Sign up to save your podcasts
Or
Share The Balancing Act: Nurturing Teens While Letting Go with Esther Joy Goetz
Share to email
Share to Facebook
Share to X
Share to email
Share to Facebook
Share to X
Or
The Balancing Act: Nurturing Teens While Letting Go with Esther Joy Goetz
Parenting teens is a tricky balancing act—nurturing your child while letting them go. Every parent hopes their teen grows into a confident, capable adult who makes good choices and chases their dreams. But there's always the fear of them making big mistakes or getting hurt along the way. Esther Joy Goetz, author, speaker, and the force behind the popular Moms of Bigs social media community, is here to help us navigate this challenge.
Esther's insights will empower you to find that balance between nurturing and letting go, while focusing on long-term, healthy relationships with your teens. She’ll also share what inspired her to create the Moms of Bigs community—a lifeline for moms of teens and young adults who are facing similar struggles.
WHAT YOU'LL LEARN IN THIS EPISODE
• How to create a safe space that allows your teen to explore their individuality
• Why healthy boundaries are key to building trust and respect
• How to balance nurturing with letting go while maintaining a strong connection
• Tips for connecting with your teen without expectations or pressure
5 KEY TAKEAWAYS FOR PARENTS OF TEENS
🎧❤️ ENJOYING THE SHOW?
Don’t keep it to yourself! Share your favorite episode and leave a rating and review to help other parents find the support they need. Your feedback helps me create even more episodes filled with practical tips for you and your family! Thanks so much for your support! 🙏💫
🔔 Remember to hit Follow so you never miss another solution-packed episode! 🙌
RESOURCES MENTIONED IN THIS EPISODE
EPISODE CHAPTERS:
CONNECT WITH OUR GUEST: Esther Joy Goetz
CONNECT WITH YOUR HOST: Dr. Cam Caswell
FULL TRANSCRIPT
Dr. Cam (00:01.297)
Hello parents, Dr. Cam here. As parents, we hope our kids grow up confident and capable. We want them to make good choices and chase their dreams, but we’re also worried they’ll make big mistakes or even get hurt. That’s why I’m so excited to have Esther Joy Goetz here today. Esther is an author, speaker, and the force behind the popular Moms of Bigs social media community. She’s here to help us find that balance between nurturing our teens and letting them go. Esther, welcome to the show.
Esther Joy Goetz (00:32.526)
Thank you. I’m so excited to be here. And just when you said that, I thought, hmm, that’s the tricky tightrope of parenting teens.
Dr. Cam (00:42.353)
It really, really is. Let’s start with a quick backstory. What inspired you to launch Moms of Bigs?
Esther Joy Goetz (00:52.942)
Well, my daughter said to me, “Mom, you need to...” She’s so funny; she thinks that I have some wisdom. What really happened was, when she graduated high school, she said, “Mom, there are so many people out there that really don’t know how to do the mom gig well, especially moms of teens.” How can they know? I thought, well, I don’t know if I’m the answer to that, but I had two older friends who guided me along and continue to guide me. I realized there was nothing out there on social media for this stage—nothing. I couldn’t find a thing. I thought, “Why don’t I give out what I actually need?”
A lot of times, our passion is born from what we needed. There’s plenty of advice on breastfeeding and how to handle toddlers, but once they hit the teen years, it’s sparse. Or it feels very formulaic—“Do these three things, and you’ll have a magic relationship with your teen.” I was like, “Yeah, I know.” I felt like my teens were some of my greatest teachers, and that’s the posture I wanted to take. Plus, all the mom emotions. You mentioned the big one—fear. No one was really talking about what to do with those emotions in the meantime. That’s really where I focused—on those motherhood emotions.
Dr. Cam (03:03.665)
I think that’s so important. I was finding the same thing. When parents are new, it feels comfortable to ask for advice. You go to a baby shower and people offer advice. But once you have teens, you feel like you should know, but it’s a whole new skill set. Plus, a whole new emotional package we don’t even know how to deal with. Fear and worry, I think, are two of the biggest ones. Is that what you’re seeing as well? Guilt—my goodness.
Esther Joy Goetz (03:41.07)
Guilt, fear, worry—and I think grief and sadness. Those are the three uncomfortable emotions. We have more comfortable ones too, like joy—watching them become their own people, having exciting conversations, and celebrating things like their sports achievements or academic success. But the uncomfortable emotions, like the letting-go process and anticipatory grief, come into play a lot. And I think with fear, it’s the loss of control.
When they’re young, you think you can control them. But once they hit the teen years, the illusion of control disappears. You’re left with fear and worry.
Dr. Cam (04:49.521)
Yeah, I see this now with parents, especially with technology—GPS, tracking apps, all these things. Parents send their kids off to high school or college, but they’re still micromanaging, tracking everything. It’s all driven by fear and worry. How do we make sure our kids have the freedom they need? Because I think that’s where the biggest conflict comes from—parents holding on too tight. How do we navigate the balance between keeping them safe and giving them the freedom to experience life?
Esther Joy Goetz (05:34.798)
The good news is we don’t have to give blanket freedom immediately. We’ve been giving them little bits of freedom all along. When you experience that pushback, there needs to be a conversation with your child. Communication is key during the teenage years. They need to be part of the conversation, and they have a massive voice in their own life.
My tagline is giving our kids the roots of unconditional love and the wings of freedom to be completely themselves. And the safety aspect—it’s something we have to come to grips with. Can we keep them “safe”? What does that even mean? You can keep them physically safe, but they could still be emotionally crippled. If we focus only on physical safety, we emotionally stunt them. My kids have told me this: “You’re emotionally stunting me. I can’t even make a mistake or figure out what I like or don’t like.”
There are different kinds of safety we’re talking about here. My job is to be a safe space for them.
Dr. Cam (07:23.825)
What does that mean?
Esther Joy Goetz (07:26.158)
My job as a mom is to create a safe space. That means I create a physically safe home—no abuse, no bullying, no judgment. There’s empathy. It’s a place of unconditional love, no strings attached. That’s the “roots of unconditional love.”
If I’m a safe space, I’m creating a soft place for them to land. But there’s also that idea I love where it says, “Ships are not made to stay in the harbor. Ships are made to go out—sometimes into beautiful waters, sometimes into treacherous ones. But the design of the ship is to manage all of that. They’re not designed to stay safe in the harbor.”
Dr. Cam (08:35.505)
Right. They wouldn't have much of a life if their job is to make sure we feel that they're safe. If their job is to protect us from our fear and worry, that stunts them. I see that a lot without parents realizing it. The kids push back really hard, and parents see that as disrespect when, in truth, the parents aren't really respecting the kids' individuality. That's a tough one.
Esther Joy Goetz (09:05.838)
You said something key there: we are responsible for our own emotions. They are not responsible for ours. One of the interesting things that happened with my son, a senior, was that he didn’t want a curfew. I said to him, "Look, I'm afraid when you're out past midnight. I own that—you're not responsible for that, but I have to get up and go to work." Part of living here means this is going to be a conversation we have back and forth. It's about respecting me and the stage I’m in—I'm not there yet. I haven’t fully let go and allowed you to just run around the world. I want you to know the emotions I'm experiencing—you're not responsible for those, but I'm dealing with them myself, in fits and starts. For now, when you're in high school, we’d like you to come home by midnight. If there are any issues surrounding that, just communicate with us the same way I would if I wasn’t going to show up when I said I would. So we navigated my emotions and their freedom at the same time, but I never said, “You are responsible for me not being afraid."
Dr. Cam (10:28.593)
Yeah, and I don't think we even say it. I think we just assume it or do it. We make decisions and choices without realizing it, to protect our own fear, not thinking about the bigger picture and how that impacts our kids. Now, there are two extremes I see a lot. There are people who say, "Are we just supposed to let them do whatever they want?"
Esther Joy Goetz (10:29.294)
Never.
Dr. Cam (10:55.825)
And not guide them at all? Then I hear others say, “We’re being too soft on our kids, and that’s the problem with kids today.” I hear that all the time. So, when people say, “Do we just let them do whatever they want?” What do you have to say to that?
Esther Joy Goetz (11:16.462)
We had a conversation about boundaries, healthy boundaries in the house. There were things related to chores, finances, and respecting the fact that I have emotions, but respect goes both ways. I respect the pushback. The most fun experience I had was with my daughter, my oldest. She is super compliant—she came out wanting to please us. That’s just who she was. She didn’t do much of the pushback. She’s naturally empathetic—always asking, "How’s mommy feeling?" I remember her coming to me her senior year and saying, "Hey, our entire senior class is going to midnight movies, and I’m going to go, no matter what you say." I literally thought, “Come over here and high-five me right now!” I was so happy that she was doing the normal pushback.
So, you’re going to have all kinds of kids. Some will push back on everything you say, and it’s exhausting. Others will naturally want to please you. Then there’s everything in between. These constant conversations about what they really need versus what you need are important. We’re all allowed to have needs in a home. No, letting them do whatever they want is not healthy. Healthy boundaries are where I can love you and myself simultaneously. You don’t just get to be a slob and leave dishes everywhere in the common area. But guess what? I’ll never come into your room.
We have common space that everyone must respect. But your room, or section of the room—if you share with a sibling—is your responsibility. We had two boys who shared a room, and they had their own sections they couldn’t invade. It's not about all-or-nothing thinking. That’s devastating for parenting teens.
Dr. Cam (13:29.809)
Yeah, it definitely gets that pushback. Then there are people who say, “This is what's wrong with kids today. Parents are too open to listening to them, giving them a voice. We need to be parents and just tell them what it is.” I see a lot of pushback on social media, particularly from parents who believe that parents need to be more authoritative. They think that’s why kids are the way they are today.
Esther Joy Goetz (13:59.022)
And friends less, I hear that too. Again, it goes back to all-or-nothing thinking. It’s either this or that. I would say one of the most important attributes we need is wisdom. It’s not going to be all this or all that, and it’s not going to be the same for every kid. There has to be some of both. I always say the “both-and” is much more important than the “either-or.”
We can have guidance and freedom. I can give unconditional love, with no strings attached, and I can also give them the wings of freedom. Freedom means no control. You can't have love and control. If you're trying to regulate your own fear, there’s a little voice inside saying, “Listen, you’re trying to regulate yourself by controlling them.” That’s different from, “Hey, this is a common space, and I’m not okay with this. I live here too, and the dishes can’t be left everywhere. I’m not cleaning up after you. You take care of your stuff, and I’ll never be on your back.”
But I also have to take care of myself and my stuff. I don't just get to go into your room and throw my things around. I wouldn’t throw my stuff in your head either.
Dr. Cam (15:38.513)
I like that. Go a little deeper into what you mean by that.
Esther Joy Goetz (15:43.79)
Yeah. There’s a sacred space, and kids are going through something Carl Jung calls "individuation." They’re trying to become themselves. We’re there to be ourselves, too. We can share our individuated selves, our healed selves, our whole selves with them. This is the ideal, of course.
That means we get to share our hopes, our dreams, and our interests. Maybe they’ll try on some of our hats and say, "Wow, I really like the Pittsburgh Steelers, because Dad shared his love for the Steelers." Or, "I like how Mom keeps everything organized. I want to do that in my room." But we don’t belong in their heads, telling them who to be, what to love, or who to love. That’s not ours to own. Their minds and hearts are theirs to figure out.
It doesn’t mean I can’t try on some of their hats, too. They’ve taught me so much. I never knew I loved a certain band, and then they showed it to me, and I thought, “Wow, this is great!” But they didn’t force me to listen to it all day long in the car. It’s about permission to explore together. I just love that.
Dr. Cam (17:18.097)
Yeah, I think it’s so important. It’s very hard for parents to know where those boundaries are. I see a lot of overstepping into our teens’ boundaries, which is where the pushback, disrespect, and even dislike often come from. They feel violated when we try to change how they think and what they believe. It’s tough to separate what we’re doing to guide them as their parent—teaching them good manners, ethics, morals, and making good choices—and where it becomes overbearing, when we’re telling them what to do. How do we know when we’re stepping over that boundary?
Esther Joy Goetz (18:10.03)
Right, and we are.
Yeah, the whole “should” word. I think we all have pushback against the word “should,” right? Our generation especially. We had that major pushback against the “shoulds.” It was like a stranglehold on us. We don’t want to raise our kids in a way where they have to heal from the “shoulds.” We want to provide an environment where the “shoulds” are off the table. There are certain moral ethics we abide by, of course—things like kindness, compassion, and justice. But I would say that happens by modeling. You want your kids to learn how to be respectful? Respect them.
A couple of Christmases ago, or maybe it was New Year’s Day, we asked our kids, “What do you think our three major takeaways were for you guys?” Believe it or not, they all had different answers based on their personal relationships with us, but all four of them said “respect.” We asked, “Why respect?” And they said, “Because from the time we were taught, all the way through, even as teens, you always respected us.” We didn’t even realize we were doing it. They felt like they always had a voice in vacations, that we listened to them. Of course, it wasn’t perfect, and I’ve had major mom fails still. But still, I love that. There’s that modeling piece. We just showed them respect and talked about it when they felt disrespected—by a coach, a teacher, a sibling, or even us. They were always allowed to tell us how they felt.
And we were there to listen, like, “Yeah, what made you feel disrespected? That doesn’t seem respectful for that teacher to talk to you like that. You don’t have to be treated that way.” It’s interesting, they always respected people who respected them.
Dr. Cam (19:29.745)
We won’t tell which one you forgot about for a second.
Esther Joy Goetz (19:43.182)
Right! They felt respected, even when we made tough decisions. Modeling it is key. You don’t learn integrity by talking about it. Kids learn integrity by seeing you do what you say. If you say you’ll pick them up at 8:00, and you do, that’s integrity. It’s more caught than taught, and that’s a lot of work on us as parents.
Dr. Cam (21:07.921)
Yeah, absolutely. So if you're seeing something in your teen that concerns you, instead of trying to push them to change it, step back and think, “How can I change the way I’m showing up to model that better?”
Esther Joy Goetz (21:26.862)
Right. Like you said earlier—parents need to be parents, but these kids today have taught me more than anyone in my life. It’s about being both a learner and a teacher. It’s not about authoritarian parenting. It’s not top-down.
Dr. Cam (21:29.329)
That’s a big one.
Esther Joy Goetz (21:56.494)
It’s about being side by side, where you have a voice, and I have a voice. We’re all in this together, learning and teaching from each other. But there are times when you have to be a parent. For example, if you’ve been on a family vacation and the last time we did this, you had a huge rager at our house—guess what? The house is locked. If you don’t want to come, we’re changing the garage code. You’re not welcome in the home we’re paying for. Sometimes you’re a parent, sometimes you’re a friend.
Dr. Cam (22:44.273)
Right. I always find it interesting when people say we need to parent, they often mean we need to discipline, punish, and be the “bad guy.” I don’t know when parenting became equivalent to being the bad guy, because I’ve been a parent for 18 years, and I’ve never had to be the bad guy. I’ve had to say no, I’ve had to make tough decisions, but I’ve never been the bad guy. Why do we associate parenting with being the bad guy?
Esther Joy Goetz (23:01.838)
I hate that, too.
Dr. Cam (23:12.305)
Yeah, it’s puzzling.
Esther Joy Goetz (23:22.158)
You just hit on a key word—connection. Brene Brown says, “Connection is the energy that exists between people when they feel seen, heard, and valued, when they can give and receive without judgment, and when they derive sustenance and strength from the relationship.” My goal is to have a long-term, healthy relationship with my kids—one based on connection, not fear, guilt, or shame.
If I keep that long-term goal in mind, I think about it like a crockpot, not a microwave.
Dr. Cam (24:18.033)
I love it. That’s great.
Esther Joy Goetz (24:23.118)
In those moments when I say no, the key isn’t the no. It’s the feeling of being seen, heard, and valued. When they feel that, they’re more likely to come to the same decision on their own. And even if they don’t agree with the decision, if they feel heard and respected, the no is easier to accept. So, long-term healthy relationships are what matter, and that won’t change as they leave the teen years. Eventually, you’re navigating adult-to-adult relationships. It’s all a learning process, and that’s okay.
Dr. Cam (25:15.697)
It changes everything again. Yeah.
Esther Joy Goetz (25:23.278)
If you keep that crockpot, not microwave mindset in your head, it really helps in those tough decisions—like when they want to go to a party, or they’re asking for the pill, or when they say they don’t want to go to church anymore. In those moments, you have to ask yourself, “Is this crockpot or microwave thinking?”
Think about your relationship with your parents.
Dr. Cam (25:54.385)
Exactly. It’s funny because we often think it should be different for us and our kids, but really it’s not. When you have a connection, there’s a difference between not liking the decision and not liking you. When there’s no connection, anything negative becomes a reflection of their feelings toward us.
Esther Joy Goetz (25:59.534)
When we have that connection, and there’s a difficult decision, they don’t trust the decision, they trust us. They might not like it, but they feel heard and respected, and that makes all the difference. That’s the real test of connection.
I also think parents should say yes as much as possible. Listen, hear them out, and say yes when you can. If you say yes more often, the no’s are easier to handle because they know you’re not just trying to control everything. When they ask if they can do something, instead of immediately saying no, I used to say, “When you’ve figured everything out, come back and we’ll talk about it.” And most of the time, their plans fell through anyway.
Dr. Cam (27:58.385)
Yeah, and if your plan involves me, let me know, so I have a chance to say yes or no. I say yes to almost anything unless there’s a really big reason not to. I want my daughter to live her best life, and I don’t want to hold her back. It’s wonderful to see.
So, what’s the one thing you want parents to take away from today’s conversation? What’s the most important point?
Esther Joy Goetz (28:41.806)
For me, it’s the crockpot, not microwave mindset. Long-term, healthy relationships are built step by step. When you make tough decisions, deal with your own fear in the moment so you can make wise decisions with your teen. Those little decisions accumulate over time, like a lovely meal at the end. This is a lifetime journey.
There are a million ways people try to control their kids, but ultimately, we’re in this for the long haul.
Dr. Cam (29:34.193)
Yeah, exactly. I still know a lot of people my age who are complaining about their parents' control over them. I'm like, that's not a healthy relationship.
Esther Joy Goetz (29:41.454)
Controlling... yeah, no, not a healthy relationship. So, think Crockpot, not microwave—that’s my one takeaway.
Dr. Cam (29:49.585)
I love it. And what is one action item parents can do right after they listen to this episode?
Esther Joy Goetz (29:55.118)
I would say find one way to connect with your kid without any strings attached. Don’t connect with them just so you can get something from them. Just connect. Write a note on their mirror reminding them that you're their biggest fan. My one son, every morning, I’d say, “Remember, I’m your biggest fan,” as he walked out to school. And even now, in his 20s, he says, “You know what, Mom? You’re my biggest fan.” And I’m like, yes.
It’s simple, just connecting without any agenda. If what I said about the “self-stuff” resonated with you, have a conversation. Tell them, “I heard this podcast today, and they said this and this. I was just wondering what you thought about it.” My favorite way to connect is sending random notes—texts, TikToks, whatever I can do—to say one thing I’m thankful for, whether it's about them, something they’ve done lately, or how they’ve made me feel. Not tied to anything specific. Not, “Thank you for the flowers on Mother’s Day,” just, “Thank you for being you.” That’s just one way to connect without any strings attached, without any “mom agenda.”
Dr. Cam (31:23.697)
That means not getting mad if they don’t respond back. If you get mad that they didn’t respond, that shows strings.
Esther Joy Goetz (31:32.494)
Exactly. No strings, one-way connection.
Dr. Cam (31:36.849)
Yeah, that’s a hard one for a lot of parents because they think, “I do all this. I deserve this.” But it’s not your kid’s responsibility. It just isn’t. And when you keep doing it enough and building that connection, you get a lot of it in return. My daughter tells me every day, “You’re my biggest fan.” So it goes both ways, but it takes constant building and trust.
Esther Joy Goetz (31:57.912)
Yes, exactly.
Dr. Cam (32:06.446)
Esther, how can people find you?
Esther Joy Goetz (32:06.446)
I’m on Instagram and Facebook as @MomsOfBiggs. My website is EstherJoyGoetz.com/moms-of-biggs, where I have all my resources. It’s a catch-all for everything I do, but you’ll find "Moms of Biggs" in the menu. I’ve written a book called Moms Never Stop Momming with a co-author. We also have a collaborative book coming out in the fall called Moms Never Stop Worrying and Being Brave at the Same Time, releasing in the fall of 2024. I also have a program called Roots and Wings for moms whose kids are transitioning to college, and it’s available for sale right now.
Dr. Cam (32:47.761)
Excellent, we will put links everywhere in the show notes so people can find all of that. Esther, thank you so much for joining us today. This was fun.
Esther Joy Goetz (32:54.126)
Thank you!
ABOUT THE SHOW
The Parenting Teens with Dr. Cam Podcast is your go-to resource for navigating the challenges of raising teenagers. Hosted by Dr. Cam Caswell, an adolescent psychologist and certified parenting coach, this podcast offers practical parenting strategies, expert advice, and real-world insights to help you build a stronger relationship with your teen and support their emotional growth. Whether you’re struggling with teenage behavior or looking to improve communication, each episode provides actionable tips to make parenting teens easier and more rewarding. Perfect for both new and seasoned parents, this podcast helps you build the confidence to handle teen challenges and thrive together. #theteentranslator #drcamcaswell #parentingteenswithdrcam
#ParentingTeens #MomsOfBigs #Teenagers
View all episodes
By Dr. Cam
4.6
5252 ratings
Parenting teens is a tricky balancing act—nurturing your child while letting them go. Every parent hopes their teen grows into a confident, capable adult who makes good choices and chases their dreams. But there's always the fear of them making big mistakes or getting hurt along the way. Esther Joy Goetz, author, speaker, and the force behind the popular Moms of Bigs social media community, is here to help us navigate this challenge.
Esther's insights will empower you to find that balance between nurturing and letting go, while focusing on long-term, healthy relationships with your teens. She’ll also share what inspired her to create the Moms of Bigs community—a lifeline for moms of teens and young adults who are facing similar struggles.
WHAT YOU'LL LEARN IN THIS EPISODE
• How to create a safe space that allows your teen to explore their individuality
• Why healthy boundaries are key to building trust and respect
• How to balance nurturing with letting go while maintaining a strong connection
• Tips for connecting with your teen without expectations or pressure
5 KEY TAKEAWAYS FOR PARENTS OF TEENS
🎧❤️ ENJOYING THE SHOW?
Don’t keep it to yourself! Share your favorite episode and leave a rating and review to help other parents find the support they need. Your feedback helps me create even more episodes filled with practical tips for you and your family! Thanks so much for your support! 🙏💫
🔔 Remember to hit Follow so you never miss another solution-packed episode! 🙌
RESOURCES MENTIONED IN THIS EPISODE
EPISODE CHAPTERS:
CONNECT WITH OUR GUEST: Esther Joy Goetz
CONNECT WITH YOUR HOST: Dr. Cam Caswell
FULL TRANSCRIPT
Dr. Cam (00:01.297)
Hello parents, Dr. Cam here. As parents, we hope our kids grow up confident and capable. We want them to make good choices and chase their dreams, but we’re also worried they’ll make big mistakes or even get hurt. That’s why I’m so excited to have Esther Joy Goetz here today. Esther is an author, speaker, and the force behind the popular Moms of Bigs social media community. She’s here to help us find that balance between nurturing our teens and letting them go. Esther, welcome to the show.
Esther Joy Goetz (00:32.526)
Thank you. I’m so excited to be here. And just when you said that, I thought, hmm, that’s the tricky tightrope of parenting teens.
Dr. Cam (00:42.353)
It really, really is. Let’s start with a quick backstory. What inspired you to launch Moms of Bigs?
Esther Joy Goetz (00:52.942)
Well, my daughter said to me, “Mom, you need to...” She’s so funny; she thinks that I have some wisdom. What really happened was, when she graduated high school, she said, “Mom, there are so many people out there that really don’t know how to do the mom gig well, especially moms of teens.” How can they know? I thought, well, I don’t know if I’m the answer to that, but I had two older friends who guided me along and continue to guide me. I realized there was nothing out there on social media for this stage—nothing. I couldn’t find a thing. I thought, “Why don’t I give out what I actually need?”
A lot of times, our passion is born from what we needed. There’s plenty of advice on breastfeeding and how to handle toddlers, but once they hit the teen years, it’s sparse. Or it feels very formulaic—“Do these three things, and you’ll have a magic relationship with your teen.” I was like, “Yeah, I know.” I felt like my teens were some of my greatest teachers, and that’s the posture I wanted to take. Plus, all the mom emotions. You mentioned the big one—fear. No one was really talking about what to do with those emotions in the meantime. That’s really where I focused—on those motherhood emotions.
Dr. Cam (03:03.665)
I think that’s so important. I was finding the same thing. When parents are new, it feels comfortable to ask for advice. You go to a baby shower and people offer advice. But once you have teens, you feel like you should know, but it’s a whole new skill set. Plus, a whole new emotional package we don’t even know how to deal with. Fear and worry, I think, are two of the biggest ones. Is that what you’re seeing as well? Guilt—my goodness.
Esther Joy Goetz (03:41.07)
Guilt, fear, worry—and I think grief and sadness. Those are the three uncomfortable emotions. We have more comfortable ones too, like joy—watching them become their own people, having exciting conversations, and celebrating things like their sports achievements or academic success. But the uncomfortable emotions, like the letting-go process and anticipatory grief, come into play a lot. And I think with fear, it’s the loss of control.
When they’re young, you think you can control them. But once they hit the teen years, the illusion of control disappears. You’re left with fear and worry.
Dr. Cam (04:49.521)
Yeah, I see this now with parents, especially with technology—GPS, tracking apps, all these things. Parents send their kids off to high school or college, but they’re still micromanaging, tracking everything. It’s all driven by fear and worry. How do we make sure our kids have the freedom they need? Because I think that’s where the biggest conflict comes from—parents holding on too tight. How do we navigate the balance between keeping them safe and giving them the freedom to experience life?
Esther Joy Goetz (05:34.798)
The good news is we don’t have to give blanket freedom immediately. We’ve been giving them little bits of freedom all along. When you experience that pushback, there needs to be a conversation with your child. Communication is key during the teenage years. They need to be part of the conversation, and they have a massive voice in their own life.
My tagline is giving our kids the roots of unconditional love and the wings of freedom to be completely themselves. And the safety aspect—it’s something we have to come to grips with. Can we keep them “safe”? What does that even mean? You can keep them physically safe, but they could still be emotionally crippled. If we focus only on physical safety, we emotionally stunt them. My kids have told me this: “You’re emotionally stunting me. I can’t even make a mistake or figure out what I like or don’t like.”
There are different kinds of safety we’re talking about here. My job is to be a safe space for them.
Dr. Cam (07:23.825)
What does that mean?
Esther Joy Goetz (07:26.158)
My job as a mom is to create a safe space. That means I create a physically safe home—no abuse, no bullying, no judgment. There’s empathy. It’s a place of unconditional love, no strings attached. That’s the “roots of unconditional love.”
If I’m a safe space, I’m creating a soft place for them to land. But there’s also that idea I love where it says, “Ships are not made to stay in the harbor. Ships are made to go out—sometimes into beautiful waters, sometimes into treacherous ones. But the design of the ship is to manage all of that. They’re not designed to stay safe in the harbor.”
Dr. Cam (08:35.505)
Right. They wouldn't have much of a life if their job is to make sure we feel that they're safe. If their job is to protect us from our fear and worry, that stunts them. I see that a lot without parents realizing it. The kids push back really hard, and parents see that as disrespect when, in truth, the parents aren't really respecting the kids' individuality. That's a tough one.
Esther Joy Goetz (09:05.838)
You said something key there: we are responsible for our own emotions. They are not responsible for ours. One of the interesting things that happened with my son, a senior, was that he didn’t want a curfew. I said to him, "Look, I'm afraid when you're out past midnight. I own that—you're not responsible for that, but I have to get up and go to work." Part of living here means this is going to be a conversation we have back and forth. It's about respecting me and the stage I’m in—I'm not there yet. I haven’t fully let go and allowed you to just run around the world. I want you to know the emotions I'm experiencing—you're not responsible for those, but I'm dealing with them myself, in fits and starts. For now, when you're in high school, we’d like you to come home by midnight. If there are any issues surrounding that, just communicate with us the same way I would if I wasn’t going to show up when I said I would. So we navigated my emotions and their freedom at the same time, but I never said, “You are responsible for me not being afraid."
Dr. Cam (10:28.593)
Yeah, and I don't think we even say it. I think we just assume it or do it. We make decisions and choices without realizing it, to protect our own fear, not thinking about the bigger picture and how that impacts our kids. Now, there are two extremes I see a lot. There are people who say, "Are we just supposed to let them do whatever they want?"
Esther Joy Goetz (10:29.294)
Never.
Dr. Cam (10:55.825)
And not guide them at all? Then I hear others say, “We’re being too soft on our kids, and that’s the problem with kids today.” I hear that all the time. So, when people say, “Do we just let them do whatever they want?” What do you have to say to that?
Esther Joy Goetz (11:16.462)
We had a conversation about boundaries, healthy boundaries in the house. There were things related to chores, finances, and respecting the fact that I have emotions, but respect goes both ways. I respect the pushback. The most fun experience I had was with my daughter, my oldest. She is super compliant—she came out wanting to please us. That’s just who she was. She didn’t do much of the pushback. She’s naturally empathetic—always asking, "How’s mommy feeling?" I remember her coming to me her senior year and saying, "Hey, our entire senior class is going to midnight movies, and I’m going to go, no matter what you say." I literally thought, “Come over here and high-five me right now!” I was so happy that she was doing the normal pushback.
So, you’re going to have all kinds of kids. Some will push back on everything you say, and it’s exhausting. Others will naturally want to please you. Then there’s everything in between. These constant conversations about what they really need versus what you need are important. We’re all allowed to have needs in a home. No, letting them do whatever they want is not healthy. Healthy boundaries are where I can love you and myself simultaneously. You don’t just get to be a slob and leave dishes everywhere in the common area. But guess what? I’ll never come into your room.
We have common space that everyone must respect. But your room, or section of the room—if you share with a sibling—is your responsibility. We had two boys who shared a room, and they had their own sections they couldn’t invade. It's not about all-or-nothing thinking. That’s devastating for parenting teens.
Dr. Cam (13:29.809)
Yeah, it definitely gets that pushback. Then there are people who say, “This is what's wrong with kids today. Parents are too open to listening to them, giving them a voice. We need to be parents and just tell them what it is.” I see a lot of pushback on social media, particularly from parents who believe that parents need to be more authoritative. They think that’s why kids are the way they are today.
Esther Joy Goetz (13:59.022)
And friends less, I hear that too. Again, it goes back to all-or-nothing thinking. It’s either this or that. I would say one of the most important attributes we need is wisdom. It’s not going to be all this or all that, and it’s not going to be the same for every kid. There has to be some of both. I always say the “both-and” is much more important than the “either-or.”
We can have guidance and freedom. I can give unconditional love, with no strings attached, and I can also give them the wings of freedom. Freedom means no control. You can't have love and control. If you're trying to regulate your own fear, there’s a little voice inside saying, “Listen, you’re trying to regulate yourself by controlling them.” That’s different from, “Hey, this is a common space, and I’m not okay with this. I live here too, and the dishes can’t be left everywhere. I’m not cleaning up after you. You take care of your stuff, and I’ll never be on your back.”
But I also have to take care of myself and my stuff. I don't just get to go into your room and throw my things around. I wouldn’t throw my stuff in your head either.
Dr. Cam (15:38.513)
I like that. Go a little deeper into what you mean by that.
Esther Joy Goetz (15:43.79)
Yeah. There’s a sacred space, and kids are going through something Carl Jung calls "individuation." They’re trying to become themselves. We’re there to be ourselves, too. We can share our individuated selves, our healed selves, our whole selves with them. This is the ideal, of course.
That means we get to share our hopes, our dreams, and our interests. Maybe they’ll try on some of our hats and say, "Wow, I really like the Pittsburgh Steelers, because Dad shared his love for the Steelers." Or, "I like how Mom keeps everything organized. I want to do that in my room." But we don’t belong in their heads, telling them who to be, what to love, or who to love. That’s not ours to own. Their minds and hearts are theirs to figure out.
It doesn’t mean I can’t try on some of their hats, too. They’ve taught me so much. I never knew I loved a certain band, and then they showed it to me, and I thought, “Wow, this is great!” But they didn’t force me to listen to it all day long in the car. It’s about permission to explore together. I just love that.
Dr. Cam (17:18.097)
Yeah, I think it’s so important. It’s very hard for parents to know where those boundaries are. I see a lot of overstepping into our teens’ boundaries, which is where the pushback, disrespect, and even dislike often come from. They feel violated when we try to change how they think and what they believe. It’s tough to separate what we’re doing to guide them as their parent—teaching them good manners, ethics, morals, and making good choices—and where it becomes overbearing, when we’re telling them what to do. How do we know when we’re stepping over that boundary?
Esther Joy Goetz (18:10.03)
Right, and we are.
Yeah, the whole “should” word. I think we all have pushback against the word “should,” right? Our generation especially. We had that major pushback against the “shoulds.” It was like a stranglehold on us. We don’t want to raise our kids in a way where they have to heal from the “shoulds.” We want to provide an environment where the “shoulds” are off the table. There are certain moral ethics we abide by, of course—things like kindness, compassion, and justice. But I would say that happens by modeling. You want your kids to learn how to be respectful? Respect them.
A couple of Christmases ago, or maybe it was New Year’s Day, we asked our kids, “What do you think our three major takeaways were for you guys?” Believe it or not, they all had different answers based on their personal relationships with us, but all four of them said “respect.” We asked, “Why respect?” And they said, “Because from the time we were taught, all the way through, even as teens, you always respected us.” We didn’t even realize we were doing it. They felt like they always had a voice in vacations, that we listened to them. Of course, it wasn’t perfect, and I’ve had major mom fails still. But still, I love that. There’s that modeling piece. We just showed them respect and talked about it when they felt disrespected—by a coach, a teacher, a sibling, or even us. They were always allowed to tell us how they felt.
And we were there to listen, like, “Yeah, what made you feel disrespected? That doesn’t seem respectful for that teacher to talk to you like that. You don’t have to be treated that way.” It’s interesting, they always respected people who respected them.
Dr. Cam (19:29.745)
We won’t tell which one you forgot about for a second.
Esther Joy Goetz (19:43.182)
Right! They felt respected, even when we made tough decisions. Modeling it is key. You don’t learn integrity by talking about it. Kids learn integrity by seeing you do what you say. If you say you’ll pick them up at 8:00, and you do, that’s integrity. It’s more caught than taught, and that’s a lot of work on us as parents.
Dr. Cam (21:07.921)
Yeah, absolutely. So if you're seeing something in your teen that concerns you, instead of trying to push them to change it, step back and think, “How can I change the way I’m showing up to model that better?”
Esther Joy Goetz (21:26.862)
Right. Like you said earlier—parents need to be parents, but these kids today have taught me more than anyone in my life. It’s about being both a learner and a teacher. It’s not about authoritarian parenting. It’s not top-down.
Dr. Cam (21:29.329)
That’s a big one.
Esther Joy Goetz (21:56.494)
It’s about being side by side, where you have a voice, and I have a voice. We’re all in this together, learning and teaching from each other. But there are times when you have to be a parent. For example, if you’ve been on a family vacation and the last time we did this, you had a huge rager at our house—guess what? The house is locked. If you don’t want to come, we’re changing the garage code. You’re not welcome in the home we’re paying for. Sometimes you’re a parent, sometimes you’re a friend.
Dr. Cam (22:44.273)
Right. I always find it interesting when people say we need to parent, they often mean we need to discipline, punish, and be the “bad guy.” I don’t know when parenting became equivalent to being the bad guy, because I’ve been a parent for 18 years, and I’ve never had to be the bad guy. I’ve had to say no, I’ve had to make tough decisions, but I’ve never been the bad guy. Why do we associate parenting with being the bad guy?
Esther Joy Goetz (23:01.838)
I hate that, too.
Dr. Cam (23:12.305)
Yeah, it’s puzzling.
Esther Joy Goetz (23:22.158)
You just hit on a key word—connection. Brene Brown says, “Connection is the energy that exists between people when they feel seen, heard, and valued, when they can give and receive without judgment, and when they derive sustenance and strength from the relationship.” My goal is to have a long-term, healthy relationship with my kids—one based on connection, not fear, guilt, or shame.
If I keep that long-term goal in mind, I think about it like a crockpot, not a microwave.
Dr. Cam (24:18.033)
I love it. That’s great.
Esther Joy Goetz (24:23.118)
In those moments when I say no, the key isn’t the no. It’s the feeling of being seen, heard, and valued. When they feel that, they’re more likely to come to the same decision on their own. And even if they don’t agree with the decision, if they feel heard and respected, the no is easier to accept. So, long-term healthy relationships are what matter, and that won’t change as they leave the teen years. Eventually, you’re navigating adult-to-adult relationships. It’s all a learning process, and that’s okay.
Dr. Cam (25:15.697)
It changes everything again. Yeah.
Esther Joy Goetz (25:23.278)
If you keep that crockpot, not microwave mindset in your head, it really helps in those tough decisions—like when they want to go to a party, or they’re asking for the pill, or when they say they don’t want to go to church anymore. In those moments, you have to ask yourself, “Is this crockpot or microwave thinking?”
Think about your relationship with your parents.
Dr. Cam (25:54.385)
Exactly. It’s funny because we often think it should be different for us and our kids, but really it’s not. When you have a connection, there’s a difference between not liking the decision and not liking you. When there’s no connection, anything negative becomes a reflection of their feelings toward us.
Esther Joy Goetz (25:59.534)
When we have that connection, and there’s a difficult decision, they don’t trust the decision, they trust us. They might not like it, but they feel heard and respected, and that makes all the difference. That’s the real test of connection.
I also think parents should say yes as much as possible. Listen, hear them out, and say yes when you can. If you say yes more often, the no’s are easier to handle because they know you’re not just trying to control everything. When they ask if they can do something, instead of immediately saying no, I used to say, “When you’ve figured everything out, come back and we’ll talk about it.” And most of the time, their plans fell through anyway.
Dr. Cam (27:58.385)
Yeah, and if your plan involves me, let me know, so I have a chance to say yes or no. I say yes to almost anything unless there’s a really big reason not to. I want my daughter to live her best life, and I don’t want to hold her back. It’s wonderful to see.
So, what’s the one thing you want parents to take away from today’s conversation? What’s the most important point?
Esther Joy Goetz (28:41.806)
For me, it’s the crockpot, not microwave mindset. Long-term, healthy relationships are built step by step. When you make tough decisions, deal with your own fear in the moment so you can make wise decisions with your teen. Those little decisions accumulate over time, like a lovely meal at the end. This is a lifetime journey.
There are a million ways people try to control their kids, but ultimately, we’re in this for the long haul.
Dr. Cam (29:34.193)
Yeah, exactly. I still know a lot of people my age who are complaining about their parents' control over them. I'm like, that's not a healthy relationship.
Esther Joy Goetz (29:41.454)
Controlling... yeah, no, not a healthy relationship. So, think Crockpot, not microwave—that’s my one takeaway.
Dr. Cam (29:49.585)
I love it. And what is one action item parents can do right after they listen to this episode?
Esther Joy Goetz (29:55.118)
I would say find one way to connect with your kid without any strings attached. Don’t connect with them just so you can get something from them. Just connect. Write a note on their mirror reminding them that you're their biggest fan. My one son, every morning, I’d say, “Remember, I’m your biggest fan,” as he walked out to school. And even now, in his 20s, he says, “You know what, Mom? You’re my biggest fan.” And I’m like, yes.
It’s simple, just connecting without any agenda. If what I said about the “self-stuff” resonated with you, have a conversation. Tell them, “I heard this podcast today, and they said this and this. I was just wondering what you thought about it.” My favorite way to connect is sending random notes—texts, TikToks, whatever I can do—to say one thing I’m thankful for, whether it's about them, something they’ve done lately, or how they’ve made me feel. Not tied to anything specific. Not, “Thank you for the flowers on Mother’s Day,” just, “Thank you for being you.” That’s just one way to connect without any strings attached, without any “mom agenda.”
Dr. Cam (31:23.697)
That means not getting mad if they don’t respond back. If you get mad that they didn’t respond, that shows strings.
Esther Joy Goetz (31:32.494)
Exactly. No strings, one-way connection.
Dr. Cam (31:36.849)
Yeah, that’s a hard one for a lot of parents because they think, “I do all this. I deserve this.” But it’s not your kid’s responsibility. It just isn’t. And when you keep doing it enough and building that connection, you get a lot of it in return. My daughter tells me every day, “You’re my biggest fan.” So it goes both ways, but it takes constant building and trust.
Esther Joy Goetz (31:57.912)
Yes, exactly.
Dr. Cam (32:06.446)
Esther, how can people find you?
Esther Joy Goetz (32:06.446)
I’m on Instagram and Facebook as @MomsOfBiggs. My website is EstherJoyGoetz.com/moms-of-biggs, where I have all my resources. It’s a catch-all for everything I do, but you’ll find "Moms of Biggs" in the menu. I’ve written a book called Moms Never Stop Momming with a co-author. We also have a collaborative book coming out in the fall called Moms Never Stop Worrying and Being Brave at the Same Time, releasing in the fall of 2024. I also have a program called Roots and Wings for moms whose kids are transitioning to college, and it’s available for sale right now.
Dr. Cam (32:47.761)
Excellent, we will put links everywhere in the show notes so people can find all of that. Esther, thank you so much for joining us today. This was fun.
Esther Joy Goetz (32:54.126)
Thank you!
ABOUT THE SHOW
The Parenting Teens with Dr. Cam Podcast is your go-to resource for navigating the challenges of raising teenagers. Hosted by Dr. Cam Caswell, an adolescent psychologist and certified parenting coach, this podcast offers practical parenting strategies, expert advice, and real-world insights to help you build a stronger relationship with your teen and support their emotional growth. Whether you’re struggling with teenage behavior or looking to improve communication, each episode provides actionable tips to make parenting teens easier and more rewarding. Perfect for both new and seasoned parents, this podcast helps you build the confidence to handle teen challenges and thrive together. #theteentranslator #drcamcaswell #parentingteenswithdrcam
#ParentingTeens #MomsOfBigs #Teenagers
More shows like Parenting Teens with Dr. Cam
View all
Emotionally Uncomfortable
587 Listeners
The Lazy Genius Podcast
6,496 Listeners
Change Your Brain Every Day
1,953 Listeners
Calm Parenting Podcast
1,385 Listeners
Talking To Teens: Expert Tips for Parenting Teenagers
200 Listeners
Feel Better, Live More with Dr Rangan Chatterjee
4,016 Listeners
The Peter Attia Drive
7,944 Listeners
On Purpose with Jay Shetty
27,078 Listeners
Raising Good Humans
1,857 Listeners
Parenting Today's Teens
319 Listeners
Ask Lisa: The Psychology of Parenting
820 Listeners
Huberman Lab
28,252 Listeners
Good Inside with Dr. Becky
4,343 Listeners
The Mel Robbins Podcast
20,846 Listeners
Parenting & You With Dr. Shefali
160 Listeners