when he became fascinated with his team’s trainers and nutritionists. Over time, he found a way to combine his two passions, and his company, Dialed Health, was born, a strength training program geared specifically toward cyclists. In this episode, Derek joins Payson to talk about why cyclists require a different kind of strength training than other athletes, and how conversations with his fellow gravity racers inspired him to start his business. He dispels some long-held beliefs about cyclists and strength training, offers advice for those who are short on time, and discusses where cyclists should fit strength training into their schedules based on their racing goals. He also delves into his personal journey and how the difficult decision to go all-in on Dialed Health at a pivotal point in his life paid off. 

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Katie Burrell has been called the “action sports cult antihero” for her wildly popular videos satirizing the outdoor industry. Through YouTube videos and Instagram reels, the comedian has poked fun at everything from know-it-all mountain bikers to couples having relationship meltdowns in the middle of hiking expeditions. Now, she’s written, directed, and starred in her first feature-length film, ‘Weak Layers,’ which follows a woman in a ski town who tries to win a world-famous ski film competition. The movie was selected for the Whistler, Banff, and Kendal Mountain film festivals, and has been picked up for distribution by the same distributors that launched 'Free Solo' into theaters. 

Katie sat down with Payson to talk about her roots in stand-up comedy in Canada, finding a comedy goldmine when she moved to Revelstoke to pursue skiing, and how the character she plays on social media accidentally became a real-life influencer. She also talks about leaving her 9 to 5 to pursue filmmaking just months before the pandemic hit, the steep learning curve of directing 'Weak Layers,' and the joke that inspired a proposal between two of her fans. 

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After finishing high school in his native Australia, Angus Neaves devised the ultimate gap year plan: a 9,000-mile solo bikepacking trip from Mongolia to Scotland. After seven months and 16 countries, he finally completed the journey this week and joined Payson to talk about it. From the hospitality he found in Kazakstan to an impromptu trip to Gravel Worlds in Italy and a detour to Berlin for the museums, Angus found unexpected highlights along the way, in addition to some low points. He was held up at the border to Azerbaijan, had some run-ins with dogs in rural Turkey, and broke two phones, but throughout the ups and downs, he had plenty of time to reflect on friendship, connection, and his future. He tells Payson about why he decided to travel across the world for such an epic journey, what he’s learned from the experience, and why Albania was his favorite country to visit.

Tap here to donate to Angus's climate action fundraiser.

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YouTube: Payson McElveen

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Starla Teddergreen had an extensive professional cycling career behind her and a spot in the Life Time Grand Prix when she was diagnosed with Multiple Sclerosis in 2022. Despite dropping out of the series due to the diagnosis, she reapplied in 2023 and completed the series. 

Starla sat down with Payson this week to discuss the confusing mix of symptoms she began feeling during the pandemic and the skepticism and dismissal she received from doctors before finally receiving an MS diagnosis. Despite the relief of having an answer, however, she had to come to terms with the reality that she might not be able to ride her bike again. She talks about her emotional first race back after her diagnosis when the support of an old friend changed her career trajectory even more than her win, and her plan to race one of the biggest off-road stage races in the world next year. She also talks about how her early years as a bike messenger led her to becoming the 2019 USA Crits winner. 

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This week, photographer and adventurer Chris Burkard returns to the show to talk about moving to Iceland and his experience racing the Tour Divide this summer. Having spent the last decade exploring and documenting Iceland, Chris finally made the big move with his family. He tells Payson about why he decided the time was right, what it’s been like as a parent to watch his sons assimilate so quickly into the community, and how the current seismic activity has made him ponder the morality of documenting natural disasters. 

He also talks about his grueling journey on the Tour Divide, complete with persistent mechanicals, an emotional voicemail, and an incident with a canister of bear spray that definitely isn’t what you’d think. He might've wanted to burn all his bikes by the end of it, but he's already thinking about going back. 

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For the past couple of weeks, Iceland has been shaking with earthquakes as an underground river of magma moves toward the surface. Over the weekend, more than 800 earthquakes were detected in 14 hours in the Reykjanes Peninsula in the southwest of the country, and nearly 4,000 people were evacuated from the small town of Grindavík. One of the people who has had a front-row seat to these events is Thrainn Kolbeinsson, a photographer who Payson worked with on both of his island crossing films. Thrainn got his start in photography by documenting the Reykjanes Peninsula and has even lived in Grindavík alongside many of his family members. When the Fagradalsfjall volcano began erupting in the spring of 2021, he immediately went to the site with his camera and returned nearly every day for months. But this time, it’s different. With a national emergency declared and earthquakes carving canyons through roads and houses, the possibility of a disastrous eruption is more present than it’s been in decades.

Thrainn joins Payson from Reykjavik to talk about the events of the past few days, how the people of Iceland have been defined by the volcanic activity of their island for thousands of years, and ways that the community is dealing with an impending eruption. He also talks about his past as a multi-time Jiu-Jitsu national champion and child psychologist before he found his passion for photographing the outdoors. Since then, he’s worked with endurance athletes, outdoor gear companies, and tourism boards in Iceland and abroad to produce images that capture the wildness of the natural environment. 

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If you haven’t already heard of Asa Vermette, chances are, that’s about to change in a big way this coming year. The 16-year-old Durango native has been making waves in the downhill scene since he was 14, showing up at pro races and beating some of the sport’s top riders for the podium. He won most of his races this year, including the Enduro National Championship where he beat 3x world champ Richie Rude. 2024 will be the first year that he can compete in World Cups, where he’ll be racing as a junior despite proving his ability to race at the top of the pro field. Earlier this year, he signed a multi-year deal with Frameworks, the team led by fellow downhill racer Neko Mulally. 

Asa joins Payson this week to talk about being one of the most hyped young riders the sport has seen in years. He talks about rubbing shoulders with his heroes…while standing next to them on the podium, and throwing backflips at Red Bull Rampage. He explains how Neko Mulally and the Frameworks team immediately felt like family, and how he plans to spend the $7,500 he won when he placed second at the U.S. Open this year ahead of the likes of Greg Minnaar and Jackson Goldstone. 

Payson also chats with Neko Mulally about when Asa first appeared on his radar, how his role as a mentor has been surprisingly emotional, and the moment when Asa’s course record sweep at Snowshoe sent shockwaves through the pro field. 

Instagram: @withpacepodcast
YouTube: Payson McElveen

Email: [email protected]