Matt Miller is co-founder of Fair Trade Real Estate, a California-only wholesale brokerage launched in July 2020 that now runs five offices and roughly 60 team members alongside his partner Deke Blake. A former Army paratrooper who enlisted at 17 and served nearly five years including deployments to South Korea and Iraq, Matt brings 14 years of real estate experience to one of the most competitive markets in the country.

Recorded live at the Collective Genius Q2 event in Oceanside, this episode covers how Fair Trade survived a partnership split and months of six figure losses while refusing to abandon the dispositions technology they were building. If you're a wholesaler in a competitive market wondering whether to keep investing through a downturn, or a leader trying to get more out of a mastermind, this one is for you.

Timeline Summary

[0:00] – Leon opens live from Oceanside at the CG Q2 event with 200 plus Premier and 40 to 45 CEO members in the room

[0:40] – Fair Trade Real Estate: exclusively wholesale, exclusively California, 5 offices, 60 team members since July 2020

[1:03] – Matt's path from enlisting in the Army at 17 to deployments in South Korea and Iraq

[1:45] – Why former athletes and military veterans consistently scale the biggest real estate businesses

[2:41] – How military leadership, good and bad, shaped Matt's approach to running a company

[3:51] – The difference makers presentation: from peak performance to falling off a cliff after a partnership split

[4:17] – Why the hardest part wasn't telling the story but telling it respectfully

[5:56] – Committing to the tech build while hemorrhaging $100K plus per month, funded entirely by retained earnings

[7:08] – Why off the shelf software couldn't give their agents an edge and why building was the only option

[7:37] – Keeping the doors open: cutting staff, subleasing offices, killing software that didn't work

[8:55] – The broken dispositions problem and why they rebuilt it as an investor marketplace

[10:01] – Training agents to think like sales professionals with pipeline management and buy windows

[10:51] – Southern California is a top five most competitive market, and why "I can't compete" is the wrong response

[12:14] – The goal: become the largest home buyer in California within five years, with talent as the only constraint

[12:56] – Why Fair Trade won't expand to new states unless it's a culture fit

[14:01] – Top three takeaways from 18 months in CG: real networking, a mini leadership offsite, and industry intel

[17:33] – Why the best operators stay an extra day after events to turn notes into a strategic plan

[19:06] – Borrowing one CG networking exercise per event to make internal team trainings more impactful

5 Key Takeaways

1. Invest Through the Downturn — Fair Trade kept building its dispositions platform even while losing six figures a month. Technology gives you an edge for a short window, and waiting until things are comfortable means someone else builds it first.
2. Cut Everything Except the Priority — Staying committed to the tech build meant cutting staff they liked, subleasing office space, and killing underperforming software. You can't fund a vision on business as usual when revenue is down.
3. Agents Are the Number One Customer — Sellers are a single transaction and investors need to repeat, but agents have to win for the business to grow. Every tool Fair Trade built was designed to give their agents the best chance to close.
4. Competitive Markets Reward Differentiation — Every market is tough, so "I can't compete" is not a strategy. Fair Trade picked dispositions as its differentiator and built a marketplace nobody else in Southern California had.
5. Stay the Extra Day — The best operators in mastermind rooms don't fly home right after the last session. They spend a few hours decompressing the notes and picking the one domino that will move the business.

Links & Resources

• Collective Genius, application only, 500 plus members meeting four times a year — https://explorecg.com
• Deke Blake's episode on the Collective Genius Podcast (released a few weeks prior)

Enjoyed This Episode?

If Matt's story of building through $100K monthly losses reminded you that the tough season you're in is survivable, share this with a partner or operator who needs to hear it today. Then follow the Collective Genius Podcast, leave a rating and review, and head to explorecg.com to find out which room you qualify for.

Tim Vitale is a Wilmington, North Carolina based multifamily investor who owns 28 properties and roughly 1,100 units across the Southeast, 25 of which are LIHTC affordable housing. A former Wall Street accounting and finance professional who hit assistant vice president at 28, Tim walked away from the corporate ladder and will mark five years as a full time real estate investor this September.

In this episode, Tim breaks down why he built his entire business around a niche most operators avoid, including 0% interest 40 year debt, property tax abatements up to 90%, and why he now underwrites strictly on day one in-place cash flow. If you're a single family investor eyeing commercial, a multifamily operator trying to buy in today's market, or a W-2 employee wondering how to make the jump, this conversation is for you.

Timeline Summary

[1:30] – Leon opens the show and introduces CG Legacy, the commercial room formed through the merger with Tim Bratz's group

[3:14] – Tim explains LIHTC affordable housing and why he's the only person in the room focused on it

[3:54] – 28 properties, 25 of them LIHTC, and why a tight buy box makes it easy to say no to deals

[5:38] – Why nobody wants affordable housing: paperwork, red tape, housing authorities, and difficult residents

[6:21] – The upside: 90% property tax abatements, 0% interest loans with no payments for 40 years, and one asset free and clear

[7:37] – The bad stuff: inheriting prior owners' compliance mistakes and why Tim built an in-house compliance department

[8:59] – Inflation's hit on affordable housing, with rent collection slipping from 80 to 85% in 12 days to 80% in 15 to 20 days

[11:10] – Why LIHTC deals rarely hit the market and why Tim and Tim get the first broker call in the Carolinas

[12:07] – Selling two Alabama assets and consolidating into the Carolinas for centralized operations and shared resources

[13:13] – Why AMI growth in Charlotte and Raleigh makes major metros outperform tertiary markets

[15:26] – Refining underwriting after insurance costs jumped 2,400% and putting the weight on day one in-place cash flow

[19:25] – The Wall Street AVP promotion, a 3% raise, and the dinner that made Tim ask when the life changing money starts

[21:26] – Doing the books for his grandmother's Connecticut portfolio and realizing how much passive income real estate created

[22:10] – First condo bought in November 2019, a flat appraisal, and the loan officer comment that pushed Tim into commercial

[24:36] – Selling the house, downsizing to an apartment, and giving himself two years and $150K to make it work, his wife's idea

[28:44] – Why it's better to do no deal than a mediocre one, and the confidence that comes from not needing the next deal

[30:05] – Tim's forecast: construction starts down 80%, no new supply until 2030, and why 2029 into 2030 is when things heat up

[32:49] – Values down 20 to 30% in 24 months and why the next 6 to 24 months could be the buying window of the decade

5 Key Takeaways

1. The Riches Are in the Niches — Tim built a 1,100 unit portfolio by focusing on LIHTC affordable housing, a niche most investors avoid because it's hard. Being the specialist means brokers call you first when the rare deal surfaces.
2. Affordable Housing Comes With Real Trade-Offs — Tax abatements, 0% interest debt, and higher cap rates are the reward. Compliance audits, higher delinquency, heavier CapEx, and difficult residents are the price, so build the team around the problem.
3. Underwrite on Day One Cash Flow — After a 2,400% insurance spike, Tim stopped paying for someone else's future upside. In-place cash flow is the baseline now, and rent growth is gravy on top.
4. No Deal Beats a Mediocre Deal — Marginal deals drain your team and your investors. Tim would rather sit out than put his people through another property that doesn't perform.
5. Going Full Time Requires a Runway, Not Just Guts — Tim bought one rental in three years, got up at 5 a.m. to study, and sold his house for $150K of runway before quitting. Active income or savings has to bridge the gap while commercial deals take shape.

Links & Resources

• Collective Genius and the CG Legacy commercial room — https://explorecg.com

Enjoyed This Episode?

If Tim's story of trading a 3% raise for 1,100 units got you thinking, you know someone stuck on the same corporate ladder he climbed off of. Send them this episode. And if you want more conversations like this every week, follow the Collective Genius Podcast and leave us a rating and review.

Vance Courtney is an AI implementation expert who co-led two overflowing AI masterclasses with Steve Trang at Collective Genius Select and Elevate in Clearwater Beach, May 2026. His focus is practical: building agents that audit 100 percent of your sales calls, and giving operators a repeatable framework for prompting AI like they'd lead an employee.

In this live episode, Vance walks through the RACE prompting framework, why auditing sales calls is the best zero-to-one AI project for real estate investors, and how Claude's Cowork mode lets non-technical operators build working agents by describing an outcome instead of a task. If you're a real estate investor who wants to use AI in your business right now without learning to code, or you're trying to scale without bloating your team, this one is for you.

Timeline Summary

[0:00] – Leon opens live from CG Select and Elevate in Clearwater Beach, where AI is the hottest buzzword in real estate investing

[0:50] – Why CG runs an AI session at every Select and Premier meeting, and why Vance's masterclass room was the fullest of the day

[1:29] – What the masterclass built: a custom GPT sales auditor, then a full agent that pulls, transcribes, scores, and sends feedback to reps

[2:50] – The RACE framework for prompting AI: role, action, context, and expected output

[3:38] – Why "world class digital marketer focused on Facebook for real estate investors" beats "digital marketer" as a role

[4:26] – Context is everything: feed it your lead manager script, grading rubric, and training docs, plus guardrails on what not to do

[5:01] – Treat AI like an employee: lead it the way your best self would lead a new hire, and define the output format up front

[6:12] – The case for sales call auditing: only 2 percent of recorded calls get reviewed by a human, AI can hit 100 percent

[6:48] – Leon on listening to every recorded call as a CEO, and why AI makes that job easier instead of replacing it

[7:38] – Where AI has the least impact: the closer you get to human connection and leadership, the safer the job

[8:30] – Getting started with agents: download the Claude app, open Cowork, and describe the outcome you want

[9:38] – The one-prompt agent: connect to the call system, download, transcribe, score, and post to Slack

[11:14] – The biggest takeaway from the room: when the AI tells you to go do something yourself, tell it no, you do it

[13:16] – Automate what's standard, use AI where your business is unique, and start with the step that eats the most time

[14:37] – Leon's Gen X take: the next 20 years of distressed sellers will still want a trusted local human at the closing table

[17:16] – Why AI means hiring the best five instead of a bloated ten, and how lean operations replace armies of VAs

[18:25] – Using AI to score interviews, load Predictive Index results, and evaluate candidates against your own criteria

[20:40] – The daily huddle question that builds an AI habit across your whole team: how did you use AI yesterday?

5 Key Takeaways

1. Prompt With the RACE Framework — Give AI a specific role, the action you want, as much context as possible including guardrails, and an example of the output. Most bad results come from skipping context.
2. Audit 100 Percent of Your Sales Calls — Only about 2 percent of recorded calls get reviewed today. An AI auditor scores every call, surfaces the best and worst, and lets a human coach the gap.
3. Lead AI Like Your Best Employee — Give it the what and the why, expect clarifying questions, and when it hands a task back to you, tell it no, you do it. Persistence beats technical skill.
4. Automate the Standard, Own the Unique — Every wholesaler runs similar processes, so automate those. Point AI at what makes your business different and start with the step that costs the most time or produces the most revenue.
5. Scale People, Not Headcount — AI lets you hire five great people instead of ten average ones. Use it to score interviews and assessments so the humans you do hire are the right ones.

Links & Resources

• Vance Courtney on Instagram — https://instagram.com/vanceconnect
• Vance Courtney on X — https://x.com/vanceconnect
• Claude (download the app and use Cowork) — https://claude.ai
• ChatGPT — https://chatgpt.com
• Collective Genius — https://explorecg.com

Vance's advice to tell the AI "no, you do it" when it hands work back to you might be the most useful sentence you hear about AI all year. Pair that with auditing every sales call and the daily huddle question, and you've got a zero-to-one plan you can start on Monday. Share this one with the operator on your team who says AI is too technical. Head to https://explorecg.com to learn more and apply.

Adam and Paul Vincent are brothers and real estate attorneys behind Vincent Esquire, a Northeast Ohio law firm they founded a little over ten years ago after walking away from their old jobs to represent a bulk tax lien buyer. Today the majority of their practice is securities work: private placement memorandums, syndications, and debt funds for flippers, multifamily buyers, and business acquisitions, plus general counsel and estate planning for entrepreneurs.

In this episode, the first ever with two guests and the first with attorneys, the Vincents break down why volume flippers are moving from one-off notes and mortgages to debt funds, how the best commercial operators are still finding deal flow through banks, receiverships, and broker relationships, and the legal risks around texting, wholesaling, and assignment laws that are tightening state by state. If you're raising capital for flips or multifamily, trying to fix inconsistent deal flow, or wondering when pooling investor money means you need a lawyer, this one is for you.

Timeline Summary

[1:30] – Leon welcomes Adam and Paul Vincent of Vincent Esquire, the first attorneys and first two-guest episode in the show's history

[3:34] – What the firm does: startups, general counsel, capital raising paperwork, debt funds, and estate planning for entrepreneurs

[6:28] – How two brothers with English and history degrees stumbled into real estate law through a bulk tax lien client

[7:41] – Adam's path from adjunct professor and writing centers to law school after Paul was already practicing

[10:00] – The tax lien "golden goose" lasted two years, then dried up when a county prosecutor took over the work

[11:55] – Lesson learned: one big client is zero clients, and 30-something Paul had to learn to network from scratch

[13:33] – How work with single family flippers evolved from one investor, one note and mortgage into pooled debt funds

[15:37] – The Costco hot dog strategy: giving flippers a free note and mortgage template to build relationships early

[18:29] – What a PPM actually is, and why pooling money from multiple investors is the trigger to call a lawyer

[20:08] – Where operators buying a couple hundred units a year are finding deals: direct from banks and receiverships

[21:21] – Why broker relationships still beat direct to seller on commercial, and how to reach special asset managers

[23:48] – Why direct mail and cold outreach are drying up, and the legal exposure of texting unconsented sellers

[27:07] – The clients the Vincents love working with: hands-on operators who visit their properties and think long term

[29:09] – The biggest mistake right now: buying too far away and failing to manage your property manager

[30:47] – A Zoom call is not a site visit, and spreading yourself thin can quietly kill team morale

[34:26] – Why debt funds beat one-off mortgages for volume flippers, and why 10 to 12 percent is the sweet spot for investor returns

[38:15] – Legal watch list: be able to close on your wholesales, check your licensing, and beware of state and city crackdowns

[40:12] – Leon on CG's quarterly legal updates: Phoenix assignment rules, Missouri's 14-day disclosure, and lobbying efforts

[41:41] – How to reach the Vincents, the free How to Syndicate walkthrough, and what they can do for clients outside Ohio

5 Key Takeaways

1. Pooling Investor Money Triggers the Lawyer Call — One investor secured by a note and mortgage is simple. The moment you combine several investors into one deal, you need a PPM so everyone is on the same page before something goes sideways.
2. Debt Funds Keep Volume Flippers Liquid — Raising into a fund while you're working on projects means the money is there when the next deal appears. It also keeps you honest about raising continuously instead of scrambling deal by deal.
3. Deal Flow Lives in Bank and Broker Relationships — Operators still doing multiple commercial deals a year are buying from special asset managers, receiverships, and brokers hired to unload troubled properties. Ask your commercial lender for the intro.
4. Distance Is the Silent Portfolio Killer — If you can't see your building regularly, you're not managing it. Third-party managers get paid at 75 percent occupancy nearly the same as 90, so someone has to manage the manager.
5. Wholesaling Law Is Changing State by State — Texting unconsented sellers, assigning without disclosure, and operating without required licenses are feeding entire law practices. Be able to close, disclose, and stay plugged into a group that tracks the rules.

Links & Resources

• Vincent Esquire — https://vincentesquire.com
• How to Syndicate (free video and slide deck walkthrough of a sample deal) — https://howtosyndicate.com
• Collective Genius — https://explorecg.com

Two attorneys with more personality than most operators, and more useful legal insight than most podcasts. The Vincents' point about relationships driving both deal flow and capital, whether that's a special asset manager at a local bank or a core group of 5 to 10 investors in a debt fund, is the thread that ties this whole episode together. If you've been guessing at when you need a PPM or why your direct-to-seller pipeline is drying up, you now have answers. Head to https://explorecg.com to learn more and apply.

CJ Moss runs a wholesale only company on the Rhode Island and Massachusetts line, operating out of a hub in Seekonk with a stated goal of becoming the biggest wholesale company in the country. He was named Collective Genius Newcomer of the Year in his first year, and this conversation was recorded live on stage in Clearwater Beach right after his track presentation on disposition.

CJ breaks down how he maximizes dispo fees, why he tells every seller upfront that he is not the buyer and plans to make a profit, and the 2030 plan to hit 100 million across 20 northeast satellite offices. If you run a wholesale operation and keep getting told to graduate into flips or multifamily, this episode makes the case for staying in your lane and perfecting it instead.

Timeline Summary

[0:23] – Leon opens day two of the live podcast from Clearwater Beach and welcomes CJ Moss to the chair

[1:31] – Why former athletes tend to make good entrepreneurs and where the drive to win actually comes from

[2:22] – The go giver culture Jason built 14 years ago and the candle analogy that keeps competition healthy

[3:56] – CJ on running a wholesale only business on the Rhode Island and Massachusetts line with the blinders on

[4:35] – The goal of becoming the biggest wholesale company in the country and competing with New Western

[5:19] – What his dispo track presentation covered and why fundamentals beat market conditions

[6:19] – The first step operators should take, committing to open houses instead of dishing deals to one buyer

[6:57] – Telling sellers upfront that you are not the buyer and you will make a profit on the deal

[9:24] – Why wholesaling gets treated as a springboard instead of a business worth perfecting

[12:04] – The 2030 plan, 100 million across 20 northeast locations at 5 million per office

[12:21] – Leon connects CJ with Joseph Beck, who went from 56 deals in 2020 to over 450

[17:12] – The Rhode Island anti flip bill and the two minutes CJ got in front of the House of Reps

[19:16] – What CJ is taking home from the event, hiring high level people who have already done the job

[20:16] – Why operators stall at 5 million and the profit margin that quietly signals understaffing

[23:52] – Inside the CG tier structure with 33 members in the CEO room and 186 in Premier

[29:00] – Winning Newcomer of the Year and why three quarters of the room is chasing a belt

5 Key Takeaways

1. Perfect One Thing Before Adding Another — CJ turned down flipping, multifamily, and lending to stay wholesale only. The plan is to make the home base close to perfect, then replicate it across 20 offices rather than collect new asset classes.
2. Tell the Seller You Are Not the Buyer — Wiggling around the truth always felt sticky, so he started disclosing upfront that the house gets assigned and he makes a fee. Nine times out of ten the seller has no issue with it, and it makes the open house strategy work.
3. Never Dish a Deal to One Buyer — The single biggest dispo lever is committing to open houses on every property. Selling to the first buyer who says yes is the fastest way to leave fee on the table.
4. High Margins Can Mean You Are Understaffed — When operators brag about 45 or 50 percent net, they are usually still doing acquisitions and lead management themselves. A healthy margin in this business sits closer to 20 to 35 percent because the rest goes back into talent.
5. Hire People Who Have Done the Job Already — Most companies get stuck between 4 and 6 million because they put middle managers into C suite seats. Integrator has become a buzzword, and calling someone one does not give them executive track record.

Links & Resources

• Collective Genius — https://www.explorecg.com
• New Western — https://www.newwestern.com

Enjoyed This Episode?

If the part about telling sellers straight up that you are assigning the contract and making a fee made you rethink your own script, send this to the acquisitions manager on your team. CJ makes a real case that the boring fundamentals are where the money actually is. Follow the show, leave a rating, and drop a review so more operators can find these live conversations.

Colby Kirk has spent eight years building a Kansas City real estate business across three buckets: wholesaling, multifamily repositions, and private lending. Before real estate he was, in his words, a failed entrepreneur, running a custom suit company out of Georgetown with product made in Pakistan after a Peace Corps stint in Costa Rica.

In this episode Colby walks through the 33 unit package he closed with 18% hard money after a year of follow up, the 32 unit deal that broke when interest rates doubled in 2022, and how he found a hard money lending opportunity in Wichita where borrowers were paying 24 to 36 percent annually. If you are an operator trying to figure out how to stack multifamily and private lending without letting one starve the other, this conversation is for you.

Timeline Summary

[1:30] – Leon welcomes Colby Kirk to the show and heads back home to Kansas City for the conversation

[3:01] – Colby breaks down his three buckets, the wholesale company he is winding down, multifamily repositions, and private lending

[4:58] – Why he walked away from the retail agent path within months of getting his license in 2018

[5:58] – Finding an old vacant property rental registration list and cold calling his way into off market deals

[7:14] – The businesses that failed before real estate, a men's suiting company, affiliate marketing, and lawn care

[8:31] – Peace Corps in Costa Rica, grad school at Georgetown, and why bureaucracy pushed him back toward entrepreneurship

[9:38] – Building a custom suit company with product made in Pakistan, priced at 500 dollars against 1200 dollar competitors

[12:21] – Selling suits on the corner of Wisconsin and M Street in 85 degree heat and getting laughed at

[17:32] – The 33 unit package from owners in their 80s, closed December 2019 with 18% hard money

[21:17] – Growing up with a poverty mindset and still actively working to unlearn it

[24:01] – The handwritten 30 page list that served as his CRM and a full year of monthly follow up

[24:44] – Closing the deal over Denny's lunches and the elderly landlord avatar he still targets today

[29:22] – The 32 unit fourplex play that broke when rates jumped from 3.5 to 7.5 percent

[32:21] – How renovating one model unit set a new comp at 375 when the highest was 325

[35:25] – Why Wichita borrowers paying 24 to 36 percent annually signaled a lending opportunity

[39:45] – The barbell strategy of pairing a debt fund with multifamily equity so capital never forces a bad deal

5 Key Takeaways

1. Give the Business Five Years — Colby's earlier ventures died because he got bored and moved on inside two or three years. He committed to five years in real estate no matter how it looked early, and that commitment is what let the business compound.
2. Follow Up Longer Than Feels Reasonable — He called the same elderly owners roughly once a month for twelve months before they came off their price. The 33 unit package closed because nobody else stayed in the conversation that long.
3. Sell to the Avatar, Not the Address — Elderly landlords with no professional management and kids who want nothing to do with the properties became a repeatable buy box. He found it on one deal and has bought from that same profile many times since.
4. Lender Relationships Are the Real Backstop — When rates doubled and the fourplex exit vanished, he went back to capital partners who owned half the deal and asked for more renovation money. That relationship turned a stuck project into a profitable one.
5. Pair Debt With Equity So Capital Never Rushes You — A standalone multifamily fund pressures you to deploy, and pressure produces bad deals. Running a debt fund alongside it keeps capital working while you wait for the right asset.

Links & Resources

• Collective Genius — https://www.explorecg.com
• Vetus Capital, Colby's lending and multifamily company — https://www.vetuscapital.com
• Colby Lee Kirk on Facebook
• Rich Dad Poor Dad by Robert Kiyosaki
• Think and Grow Rich by Napoleon Hill

Enjoyed This Episode?

If the story about setting a brand new comp at 375 in a market where nothing had sold above 325 got your attention, you probably know an operator who is sitting on a deal that stopped penciling. Send this one to them. Follow the show, leave a rating, and drop a review so more investors can find these conversations.

Steve Casamassima spent 14 years as a police officer in South Jersey, becoming the youngest sergeant ever promoted at his department at age 30, all while quietly flipping roughly 100 houses on the side. Today he is the closer at Hall of Fame Real Estate, where he personally drove $5 million in gross profit in 2025, his first full year in the business.

This episode breaks down how he did it, including the relationship network he built with postmasters, UPS and FedEx drivers to find off-market real estate deals three months before anyone else could, and the brokerage strategy that produced four deals in a single month. If you are a real estate investor trying to scale past your marketing spend, or an operator who knows the next level depends on hiring the right people, this conversation is your playbook.

[0:22] – Host opens live from the Q2 Collective Genius event in Oceanside, California

[1:20] – Steve joins the show and the conversation turns to hiring great people to scale

[2:24] – How Santini found him, and why he was a police officer for 14 years first

[2:38] – A torn ACL on a soccer scholarship sends him into the police academy at 18

[3:16] – Youngest sergeant ever promoted at his department, on his 30th birthday

[3:32] – Roughly 100 flips in seven years while working full time as an active sergeant

[3:55] – Why nearly every cop and firefighter runs a side business, and how he used his

[5:01] – The end of 2022 flip that made $43,000 and changed the relationship

[5:17] – Selling to a fellow officer with a 3.9 percent pension rate lock from 2021

[5:56] – The bagels story, and how one small gesture led to the job that changed his life

[7:21] – Host on why you cannot scale anything special without special people

[9:12] – $5 million in gross profit in his first full year, with 42 percent from relationships

[10:43] – The only instruction Santini ever gave him, which was just go get deals

[12:36] – Building a lead source out of postmasters, UPS and FedEx drivers

[13:15] – Why he became his own predictive data company and ran three months ahead

[15:42] – Advice one, partner with small wholesalers who can acquire but cannot dispo

[17:07] – Advice two, buy dinner for a brokerage and turn 20 minutes into four deals

[20:33] – Why giving away all your secrets costs you nothing

1. Recruit Before You Need Them — When you meet someone who fits your core values, start the relationship now even if there is no role for them yet. Steve was recruited for close to two years before he ever left the police department.
2. Small Gestures Close Big People — Steve dropped off bagels for a family that had just moved in, expecting nothing. That five dollar gesture is what turned a strong acquaintance into the business partnership that produced $5 million in gross profit.
3. Build Your Own Predictive Data — Postmasters, UPS drivers and FedEx drivers already know which houses have 100 unopened envelopes piling up. Steve turned those relationships into off-market leads that reached him three months before any list vendor could sell them.
4. Partner With Wholesalers Who Cannot Dispo — Find the operator who is great at acquisitions but has no buyers list, capital or construction team. Even at a 50/50 JV, your systems can double their average assignment fee, so they make the same or more while you get the volume.
5. Go Straight To The Broker — Instead of chasing individual agents, Steve bought dinner for entire brokerages and spent 20 minutes explaining what a wholesaler actually does. One meeting produced four deals that same month.

• Collective Genius — https://www.explorecg.com
• Follow Steve on Instagram — https://instagram.com/stevecas_hof
• Hall of Fame Real Estate, South Jersey
• Steve's direct line, call or text — (609) 519-1782
• Cameron Herold, Q2 event keynote speaker — https://cameronherold.com
• Tim Bratz on the CG commercial room announcement, previous episode

If the bagels story stuck with you, that is the whole lesson. The relationships you build when there is nothing in it for you are the ones that pay you back years later. Send this to the operator you know who is stuck at their marketing ceiling and needs to hear how 42 percent of a $5 million year came from people instead of ads. Follow the show, leave a rating, and drop a review so more investors can find these conversations.

Dan Rivers is the co-founder of Synergy Stays, a short term rental revenue management company operating in 45 markets including Mexico, and a CG Legacy member out of Charleston, South Carolina. He started in Tampa in 2005 with 600 units handed to him on his first day at 25 years old, spent 13 years in property management, and has since done over 350 deals across flips, rentals, wholesaling, and private lending.

This conversation covers why short term rentals are a hospitality business and not a rental play, the two revenue blockers Dan sees on almost every new client, and how native language search is about to change how listings get found. If you own Airbnbs that are plugging along at okay instead of profitable, this is the episode that tells you where the money is leaking.

Timeline Summary

[2:24] – The Collective Genius merger with Legacy Family, and Dan joins as a CG Legacy member

[3:25] – What Synergy Stays does and why they go five layers past pricing

[5:02] – Why Airbnb is a hospitality play, not a rental play, and why so many investors missed that

[5:19] – The four separate businesses hiding inside every short term rental

[6:16] – Killing the full service management arm to be great at one thing instead of good at four

[7:00] – Day one in Tampa at 25 years old with 600 units and 16 properties handed over

[9:30] – Two open heart surgeries before 16 and the willingness to bet on himself it created

[11:13] – Moving to Charleston in 2018 and finding the investor breakfast room that changed everything

[12:25] – Hiring Kelly Garrett as a coach, setting a $500K goal, and finishing 2021 at $775K

[14:41] – Over 350 deals in eight years and the shiny object problem that came with all of them

[19:34] – Native language search is coming to Airbnb and how to write a listing that gets found

[22:12] – Name your photo files what they actually are, because the search reads words and not images

[23:17] – The two biggest revenue blockers, cell phone photos and refusing to move off your ADR

[29:41] – Run year one pro forma at the 50th percentile, save the 90th for year two

[32:38] – A client's Outer Banks property goes from being listed for sale to netting six figures

[35:09] – Cutting minimum stay from four nights to two adds $22,000 in a single quarter

5 Key Takeaways

1. Be Great at One Thing — Dan grew a full service short term rental company to 28 units, then cut it because they were only excellent at revenue. Being good at four businesses is worth less than being the best at one.
2. Stop Defending Your ADR — Owners who refuse to price below $300 a night while the market prices at $220 end up sitting empty, and empty is $0 a night. A $270 average across five nights beats $300 across two.
3. Write for Search, Not for You — Guests are starting to search in full sentences instead of clicking filter boxes. Neighborhood descriptions, plain language, and descriptively named photo files all feed the words that engine reads.
4. Price Year One for Velocity — New owners underwrite at the 90th percentile, miss the number, and get hurt. The first 6 to 12 months are for reviews and momentum, so run the pro forma at the 50th percentile and grow into the rest.
5. Experience Is the Moat — In a K shaped economy the higher end properties are pulling away. Look at what the top 5% in your market already has, then find the one thing past it, whether that's an indoor pool, a simulator, or something nobody there has tried.

Links & Resources

• Synergy Stays — https://www.synergystayslocal.com
• Follow Dan Rivers on Instagram — https://instagram.com/danriverslifebydesign
• Collective Genius Community — https://explorecg.com
• The Helm, the Charleston investor hub Dan co-owns

Enjoyed This Episode?

If you own short term rentals and have never once looked at a pacing report, the ADR section alone is worth rewinding. Send this to the investor you know who bought an Airbnb in 2021 and has been quietly wondering whether to sell it. Follow the show, leave a rating and review, and head to https://explorecg.com if you want to be in the room where these conversations happen.

Stella Han is the founder and CEO of Fractional, a platform that lets real estate operators legally raise capital from both accredited and unaccredited investors without setting up a fund or a syndication. Her investment club model runs about $3,500 and can be live in a day, against roughly $30,000 in securities attorney fees and a month of paperwork for a traditional fund.

Recorded live at the Collective Genius Q2 event in Oceanside, this conversation breaks down exactly where the club model fits for operators who have outgrown deal by deal private money but are not ready to run a fund as its own business. If you are managing a different lender on every flip and wondering whether a debt fund is the answer, this is the episode that shows you a third option.

Timeline Summary

[0:23] – Leon Barnes opens from the Collective Genius Q2 event in Oceanside, California

[1:23] – What Fractional does, letting operators raise from accredited and unaccredited investors legally

[2:05] – Who this is actually for, and why a fund is the wrong first move for most operators

[2:43] – The operator with a different private lender on every deal becomes an accidental loan servicer

[3:41] – The wall people hit, attorney fees, months of paperwork, and a network they legally can't touch

[4:19] – How the introduction to Fractional came through one of CG's own lenders

[5:21] – Leon's Cookie Monster analogy, why a fund becomes its own business you have to feed

[6:31] – Why a fund forces you to shut out roughly half your network and stop marketing

[7:07] – The club isn't a security under the SEC, so you can market it publicly

[7:49] – One club can fund multiple projects, so it scales without a new raise each time

[8:13] – Automated tax documents, K-1s, and distributions handled instead of hiring an admin

[9:27] – The debt club, building your own bank at 10% annualized and recycling capital for years

[10:28] – Typical raises run $250K to $5 million, with the CG room clustering at the higher end

[13:14] – Club members vote to approve deals, and why that transparency drives investor retention

[13:59] – A CG member's $700K debt club, RV park clubs, and a group rolling up candy stores

[16:01] – Where to find Stella and why she prefers one on one conversations on structure

5 Key Takeaways

1. A Fund Is Its Own Business — Setting one up is the easy part. Somebody has to raise for it continuously, and if you're already running a fix and flip operation at volume, that's a second full time job you didn't budget for.
2. Unaccredited Doesn't Mean Broke — Stella sees unaccredited investors bringing $25K to $125K each. A fund structure legally cuts most of your friends, family, and followers out of the deal, which is where a lot of the available capital actually sits.
3. The Club Isn't a Security — Because members vote to approve deals, the structure sits outside SEC securities rules. That means you can post about it, talk about it publicly, and raise from anyone who believes in you.
4. Build a Bank Instead of Chasing Deals — Rather than returning capital every six months and starting over, form a club, borrow at around 10% annualized, and recycle the same money across projects for two to three years.
5. Voting Is a Retention Feature — Bringing deals back for member approval sounds like friction, but it gives investors real visibility into the process. Operators using it are seeing investors come back with bigger checks on the next deal.

Links & Resources

• Fractional — https://www.fractional.app
• Follow Stella Han on Instagram — https://instagram.com/hellastellah
• Collective Genius Community — https://explorecg.com

Enjoyed This Episode?

If you've ever priced out a debt fund and walked away when you saw the attorney invoice, the club model is worth twenty minutes of your attention. Send this to the operator you know who's juggling six private lenders and quietly turning into a loan servicer. Follow the show, leave a rating and review, and head to https://explorecg.com if you want to be in the room where conversations like this one happen.

Chip Ferguson is the founder of Smooth Closing in Austin, Texas, a direct to seller home buying operation he built after spending eight to nine years as a full time online poker player. He went from flipping houses completely solo to running a team of nine in office and two overseas, with Q2 of this year landing 50% above his previous revenue record.

This conversation walks through the whole arc, including the single hire that doubled his deal count in 12 months, why standard operating procedures were the hinge that changed everything, and the hairy deal niche most investors walk away from. If you are a solo operator who suspects you have hit your personal ceiling, this episode shows you exactly what the next step looks like.

Timeline Summary

[1:30] – Leon welcomes Austin based CG member Chip Ferguson to the show

[2:41] – What Smooth Closing buys today, mostly wholesale with flips on rural and messy title situations

[5:01] – From Ohio to Northwestern, a school he picked by sorting national rankings

[5:45] – Catching the online poker boom in college and going pro before he turned 21

[8:25] – Biggest single night win, worst pot lost, and why the losses stick harder

[10:02] – Playing 30 tables at once online versus the slower grind of live tournaments

[12:19] – Buying his first duplex in 2009 and getting scammed by his first contractor

[13:35] – Entering wholesaling in 2014 by transcribing a podcast role play into a seller script

[19:22] – Doing all of it alone, acquiring, project managing the GC, and listing the flips himself

[21:39] – Hitting 36 deals two years in a row and reading that as proof of his ceiling

[22:38] – One acquisitions hire takes the business from 36 to 65 deals in the first 12 months

[25:37] – How lending to Sean Grabow sight unseen led to the introduction to Collective Genius

[28:49] – The SOP problem, when every process lives inside two founders' heads

[32:15] – Bringing dispo in house after years of handing deals to a third party company

[37:14] – The hairy deal niche, chasing broken chains of title and estranged heirs nobody else finds

[42:47] – Best quarter ever in Q1, then Q2 comes in 50% above the previous record

5 Key Takeaways

1. Hire What You Are Not Good At — Most operators are their own best salesperson, so acquisitions is usually the last seat to fill. Chip was honest that talking to sellers was not his strength, hired for it, and nearly doubled the business in a year.
2. A Repeated Number Is a Ceiling — Doing 36 deals two years running told him the constraint was him, not the market. When your output stops moving no matter how hard you work, that is a capacity problem and not an effort problem.
3. Process Beats Instinct at Scale — Running everything from memory works right up until you hire someone. Without documented procedures you will keep churning through people and blaming the hires for a gap you never filled.
4. Be the Worst Person in the Room — Chip joined CG specifically because everyone there was doing more volume than he was. The upside of being the least experienced person in the room is that everything you need has already been solved by someone sitting near you.
5. Nobody Chases the Hairy Deals — Broken chains of title, estranged siblings on an inherited property, owners who cannot be found. Chip closed 10 to 15 of these because most investors will not do the research, which makes it one of the least competitive deal sources available.

Links & Resources

• Collective Genius Community — https://explorecg.com
• Smooth Closing — https://www.smoothclosing.com
• Chip Ferguson on Instagram — https://instagram.com/thechipferguson
• Chip Ferguson on Facebook — https://facebook.com/thechipferguson
• Email Chip directly — [email protected]
• BiggerPockets Podcast — https://www.biggerpockets.com

Enjoyed This Episode?

If Chip going from 36 deals on a whiteboard to a team of eleven hit close to home, send this to the operator in your life who keeps saying they are too busy to document anything. The hairy deal conversation alone is worth a second listen, especially if you have let a title issue kill a contract this year. Follow the show, leave a rating and review, and head to https://explorecg.com if you want to be in the room with investors like Chip.