Meet two of my awesome mates, Pietra Brettkelly and Sandy Burgham, who are two fabulous wāhine living life to the beat of their own drums, and saying No to the script society says women need to follow. So I thought it'd be bloody good fun to sit down and swap stories, and find out what makes their brave risk-taking brains tick.

Pietra is a documentary film-maker whose body of work includes Yellow is Forbidden and The Art Star and the Sudanese Twins. She is a member of The Academy of Motion Pictures Arts and Sciences (yes, she was at this year's Oscars!), and was recently named an Arts Laureate of New Zealand. She also cycled for almost two hours to get to our interview!

At the age of 50, Sandy quit her high-powered corporate job and decided to go back to uni, design an app, write a blog and so much more. In 2016, founded Play CoLab - a collaborative practice deeply invested in innovative approaches to systemic, organisational and personal transformation. 

Song credit: Korimako, Performed by Aro, Written by Emily Looker and Charles Looker and published by Songbroker.

Support the show: https://greyareas.nz/support

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices