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In Don't @ Me (2:17), Tom opens this week by sharing his #OneWord for 2022. Then, Tom is joined by educator and author Andrew Maxey (11:52) for a conversation centered on his newly released book, "Elephant in the Classroom: Tracing the Complexity of Teaching by Exploring 13 Competencies and Practices." Finally, in Assessment Corner (58:47), Tom addresses what he sees as an overcorrection in the field with our assessment practices and why trading one restriction for another is counterproductive.
In Don't @ Me (1:52), Tom opens with a recent experience that reminded him that even the smallest connections can make the biggest difference. Then, Tom is joined by George Sugai (12:24) in part two of their conversation about PBIS; they specifically talk about positive reinforcement & the critical role of Tier 2 interventions. Finally, in Assessment Corner (1:08:11), Tom focuses on every educator's assessment journey and the one piece of advice that matters the most!
In Don't @ Me (2:11), Tom opens by recounting his work with George Sugai in the early 2000s and describes why George is on his Mount Rushmore of career influencers. Then, Tom is joined by George Sugai (14:04) in part one of their conversation about the origins of the OSEP Center for Positive Behavior Interventions and Supports. Finally, in Assessment Corner (1:04:28), Tom focuses on the importance of student mindset and belief and how it greatly influences their receptivity to feedback and their willingness to keep learning.
In Don't @ Me (2:11), Tom opens this week by talking about what career he would have chosen had he not gone into education. Then, Tom is joined by author and podcast host Hedreich Nichols (14:14) for a conversation about the anti-racism work and what it means to be a culturally responsive educator. Finally, in Assessment Corner (1:02:55), Tom deconstructs six myths of summative assessment and what the research actually says about using assessment evidence to verify and report.
In Don't @ Me (3:50), Tom opens this week by questioning why we've collectively become so brazen and disrespectful towards others. Then, Tom is joined by friend and colleague Brian Butler (16:03) for a conversation about why gifted education should be the floor for all learners if we are to achieve true equity in our schools. Finally, in Assessment Corner (1:00:35), Tom talks about common assessments not just as an efficient way to increase student achievement, but an effective way to create an authentic collaborative culture amongst educators.
In Don't @ Me (2:41), Tom opens this week with some thoughts about reaching milestones as the podcast hits its 50th episode. Then, Tom is joined by friend, colleague, and co-author Garnet Hillman (12:30) for a conversation about assessment and grading. Finally, in Assessment Corner (47:36), Tom focuses on engineering classroom conversations as a way to elicit formative assessment evidence.
In Don't @ Me (3:48), Tom opens this week with a reminder that educators have more influence and control over the machinery of student achievement than some might think. Then, Tom is joined by teacher and podcast co-host Pav Wander (17:43) for a conversation about teacher-voice. Finally, in Assessment Corner (1:00:30), Tom focuses on the importance of acceptable alternatives in assessment and grading reform.
12for12 Challenge (50th Episode)
(1) Post a picture on Twitter, Instagram (NOT IG story b/c those disappear), or Facebook OR a video on TikTok (yes, the podcast is on TikTok) of what you typically do while listening to the podcast. E.g., Twitter - Something like Hey @TomSchimmerPod, I love listening to the podcast while on my commute to/from work every day OR Hey, @TomSchimmerPod, I love listening to the podcast while I work out or whatever. You have to tag the podcast - Podcast handles. I’ll check you are following the podcast too; that’s a must.
(2) Then, you have to get at least 12 people in the next 2 weeks to subscribe to the podcast and post about it. 12 hours of coaching – 12 people. It might sound something like this: I just subscribed to the @TomSchimmerPod. Thanks (tag you - @mybestfriend) for the recommendation! They don’t have to post a pic but that would certainly be cool if they did.
In Don't @ Me (6:22), Tom takes aim at the (intentional or otherwise) divisiveness that seems to be emerging within the education profession, especially on social media. Then, Tom is joined by Doug Reeves (15:38) part two of their conversation; this week centers on leadership and implementation of change. Finally, in Assessment Corner (39:05), Tom highlights the importance of relevance in assessment design.
50th Episode Contest (12 for 12)
(1) Post a picture on Twitter, Instagram (NOT IG story b/c those disappear), or Facebook OR a video on TikTok (yes, the podcast is on TikTok) of what you typically do while listening to the podcast. E.g., Twitter - Something like Hey @TomSchimmerPod, I love listening to the podcast while on my commute to/from work every day OR Hey, @TomSchimmerPod, I love listening to the podcast while I work out or whatever. You have to tag the podcast - Podcast handles. I’ll check you are following the podcast too; that’s a must.
(2) Then, you have to get at least 12 people in the next 2 weeks to subscribe to the podcast and post about it. 12 hours of coaching – 12 people. It might sound something like this: I just subscribed to the @TomSchimmerPod. Thanks (tag you - @mybestfriend) for the recommendation! They don’t have to post a pic but that would certainly be cool if they did.
In Don't @ Me (2:16), Tom opens with an assertion that risk-taking itself can and should be the reward (as opposed to playing the results and deciding in retrospect). Then, Tom is joined by Doug Reeves (12:47) in part one of their two-part conversation; this week centers on how creativity and innovation can become more of a driving force in a 21st century, K-12 education. Finally, in Assessment Corner (39:53), Tom highlights a handbook chapter by Gordon Stobart that focuses on why it’s critical to tailor our feedback to where learners are along their learning continuums.
The Cambridge Handbook of Instructional Feedback
In Don't @ Me (1:42), Tom opens with a personal story that illustrates how the fear of regret can be a driver of success in our lives. Then, Tom is joined by Tina Boogren (19:08) to discuss the importance of self-care for educators and why focusing on ourselves is not selfish, but necessary for us to be at our best for students. Finally, in Assessment Corner (51:33), Tom talks briefly about whether teachers should intentionally use a variety of assessment methods?
From the publisher's feed
Assess THAT with Tom & Nat is a bi-weekly podcast where co-hosts Tom Schimmer and Natalie Vardabasso unpack what it really means to deepen assessment literacy in schools. Known for their dynamic, insightful, and sometimes provocative conversations, Tom and Nat create a space where educators can rethink grading, feedback, and accountability in ways that put student learning first. Each episode blends practical strategies with big-picture thinking, helping teachers and leaders translate research into action without losing sight of the human side of education.
Listeners can expect honest discussions, fresh perspectives, and plenty of take-home ideas. From reimagining final exams to exploring the role of assessment in equity and Universal Design for Learning, Assess THAT is for any educator ready to challenge the status quo and embrace assessment as a tool for growth—not just measurement.
About the Hosts
Tom Schimmer and Natalie Vardabasso are internationally recognized speakers, authors, and consultants who have spent their careers helping schools modernize assessment and grading practices. Together, they are the co-founders of the Canadian Assessment Centre (CAC), a national professional learning hub created by Canadians, for Canadians to bring clarity, credibility, and care to assessment in classrooms across the country.
Tom Schimmer is the author and co-author of multiple best-selling books, including Grading from the Inside Out and Standards-Based Learning in Action. With 35 years of experience as a teacher, leader, and consultant, Tom is known for his ability to translate big ideas into practical tools educators can use right away.
Natalie Vardabasso is a leading voice in assessment and equity, recognized for her innovative approaches to standards-based learning, feedback, and student agency. As a speaker, writer, and coach, she has helped thousands of educators create assessment systems that are not only accurate but also deeply humanizing.
Together, Tom and Natalie bring complementary perspectives, humour, and a deep commitment to making assessment meaningful. Their partnership in Assess THAT and at the Canadian Assessment Centre reflects a shared belief that when educators improve how they assess, they unlock the full potential of every learner.
Tom and Natalie are also the authors of Rehumanizing Assessment: Gathering Evidence of Learning Through Storytelling, a book that challenges traditional grading systems and shows how assessment can honour student voice and identity.
Why Listen?
Whether you’re a classroom teacher, school leader, or policy maker, Assess THAT with Tom & Nat will challenge your assumptions, equip you with actionable strategies, and inspire you to see assessment as the most powerful driver of student success.

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