The Cellar Door Podcast

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There are wine regions that the world knows by name, and there are wine regions that deserve to be known a whole lot better.

Frankland River, tucked away in Western Australia’s Great Southern, is one of the latter.

It’s a region with a rich agricultural history, a distinctive climate, some seriously exciting wines, and a community of producers working hard to put their corner of the world on the map.

For years, Frankland River has supplied fruit that has found its way into wines carrying broader regional identities. But increasingly, producers are proudly putting Frankland River front and centre, building recognition for the place, its people and the wines they make.

And now, the region is taking another step forward with its first-ever Frankland River Wine Show.

In this episode of The Cellar Door Podcast, I’m joined by Chelsea Langie and Laura Penniment to talk about the show, the region’s identity, the challenges of operating in a relatively isolated wine region, and the opportunities that come from bringing producers together behind a common cause.

This conversation is the starting point for a deeper exploration of Frankland River, its history, its vineyards, its wines and the people who make it special.

Because sometimes, the most interesting wine stories are found in the places we haven’t quite discovered yet.

Welcome to The Cellar Door Podcast.

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The wine industry is cyclical.

Booms become busts. Shortages become oversupply. Prices rise, vineyards get planted, markets change, and suddenly everyone is asking: how did we get here?

But perhaps the more important question is: did we see it coming?

In this conversation, Toby Langley and I unpack the Turrentine Wine Business Wheel of Fortune, and what it tells us about supply, demand, inventory, timing and the decisions businesses make when the market turns.

Because in wine, by the time the signal becomes obvious, it can already be too late.

So how do you read the signs?

And how do you know whether you're looking at a genuinely valuable business, or simply one that's benefiting from being in the right part of the cycle?

This is my second conversation with Toby Langley, and it's all about cycles, timing and surviving the business of wine. A huge thanks for Toby for joining me. 

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I’ve spoken to Giles Cooke before on the Cellar Door Podcast, usually about his successful Thistledown.

But this conversation is a little different.

I must warn listeners that some of the themes in this conversation are heavy, including loss, mental health and suicide. 

Behind Giles’s Our Fathers label is a story that I found genuinely moving. It’s a wine project that came out of an extraordinarily difficult period in Giles’ life, the loss of his father and mother, and then his own brush with mortality.

And rather than doing what most of us might do after a run of events like that, Giles decided to make some wine.

But Our Fathers isn’t just a wine with a good story attached to it. All of the profits go to charity, with the project increasingly focused on mental health, suicide prevention and supporting people who are doing it tough.

So, while is a conversation about wine, but it’s also about loss, purpose, resilience and the idea that something good can come out of something pretty bloody difficult.

A massive thanks to Giles for joining me on the Cellar Door Podcast. 

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What makes a wine business worth buying?

You might think it's the vineyard. Or the winery. Maybe it's the brand, the wine sitting in the cellar, or the customers who have been buying it for generations.

But what if one of the biggest things affecting the value of a wine business is actually the person who owns it?

To answer these questions I reached out to Toby Langley of Langley and Co. Toby has spent decades working with buyers and sellers of wine businesses, and he has a fascinating perspective on what actually creates value in this industry.

We talk about mergers and acquisitions, why people sell, what buyers are looking for, succession, vineyards, inventory, foreign investment and the changing economics of Australian wine.

And perhaps most importantly, we get into the question every wine business owner eventually has to confront: if you wanted to sell your business tomorrow, what would someone actually be buying?

Here is my conversation with Toby Langley, and a massive thanks to Toby for joining me, on the Cellar Door Podcast. 

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For Mac Forbes, wine has never been just about what’s in the glass.

It’s about identity. Place. Curiosity. And the willingness to choose the harder path in pursuit of something meaningful.

Over the past two decades, Mac has built one of Australia’s most respected wine businesses by questioning convention—from dry farming and single vineyards to a philosophy centred on understanding the Yarra Valley on its own terms.

In this conversation, we explore the challenges facing Australian wine today, the lessons Mac has drawn from family, Indigenous perspectives on land, and why emotion plays such a powerful role in the wines we make and the bottles we choose.

More than anything, this is a conversation about purpose, resilience, and leaving something better for the next generation.

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Most conversations about wine start with a simple assumption: that there is such a thing as the wine market.

Joe Fattorini argues that's completely wrong.

In this episode, we unpack why treating wine as a single market leads to poor marketing, poor positioning, and missed opportunities. Drawing on examples from around the world, Joe explains why the most successful wine businesses don't try to sell to everyone—they understand exactly who they're selling to, why those people buy, and what problem they're really solving.

Whether you're a winery owner, marketer, retailer, or simply fascinated by how brands succeed, this conversation is packed with practical insights into segmentation, positioning, consumer behaviour, and the future of wine marketing.

Here's my conversation with Joe Fattorini.

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For most wine drinkers, a wine show is something that happens in the background.

A medal on a bottle. A trophy announced at an awards dinner. A score that helps guide a purchasing decision.

But behind those medals sits one of the most important institutions in Australian wine.

This year, the Sydney Royal Wine Show celebrates an extraordinary milestone: 200 years since wine was first included in the competitions of what would become the Royal Agricultural Society of New South Wales. Over those two centuries, the show has helped benchmark quality, foster excellence, train future judges, and contribute to the development of the Australian wine industry.

Few people understand that world better than Sally Evans.

A long-serving Councillor of the Royal Agricultural Society of New South Wales, former Steward-in-Chief, former Chair of the Sydney Royal Wine Committee, and one of the Sydney Royal's most passionate advocates, Sally has spent decades helping shape and support one of Australia's most respected wine competitions.

In this conversation, we explore the history of the Sydney Royal Wine Show, how wine judging actually works, what happens behind the scenes during judging week, and why wine shows continue to matter in an increasingly competitive wine market.

Most importantly, we discuss the role wine shows play in bringing people together, sharing knowledge, encouraging excellence, and helping shape the future of Australian wine.

So, as the Sydney Royal Wine Show celebrates its bicentenary and prepares for the Sydney Royal 200 Symposium, please enjoy my conversation with Sally Evans.

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This episode welcomes back Ed Cavanagh — wine writer, historian, policy researcher, and author of the forthcoming book Crushed: The Hand of Government on the Australian Wine Industry.

Ed has spent the last several years digging into the policies, regulations, and market forces that have shaped Australian wine, and his latest paper examines the controversial topic of : ghost labels.

Ghost labels are wine brands created and owned by major retailers rather than independent wineries. On their own, they're not necessarily a problem. The wine may be well made and fairly priced. But Ed argues that ghost labels are a symptom of a much bigger issue — the growing concentration of power within Australia's wine retail sector.

In this conversation, we explore how Coles and Woolworths came to dominate so much of the liquor market, why Ed distinguishes between a duopoly and a duopsony, and what that concentration of buying and selling power means for wineries trying to compete.

Drawing on decades of industry history, Senate inquiries, ACCC investigations, and competition policy, Ed asks a challenging question: have we become so focused on issues like oversupply, exports, and changing consumer tastes that we've overlooked the role market concentration plays in shaping the fortunes of Australian wine?

It's a fascinating discussion about economics, competition, public policy, and ultimately the future of the Australian wine industry.

Here's my conversation with Ed Cavanagh. A massive thanks for joining me on the CDP. 

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For many wineries, making great wine is only half the challenge. The other half is getting that wine into the hands of consumers.

Behind every bottle that finds its way onto a restaurant wine list, an independent retailer's shelf, or a national distribution network sits a commercial relationship that most wine drinkers never see. And when those relationships work well, they can help build brands, grow businesses, and create long-term success. When they don't, the consequences can be costly.

My guest today is Will Taylor, Senior Partner at Finlaysons and one of Australia's leading wine industry lawyers. Over the past three decades, Will has advised wineries, distributors, grapegrowers, and wine businesses through some of the industry's most significant commercial challenges.

In this episode, we're diving into the world of wine distribution agreements. We explore why these contracts matter, the common mistakes wineries make when entering distribution relationships, the risks of relying on handshake deals, how disputes arise, and why a well-drafted agreement can be one of the most valuable tools a wine business has.

Here's my conversation with Will Taylor. A huge thanks to Will for joining me.

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For centuries, France has occupied a unique place in the world of wine. Its vineyards, classifications, language, and traditions have shaped how we think about fine wine, from Bordeaux and Burgundy to concepts like terroir and appellation. But how did French wine come to dominate the global imagination? And was that dominance really built on superior wine, or on something else entirely?

My guest today is historian Kathy Burk. Kathy is Professor Emerita of Modern and Contemporary History at University College London, an acclaimed author, broadcaster, and one of the world's leading historians of economic and cultural history. 

In this conversation, we explore the rise of French wine, the role of England in creating the reputation of Bordeaux, the significance of the 1855 Classification, the origins of concepts like terroir and chaptalisation, and how the famous 1976 Judgment of Paris challenged centuries of French supremacy. Along the way, Kathy takes us from the Stone Age to modern California, revealing how trade, politics, empire, religion, and marketing helped shape the wine world we know today.

And where better to begin than at the very beginning.

Here is Kathy Burk.

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