Joe Biden’s immigration policies may have contributed to Donald Trump’s winning a second term, but a year later, Americans are increasingly unhappy with the president’s aggressive deportation tactics. For the final installment of the America’s Next Story series, the columnist Michelle Goldberg joins David Leonhardt, an editorial director in Times Opinion, to discuss her strongly held belief that America is, at its best, a nation of immigrants and that should inform how the country moves forward.

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Read the full transcript here: https://nytimes.com/2025/12/22/opinion/next-american-story-michelle-goldberg-immigration.html

This episode of “The Opinions” was produced by Jillian Weinberger. It was edited by Alison Bruzek and Kaari Pitkin. Mixing by Efim Shapiro. Original music by Carole Sabouraud. Fact-checking by Mary Marge Locker. Audience strategy by Shannon Busta and Kristina Samulewski. The director of Opinion Audio is Annie-Rose Strasser.