Resilience is often touted as the end all, be all of coping with life's challenges and setbacks. But my guest knows from her studies, executive coaching, and her own life that sometimes resilience just isn't enough. You need an even more durable source of strength.

Dr. Tasha Eurich is an organizational psychologist and researcher and the author of Shatterproof: How to Thrive in a World of Constant Chaos. Today on the show, Tasha explains why the concept of resilience rose to prominence in the 2010s, how resilience can be improved a little as a skill, but is largely an exhaustible capacity, and how you know when you're hitting your "resilience ceiling." We then talk about the more sustainable skillset and strength of becoming shatterproof. We discuss the potential to grow forward instead of simply bouncing back, the psychological needs that have to be met to become shatterproof, and research-backed tools for thriving in life instead of just surviving.

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