Bron is joined by Beatrice Ng-Kessler (Clinical Psychologist, Schema Therapy Trainer) about working therapeutically with clients from collectivist cultures, and why Western, individualistic models don’t always translate as cleanly as we expect.

They chat about:
👉🏽 How collectivist and individualist values shape therapy
👉🏻 Filial piety, family hierarchy, and unmet needs
👉🏿 Cultural safety, humility, and therapist authority
👉🏾 Working with emotional suppression in schema therapy
👉🏼 Practical ways to build safety without pushing too fast

This episode is essential listening for early-career clinicians wanting to work more thoughtfully, safely, and effectively across cultures.

Guest: Beatrice Ng-Kesler – Clinical Psychologist, Schema Therapy Trainer, founder of the Chinese Schema Therapy Academy

LINKS

• Register for Beatrice's next online workshop on Adapting Psychotherapy for Collectivistic Cultures, scheduled for February 2026!
• More upcoming trainings offered by Beatrice, including training on adapting psychotherapy for collectivist cultures
• Article written by Beatrice, published by the British Psychological Society: Connecting worlds and finding common ground
• Chinese Schema Therapy Academy

THE END BITS

Mental Work is the podcast for psychologists about the realities of working in mental health, with an early-career focus. Hosted by psychologist/researcher Dr Bronwyn Milkins.

Support the show by buying me a virtual coffee ☕🍵

Have a question, episode idea or just want to say hi? DM Bron on Instagram, leave a comment on the Spotify episode, or email [email protected]

Apply to be a guest / YouTube (with captions & transcript) / Website

CREDITS

Producer: Michael English

Music: Home

Commitment: Mental Work believes in an inclusive and diverse mental health workforce. We honour the strength, resilience, and invaluable contributions of mental health workers with lived experiences of mental illness, disability, neurodivergence, LGBTIQA+ identities, and diverse culture and language. We recognise our First Nations colleagues as Traditional Custodians of the land and pay respect to Elders past, present, and emerging. Mental Work is recorded on unceded Whadjuk Noongar boodja.

Disclaimer: Mental Work provides informational content. Mental Work is not a psychological service and being a listener or guest does not establish a therapeutic relationship. Content should not be considered a replacement for professional consultation or therapy. All views expressed are personal, subject to change, and do not represent those of any affiliated employer, service, or organisation past or present. Efforts are made to ensure accuracy, but opinions may not always align with fact. Listeners are encouraged to thoughtfully assess the information presented and report any inaccuracies or concerns via email. Further information can be found here.

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Bron is joined by Prunella Howell-Jay (Lived Experience Supervisor) to chat about what lived experience workers actually do, why peer work is a discipline (not just a vibe), and how clinicians and peer workers can work together in ways that are respectful, collaborative, and grounded in human rights.

They chat about:
👉🏽 What lived experience workers actually do in mental health teams
👉🏻 Why peer work is a discipline, not “just sharing a story”
👉🏿 Boundaries, scope of practice, and common misconceptions
👉🏾 How clinicians can be allies when peer workers are tokenised or sidelined
👉🏼 What good collaboration looks like in practice

Guest: Prunella Howell-Jay - Lived Experience Supervisor, Workforce Coordinator, Trainer and Facilitator

LINKS

• Prunella's LinkedIn
• Lived Experience Australia

THE END BITS

Mental Work is the podcast for psychologists about the realities of working in mental health, with an early-career focus. Hosted by psychologist/researcher Dr Bronwyn Milkins.

Support the show by buying me a virtual coffee ☕🍵

Have a question, episode idea or just want to say hi? DM Bron on Instagram, leave a comment on the Spotify episode, or email [email protected]

Apply to be a guest / YouTube (with captions & transcript) / Website

CREDITS

Producer: Michael English

Music: Home

Commitment: Mental Work believes in an inclusive and diverse mental health workforce. We honour the strength, resilience, and invaluable contributions of mental health workers with lived experiences of mental illness, disability, neurodivergence, LGBTIQA+ identities, and diverse culture and language. We recognise our First Nations colleagues as Traditional Custodians of the land and pay respect to Elders past, present, and emerging. Mental Work is recorded on unceded Whadjuk Noongar boodja.

Disclaimer: Mental Work provides informational content. Mental Work is not a psychological service and being a listener or guest does not establish a therapeutic relationship. Content should not be considered a replacement for professional consultation or therapy. All views expressed are personal, subject to change, and do not represent those of any affiliated employer, service, or organisation past or present. Efforts are made to ensure accuracy, but opinions may not always align with fact. Listeners are encouraged to thoughtfully assess the information presented and report any inaccuracies or concerns via email. Further information can be found here.

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Bron is joined by Denver Simonsz (Psychologist, Supervisor, Writer) to chat about how Acceptance and Commitment Therapy (ACT) has shaped not only his therapeutic work with clients over the past 18 years, but also his own career trajectory and personal life.

They chat about:
👉🏽 How ACT can be a guiding compass for early-career psychologists
👉🏻 Navigating the internal and external challenges of being a psychologist
👉 Figuring out professional identity
👉🏿 How Denver once left a workplace to focus on self-care

Guest: Denver Simonsz - Psychologist, Board-Approve Supervisor, Writer

LINKS

• Denver writes a popular newsletter on Effective Practice - Join the mailing list here
• Denver's Instagram and LinkedIn

THE END BITS

Mental Work is the Australian podcast for early-career psychologists about working in mental health. Hosted by psychologist/researcher Dr Bronwyn Milkins.

Support the show by buying me a virtual coffee ☕🍵

Have a question, episode idea or just want to say hi? DM Bron on Instagram, leave a comment on the Spotify episode, or email [email protected]

Apply to be a guest / YouTube (with captions & transcript) / Website

CREDITS

Producer: Michael English

Music: Home

Commitment: Mental Work believes in an inclusive and diverse mental health workforce. We honor the strength, resilience, and invaluable contributions of mental health workers with lived experiences of mental illness, disability, neurodivergence, LGBTIQA+ identities, and diverse culture and language. We recognise our First Nations colleagues as Traditional Custodians of the land and pay respect to Elders past, present, and emerging. Mental Work is recorded on unceded Whadjuk Noongar boodja.

Disclaimer: Mental Work provides informational content. Mental Work is not a psychological service and being a listener or guest does not establish a therapeutic relationship. Content should not be considered a replacement for professional consultation or therapy. All views expressed are personal, subject to change, and do not represent those of any affiliated employer, service, or organisation past or present. Efforts are made to ensure accuracy, but opinions may not always align with fact. Listeners are encouraged to thoughtfully assess the information presented and report any inaccuracies or concerns via email. Further information can be found here.

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

In the final episode of the year, Bron reflects on the wins and challenges of 2025, her favourite episode this year, behind-the-scenes updates to the podcast, and a sneak peek of episodes coming up in 2026. If you've enjoyed the podcast this year, please consider buying Bron & editor Michael a virtual coffee at buymeacoffee.com/mentalwork. New episodes coming to you from January 15 2026! 🌈

LINKS

• Burnout Part 1 and Burnout Part 2 with Matthew Jackson

THE END BITS

Mental Work is the Australian podcast for early-career psychologists about working in mental health. Hosted by psychologist/researcher Dr Bronwyn Milkins.

Support the show by buying me a virtual coffee ☕🍵

Have a question, episode idea or just want to say hi? DM Bron on Instagram, leave a comment on the Spotify episode, or email [email protected]

Apply to be a guest / YouTube (with captions & transcript) / Website

CREDITS

Producer: Michael English

Music: Home

Commitment: Mental Work believes in an inclusive and diverse mental health workforce. We honour the strength, resilience, and invaluable contributions of mental health workers with lived experiences of mental illness, disability, neurodivergence, LGBTIQA+ identities, and diverse culture and language. We recognise our First Nations colleagues as Traditional Custodians of the land and pay respect to Elders past, present, and emerging. Mental Work is recorded on unceded Whadjuk Noongar boodja.

Disclaimer: Mental Work provides informational content. Mental Work is not a psychological service and being a listener or guest does not establish a therapeutic relationship. Content should not be considered a replacement for professional consultation or therapy. All views expressed are personal, subject to change, and do not represent those of any affiliated employer, service, or organisation past or present. Efforts are made to ensure accuracy, but opinions may not always align with fact. Listeners are encouraged to thoughtfully assess the information presented and report any inaccuracies or concerns via email. Further information can be found here.

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Bron speaks with Dr Lyn O’Grady (community psychologist and suicidology researcher) about person-centred suicide prevention. Lyn shares how decades of work across communities, schools, projects and private practice shaped her understanding of suicidality and why relying solely on checklists can shut down meaningful conversations.

They chat about:
👉🏽 How person-centred care differs from traditional risk assessments
👉🏻 The limits of low/medium/high suicide-risk categories
👉🏿 Using risk formulation and collaborative, empowering safety planning
👉 Keeping conversations open without increasing shame or fear
👉🏽 How clinicians can sit with uncertainty, use existing skills, and practise sustainably in this challenging space

Guest: Lyn O'Grady - Community Psychologist

LINKS

• Lyn is featured in this article: ​How to take a person-centred approach to suicide prevention, published by the Australian Psychological Society
• Lyn is available for supervision - you can message her on LinkedIn
• Open-access research paper: Cognitive Behavior Therapy With and Without Narrative Assessment and Suicide Attempts: A Systematic Review and Meta-Analysis (2025): "Results suggest that a narrative assessment (of suicide risk) may be a simple and effective way to capture the forces that lead to suicide attempts and to direct interventions toward their prevention." 👏

THE END BITS

Mental Work is the Australian podcast for early-career psychologists about working in mental health. Hosted by psychologist/researcher Dr Bronwyn Milkins.

Support the show by buying me a virtual coffee ☕🍵

Have a question, episode idea or just want to say hi? DM Bron on Instagram, leave a comment on the Spotify episode, or email [email protected]

Apply to be a guest / YouTube (with captions & transcript) / Website

CREDITS

Producer: Michael English

Music: Home

Commitment: Mental Work believes in an inclusive and diverse mental health workforce. We honor the strength, resilience, and invaluable contributions of mental health workers with lived experiences of mental illness, disability, neurodivergence, LGBTIQA+ identities, and diverse culture and language. We recognise our First Nations colleagues as Traditional Custodians of the land and pay respect to Elders past, present, and emerging. Mental Work is recorded on unceded Whadjuk Noongar boodja.

Disclaimer: Mental Work provides informational content. Mental Work is not a psychological service and being a listener or guest does not establish a therapeutic relationship. Content should not be considered a replacement for professional consultation or therapy. All views expressed are personal, subject to change, and do not represent those of any affiliated employer, service, or organisation past or present. Efforts are made to ensure accuracy, but opinions may not always align with fact. Listeners are encouraged to thoughtfully assess the information presented and report any inaccuracies or concerns via email. Further information can be found here.

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Bron speaks with Dr Chrissy Antonopoulos (psychologist and founder of Beyond Bias Consulting) about her PhD research on implicit bias towards people with disability in Australia. Chrissy shares how her lived experience of blindness led her to investigate the subtle and often invisible attitudes shaping workplace decisions, clinical interactions, and public policy.

They chat about: 
👉🏽 The difference between explicit and implicit bias
👉🏻 The Stereotype Content Model
👉 Participant's views of people with disability in terms of competence and warmth
👉🏿 What early-career clinicians can do to challenge implicit assumptions about people with disability

Guest: Dr Chrissy Antonopoulos - Psychologist

LINKS

• Chrissy's research paper discussed in the episode: Implicit bias towards people with disability in Australia: relationship with personal values
• Chrissy's consulting business, Beyond Bias Consulting
• Chrissy's Instagram @the_blind_psychologist

THE END BITS

Mental Work is the Australian podcast for early-career psychologists about working in mental health. Hosted by psychologist/researcher Dr Bronwyn Milkins.

Support the show by buying me a virtual coffee ☕🍵

Have a question, episode idea or just want to say hi? DM Bron on Instagram, leave a comment on the Spotify episode, or email [email protected]

Apply to be a guest / YouTube (with captions & transcript) / Website

CREDITS

Producer: Michael English

Music: Home

Commitment: Mental Work believes in an inclusive and diverse mental health workforce. We honor the strength, resilience, and invaluable contributions of mental health workers with lived experiences of mental illness, disability, neurodivergence, LGBTIQA+ identities, and diverse culture and language. We recognise our First Nations colleagues as Traditional Custodians of the land and pay respect to Elders past, present, and emerging. Mental Work is recorded on unceded Whadjuk Noongar boodja.

Disclaimer: Mental Work provides informational content. Mental Work is not a psychological service and being a listener or guest does not establish a therapeutic relationship. Content should not be considered a replacement for professional consultation or therapy. All views expressed are personal, subject to change, and do not represent those of any affiliated employer, service, or organisation past or present. Efforts are made to ensure accuracy, but opinions may not always align with fact. Listeners are encouraged to thoughtfully assess the information presented and report any inaccuracies or concerns via email. Further information can be found here.

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Bron and guest Dr Bianca Denny unpack one of the trickiest early-career topics: professional boundaries in therapy. Together, they break down what boundaries actually mean (and don’t mean), how to navigate self-disclosure, gift-giving, ethical grey areas, and what to do when you realise a boundary has been crossed by you or a colleague.

👉 We cover: 

• Bianca's practical framework for handling dilemmas
• How to distinguish boundary crossings from violations
• Why supervision is your best friend
• How to approach online spaces responsibly.

Whether you’re feeling anxious about “getting it wrong” or just want to strengthen your ethical confidence, this episode will help you manage boundaries with clarity and calm.

Guest: Dr Bianca Denny - Clinical Psychologist, Board-Approved Supervisor, Author

LINKS

• Bianca's book discussed in the episode: The How-To of Psychotherapy: A Practical Guide for Therapists (HIGHLY recommended! 🥰)
• Bianca's website, LinkedIn, Instagram
• Bianca's other book: Talk To Me: Lessons from Patients and Their Therapist

THE END BITS

Mental Work is the Australian podcast for early-career mental health workers about working in mental health. Hosted by Psychologist/Researcher Dr Bronwyn Milkins.

Support the show by buying me a virtual coffee ☕🍵

Have a question, episode idea or just want to say hi? DM Bron on Instagram, leave a comment on the Spotify episode, or email [email protected]

Apply to be a guest / YouTube (with captions & transcript) / Website

CREDITS

Producer: Michael English

Music: Home

Commitment: Mental Work believes in an inclusive and diverse mental health workforce. We honor the strength, resilience, and invaluable contributions of mental health workers with lived experiences of mental illness, disability, neurodivergence, LGBTIQA+ identities, and diverse culture and language. We recognise our First Nations colleagues as Traditional Custodians of the land and pay respect to Elders past, present, and emerging. Mental Work is recorded on unceded Whadjuk Noongar land.

Disclaimer: Mental Work provides informational content. Mental Work is not a psychological service and being a listener or guest does not establish a clinical or non-clinical relationship. Content should not be considered a replacement for professional consultation or therapy. All views expressed are personal, subject to change, and do not represent those of any affiliated employer, service, or organisation past or present. Efforts are made to ensure accuracy, but opinions may not always align with fact. Listeners are encouraged to thoughtfully assess the information presented and report any inaccuracies or concerns via email. Further information can be found here.

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Ever felt like you’re carrying the extra weight of your identity into every supervision meeting, team huddle, or client session? That’s not “just stress.” It might be identity-based burnout. In this ep, Bron and guest Shuktika Bose unpack identity-based burnout - what it is and how to navigate it.

👉🏾 We cover:

• How identity-based burnout differs from general workplace burnout

• The emotional and nervous system toll of constantly “proving yourself”

• What psychological safety really looks like at work

• Boundaries as acts of self-preservation and cultural respect

• How to find your voice - even when it feels risky

Guest: Shuktika Bose - Clinical Psychologist, Mental Health Consultant & Speaker

LINKS

• Shuktika's website, Instagram, LinkedIn

THE END BITS

Mental Work is the Australian podcast for early-career mental health workers about working in mental health. Hosted by Psychologist/Researcher Dr Bronwyn Milkins.

Support the show by buying me a virtual coffee ☕🍵

Have a question, episode idea or just want to say hi? DM Bron on Instagram, leave a comment on the Spotify episode, or email [email protected]

Apply to be a guest / YouTube (with captions & transcript) / Website

CREDITS

Producer: Michael English

Music: Home

Commitment: Mental Work believes in an inclusive and diverse mental health workforce. We honor the strength, resilience, and invaluable contributions of mental health workers with lived experiences of mental illness, disability, neurodivergence, LGBTIQA+ identities, and diverse culture and language. We recognise our First Nations colleagues as Traditional Custodians of the land and pay respect to Elders past, present, and emerging. Mental Work is recorded on unceded Whadjuk Noongar land.

Disclaimer: Mental Work provides informational content. Mental Work is not a psychological service and being a listener or guest does not establish a clinical or non-clinical relationship. Content should not be considered a replacement for professional consultation or therapy. All views expressed are personal, subject to change, and do not represent those of any affiliated employer, service, or organisation past or present. Efforts are made to ensure accuracy, but opinions may not always align with fact. Listeners are encouraged to thoughtfully assess the information presented and report any inaccuracies or concerns via email. Further information can be found here.

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Bron and guest Renae Martelli explore how letting go of the tools and strategies we cling to as early-career therapists might actually make us better at our jobs. We unpack what happens when we stop trying to “do” therapy perfectly and instead tune in to the client, the context, and the process.

👉🏽 We cover:

• Why tools and worksheets can sometimes hold us back

• The shift from doing therapy to being a therapist

• How supervision helps refine your therapist lens

• Letting go of self-criticism and embracing self-compassion in your practice

Expect practical insights, plenty of “I’ve done that too” moments, and an honest conversation about what it really takes to grow as a therapist. Thanks Renae! 😊

Guest: Renae Martelli, Psychologist, supervisor and owner of Think Feel Grow

LINKS

• Renae's private practice
• Renae's Instagram
• Renae's LinkedIn
• The DNA-V model (We talked about this approach in the episode) 

THE END BITS

Mental Work is the Australian podcast for early-career mental health workers about working in mental health. Hosted by Psychologist/Researcher Dr Bronwyn Milkins.

Support the show by buying me a virtual coffee ☕🍵

Have a question, episode idea or just want to say hi? DM Bron on Instagram, leave a comment on the Spotify episode, or email [email protected]

Apply to be a guest / YouTube (with captions & transcript) / Website

CREDITS

Producer: Michael English

Music: Home

Commitment: Mental Work believes in an inclusive and diverse mental health workforce. We honor the strength, resilience, and invaluable contributions of mental health workers with lived experiences of mental illness, disability, neurodivergence, LGBTIQA+ identities, and diverse culture and language. We recognise our First Nations colleagues as Traditional Custodians of the land and pay respect to Elders past, present, and emerging. Mental Work is recorded on unceded Whadjuk Noongar land.

Disclaimer: Mental Work provides informational content. Mental Work is not a psychological service and being a listener or guest does not establish a clinical or non-clinical relationship. Content should not be considered a replacement for professional consultation or therapy. All views expressed are personal, subject to change, and do not represent those of any affiliated employer, service, or organisation past or present. Efforts are made to ensure accuracy, but opinions may not always align with fact. Listeners are encouraged to thoughtfully assess the information presented and report any inaccuracies or concerns via email. Further information can be found here.

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Bron and guest Claire Trevitt discuss the concepts of transference and countertransference. Bron has been eager to record this episode for two years, and it does not disappoint! Claire explains the nuances of these concepts that are essential for every mental health professional to understand. The episode covers what transference and countertransference are, why they're important in therapy, and offers practical strategies for managing them. Claire shares personal anecdotes from her extensive psychodynamic training and supervision, making the concepts relatable and easier to grasp. Bron and Claire also discuss the importance of supervision, personal therapy, and how to handle these reactions professionally. Enjoy and don't miss listening to this episode! 🤩

Guest: Claire Trevitt, Psychologist and Supervisor at The Growing Therapist and Host of the 'Between Two Psychs' Podcast

LINKS

• Claire's podcast, Between Two Psychs
• Claire's training/supervision website, The Growing Therapist
• Nancy McWilliam's books on Psychodynamic Psychotherapy (recommended by Claire)
• An Introduction to Contemporary Psychodynamic Psychotherapy by Jonathan Shelder (recommended by Bron - an easier introduction to psychodynamic concepts)

THE END BITS

Mental Work is the Australian podcast for early-career mental health workers about working in mental health. Hosted by Psychologist/Researcher Dr Bronwyn Milkins.

Support the show by buying me a virtual coffee ☕🍵

Have a question, episode idea or just want to say hi? DM Bron on Instagram, leave a comment on the Spotify episode, or email [email protected]

Apply to be a guest / YouTube (with captions & transcript) / Website

CREDITS

Producer: Michael English

Music: Home

Commitment: Mental Work believes in an inclusive and diverse mental health workforce. We honor the strength, resilience, and invaluable contributions of mental health workers with lived experiences of mental illness, disability, neurodivergence, LGBTIQA+ identities, and diverse culture and language. We recognise our First Nations colleagues as Traditional Custodians of the land and pay respect to Elders past, present, and emerging. Mental Work is recorded on unceded Whadjuk Noongar land.

Disclaimer: Mental Work provides informational content. Mental Work is not a psychological service and being a listener or guest does not establish a clinical or non-clinical relationship. Content should not be considered a replacement for professional consultation or therapy. All views expressed are personal, subject to change, and do not represent those of any affiliated employer, service, or organisation past or present. Efforts are made to ensure accuracy, but opinions may not always align with fact. Listeners are encouraged to thoughtfully assess the information presented and report any inaccuracies or concerns via email. Further information can be found here.

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.