Summary

In this episode, Andy talks with Sabina Nawaz, global CEO coach and former Microsoft executive, about her new book You're the Boss: Become the Manager You Want to Be and Others Need. With authenticity and insight, Sabina shares what no one tells you about stepping into management, from the strange emptiness that can follow a promotion to how pressure can quietly bring out the worst in us.

They discuss why even successful leaders can feel like imposters, how power and pressure distort our perceptions, and what it means to be an “innocent saboteur.” Sabina also offers practical advice, such as developing your “shut up muscle,” asking better questions, and making small habit changes that stick. The conversation covers everything from leadership in the workplace to parenting, making this one of those rare episodes with takeaways for every area of life.

If you're looking for insights on how to grow as a leader without losing yourself in the process, this episode is for you!

Sound Bites

• “It’s not power that corrupts. It’s pressure that corrupts.”
• “If nobody’s giving you the full truth, what are the ways you might be going off track?”
• “When you're under pressure, do nothing. That’s counterintuitive but that’s where insight lives.”
• “The more righteous you feel, the more you need to consider alternative stories.”
• “Use 'Say more' when you're curious—and especially when you're judgmental.”
• “The only way to overachieve is to underachieve—start with micro habits.”
• “You’re not the only one with imposter syndrome—CEOs have it too.”

Chapters

• 00:00 Introduction
• 02:15 Start of Interview
• 02:24 “Can you think of anything from your family culture or experiences growing up that may have influenced how you think about leadership?”
• 05:08 “You describe getting promoted as a strange emptiness—what were the signs it came with unexpected costs?”
• 07:17 “Do you see imposter syndrome even in top-level leaders you coach?”
• 08:21 “How does embracing the complexity of leadership change how we view our own leaders?”
• 10:04 “How do we unknowingly sabotage ourselves as leaders?”
• 12:09 “What are some of the signs that you're veering off track as a boss?”
• 13:10 “What specific things do you personally do to manage pressure situations so you don’t become a monster?”
• 17:13 “You say, ‘stay small longer than you think you need to.' What does that mean and how do you apply it?”
• 21:07 “What is a singular story and how do we rescue ourselves from believing them?”
• 26:20 “What’s the ‘shut up muscle’ and how do you develop it?”
• 29:02 “Can you think of ideas from the book that apply to parenting as well?”
• 31:44 End of Interview
• 32:09 Andy Comments After the Interview
• 37:40 Outtakes

Learn More

You can learn more about Sabina and her work at SabinaNawaz.com/book.

For more learning on this topic, check out:

• Episode 455 with Janet Polach. It’s a great follow-on to what we talked with Sabina here today.
• Episode 456 with Kevin Eikenberry. Leading at the next level up comes with a lot of ambiguity that can shake our confidence. Kevin hits that topic head on—I think you’ll get value out of it.
• Episode 391 with Adam Bryant about his book The Leap to Leader.

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Thank you for joining me for this episode of The People and Projects Podcast!

Talent Triangle: Power Skills

Topics: Leadership, Management, Power Dynamics, Self-Awareness, Feedback, Emotional Intelligence, Coaching, Communication, Organizational Culture, Habits, Imposter Syndrome, Pressure, Stress

The following music was used for this episode:

Music: Brooklyn Nights by Tim Kulig License (CC BY 4.0): https://filmmusic.io/standard-license

Music: Chillhouse by Frank Schroeter License (CC BY 4.0): https://filmmusic.io/standard-license