Copywriters Podcast

One name comes up more than any other when I talk to people about copywriting and AI. That name is Sam Woods, and he’s our very special guest today.

Sam has been in the game for nine years, while most of us haven’t been there half as long.

And I don’t know of anyone who’s been in it longer than Sam has.

He got started with machine learning in 2016 and generative AI in 2019. He was a pioneer in prompt engineering for AI copywriting, and marketing.

Sam has advised Fortune 1,000 companies and teams across the world, as well as advised and consulted with CEOs and other C-Suite executives.

He describes himself as “a strategic AI architect who advises C-Suite leaders on turning artificial intelligence into their most powerful competitive advantage.”

But more important to us, he’s a seasoned and successful expert using AI for writing copy that gets results.

Here’s what we asked him:

1. What would you say is the most important thing about AI that most people in marketing and copywriting haven’t really realized yet?

2. You got started with AI and machine learning so much earlier than most people. What caught your attention… why did you jump in so early?

3. What was using AI like for writing copy in the early 2000’s, before ChatGPT came out?

4. Could you talk about what you’ve done for individual copywriters, copy teams, and large organizations regarding AI and copy?

5. What have you observed, with people who haven’t worked with you, that copywriters are doing right when they use AI? What would you say they are doing wrong?

6.What’s the best way for someone to get up to speed, or even just to get better, using AI for copywriting?

7. Where do you see all this going one, two, five years down the road?

Sam’s website: https://samueljwoods.com/

Other resources:

https://bionicbusiness.com

https://www.copywriting.ai/
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What’s the opposite of a confident salesperson who makes it easy for you to buy?

A nervous salesperson who jumps the gun and makes you want to run away!

Today’s returning champion, Brenna McGowan, understands this difference all too well. She has mastered the arts of the pre-launch and the launch, and she knows all the big and little differences.

Because besides the successful implementers, Brenna’s she’s also seen nervous copywriters and offer owners jump the gun all too often.

And ruin their chances at having a successful launch down the road by spilling too much information too early on!

Brenna believes there’s a lot of misunderstanding of what a pre-launch does, as well as what it should NOT do.

So she agreed to come back on the show and tell us today.

Brenna’s specialty is pre-launches—warming up your market by letting them get to know you even before your launch begins.

Perhaps the best advantage it gives you is it puts you front and center in your prospects’ minds, and at the same time gets them eagerly looking forward to getting the full details about what you’re going to launch.

But a lot of people confuse what to do during a pre-launch and what to do during the launch itself. And that’s what she’s going to clear up for us today.

Here’s what we asked her:

1. What’s the biggest difference between a pre-launch email and a launch email?

2. What is the role of the pre-launch emails? How do you know if something belongs in a pre-launch email versus a launch email?

3. You say one of the biggest mistakes in launch emails is educating too much. Why is that a problem?

4. Can you give us an example of how a case study email can go wrong in a pre-launch—and how to fix it?

5. How does something you learn in pre-launch affect your launch?

6. Why is it important to adjust your launch copy, based on what you learn during the pre-launch?

7. Let's say someone doesn't have time to write a full pre-launch. What should they do?

Brenna’s offer: Pre-launch calendar

https://brennamcgowan.co/launchcalendar/

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Wouldn’t you love to have a confidential chat with a copywriter working at the highest levels of our business?

Well, we can’t provide the confidential part. This IS a podcast, after all, not a Signal chat.

But today’s guest, Cain Smith is on the front lines of some of the biggest businesses using direct response. So we can provide the copywriter working on the highest levels of our business part.

Cain’s client list includes real estate giant Grant Cardone, financial publishing giant Agora Financial, fitness and nutrition giant vShred… as just three examples.

His experience spans infoproducts and ecom, low-ticket and high-ticket, long-form and short-form funnels.

And we got him to come on to tell us what he’s noticing at the cutting edge. Because his observations, when put into action, can mean more money in your pocket.

But I wouldn’t think of asking Cain a thing until I first reminded you that

Copy is powerful. You’re responsible for how you use what you hear on this podcast. Most of the time, common sense is all you need. But if you make extreme claims... and/or if you’re writing copy for offers in highly regulated industries like health, finance, and business opportunity... you may want to get a legal review after you write and before you start using your copy. My larger clients do this all the time.

Here's what we asked him:

1. Since you've got your finger on the pulse at a pretty high level these days, what would you say is the one big change in copywriting that most people aren't aware of yet?

2. How did you get started in copywriting, and how did you end up where you are now?

3. What have you noticed about e–commerce and how does this present opportunities for direct-response copywriters?

4. What’s going on these days with long-form VSLs?

5. What are some modern sales formats that are working better than old-school long-form VSLs?

6. What are some simple testing strategies copywriters and marketers are using successfully?

7. Where do you see direct-response copywriting heading in 2025?

To contact Cain: [email protected]

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It happens to all of us, and can you remember a time where you wondered:

“Is this really good copywriting? It seems like what I should write, but somehow it’s not clicking.”

Here’s why you wonder.

There’s a well-known saying from the Navy SEALs:

"Under pressure, you don't rise to the level of your expectations, you sink to the level of your training".

That goes far beyond the world of the Navy SEALs, of course.

It’s true in all of life.

Well, one thing I don’t think we’ve taken a good enough look at it:

As copywriters, how were we trained?

I don’t mean for copywriting specifically. I mean for writing at all.

See, how you were ORIGINALLY trained to write can easily override what you know you SHOULD do as a copywriter.

We’re going to take a good look at that today, and see what we can do about it.

What we cover in today’s show:

School-style prose clearly informs readers but doesn’t motivate immediate action. Remember: your goal isn’t to describe things—it’s to prompt your readers to act now.

Journalism, blogs, and content writing focus on entertaining or informing readers without directly driving immediate responses. Don't just guide your reader through the facts; clearly show them exactly what to do next.

Technical and scientific writing deliver clear, factual instructions but lack urgency. Don’t simply explain—combine facts with emotional appeal to inspire immediate action.

Corporate or military writing provides structured, formal information but rarely persuades readers to take quick action. Drop the formalities; clearly invite your readers and give them a reason to act immediately.

Traditional advertising-agency writing builds emotional connections and brands but often delays immediate response. Remember John E. Kennedy’s words: “Advertising is salesmanship in print.” Keep your copy action-oriented, clearly instructing your readers exactly how and when to respond.

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Our special guest today, John Jantsch, is going to tell you about what could be the single most valuable sentence you have in your business for getting clients and customers.

John’s the author of the Wall Street Journal best-seller Duct Tape Marketing, as well as three other books.

Now when John talks about “core,” I’m pretty sure he’s not talking about your abs, lower back, and hip flexors.

No, the single most valuable sentence John’s referring to is your core message. That’s something he also calls your “talking logo.”

John says, “Like a traditional printed logo, a talking logo is a tool that allows you to communicate verbally the single greatest benefit of doing business with your firm.

“A talking logo is a short statement that quickly communicates your firm’s position and ideally forces the listener to want to know more.”

And at the end of the day, that’s exactly what every business wants, isn’t it?

John also trains and licenses small business consultants around the world, so you’ll definitely want to hear what he has to tell us today.

Special offer for both marketing consultants and business owners:

https://dtm.world/growth

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You could have written the greatest copy in the world. Perfectly targeted with a killer offer. Great price. Unique and highly desirable.

But I can tell you one way it is guaranteed NOT to work.

And that’s if nobody reads it.

Don’t laugh; it happens.

There are a couple more than a dozen crucial things you must know and consistently DO to make your copy as easy to read as possible.

Most people know some of these things.

Very few people seem to know all of them… or at least USE all of them consistently.

Which is a shame. Because every little thing that makes your copy even a little harder to read ends up costing you sales, more often than not.

Today, we’ll show you how to put a stop to this.

Here’s a preview of what we'll talk about:

1. Use short sentences.

2. Keep your paragraphs short.

3. Use bullet points for lists

4. Use short subheads and lead-ins.

5. Use simple language.

6. Write in the active voice.

7. Cut out extra words.

8. Highlight key phrases (bold or italics)

9. Write like you’re having a conversation.

10. Write directly to the reader.

11. Use numerals for numbers.

12. Use Morse Code (ellipses and long dashes)

13. Front-load what’s important.

14. Replace complex descriptions with simple ones.

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Ever get frustrated with what happens when you try to get an AI to write something?

According to Google Workspace Labs, the average prompt people give an AI is nine words or less.

Nine words!

The AI needs a lot more information than that to do a decent job for you.

But the question is–what information?

Today, we’re going to take a look at how AI goes so very wrong for so many people—and give you some proven ideas on what to do about it.

--

Here’s a great general model for prompts, which has been shared in social media by Open AI President Greg Brockman:

Here's the attached image transcribed into text form:

>>The Anatomy of a Prompt<<

Goal

I want a list of the best medium-length hikes within two hours of San Francisco.

Each hike should provide a cool and unique adventure, and be lesser known.

Return Format

For each hike, return the name of the hike as I'd find it on AllTrails, then provide the starting address of the hike, the ending address of the hike, distance, drive time, hike duration, and what makes it a cool and unique adventure.

Return the top 3.

Warnings

Be careful to make sure that the name of trail is correct, that it actually exists, and that the time is correct.

Context Dump

For context: my girlfriend and I hike a ton! We've done pretty much all of the local SF hikes, whether that's presidio or golden gate park. We definitely want to get out of town – we did mount tam pretty recently, the whole thing from the beginning of the stairs to stinson – it was really long and we are definitely in the mood for something different this weekend! Ocean views would still be nice. We love delicious food. One thing I loved about the tam hike is that it ends with a celebration (Arriving in town to breakfast!) The old missile silos and stuff near Discovery point is cool but I've just done that hike probably 20x at this point. We won't be seeing each other for a few weeks (she has to stay in LA for work) so the uniqueness here really counts.

Now, what we’ve talked about today will get you to the next level with your AI prompting.

But if you want to jump up to a much higher level, once again we’re going to recommend the AI Novus Copywriting Mastermind.

Jason Parker has figured out how to get AI to write amazing copy, all kinds of copy, that requires very little editing. Complete email campaigns. Hooks for ads. Advertorials. Lists of compelling benefits.

And that’s just scratching the surface.

Nathan and I are both members, and Jason invited me to become a partner in the business. We meet every Thursday, and all the calls are recorded.

You get ready to use AI agents when you join. It’s a terrific value.

To find out more, just send an email to [email protected] She’ll be glad to walk you through what’s available and answer any questions you may have.

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Do storytelling skills REALLY make a difference for you?

Just ask our special guest today, Parker Worth.

Parker decided he had enough of high school at 16. His first job was cleaning toilets.

From there, he went to electrician school and, after a few years, got a job traveling around the world as an electrician.

But his own story really starts to take off when he discovers social media. That led to this advice for him: “Just hop on Twitter.”

At first, not much happened.

But one day he got a powerful idea:

Put the story of his life so far into a thread.

He says, “I published it. I went to sleep. And woke up with millions of views and messages.”

Today, Parker has nearly 44,000 followers on TwitterX, more than 20,000 on LinkedIn, and multiple six-figure businesses.

One of his biggest secrets is his discovery of what makes certain social media stories, news stories, and ad stories stick.

He’s shared that with us today.

Here’s what we asked him:

1. What are some of the most common mistakes you see with people telling stories online?

2. How can you tell a story in one sentence?

3. What frameworks do you use to tell stories about your clients, or stories about your client’s clients?

4. What is digital storytelling, and why is it so important?

5. The internet is busier than ever before. So how can someone’s business cut through the noise?

6. Do you have a step by step process to write stories on any social media platform that get millions of views?

7. Could you tell us about your Mad Scientist Research Course?

Parker’s contact info:

Email: [email protected]

Social media:

X: https://x.com/worth_parker

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/parker-worth-120380270/

Newsletter: https://parkerworth.com/page/facebook-ads-v2/newsletter/

Course: https://parker-worth.mykajabi.com/mad-scientist

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Today we’re talking about three new ways to use ChatGPT for copywriters and business owners, and another development from another company which is a lot lower priced than ChatGPT’s a month for its premium service.

We’ll also talk a little about some other specific ways to use OTHER AIs, but a lot of our focus is on ChatGPT.

Now, to be clear, I wasn’t all that hot on ChatGPT 18 months ago. But in the AI world, 18 months is more like a couple of decades.

Things have changed and definitely gotten better with ChatGPT. Particularly, in the last few weeks, the introduction of two new versions: Operator, and Deep Research.

Now, at $200 a month, the combination of these two new services is 10 times as expensive per month as plain old ChatGPT. But if you need to get a lot more done more quickly in certain areas, they could definitely be an asset for you. We’ll go in depth on three ways to speed up key valuable tasks today.

Recap:

Try Operator for…

Segmenting your list, based on what they’ve done before

Coordinating social media posting

Collecting and analyzing customer feedback

Try Deep Research For…

Thorough competitive analysis

SEO and keyword strategy

Finding content opportunities

Try AI Brainstorming For

Coming up with content ideas

Coming up with email ideas

Coming up with social media ideas

Call to Action: Find out more about the Chat GPT Operator/Deep Research upgrade and see if it’s worth it for you.

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One meeting of the minds reigns supreme above all others in copywriting–and that’s when the copywriter understands and addresses the same thoughts that are most pressing in the minds of their best prospect.

Our returning champion today is the incredible Caleb O’Dowd. He was here a few weeks ago when he told us some closely guarded secrets from his book “Monetization: How To Optimize Sales Funnels and Skyrocket Back Ends.”

Caleb has worked in some of the toughest and most competitive industries in the world, and he has repeatedly launched and scaled businesses up to seven and eight figures - all through the smart use of great copy and strategic sales funnels.

But what was behind the thinking and the copy that went into those promotions?

Smart research–something Caleb knows quite a bit about.

Although he a legend in his own right among insiders in direct response marketing, Caleb has the rare distinction of having been mentored by the late Gary Halbert, one of the greatest copywriters of all time.

Today Caleb will give us some highly important tips and insights regarding research. Probably a few valuable things you’ve never heard before.

This is going to be a powerful 30 minutes, so make sure you’re listening closely and ready to take notes.

Caleb’s book, Monetization: How To Optimize Sales Funnels and Skyrocket Backend Profits.

Get it Here

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