Blue Grit Radio: the Police Performance Podcast: Mindset, Wellness, Leadership

I connected with Jason some time back, and more recently, I saw a post he made about 9/11.  He hired on with NYPD two months prior to the catastrophic event, and would be responding to Ground Zero as an academy recruit.

It boggled my mind considering what that would have been like.  It considered how being in high school, 9/11 shattered many of my paradigms and inevitably planted a seed of desire to serve in a meaningful, direct way.  What would it have been like to be from New York, to see that, and have just gotten into this profession, and to see the world turned upside down?

Jason and I discuss his experiences getting into the Navy, then as a new police recruit and officer.  We continue to talk about his work in cold cases and becoming a crisis counselor.  Today, he works with Forge, to support first responders and veterans and has recently completed a new book, Living Blue with Barbara Rubel. 

To contact Jason:

jasonmpalamara on IG
[email protected]
ForgeHealth.com

Jason's bio:

Jason Palamara is a U.S. Navy Veteran having served in US “Operation Noble Anvil” [NATO “Operation Allied Force”] aboard the USS Theodore Roosevelt. He is a retired New York City Police Department Cold Case Homicide Detective. Jason has served as a peer support counselor with the NYPD and currently serves as a volunteer crisis intervention counselor with the Long Island Crisis Center. He is also a John C. Maxwell certified life coach, teacher, speaker and trainer. He is the director of Veteran & First Responder Engagement for Forge VFR. His mission is to connect with and serve his fellow First Responder and Veteran communities ensuring the care they need is always available to them. Jason is currently co-authoring ‘Living Blue’, a book on police wellness and resilience with Barbara Rubel.

Questions, topic ideas and feedback? Send a line!

To stay connected with the latest and exclusive content:

Subscribe to the FREE newsletter at on bluegritwellness.com  !

Don’t forget to follow and subscribe to Blue Grit Radio on Apple, Spotify, YouTube and more!  Sharing the show and episodes to your friends, peers, circles and social platforms is one of the greatest compliments I can receive- which truly helps the show grow.

Please help support a healthier first responder community by giving us a 5 star rating (Spotify and Apple) and a review (on Apple) to help others find the show.

Need help with entry-level, promotional testing, career & mindset coaching? Stop spinning your wheels and prep the right mindset and awareness of all the critical hiring steps with my comprehensive hiring guide:
bluegritwellness.com/shop 

Email at [email protected]

-------------------------------------

Want to safeguard your health and the health of your team?

United Diagnostic Services brings hospital-grade diagnostic technology directly to first responder agencies, making early detection of heart disease and cancer simpler than ever.

For more information, visit udshealth.com

-------------------------------------

*the opinions expressed in all episodes of this podcast and related materials do not reflect on any departments agencies. 

music credit: Drive by ASham...

There's a new sheriff in town!  Well, as of early this year there certainly was.  My lessons in political science underlined how difficult it is to beat an incumbent, despite the other factors.  Well, my guest, Derek Sanders did just that in the election for Thurston County Sheriff here in WA State.  No small feat, but from the outside he did so with intense passion, vision, and by leading from the front.

This is a man whose claim to fame also involves his historic youth- being the youngest sheriff in WA State.  At 29 years old, he was an underdog, but I love to highlight that to give a nudge to the young ones in whatever profession- you may get labeled but don't do it to yourself.  Age is an absolute asset, when you consider the energy, drive, ability and willingness to learn and adapt that it can afford.  My conversation with Sheriff Sanders had me taking notes and gracious for the shared stories.

Sheriff Sanders' bio:

Sheriff Sanders started his law enforcement career off with Lacey Police Department at the age of 19 as a Cadet. At 22, Sheriff Sanders was hired by Thurston County Sheriff’s Office as a Patrol Deputy. 

In 2022, Sheriff Sanders challenged a 12 year incumbent for the position of Sheriff, and despite the low odds of victory, won his election by 11% to become the youngest Sheriff elected in state history. 

During his time with the sheriff’s office, Sheriff Sanders has received 2 life saving awards in addition to the Medal of Valor for his efforts to rescue a wheel chair bound woman from a house fire. Sheriff Sanders enjoys playing basketball, boating, and working on cars.

You can find him at @sheriffsanders on IG.

Questions, topic ideas and feedback? Send a line!

To stay connected with the latest and exclusive content:

Subscribe to the FREE newsletter at on bluegritwellness.com  !

Don’t forget to follow and subscribe to Blue Grit Radio on Apple, Spotify, YouTube and more!  Sharing the show and episodes to your friends, peers, circles and social platforms is one of the greatest compliments I can receive- which truly helps the show grow.

Please help support a healthier first responder community by giving us a 5 star rating (Spotify and Apple) and a review (on Apple) to help others find the show.

Need help with entry-level, promotional testing, career & mindset coaching? Stop spinning your wheels and prep the right mindset and awareness of all the critical hiring steps with my comprehensive hiring guide:
bluegritwellness.com/shop 

Email at [email protected]

-------------------------------------

Want to safeguard your health and the health of your team?

United Diagnostic Services brings hospital-grade diagnostic technology directly to first responder agencies, making early detection of heart disease and cancer simpler than ever.

For more information, visit udshealth.com

-------------------------------------

*the opinions expressed in all episodes of this podcast and related materials do not reflect on any departments agencies. 

music credit: Drive by ASham...

Often times, we are most likely to listen to those who have been there/done that (as we should).  When it comes to lessons learned in police work, mental health, and critical incident stress, Travis Gribble is an ideal example.  He is a man who has been in the thick of it, and we as first responder (in career OR LIFE) should listen and heed his experiences, insights and lessons learned.

Travis and I discuss his career, from start through transitions and accomplishments, to the finish.  We talk about mutual connection in this unparalleled world of brotherhood, and the genesis and evolution of his work creating and operating My Arena.  Travis now travels and delivers training seminars focused on teaching and building insight and resilience with mental health professionals as we steadily and deliberately combat the stigmas of addressing mental health issues in our emergency response professions and culture.

Mentioned in the episode are his appearance on the Cleared Hot podcast with Andy Stumpf, where he details a significantly traumatic experience which I chose not to ask him to discuss with me.  You can connect with and find Travis and his work at:

my_.arena on Instagram and
https://myarenallc.com/

-- Travis Gribble's Bio from his site--

My name is Travis Gribble and I am a retired 24 year law enforcement veteran. I spent 11 years in Michigan where I worked as a deputy, deputy sergeant, and SWAT team commander. In 2008 I made a lateral move to Mesa Police Department in Arizona. Mesa is a city of 520,000 and 850 sworn police officers. In Mesa I worked as a patrol officer, patrol sergeant, SWAT assistant team leader, and SWAT sergeant team leader. 

During the course of my career I was a part of countless critical incidents and I always thought none of the calls were affecting me. In 2016 I experienced what I now know to be a life-changing call. For five years after the call I never sought appropriate help and I was slowly self-destructing within. As the years and calls went by my cup was reaching capacity and in 2021 I was brought to my knees. Thankfully I was put in touch with a therapist who specializes in first responder care and I began the journey of healing.

It was then I learned to live life in a much better way, but due to the extent of the trauma I decided I would seek retirement. In 2022 I was awarded a post-traumatic stress injury retirement and my current journey began. Only one short month after my retirement and through unplanned circumstances, I was given the opportunity to share my story with a leadership group of SWAT operators. 

The response to my raw story while sharing lessons learned by me and my agency was nothing short of amazing. From that day forward I continued sharing my story on podcasts, at law enforcement conferences, and through a social media platform. This path has now turned into creating a community and advocating for first responders mental health well-being. I have created the organization “My Arena” where we are dedicated to provide training for individual first responders, their families, and agencies. 

This community will stand for one very specific concept: you’re not alone! I am working with like-minded organizations and providers to smash the stigma of getting help while providing a landing spot for those who need to see they are not alone. I now live in the mountains of Montana with my wife Emily where we are establishing roots and chasing our dreams.

Questions, topic ideas and feedback? Send a line!

To stay connected with the latest and exclusive content:

Subscribe to the FREE newsletter at on bluegritwellness.com  !

Don’t forget to follow and subscribe to Blue Grit Radio on Apple, Spotify, YouTube and more!  Sharing the show and episodes to your friends, peers, circles and social platforms is one of the greatest compliments I can receive- which truly helps the show grow.

Please help support a healthier first responder community by giving us a 5 star rating (Spotify and Apple) and a review (on Apple) to help others find the show.

Need help with entry-level, promotional testing, career & mindset coaching? Stop spinning your wheels and prep the right mindset and awareness of all the critical hiring steps with my comprehensive hiring guide:
bluegritwellness.com/shop 

Email at [email protected]

-------------------------------------

Want to safeguard your health and the health of your team?

United Diagnostic Services brings hospital-grade diagnostic technology directly to first responder agencies, making early detection of heart disease and cancer simpler than ever.

For more information, visit udshealth.com

-------------------------------------

*the opinions expressed in all episodes of this podcast and related materials do not reflect on any departments agencies. 

music credit: Drive by ASham...

Cops say they do a thankless job, which isn't true when you stop and recognize our Corrections brothers and sisters!  Joining me in this episode are returning guest, my recruiter Officer Brian Cortinas and one of our valued Corrections Officers- newly minted Sergeant Brandon Li.

Brian  recounts how Corrections made him a better police candidate than anything else he imagines.  Brandon shares his drive and story to get into law enforcement- how they led to working in various jails, as a reserve officer, and exploring the multitude of assignments and leadership opportunities as a C.O.

We talk about invaluable skills developed through the dynamic experiences, demystify some of the assumptions of working in a jail and highlight the impact C.Os. have on the community through distinct purpose and care for others.

To learn more about careers in Corrections, especially at the Kent Jail, check out:

Kentpolicerecruiting.com (click on the Corrections tab) or email Brian or Brandon at
[email protected] and [email protected] .

Questions, topic ideas and feedback? Send a line!

To stay connected with the latest and exclusive content:

Subscribe to the FREE newsletter at on bluegritwellness.com  !

Don’t forget to follow and subscribe to Blue Grit Radio on Apple, Spotify, YouTube and more!  Sharing the show and episodes to your friends, peers, circles and social platforms is one of the greatest compliments I can receive- which truly helps the show grow.

Please help support a healthier first responder community by giving us a 5 star rating (Spotify and Apple) and a review (on Apple) to help others find the show.

Need help with entry-level, promotional testing, career & mindset coaching? Stop spinning your wheels and prep the right mindset and awareness of all the critical hiring steps with my comprehensive hiring guide:
bluegritwellness.com/shop 

Email at [email protected]

-------------------------------------

Want to safeguard your health and the health of your team?

United Diagnostic Services brings hospital-grade diagnostic technology directly to first responder agencies, making early detection of heart disease and cancer simpler than ever.

For more information, visit udshealth.com

-------------------------------------

*the opinions expressed in all episodes of this podcast and related materials do not reflect on any departments agencies. 

music credit: Drive by ASham...

Ask retired traffic cops what their best job was: it was working Motors.

Ask retired SWAT cops: it was being on "the Team."

Ask K9 officers.. it was working with the dog!
School cops: working with kids.

So what do you ask the guy who worked SWAT, Traffic, Narcs, K9, promoted all the way up to Captain.. and at the height of his career... requested a voluntary double demotion back to Patrol Sergeant because he wasn't feeling the admin life and wanted to be boots on the ground, leading a team on the street again?

Well, you find a way (or ways) to talk it through on a format such as this podcast!

Meet John Pagel, a police leader who I got my start under.  It's not in the interview, but I remember getting my first reprimand just before my first year wrapped.  I remember him intentionally hitting me up in passing.  He told me no cop worth anything had a spotless file.  This painted a lesson that you have to have the right values and intentions in the job, but mistakes will happen, and you have to own them and keep moving forward.  For a young guy who was still trying to make a name for himself, that moment of encouragement meant a lot.  (*I kept my file pretty dang clean after that!)

We talk about John's long-existing desire to be a police officer, and how young John even thought he wanted to be a Chief someday!  Discussions about life, purpose, transitioning healthfully out of police work and knowing "when it's time" were huge focal points in this interview.

John’s full bio:

John enjoyed a 33 year career with the Kent Police Department, 29 as a commissioned officer and 4 years as a Community Education Specialist.  

During his career John worked in patrol, traffic, K9, SWAT, training, narcotics and detectives.  Rising through the ranks, John attained the rank of captain but realized his heart was working with people so he returned to the rank of sergeant and retired at that rank.  

As a community education specialist, John worked with the community on important events such as National Night Out, Coffee with the Chief, and other community meetings.  He was also a member of the Washington Traffic Safety Commission and is extremely proud to have been on the committee to write the 2016 version of the Washington State Strategic Highway Safety Plan known as “Target Zero.”  

After retiring, John obtained his real estate license and now works as a real estate agent.  John has been married for 37 years and has 2 adult children and 3 grandchildren.

Clearly a man who has done so much and isn’t slowing down yet!  Listen and enjoy!

Questions, topic ideas and feedback? Send a line!

To stay connected with the latest and exclusive content:

Subscribe to the FREE newsletter at on bluegritwellness.com  !

Don’t forget to follow and subscribe to Blue Grit Radio on Apple, Spotify, YouTube and more!  Sharing the show and episodes to your friends, peers, circles and social platforms is one of the greatest compliments I can receive- which truly helps the show grow.

Please help support a healthier first responder community by giving us a 5 star rating (Spotify and Apple) and a review (on Apple) to help others find the show.

Need help with entry-level, promotional testing, career & mindset coaching? Stop spinning your wheels and prep the right mindset and awareness of all the critical hiring steps with my comprehensive hiring guide:
bluegritwellness.com/shop 

Email at [email protected]

-------------------------------------

Want to safeguard your health and the health of your team?

United Diagnostic Services brings hospital-grade diagnostic technology directly to first responder agencies, making early detection of heart disease and cancer simpler than ever.

For more information, visit udshealth.com

-------------------------------------

*the opinions expressed in all episodes of this podcast and related materials do not reflect on any departments agencies. 

music credit: Drive by ASham...

Thad Kirkhoff started his law enforcement career after graduating from Western Washington University and enlisting into the United States Army.  He served two tours in Iraq and moved back to WA where his wife and his families were.
 
He began his career with the Renton Police Department in 2007 and served as an officer for 14 years.  He held roles as a firearms instructor, Field Training Officer, Hostage Negotiator, and School Resource Officer at Renton High School.  

*A story we didn’t cover was when there was a suspect who climbed up on the roof of an apartment building, trying to escape arrest. Before you get all worried, it wasn’t super tall and he got up there by way of balcony, and he kept trying to get to another one to drop back down to flee.
 
We had the place locked down and I was there with my trusty pup, Kato.  Thad got called in as a negotiator.  The suspect kept walking back and forth and for periods of time just sat and stared at us. Thad, trying to get up higher to chat with him and connect went up on the big ladder truck.    The suspect had no chance of escaping, but just wouldn’t come down.  A true test of patience.. eventually he was arrested without a ton more hubbub.  

When Thad and I recounted this call, the best guess we had for how long it took was somewhere before “hours” and “way too long.” Back to the show…  

We discuss Thad's devotion to his wife and four children (ages 15, 14, 11, and 9) and reasons for retiring.  Discussions of how we serve in and out of the uniform as well as his new chapter as a Mortgage Loan Officer for Guaranteed Rate to help people in a new, refreshing way.  (He gives a first responder discount!)

You can contact him at [email protected] 

Questions, topic ideas and feedback? Send a line!

To stay connected with the latest and exclusive content:

Subscribe to the FREE newsletter at on bluegritwellness.com  !

Don’t forget to follow and subscribe to Blue Grit Radio on Apple, Spotify, YouTube and more!  Sharing the show and episodes to your friends, peers, circles and social platforms is one of the greatest compliments I can receive- which truly helps the show grow.

Please help support a healthier first responder community by giving us a 5 star rating (Spotify and Apple) and a review (on Apple) to help others find the show.

Need help with entry-level, promotional testing, career & mindset coaching? Stop spinning your wheels and prep the right mindset and awareness of all the critical hiring steps with my comprehensive hiring guide:
bluegritwellness.com/shop 

Email at [email protected]

-------------------------------------

Want to safeguard your health and the health of your team?

United Diagnostic Services brings hospital-grade diagnostic technology directly to first responder agencies, making early detection of heart disease and cancer simpler than ever.

For more information, visit udshealth.com

-------------------------------------

*the opinions expressed in all episodes of this podcast and related materials do not reflect on any departments agencies. 

music credit: Drive by ASham...

Audrey Andrade is a wellness blogger, nutrition coach, US Navy veteran (and officer!).  What stuck out to me in Audrey was not only her story of coming up and pursuit of excellence, but her extremely practical and balanced approach to all things wellness.  Her content is a host of unimposing, functional and digestible info nuggets that you can employ in exercise, nutrition, but BEYOND that- in life and lifestyle.

We talk about her decision to join the Navy, and her progression to officer. Lessons learned in leadership, life and later- health! Stick around for the end where we bash on trends, despite my admitted fascination with self-experimentation years ago.  

Her full bio:

Audrey Andrade has a Bachelor of Science in English from the United States Naval Academy. As a certified Functional Nutrition Coach, Herbalist, and Personal Trainer, she has four years of experience coaching clients to better their health and lifestyle. 

She served in the Navy for seven and a half years as a Naval Officer and writes health-focused articles for the major publication Medium as well as business development teams in the technology sector. Audrey is a California native and resides in sunny Florida with her husband, Anthony, and sweet pups, Alessio and Louis. 

You can find her at IG: @wellnessaudrey
[email protected]
medium.com/@wellnessaudrey
m.facebook.com/wellnessaudrey

Questions, topic ideas and feedback? Send a line!

To stay connected with the latest and exclusive content:

Subscribe to the FREE newsletter at on bluegritwellness.com  !

Don’t forget to follow and subscribe to Blue Grit Radio on Apple, Spotify, YouTube and more!  Sharing the show and episodes to your friends, peers, circles and social platforms is one of the greatest compliments I can receive- which truly helps the show grow.

Please help support a healthier first responder community by giving us a 5 star rating (Spotify and Apple) and a review (on Apple) to help others find the show.

Need help with entry-level, promotional testing, career & mindset coaching? Stop spinning your wheels and prep the right mindset and awareness of all the critical hiring steps with my comprehensive hiring guide:
bluegritwellness.com/shop 

Email at [email protected]

-------------------------------------

Want to safeguard your health and the health of your team?

United Diagnostic Services brings hospital-grade diagnostic technology directly to first responder agencies, making early detection of heart disease and cancer simpler than ever.

For more information, visit udshealth.com

-------------------------------------

*the opinions expressed in all episodes of this podcast and related materials do not reflect on any departments agencies. 

music credit: Drive by ASham...

Bill Blowers needs no introduction in much of the police world nationally and certainly regionally.  He is a lot of things- Captain America with a potty-mouth as I say in this interview.

He was my first training officer- and set a tone and drive in me on so much of this profession that was a foreign language and culture.  With an unwavering attitude of work ethic, discipline, and focus on mission- I was nearly questioning if he was a real person at all.  

In our conversation, we go down each of our Memory Lanes and talk agency, police culture, and leadership. 

He retired as a Training Unit sergeant and regional SWAT team leader. He currently operates Tap Rack Tactical.  Below is the bio from his site:

Bill served in the US Army for 6 years and has been a Police Officer for over 25 years. He has spent the bulk of his LE career assigned to SWAT holding positions as a Sniper, Ballistic Shield Man, Mechanical/Ballistic Breacher, Assistant Team Leader and Team Leader on a large and busy regional SWAT team. 

He has planned or participated in approximately 1500 missions, he has over 5000 hours of documented training time, and holds instructor certifications in a variety of SWAT related topics.

Bill is passionate about what he does and is driven to provide relevant and up to date training. 

You can find him at:

Tap-rack.com, Tap Rack Tactical on Facebook and @tapracktactical on Instagram. 

As always, subscribe share and rate the podcast and share it on your socials to help us reach and coach up more people!

Stay safe and stay gritty!

Questions, topic ideas and feedback? Send a line!

To stay connected with the latest and exclusive content:

Subscribe to the FREE newsletter at on bluegritwellness.com  !

Don’t forget to follow and subscribe to Blue Grit Radio on Apple, Spotify, YouTube and more!  Sharing the show and episodes to your friends, peers, circles and social platforms is one of the greatest compliments I can receive- which truly helps the show grow.

Please help support a healthier first responder community by giving us a 5 star rating (Spotify and Apple) and a review (on Apple) to help others find the show.

Need help with entry-level, promotional testing, career & mindset coaching? Stop spinning your wheels and prep the right mindset and awareness of all the critical hiring steps with my comprehensive hiring guide:
bluegritwellness.com/shop 

Email at [email protected]

-------------------------------------

Want to safeguard your health and the health of your team?

United Diagnostic Services brings hospital-grade diagnostic technology directly to first responder agencies, making early detection of heart disease and cancer simpler than ever.

For more information, visit udshealth.com

-------------------------------------

*the opinions expressed in all episodes of this podcast and related materials do not reflect on any departments agencies. 

music credit: Drive by ASham...

Destiny Morris is a licensed marriage and family therapist working remotely in CA.  She specializes in trauma working with first responders & their spouses. She is trained in EMDR and taking new clients virtually.  

In our conversation, we talk about her life’s focus and her insight with first responders in her family. 

We do a deep dive into topics including:

Considerations for first responder families and kids, the impact of the job on kids, communicating through that…

Sleep: stress dreams, sleep hacks, how chronic stress and relationship issues can develop from poor sleep…

The need to build and healthy coping and decompression mechanisms, and how to communicate those needs with partner/family…

Relationship issues: communication, tips, infidelity, risk-seeking behaviors, ED…

And what to do about all of it!  These are extremely meaningful, valuable topics and the type of conversations we need to keep hammering to normalize support and wisdom sharing for our first responder culture!!!

You can reach Destiny at @on_being_resilient or [email protected] .  

As always, like, subscribe, give an AMAZING rating and share with your circles to help grow the positive support messaging we are sending.  Stay well and stay gritty!

Questions, topic ideas and feedback? Send a line!

To stay connected with the latest and exclusive content:

Subscribe to the FREE newsletter at on bluegritwellness.com  !

Don’t forget to follow and subscribe to Blue Grit Radio on Apple, Spotify, YouTube and more!  Sharing the show and episodes to your friends, peers, circles and social platforms is one of the greatest compliments I can receive- which truly helps the show grow.

Please help support a healthier first responder community by giving us a 5 star rating (Spotify and Apple) and a review (on Apple) to help others find the show.

Need help with entry-level, promotional testing, career & mindset coaching? Stop spinning your wheels and prep the right mindset and awareness of all the critical hiring steps with my comprehensive hiring guide:
bluegritwellness.com/shop 

Email at [email protected]

-------------------------------------

Want to safeguard your health and the health of your team?

United Diagnostic Services brings hospital-grade diagnostic technology directly to first responder agencies, making early detection of heart disease and cancer simpler than ever.

For more information, visit udshealth.com

-------------------------------------

*the opinions expressed in all episodes of this podcast and related materials do not reflect on any departments agencies. 

music credit: Drive by ASham...

Hint: talk to people like they're people! And like you're a person!  Novel concept!  We talk about humanizing the badge, which means we need to act like “normal” people first.

Easier said than done, and I wish I had know this early in my career.  It's definitely that much harder if you let your emotions and ego get in the way of things.  

I tried the robotic approach - no go. I tried the fake it til you make it tough guy- hard pass. People see right through it.

When you are able to be straight, even a bit unpolished at times, people see it, feel it as genuine and will open up and be genuine right back.

This is huge from community events, simple contacts, victim interactions and even suspect conversations.

As always, like, subscribe, share, tell your people to do the same. Better together- stay well and stay gritty!

Questions, topic ideas and feedback? Send a line!

To stay connected with the latest and exclusive content:

Subscribe to the FREE newsletter at on bluegritwellness.com  !

Don’t forget to follow and subscribe to Blue Grit Radio on Apple, Spotify, YouTube and more!  Sharing the show and episodes to your friends, peers, circles and social platforms is one of the greatest compliments I can receive- which truly helps the show grow.

Please help support a healthier first responder community by giving us a 5 star rating (Spotify and Apple) and a review (on Apple) to help others find the show.

Need help with entry-level, promotional testing, career & mindset coaching? Stop spinning your wheels and prep the right mindset and awareness of all the critical hiring steps with my comprehensive hiring guide:
bluegritwellness.com/shop 

Email at [email protected]

-------------------------------------

Want to safeguard your health and the health of your team?

United Diagnostic Services brings hospital-grade diagnostic technology directly to first responder agencies, making early detection of heart disease and cancer simpler than ever.

For more information, visit udshealth.com

-------------------------------------

*the opinions expressed in all episodes of this podcast and related materials do not reflect on any departments agencies. 

music credit: Drive by ASham...