In this episode of Going Inside, John Clarke sits down with Jessica Fern—IFS-trained trauma therapist and author of Polysecure—to explore what really happens inside our systems when we open up relationships. They unpack the intersection of attachment, trauma, and non-monogamy, and how IFS brings clarity and healing to the parts that get activated. Whether you're a therapist, curious about ethical non-monogamy, or working on your own attachment wounding, this conversation offers powerful insight, practical frameworks, and plenty of aha moments.

Key Takeaways:

• Why "opening up" a relationship often opens old wounds first—and how IFS can help you meet the infant parts crying out for safety.
• The surprising ways codependency, polyamory, and secure attachment collide—and what people get wrong about each.
• How the "shame triangle" shows up in modern relationships—and why your inner critic may be the loudest part in the room.

👤 Guest: Jessica Fern

Jessica Fern holds a Master’s degree in Conflict Resolution, is a Certified Clinical Trauma Professional, a trained Internal Family Systems (IFS) practitioner, and an integrative therapist drawing on 25 years of experience in somatic, narrative, psychotherapeutic, and spiritual healing modalities. She is the internationally recognized author of Polysecure, The Polysecure Workbook, Polywise, and her upcoming book Transforming the Shame Triangle.

Through her international private practice, Jessica works with individuals, couples, and multi-partner relationships to break free from reactive patterns, cultural conditioning, insecure attachment, and past trauma—empowering them to embody new possibilities in life and love.

Contact + Learn More:
 🌐 JessicaFern.com
📧 [email protected]
📸 Instagram: @JessicaFern

Resources & Offerings:

➡️ Discover how to stay grounded, attuned, and effective, no matter what your clients (or you) bring into the room: https://go.johnclarketherapy.com/self-energy-guide-org
➡️ Free IFS Training for Therapists: From Burnout to Balance: https://go.johnclarketherapy.com/ifs-webinar-podcast
➡️ 1-Month Grace Period with Jane – Use code JOHN or visit: https://meet.jane.app/john-clarke-ambassador
➡️ 10% Off at Grounding Well – Use code GWJOHNCLARKE or visit: https://www.groundingwell.com/GWJOHNCLARKE
➡️ 10% Off at Dharma Dr. – Use code JOHN or visit: https://dharmadr.com/JOHN

Connect with Me:

https://www.johnclarketherapy.com/
https://www.instagram.com/johnclarketherapy/
https://www.tiktok.com/@johnclarketherapy
https://www.youtube.com/@johnclarketherapy

Grab Your Seat for the Free IFS Webinar Here: https://go.johnclarketherapy.com/ifs-webinar-podcast

➡️ Free Training - Learn how to integrate the principles of IFS into your therapy practice: https://go.johnclarketherapy.com/ifs-webinar-podcast

Grief isn’t just about loss — it’s also a doorway into healing. In this deeply resonant conversation, relational therapist Rebecca Wong and host John Clarke explore how grief, when met with presence and curiosity, becomes a powerful force for integration and connection. Together, we dive into what it means to turn toward our discomfort, build trust with our nervous systems, and honor the wisdom already within us.

Whether you’re a therapist, a client, or a human navigating this wild experience of being alive, this episode will help you reflect on your own relationship with pain, healing, and connection.

Key Takeaways

• Grief as your most untapped therapeutic tool. Discover why it’s more than just sadness and how it opens a door to deep relational healing.
• Could your urge to fix block your client’s healing? Explore the subtle shift that changes how your presence impacts clients.
• How clients' reactions are actually wisdom in disguise. Learn how to recognize the intelligence of the nervous system, even in shutdown, collapse, or rage.

👤 Guest: Rebecca Wong

Rebecca Wong is a relational therapist, educator, and the creator of Connectfulness®, a practice rooted in presence, curiosity, and the courage to turn toward what’s hard. She supports individuals, couples, and healing professionals in cultivating nervous system trust, relational integrity, and generational repair. Learn more at connectfulness.com.

📩 Contact: [email protected]
🔗 Social: @connectfulness

Resources & Offerings:

➡️ Free IFS Training for Therapists: From Burnout to Balance: https://go.johnclarketherapy.com/ifs-webinar-podcast
➡️ 1-Month Grace Period with Jane – Use code JOHN or visit: https://meet.jane.app/john-clarke-ambassador
➡️ 10% Off at Grounding Well – Use code GWJOHNCLARKE or visit: https://www.groundingwell.com/GWJOHNCLARKE
➡️ 10% Off at Dharma Dr. – Use code JOHN or visit: https://dharmadr.com/JOHN

Connect with me:

https://www.johnclarketherapy.com/
https://www.instagram.com/johnclarketherapy/
https://www.tiktok.com/@johnclarketherapy
https://www.youtube.com/@johnclarketherapy

Grab Your Seat for the Free IFS Webinar Here: https://go.johnclarketherapy.com/ifs-webinar-podcast

➡️ Free Training - Learn how to integrate the principles of IFS into your therapy practice: https://go.johnclarketherapy.com/ifs-webinar-podcast

What if parenting challenges—and therapeutic resistance—make perfect sense? In this episode, John Clarke sits down with Danish IFS therapist and parenting model creator Anna Vincentz to explore how Internal Family Systems (IFS) offers a powerful lens for working with both clients and their families. Anna shares how her personal journey with neurodivergence, trauma, and parenthood led her to develop New Danish Parenting, a model that centers nervous system regulation, attachment, and deep curiosity.

This conversation is packed with practical insights for therapists navigating complex systems—inside and out.

3 Key Takeaways:

⚪ Why “bad behavior” in children and clients is a survival strategy—not a diagnosis—and how to reframe it in session.

⚪ How Anna’s New Danish Parenting model bridges IFS, attachment, and practical neurodivergent-informed tools for clinicians.

⚪ What to do when your client is “just talking” and not ready to go deeper—without trying to force the model.

Guest: Anna Vincentz

Anna Vincentz is a Certified Level 3 IFS Therapist, Family Therapist, and creator of New Danish Parenting (NDP)—a model designed for parents, therapists, and practitioners seeking deeper understanding of attachment, trauma, and relational healing. Anna specializes in working with neurodivergent and highly sensitive individuals, and brings a compassionate, trauma-informed lens to every session. A mother of two neurodivergent children, Anna integrates her lived experience into both her clinical work and teaching.

Learn more about Anna:

1. Website: https://www.annavincentz.dk/english
2. About: https://annavincentz.dk/about-me
3. Articles: https://medium.com/@annavincentz | https://annavincentz.dk/english-blog
4. Podcast: https://creators.spotify.com/pod/profile/parenting-from-the-inside/
5. Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/ifstherapy_annavincentz/
6. Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/ifsannavincentz

Resources & Offerings:
Download my Guide to Self-Energy for Practitioners - Get access here: https://go.johnclarketherapy.com/self-energy-guide-org
Free Training - Learn how to integrate the principles of IFS into your therapy practice: https://go.johnclarketherapy.com/ifs-webinar-podcast
1-Month Grace Period with Jane – Use code JOHN or visit: https://meet.jane.app/john-clarke-ambassador
10% Off at Grounding Well – Use code GWJOHNCLARKE or visit: https://www.groundingwell.com/GWJOHNCLARKE
10% Off at Dharma Dr. – Use code JOHN or visit: https://dharmadr.com/JOHN

Connect with me:
https://www.johnclarketherapy.com/
https://www.instagram.com/johnclarketherapy/

Grab Your Seat for the Free IFS Webinar Here: https://go.johnclarketherapy.com/ifs-webinar-podcast

➡️ Free Training - Learn how to integrate the principles of IFS into your therapy practice: https://go.johnclarketherapy.com/ifs-webinar-podcast

➡️ Free IFS Training for Therapists: From Burnout to Balance: https://go.johnclarketherapy.com/ifs-webinar-podcast

In this insightful episode of Going Inside, John Clarke sits down with Dr. Daphne Fatter to explore how Internal Family Systems (IFS) and Eye Movement Desensitization and Reprocessing (EMDR) can be integrated for powerful trauma recovery work. Dr. Fatter shares her step-by-step approach to blending these models, offering practical tips for clinicians working with complex trauma. From building client readiness to navigating the nuances of protector parts and exiles, this conversation is packed with concrete strategies, clinical wisdom, and encouragement for therapists ready to deepen their practice.

3 Key Takeaways:

👉 Why IFS and EMDR complement each other so well in treating complex trauma.
👉 How to determine client readiness for EMDR and gain system-wide consent.
👉 Practical ways to use parts mapping, befriending, and stabilization tools before reprocessing.

Guest:
Dr. Daphne Fatter is a licensed psychologist, consultant, author, and international speaker dedicated to providing education on integrative trauma-informed therapies. She is certified in IFS and is an Approved IFS Clinical Consultant. She is also certified in EMDR and is an EMDRIA Approved EMDR Consultant. As a certified ancestral healing practitioner, she also works with intergenerational and historical trauma.

Connect with Dr. Daphne Fatter:
Website: https://www.daphnefatterphd.com

Resources & Offerings:

➡️ Free IFS Training for Therapists: From Burnout to Balance: https://go.johnclarketherapy.com/ifs-webinar-podcast
➡️ 1-Month Grace Period with Jane – Use code JOHN or visit: https://meet.jane.app/john-clarke-ambassador
➡️ 10% Off at Grounding Well – Use code GWJOHNCLARKE or visit: https://www.groundingwell.com/GWJOHNCLARKE
➡️ 10% Off at Dharma Dr. – Use code JOHN or visit: https://dharmadr.com/JOHN

Connect with me:

https://www.johnclarketherapy.com/
https://www.instagram.com/johnclarketherapy/
https://www.tiktok.com/@johnclarketherapy
https://www.youtube.com/@johnclarketherapy

Grab Your Seat for the Free IFS Webinar Here: https://go.johnclarketherapy.com/ifs-webinar-podcast

➡️ Free Training - Learn how to integrate the principles of IFS into your therapy practice: https://go.johnclarketherapy.com/ifs-webinar-podcast

In this soul-stirring conversation, IFS pioneer Bob Falconer returns to explore the intersection of Internal Family Systems (IFS), spirituality, and trauma healing. We discuss how trauma creates separation, the necessity of spiritual connection in deep healing, and how curiosity can be a transformative force. Bob shares insight from his upcoming books and over 50 years of clinical experience, emphasizing the porous nature of the mind and the healing power of respectful engagement with all parts of the self—both personal and transpersonal. This episode is a heartfelt invitation to open your inner world with compassion and wonder.

3 Key Takeaways:

1. A surprising reason why many trauma survivors don’t fully heal—and what might be missing.
2. The two types of curiosity—and why only one leads to transformation.
3. What Bob means when he says “the mind isn’t just multiple... it’s porous.”

👤 Guest: Robert Falconer

Robert Falconer is a dedicated therapist, teacher, and global educator of the IFS model. Author of The Others Within Us, Bob brings over five decades of experience to his work exploring the porous nature of the mind, particularly in the context of trauma and spiritual experiences. His latest books, Opening the Inner World and Spirit Speaks, delve into the intersection of IFS, mysticism, and healing.

Get your copy of Opening the Inner World and Spirit Speaks: https://swedenborg.com/product/opening-the-inner-world/

Resources & Offerings:

➡️Register for a FREE IFS Training "From Burnout to Balance": https://go.johnclarketherapy.com/ifs-webinar-yt
➡️ Download my FREE IFS Resource Library - Get access here: https://go.johnclarketherapy.com/ifs-resource-library
➡️ Register for a FREE IFS Training "From Burnout to Balance": https://go.johnclarketherapy.com/ifs-webinar-podcast
➡️ 1-Month Grace Period with Jane – Use code JOHN or visit: https://meet.jane.app/john-clarke-ambassador
➡️ 10% Off at Grounding Well – Use code GWJOHNCLARKE or visit: https://www.groundingwell.com/GWJOHNCLARKE
➡️ 10% Off at Dharma Dr. – Use code JOHN or visit: https://dharmadr.com/JOHN

Connect with me:

https://www.johnclarketherapy.com/
https://www.instagram.com/johnclarketherapy/
https://www.tiktok.com/@johnclarketherapy
https://www.youtube.com/@johnclarketherapy

Transcript:

Bob Falconer: [00:00:00] And McGilchrist makes this wonderful point, which at first really pissed me off, but usually when there's a radical new idea, it pisses me off at first because it takes me out of my comfort zone. He says, how we pay attention is a moral act, and I think how we pay attention is a choice like that, that determines the nature of the world we live in.

John Clarke: Going Inside is a podcast on a mission to help people heal from trauma and reconnect wit

Grab Your Seat for the Free IFS Webinar Here: https://go.johnclarketherapy.com/ifs-webinar-podcast

➡️ Free Training - Learn how to integrate the principles of IFS into your therapy practice: https://go.johnclarketherapy.com/ifs-webinar-podcast

In this powerful episode, psychiatrist and psychedelic therapy researcher Dr. Will Van Derveer joins John to explore the cutting-edge world of MDMA-assisted therapy and how it's changing the game for trauma recovery. They unpack the failures of conventional psychiatry, the neuroscience behind MDMA’s healing power, and why training—and restraint—are everything when it comes to this work. If you’re curious about psychedelic therapy or working with trauma more effectively, this one’s for you.

🔑 Key Takeaways:

1. The MDMA Data That Stunned the Field – Discover why an 83% recovery rate from treatment-resistant PTSD shook the psychiatric world—and how it’s even possible.
2. Healing as Remembering, Not Escaping – Why psychedelic therapy often works by accessing the mind’s natural blueprint for healing—and how “parts work” arises spontaneously.
3. The Danger of Doing Too Much – Learn why well-meaning but untrained therapists can unintentionally cause harm—and what true “holding space” actually looks like.

👤 Guest: Dr. Will Van Derveer

Dr. Will Van Derveer is a psychiatrist, integrative mental health leader, psychedelic therapy researcher, and host of the Higher Practice Podcast. He is the co-founder of the Integrative Psychiatry Institute, which trains clinicians in cutting-edge trauma and psychedelic modalities.
Learn more:psychiatryinstitute.com
Instagram: @will.vanderveer.md
Facebook: @will.vanderveer.md

Resources & Offerings:

➡️ Free IFS Training for Therapists: From Burnout to Balance: https://go.johnclarketherapy.com/ifs-webinar-podcast
➡️ 1-Month Grace Period with Jane – Use code JOHN or visit: https://meet.jane.app/john-clarke-ambassador
➡️ 10% Off at Grounding Well – Use code GWJOHNCLARKE or visit: https://www.groundingwell.com/GWJOHNCLARKE
➡️ 10% Off at Dharma Dr. – Use code JOHN or visit: https://dharmadr.com/JOHN

Connect with me:

https://www.johnclarketherapy.com/
https://www.instagram.com/johnclarketherapy/
https://www.tiktok.com/@johnclarketherapy
https://www.youtube.com/@johnclarketherapy

Grab Your Seat for the Free IFS Webinar Here: https://go.johnclarketherapy.com/ifs-webinar-podcast

➡️ Free Training - Learn how to integrate the principles of IFS into your therapy practice: https://go.johnclarketherapy.com/ifs-webinar-podcast

In this special breakdown episode, John Clarke takes us inside a real IFS (Internal Family Systems) therapy session with a demo client named Sandra. With transparency and depth, John unpacks the nuances of their interaction, from checking in with previously unburdened parts to recognizing a live polarity between imagination and expectations. This session is packed with insights for both practitioners and those curious about the IFS model. Expect honest reflections, subtle therapeutic moves, and rich emotional terrain.

3 Key Takeaways:

1. Discover how a single metaphorical image—like a genie named "Jolly Jeanie"—can illuminate the gifts and limitations within our internal system.
2. Learn the signs of subtle therapist overreach and how honoring the client’s process can yield deeper transformation.
3. Hear how the root of a manager part’s strategy often stems from early unmet attachment needs, like being “what mom wants.”

Resources & Offerings:
➡️ Free IFS Training for Therapists: From Burnout to Balance: https://go.johnclarketherapy.com/ifs-webinar-podcast
➡️ 1-Month Grace Period with Jane – Use code JOHN or visit: https://meet.jane.app/john-clarke-ambassador
➡️ 10% Off at Grounding Well – Use code GWJOHNCLARKE or visit: https://www.groundingwell.com/GWJOHNCLARKE
➡️ 10% Off at Dharma Dr. – Use code JOHN or visit: https://dharmadr.com/JOHN

Connect with me:
 https://www.johnclarketherapy.com/
https://www.instagram.com/johnclarketherapy/
https://www.tiktok.com/@johnclarketherapy
https://www.youtube.com/@johnclarketherapy

Grab Your Seat for the Free IFS Webinar Here: https://go.johnclarketherapy.com/ifs-webinar-podcast

➡️ Free Training - Learn how to integrate the principles of IFS into your therapy practice: https://go.johnclarketherapy.com/ifs-webinar-podcast

What if healing trauma didn’t have to happen in an office—or even through traditional “talk therapy”? In this episode of Going Inside, John Clarke sits down with therapist Emmy Ferguson to explore how IFS (Internal Family Systems), nonviolent communication, and extended wilderness experiences can create profound healing and growth. Emmy shares her journey from leading month-long outdoor expeditions to becoming a therapist, and how she helps people unlock their emotional resilience by stepping into discomfort, conflict, and connection.

Whether you’re a therapist, a healer, or someone on your own growth journey, this episode invites you to rethink what therapy looks like—and where true transformation happens.

3 Key Takeaways:

1️⃣ Why Facing Real-Life Challenges Can Unlock Emotional Healing
 Discover how stepping into discomfort—whether in therapy or the wilderness—helps people reconnect with their strength and capacity for change.

2️⃣ The Healing Power of Conflict (When Done Right)
 Learn how nonviolent communication and group dynamics can transform conflict into connection and growth.

3️⃣ IFS as a Way of Life, Not Just a Therapy Tool
 Emmy shares how IFS interweaves with practices like embracing mortality, restorative circles, and outdoor leadership to create holistic healing.

Guest: Emmy Ferguson

Emmy Ferguson is a therapist who sees IFS as more than a therapeutic modality—it’s a daily practice of awakening to interconnection, healing, and aliveness. Her work is deeply informed by years of facilitating transformative wilderness expeditions, guiding restorative processes, and helping people embrace personal growth through challenge. Emmy helps clients access their inner healing capacity by integrating IFS with experiential learning and mindfulness around life’s impermanence.

Resources & Offerings:
➡️ Free IFS Training for Therapists: From Burnout to Balance: https://go.johnclarketherapy.com/ifs-webinar-podcast
➡️ 1-Month Grace Period with Jane – Use code JOHN or visit: https://meet.jane.app/john-clarke-ambassador
➡️ 10% Off at Grounding Well – Use code GWJOHNCLARKE or visit: https://www.groundingwell.com/GWJOHNCLARKE
➡️ 10% Off at Dharma Dr. – Use code JOHN or visit: https://dharmadr.com/JOHN

Connect with me:

https://www.johnclarketherapy.com/
https://www.instagram.com/johnclarketherapy/
https://www.tiktok.com/@johnclarketherapy
https://www.youtube.com/@johnclarketherapy

Grab Your Seat for the Free IFS Webinar Here: https://go.johnclarketherapy.com/ifs-webinar-podcast

➡️ Free Training - Learn how to integrate the principles of IFS into your therapy practice: https://go.johnclarketherapy.com/ifs-webinar-podcast

In this episode of Going Inside, trauma therapist John Clarke sits down with Debra Wesselmann, MS, LIMHP, to explore her decades of work with attachment trauma in children. Debra shares the evolution of her integrative model combining EMDR and family therapy, explains how to work effectively with kids carrying "little parts" of trauma inside, and highlights the critical role of parents in the healing process. Whether you're a clinician or a curious listener, this conversation offers valuable insights into the art and science of trauma therapy.

3 Key Takeaways:

🌱 Discover why traditional EMDR protocols often need adapting when working with children who have complex trauma.

🌱 Learn how involving parents and building a secure emotional environment is foundational before trauma reprocessing can even begin.

🌱 Hear how "little parts" work and therapeutic storytelling can unlock healing for kids long before adulthood.

🗣️ Guest: Debra Wesselmann, MS, LIMHP 

Debra co-founded The Attachment and Trauma Center of Nebraska where she has specialized in treating attachment trauma for 35 years. She's an EMDR trainer with the EMDR Institute and has authored numerous articles, chapters, and books including two co-authored with Francine Shapiro, Ph.D. Her latest book, EMDR and Family Therapy: Integrative Treatment for Attachment Trauma in Children (2nd Edition), is available through W.W. Norton, Amazon, or Barnes & Noble.

Website: DebraWesselmann.com
Instagram: @debra.wesselmann.EMDR
LinkedIn: Debra Wesselmann
Facebook: Debra Wesselmann, MS, LIMHP

Resources & Offerings:

➡️ Free IFS Training for Therapists: From Burnout to Balance: https://go.johnclarketherapy.com/ifs-webinar-yt
➡️ Download my FREE IFS Resource Library - Get access here: https://go.johnclarketherapy.com/ifs-resource-library
➡️ Free IFS Training for Therapists: From Burnout to Balance: https://go.johnclarketherapy.com/ifs-webinar-podcast
➡️ 1-Month Grace Period with Jane – Use code JOHN or visit: https://meet.jane.app/john-clarke-ambassador
➡️ 10% Off at Grounding Well – Use code GWJOHNCLARKE or visit: https://www.groundingwell.com/GWJOHNCLARKE
➡️ 10% Off at Dharma Dr. – Use code JOHN or visit: https://dharmadr.com/JOHN

Connect with me:
https://www.johnclarketherapy.com/
https://www.instagram.com/johnclarketherapy/
https://www.tiktok.com/@johnclarketherapy
https://www.youtube.com/@johnclarketherapy

Transcript

Debra Wesselman: [00:00:00] And the other, the other piece I think that's really critical is. These kids with this complex trauma, just like the adults, they have littler parts inside.

They may be five, but they may have a 2-year-old

Grab Your Seat for the Free IFS Webinar Here: https://go.johnclarketherapy.com/ifs-webinar-podcast

➡️ Free Training - Learn how to integrate the principles of IFS into your therapy practice: https://go.johnclarketherapy.com/ifs-webinar-podcast

In this special breakdown episode, John Clarke takes us inside a real IFS (Internal Family Systems) therapy session with a demo client named Sandra. With transparency and depth, John unpacks the nuances of their interaction, from checking in with previously unburdened parts to recognizing a live polarity between imagination and expectations. This session is packed with insights for both practitioners and those curious about the IFS model. Expect honest reflections, subtle therapeutic moves, and rich emotional terrain.

3 Key Takeaways:

✔️ Discover how a single metaphorical image—like a genie named "Jolly Jeanie"—can illuminate the gifts and limitations within our internal system.

✔️ Learn the signs of subtle therapist overreach and how honoring the client’s process can yield deeper transformation.

✔️ Hear how the root of a manager part’s strategy often stems from early unmet attachment needs, like being “what mom wants.”

Resources & Offerings:
➡️ Download my FREE IFS Resource Library - Get access here: https://go.johnclarketherapy.com/ifs-resource-library
➡️Free Training - Learn how to integrate the principles of IFS into your therapy practice: https://go.johnclarketherapy.com/ifs-webinar-podcast
➡️ 1-Month Grace Period with Jane – Use code JOHN or visit: https://meet.jane.app/john-clarke-ambassador
➡️ 10% Off at Grounding Well – Use code GWJOHNCLARKE or visit: https://www.groundingwell.com/GWJOHNCLARKE
➡️ 10% Off at Dharma Dr. – Use code JOHN or visit: https://dharmadr.com/JOHN

Connect with me:
https://www.johnclarketherapy.com/
https://www.instagram.com/johnclarketherapy/
https://www.tiktok.com/@johnclarketherapy
https://www.youtube.com/@johnclarketherapy

Grab Your Seat for the Free IFS Webinar Here: https://go.johnclarketherapy.com/ifs-webinar-podcast