Daniel is an entrepreneur and was raised inside the church. His journey into understanding the nature of fraud and its application to religion started when he was excommunicated from his church for exposing sexual abuse. This has led him to ask the hard questions around his most deeply held beliefs. He has found healing through conversations around faith and abuse. He shares very personal stories with the hope that it will help others to find strength and healing.

Rachel and Daniel have a wide-ranging discussion examining the logic behind the ideology of creationism. Daniel points out the common misconceptions of biblical literalism and by extension highlights the presuppositions that lead to vastly different interpretations of the biblical texts. Daniel explains why often in the most divisive issues the truth lies somewhere in the middle. He also expands on why difficult and honest conversations are key to unifying the most divided factions in both religion and politics.

Before You Go: Rachel revisits Daniel's idea that religion is a sense-making apparatus. She examines the most important sense-making mechanism, the question, "Why?"

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