This is the final episode of the 4-part series, 2 am Pep Talks. You can check out Part 1, Part 2, and Part 3 by clicking these links. Today’s episode is all about hope! It is essential to understand that this season of early morning wake-up times will pass. Sleeping through the night again will happen for you, even though you may wonder now if you will ever sleep enough to feel like yourself again. A perinatal mood and anxiety disorder can increase the likelihood of thoughts filled with self-judgment, negativity, and hopelessness. Having to attend to the middle-of-the-night details of infant care can, even without PMADs, leave you feeling wrung out, tired, and isolated. It’s hard to maintain hope that this phase will shift when you are in the middle of it. Believe me, with time, practice, and support, everything will get easier, but it’s often difficult to see through to the other side. Join me for today’s discussion.

Show Highlights:

Identify one thing you are looking forward to in the morning–even if it’s just that first cup of coffee!

Nighttime care can feel monotonous and never-ending.

Look at all the things you’ve learned!

Take encouragement from other moms who can validate your experiences.

Learn to validate your own feelings.

Resilience and growth are yours to claim and honor.

Tips for that middle-of-the-night time:

Use visualizations and affirmations.

Assure yourself that you are learning, shifting, and growing.

Be gentle with yourself. You are doing better than you think!

Resources:

Call the National Maternal Mental Health Hotline at 1-833-TLC-MAMA or visitcdph.ca.gov.

Please find resources in English and Spanish at Postpartum Support International, or by phone/text at 1-800-944-4773. 

There are many free resources, like online support groups, peer mentors, a specialist provider directory, and perinatal mental health training for therapists, physicians, nurses, doulas, and anyone who wants to be more supportive in offering services.

You can also follow PSI on social media: Instagram, Facebook, and most other platforms.

Visit www.postpartum.net/professionals/certificate-trainings/for information on the grief course. 

Visit my website, www.wellmindperinatal.com, for more information, resources, and courses you can take today! 

If you are a California resident seeking a therapist in perinatal mental health, please email me about openings for private pay clients.

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Today’s topic centers around a book written by my guest, Dr. Margo Lowy. She has researched and written about maternal ambivalence, including how to understand it and why it remains a taboo subject. We will discuss destigmatizing uncomfortable feelings and normalize the understanding that motherhood is not “all or nothing.” We’ll cover the darker emotions of anger, guilt, and resentment, and we'll refute the myth of “the perfect mother” and recognize that motherhood can be viewed in different ways. Join us to learn more!

Dr. Margo Lowy is a psychotherapist specializing in mothering. She is the author of Maternal Ambivalence: The Loving Moments and Bitter Truths of Motherhood and her previous book, The Maternal Experience: Encounters with Ambivalence and Love. Dr. Lowy earned her doctorate from the University of South Wales in Sydney, Australia, and she has spoken on maternal ambivalence at universities and in media interviews worldwide. She is a columnist for Psychology Today, a member of PEN America, and a former advisor to the founder of the Australian Jewish Fertility Network (AJFN). As a mom of three adult children, she makes her home in NYC with her husband. 

Show Highlights:

Understanding maternal ambivalence and ALL the associated emotions

Motherhood, at its essence, involves complicated feelings.

Unrealistic expectations of mothers

In motherhood, we ONLY learn by making mistakes and repairing them.

Mothering means we make mistakes and learn from them.

Perfection is an impossible, rigid goal; we need humor and laughter in motherhood.

Children seeing us encounter challenges and NOT being perfect

Importance of discernment in social media messages

Finding your team and community

Emulating our mothers vs. finding our own mothering style 

When it’s hard to give yourself a pat on the back

Understanding the value of difficult emotions

Indicators of maternal ambivalence

An example of advocating for YOUR motherhood journey

Dr. Lowy’s practical advice to mothers

Resources:

Connect with Dr. Margo Lowy

 Website, Instagram

Dr. Lowy’s Books 

Maternal Ambivalence: The Loving Moments and Bitter Truths of Motherhood

The Maternal Experience: Encounters with Ambivalence and Love

Call the National Maternal Mental Health Hotline at 1-833-TLC-MAMA or visitcdph.ca.gov.

Please find resources in English and Spanish at Postpartum Support International, or by phone/text at 1-800-944-4773. 

There are many free resources, like online support groups, peer mentors, a specialist provider directory, and perinatal mental health training for therapists, physicians, nurses, doulas, and anyone who wants to be more supportive in offering services.

You can also follow PSI on social media: Instagram, Facebook, and most other platforms.

Visit www.postpartum.net/professionals/certificate-trainings/for information on the grief course. 

Visit my website, www.wellmindperinatal.com, for more information, resources, and courses you can take today! 

If you are a California resident seeking a therapist in perinatal mental health, please email me about openings for private pay clients

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

I’m honored to interview Jaimie Kelton for today’s episode. She shares interesting parts of her journey as a queer parent, discusses elements of queer family building, and opens up about her three-year infertility journey as a queer woman. Her motherhood story includes birth trauma and postpartum anxiety. As a podcast host, Jaimie explains how hearing from the guests on her show has helped her on her healing journey. 

Jaimie Kelton hosts The Queer Family Podcast, an award-winning show that uplifts and normalizes LGBTQIA+ families by sharing real, candid, and often hilarious stories about queer family building. She is a Webby Honoree and was named one of GO Magazine’s “100 Women We Love.” Jaimie has also been named one of Podcast Magazine’s “Top 50 Moms in Podcasting.” Her work has been featured in The Washington Post, People, Parents Magazine, and more. She is the co-author of If These Ovaries Could Talk: The Things We've Learned About Making an LGBTQ Family. A longtime performer, queer mom, and outspoken advocate, Jaimie brings humor and heart to every conversation about parenting, visibility, and justice for LGBTQ families. 

Show Highlights:

Jaimie’s family-building journey for her and her wife to have two children, making a lot of decisions quickly

The logistics of each of them carrying a child, which meant multiple IUI and IVF cycles for Jaimie to get pregnant

Switching doctors and clinics: why it was refreshing to change things up

Differences in clinics for LGBTQIA+ families and non-LGBTQIA+ families

Jaimie’s philosophy of “gay drafting”and how it works for queer families

The not-so-simple process of filling out paperwork for their babies’ birth certificates

Jaimie’s relatively easy pregnancy and the traumatic birth of her son via emergency C-section

Postpartum struggles with severe anxiety and fears about her son dying

Feeling “out of control” and stuck when you know you should be grateful

Parenting with “a little more than normal” worry and fears

Jaimie’s podcast topics, which allow her to learn and experience healing from hearing other people’s stories

Resources:

Connect with Jaimie Kelton: Website, Instagram, TikTok, The Queer Family Podcast, and If These Ovaries Could Talk: The Things We've Learned About Making an LGBTQ Family

Call the National Maternal Mental Health Hotline at 1-833-TLC-MAMA or visitcdph.ca.gov.

Please find resources in English and Spanish at Postpartum Support International, or by phone/text at 1-800-944-4773. 

There are many free resources, like online support groups, peer mentors, a specialist provider directory, and perinatal mental health training for therapists, physicians, nurses, doulas, and anyone who wants to be more supportive in offering services.

You can also follow PSI on social media: Instagram, Facebook, and most other platforms.

Visit www.postpartum.net/professionals/certificate-trainings/for information on the grief course. 

Visit my website, www.wellmindperinatal.com, for more information, resources, and courses you can take today! 

If you are a California resident seeking a therapist in perinatal mental health, please email me about openings for private pay clients. 

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

In Part 1 of this series, we discussed how heavy and burdensome things can feel in the middle of the night when you are alone with your baby, struggling to function and feeling exhausted. 

In Part 2, we ventured into what it’s like when anxiety and intrusive thoughts pop up in the middle of the night. Today’s focus is on the importance of taking care of YOU, even in the middle of the night. You could feel “touched out” and overwhelmed, forgetting that you need self-care, too. You need to actively and intentionally have a plan. Let’s explore this topic further!

Show Highlights:

Your options in the middle of the night may be limited. 

Think ahead and plan for water/snacks while taking care of the baby. Have them available nearby.

Consider your personal comfort: blankets, socks, a sweater, or a small fan

Plan for other options for music/noise besides doom-scrolling on your phone.

After tending to the baby's needs, do some gentle stretches to help your neck, shoulders, and arms relax and release tension.

“Are there small do-able things I can do to inject a little more self-care and attention into that hour or so in the middle of the night?”

The magic in a slow, deep breath in and out to regulate your nervous system

Feeling physically tired and “wired” at the same time

Self-care is NOT selfish!

Enlist your partner to help—before bedtime. (Dr. Kat shares tips about asking for help in the right way.)

If you have that feeling of dread about the middle of the night, find one thing that brings you comfort and calm; add it into your middle-of-the-night practice.

Consider using affirmations and meditation for grounding and self-compassion.

Give yourself the same kindness that you would give to a friend. 

Resources:

Call the National Maternal Mental Health Hotline at 1-833-TLC-MAMA or visitcdph.ca.gov.

Please find resources in English and Spanish at Postpartum Support International, or by phone/text at 1-800-944-4773. 

There are many free resources, like online support groups, peer mentors, a specialist provider directory, and perinatal mental health training for therapists, physicians, nurses, doulas, and anyone who wants to be more supportive in offering services.

You can also follow PSI on social media, including Instagram, Facebook, and other platforms.

Visit www.postpartum.net/professionals/certificate-trainings/for information on the grief course. 

Visit my website, www.wellmindperinatal.com, for more information, resources, and courses you can take today! 

If you are a California resident seeking a therapist in perinatal mental health, please email me about openings for private pay clients. 

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

In this episode, I’m excited to be joined by Emily Harrington, one of the most successful and versatile professional climbers in the world. Emily discusses the pressure of failure and perfectionism in motherhood, pregnancy, and postpartum, which are common experiences among mothers. Join us to hear this beautiful conversation about life at the intersection of motherhood and elite athleticism in a largely male-dominated sport.

Emily Harrington is a five-time US National Champion, has completed numerous first female ascents of 5.14 routes, summited Mt. Everest, and made a complete ski descent of Cho Oyu, the world’s sixth-tallest peak. She made history when she became the first woman to free-climb “Golden Gate on El Capitan in under 24 hours. The movie about Emily’s career, Girl Climber, is screening at IMAX theaters and various cinemas through the end of the year. It will be available on JOLT starting on October 15 and will be available for full streaming in November. Emily currently resides in Tahoe City, CA, where she spends her time training, climbing, and skiing with her husband and young son. 

Show Highlights:

Common assumptions about what moms “can/can’t” do

Emily’s journey as a climber, which started at age 10

Thinking about having a baby as a natural part of life

The 7-year plan to climb El Capitan—and then have a baby

A plan for modified climbing and running as her pregnant body changed

Approaching pregnancy from a place of curiosity

Feeling unprepared for what came after childbirth

Breastfeeding and sleep challenges—and dealing with unsolicited advice

Emily’s way of dealing with others’ judgments and comparisons

Parallels between climbing and motherhood

Letting go of perfection to find more peace

“Enjoying the struggle and embracing failure”

Girl Climber: how it tells the story that we all go through failure, and we can show that with honesty and vulnerability

Climbing: a sport that is growing in popularity and accessibility

What Emily wants other moms to know

Resources:

Connect with Emily Harrington: Instagram and the screening schedule for Girl Climber

Call the National Maternal Mental Health Hotline at 1-833-TLC-MAMA or visitcdph.ca.gov.

Please find resources in English and Spanish at Postpartum Support International, or by phone/text at 1-800-944-4773. 

There are many free resources, like online support groups, peer mentors, a specialist provider directory, and perinatal mental health training for therapists, physicians, nurses, doulas, and anyone who wants to be more supportive in offering services.

You can also follow PSI on social media, including Instagram, Facebook, and other platforms.

Visit www.postpartum.net/professionals/certificate-trainings/for information on the grief course. 

Visit my website, www.wellmindperinatal.com, for more information, resources, and courses you can take today! 

If you are a California resident seeking a therapist in perinatal mental health, please email me about openings for private pay clients. 

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Our conversation today is on the recent FDA panel about the safety of antidepressants during pregnancy—and all the ways the panel got it wrong. It’s not just about wrong information, but it’s about the harm that wrong information does to people in the perinatal period. Join us to learn more about why this information from the FDA is so dangerous to women. 

Dr. Catherine Birndorf is a reproductive psychiatrist and the CEO, founder, and medical director of The Motherhood Center of New York. Dr. Birndorf is a founding director of the Payne Whitney Women’s Program at Weill Cornell Medical Center at New York-Presbyterian Hospital, where she is a clinical associate professor of psychiatry. A graduate of Smith College, Dr. Birndorf attended Brown University Medical School and did her psychiatry residency at New York-Presbyterian Hospital. For 10 years, Dr. Birndorf was a regular mental health columnist for Self Magazine and appeared on numerous television programs, including the Today Show, Good Morning America, MSNBC, and CNN. Her most recent book, What No One Tells You: A Guide to Your Emotions from Pregnancy to Motherhood, was published by Simon & Schuster in 2019.

Show Highlights:

Dr. Birndorf’s perspective on the FDA panel and their decisions: “I knew this was a disaster in the making.”

The FDA panel was made up of 10 “experts” (8 men/2 women) who were biased and stacked against medication and mental illness.

Women have been suffering, and they continue to suffer.

The work of The Motherhood Center in supporting women who need help through mental illness

The potential for harm is HUGE.

 What Dr. Birndorf wants people to know about mental illness and life-saving medications

Dr. Birndorf’s motivation to start The Motherhood Center

Highlights of the support provided for women through The Motherhood Center

The ways we “mother” have impacts on the generations to come; no mother should suffer with mental illness when transformation is possible.

The Motherhood Center focuses on all the therapies and interventions that bring wellness, not just medications. 

Resources:

Connect with Dr. Catherine Birndorf: Website, Instagram, Facebook, and What No One Tells You: A Guide to Your Emotions from Pregnancy to Motherhood

Call the National Maternal Mental Health Hotline at 1-833-TLC-MAMA or visitcdph.ca.gov.

Please find resources in English and Spanish at Postpartum Support International, or by phone/text at 1-800-944-4773. 

There are many free resources, like online support groups, peer mentors, a specialist provider directory, and perinatal mental health training for therapists, physicians, nurses, doulas, and anyone who wants to be more supportive in offering services.

You can also follow PSI on social media, including Instagram, Facebook, and other platforms.

Visit www.postpartum.net/professionals/certificate-trainings/for information on the grief course. 

Visit my website, www.wellmindperinatal.com, for more information, resources, and courses you can take today! 
If you are a California resident seeking a therapist in perinatal mental health, please email me about openings for private pay clients.

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Today, I’m bringing you the second part of my 2 am Pep Talk. This time, I’m really focusing on supporting new parents, especially those of you who might be feeling anxious, lonely, or dealing with those tough, intrusive thoughts that can pop up during pregnancy or after having a baby. I know those quiet, late-night hours can make everything feel even more overwhelming, and I want you to know you’re not alone in that.

I’m discussing setting aside “worry time” to help manage anxious thoughts, using thought labeling to get some distance from those worries, practicing grounding exercises to stay present, and I even guide you through a relaxing body scan technique to help calm both your mind and body.

Your feelings are valid, and there are fundamental, actionable strategies you can use to navigate the ups and downs of perinatal mental health. Tune in to hear more!

Show Highlights:

Emotional challenges faced by new parents during pregnancy and after childbirth

Feelings of loneliness, anxiety, intrusive thoughts, and exhaustion

Normalization of negative feelings and experiences in new parenthood

Practical coping strategies for managing anxiety and intrusive thoughts

Techniques such as "worry time" and labeling anxious thoughts

Grounding exercises, including the 5-4-3-2-1 method

Importance of seeking support and recognizing when to reach out for help

Impact of sleep deprivation and hormonal changes on mental health

The significance of mindfulness and relaxation techniques, such as body scans

Encouragement and reassurance for new parents navigating perinatal mental health challenges

Resources:

Call the National Maternal Mental Health Hotline at 1-833-TLC-MAMA or visit cdph.ca.gov

Please find resources in English and Spanish at Postpartum Support International, or by phone/text at 1-800-944-4773. There are many free resources, like online support groups, peer mentors, a specialist provider directory, and perinatal mental health training for therapists, physicians, nurses, doulas, and anyone who wants to be more supportive in offering services. 

You can also follow PSI on social media: Instagram, Facebook, and most other platforms

Visit www.postpartum.net/professionals/certificate-trainings/ for information on the grief course.  

Visit my website, www.wellmindperinatal.com, for more information, resources, and courses you can take today!

If you are a California resident seeking a therapist in perinatal mental health, please email me about openings for private pay clients.

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Maternal rage is, unfortunately, more common than we want to think. The worst part is that not many people are talking about it, which only adds to the stigma and misunderstanding. New mothers are led to believe that they shouldn’t feel rage and anger, and they are shamed when they do. We are uncovering maternal rage, exploring how and why it manifests, and what can be done about it. Join us to learn more!

Nicole McNelis is a licensed mental health therapist and a specialist in perinatal mental health counseling. She is the founder of an award-winning counseling private practice in the suburbs of Philadelphia, where she resides with her family. She has been featured as a mental health expert in print publications, online media, books, and podcasts, and she serves as a subject matter expert and conference presenter for Postpartum Support International. Nicole is passionate about serving the perinatal mental health community through life transitions, big and small. 

Show Highlights:

Understanding maternal rage

Nicole’s belief is that EVERY mom experiences maternal rage at some point.

The “completely unrealistic, nonsensical, and harmful expectations” that we have of mothers in our society

A mother’s experience of injustice, both systemically and in her household

Nicole’s experience and journey with mom rage during the pandemic

The correlation between mom rage, depression, and anxiety

An overloaded system that cannot take any more

When rage is a rational response to what you’re experiencing in your environment

Ways in which rage commonly shows up: the buildup, the explosion, and the aftermath

Individual and system strategies that are sustainable

Recognizing the “season” you’re in helps customize the interventions and strategies.

The two broad factors contributing to mom rage: compromised needs and violated expectations 

Changing our language around sharing household and family labor between partners

Nicole’s two-pronged approach to acknowledging and easing mom rage through individual interventions and strategies

ALL of the responsibility should not be put on the mother!

Nicole’s “rupture and repair” strategy of parenting 

Nicole’s takeaways: “It’s not a meltdown; it’s a message.”

Resources:

Connect with Nicole McNelis: Website and Instagram

Call the National Maternal Mental Health Hotline at 1-833-TLC-MAMA or visit cdph.ca.gov

Please find resources in English and Spanish at Postpartum Support International, or by phone/text at 1-800-944-4773. There are many free resources, like online support groups, peer mentors, a specialist provider directory, and perinatal mental health training for therapists, physicians, nurses, doulas, and anyone who wants to be more supportive in offering services. 

You can also follow PSI on social media: Instagram, Facebook, and most other platforms

Visit www.postpartum.net/professionals/certificate-trainings/ for information on the grief course.  

Visit my website, www.wellmindperinatal.com, for more information, resources, and courses you can take today!

If you are a California resident seeking a therapist in perinatal mental health, please email me about openings for private pay clients.

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

This episode explores how doulas integrate themselves into the healthcare system to enhance outcomes for mothers, families, and babies. There are countless benefits to hiring a doula to improve the pregnancy, birth, and postpartum experience. Join us to learn more!

HeHe Stewart is a leading childbirth educator, advocate, and maternity care reform expert. With a master’s in human development and over a decade of experience, she empowers families with evidence-based birth prep, informed decision-making, and postpartum readiness. She is a fierce advocate for informed consent, reducing unnecessary interventions, and ensuring patient autonomy in birth. Beyond working with families, HeHe is actively involved in legislative efforts to improve women’s health policies and expand access to midwifery care. She works to reform maternity care by advocating for patient rights, increased birth options, and improved mental health outcomes. As the host of The Birth Lounge Podcast, HeHe interviews leading experts in women’s health, pregnancy, and newborn development, giving parents the knowledge they need to navigate birth and postpartum with confidence. Her work continues to drive meaningful change through education, advocacy, and policy reform. 

Show Highlights:

HeHe’s path to this work–a continual emphasis on advocacy

Birth doulas and postpartum doulas: What they do and how they help

A doula is beneficial for every pregnancy and birth, offering unique care.

The intimate relationship between doula and client (“I have a cheerleader who will advocate for me.”)

The benefits of a birth doula result in reduced risks and problems.

HeHe’s role in “pausing the room and giving space” for the patient to ask questions of the healthcare providers

The big lesson for healthcare providers: The person who’s giving birth will never forget how you make them feel in their experience. 

When a doula notices problems and needs to intervene

Doing better for women in pregnancy and the postpartum

What HeHe wants women to know about self-advocacy

Resources:

Connect with HeHe Stewart: The Birth Lounge, Tranquility by HeHe, The Birth Lounge Instagram, Tranquility by HeHe Instagram, and The Birth Lounge App (available from the Apple App Store and Google Play)

Call the National Maternal Mental Health Hotline at 1-833-TLC-MAMA or visit cdph.ca.gov

Please find resources in English and Spanish at Postpartum Support International, or by phone/text at 1-800-944-4773. There are many free resources, like online support groups, peer mentors, a specialist provider directory, and perinatal mental health training for therapists, physicians, nurses, doulas, and anyone who wants to be more supportive in offering services. 

You can also follow PSI on social media: Instagram, Facebook, and most other platforms

Visit www.postpartum.net/professionals/certificate-trainings/ for information on the grief course.  

Visit my website, www.wellmindperinatal.com, for more information, resources, and courses you can take today!

If you are a California resident looking for a therapist in perinatal mental health, email me about openings for private pay clients!

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

We are starting something different today that will carry through the next few Behind the Sessions episodes. I’m tackling those “middle-of-the-night” feelings during pregnancy and the postpartum. Nighttime can bring feelings of dread and loneliness that mothers experience as a heaviness, and all of this can magnify and intensify any perinatal mood and anxiety disorders to make life very challenging for a sleep-deprived parent. You are not alone, and there is a whole community of people experiencing the same things. Think of these subsequent few sessions as your “2 am pep talk.” Join me now!

Show Highlights:

The importance of connection

Sleep deprivation makes everything darker.

You may feel like you’re doing everything wrong.

You are doing a LOT while giving love and care to your baby.

You aren’t a bad mother if you don’t LOVE middle-of-the-night care.

Don’t judge yourself because of how you feel at 2 am.

The next few episodes will include coping skills for the middle of the night.

Join me for a guided visualization to ease your feelings of isolation.

Join me for self-compassion affirmations to try today.

Resources:

Call the National Maternal Mental Health Hotline at 1-833-TLC-MAMA or visit cdph.ca.gov

Please find resources in English and Spanish at Postpartum Support International, or by phone/text at 1-800-944-4773. There are many free resources, like online support groups, peer mentors, a specialist provider directory, and perinatal mental health training for therapists, physicians, nurses, doulas, and anyone who wants to be more supportive in offering services. 

You can also follow PSI on social media: Instagram, Facebook, and most other platforms.

Visit www.postpartum.net/professionals/certificate-trainings/ for information on the grief course.  

Visit my website, www.wellmindperinatal.com, for more information, resources, and courses you can take today!

If you are a California resident looking for a therapist in perinatal mental health, email me about openings for private pay clients!

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices