In this deeply honest episode of The Convocation Unscripted, historians Dr. Jemar Tisby, Kristin Kobes Du Mez, and Diana Butler Bass gather to reflect on the emotional toll of studying and speaking out on faith, politics, and power in America. As cultural crises mount, they explore the personal and professional exhaustion that comes from repeatedly warning of societal dangers—only to watch them unfold.

Together, they ask: What does it mean to persist as public voices of conscience? How do we process the discouragement that comes with being right too soon? And where might we find resilience in the face of recurring injustice?

Religion is always part of the story--even when it comes to U.S. foreign policy. Trump's decision to bomb nuclear sites in Iran, an action taken after Israel's military actions in the nation, are not simply geopolitical in their dimensions. Many Christians uncritically support the modern state of Israel because of a theological belief system called premillennial dispensationalism. Diana, Kristin, and Jemar dig into the history, the culture and the implications of this ideology. They also discuss ongoing ICE human rights abuses and the surprising projected victory of Zohran Mamdani as the Democratic Party nominee for mayor of New York City.

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The hosts of Convocation Unscripted discussed the tragic political assassination of Minnesota Rep. Melissa Hortman and her husband, Mark Horton, and the shootings of Minnesota Sen. John Hoffman and his wife, Yvette. It is now clear that these murders were carried out by Vance Boelter, a devout white evangelical Christian who held a degree in practical theology from the unaccredited Christ for the Nations Institute, which is associated with the New Apostolic Reformation movement. This worldview is steeped in spiritual warfare language that casts politics as a battle between God and Satan and in the US portrays Democrats and liberals as possessed by demons and instruments of evil. We talk about our dismay at the lack of outrage, particularly among Republicans and white evangelicals and the depraved used of this awful violence to score political points as Sen. Mike Lee has done. We concluded our conversation with reflections on the importance of Juneteenth, our newest federal holiday, and the importance of white Americans and white Christians particularly to incorporate a celebration of the holiday, and the history it commemorates, as part of our story.

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In this LIVE episode of The Convocation Unscripted, the team talks about the bright line Trump has crossed, as we witness his first overt attempts to turn America into a militarized police state. He’s creating a made-for-TV authoritarian reality show. It’s West Coast/East Coast split screen features Trump’s escalation of conflict by deploying the national guard and the marines in LA and his vain $45 million military parade in DC. It’s classic authoritarian propaganda: chaos and threatening brown people juxtaposed with displays of force and order—all meant to project the great white leader as the king, the only one who can save the country. We also talked about the tragic death of Jennifer Lyell, who survived alleged sexual abuse at the hands of her Southern Baptist seminary professor. After speaking out, she was smeared by church leaders, lost her job, and ultimately lost her life at age 47. Meanwhile, at the SBC annual meeting--amid this loss, the denomination's own refusal to address rampant sexual abuse in its own ranks, and the attacks on our democracy by the man Southern Baptists were instrumental in bringing to power--the leaders at the meeting determined that the most pressing issues God was calling them to address were overturning the legality of marriage equality and banning women from being pastors. Finally, we talk about the importance of resistance in all its forms and about empathy and solidarity as the antidote to authoritarianism.

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In this episode, the Convocation Unscripted team discussed President Trump's bonkers speech and dishonorable behavior at West Point's graduation ceremony and his inappropriate Memorial Day message on Truth Social, where he attacked political opponents rather than honoring fallen soldiers. Diana and Kristin expressed dismay at Trump's lack of respect for military traditions and values--noting that Trump seems only to honor himself while disparaging soldiers who died or were captured as losers and suckers--while Jemar and Robby highlighted how the President is repositioning national holidays as platforms for political propaganda. The discussion concluded with deeper reflections on the values of honor, service, and self-sacrifice and their religious roots. The Convocation Unscripted team also reflected on our recent retreat, where we decided to continue producing the Convocation Unscripted podcast beyond Trump's first 100 days. We heard from you all, and we agree, that TCU is helping provide all of us with a weekly dose of sanity and community. We’ve also decided to open the comments you YouTube, so please share your thoughts below on this episode!

Show Notes:

This episode is a whirlwind! With critical headlines stacking up by the day, we sprint through urgent stories shaping our moment:

--South African President Ramaphosa’s visit to the White House,

--the Supreme Court’s shocking decision on religious schools in Oklahoma,

--Pete Hegseth’s dominionist prayer rally,

--a tragic shooting in DC raising tensions around antisemitism and Zionism,

--and the political targeting of Harvard and international students.

Plus, we recap the joy and connection we found at The Convocation Unscripted retreat.Like we said, a whirlwind—but it’s honest, grounded, and deeply necessary.

P.S. Here's the LINK to Lisa Sharon Harper's article we reference in the episode.

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On this episode of The Convocation Unscripted, we discussed the breaking news of the historic appointment of Cardinal Robert Francis Prevost, who chose the name Pope Leo XIV, as the first Pope from the United States. We expressed relief and hope at this unexpected appointment. The early signs are that Prevost--a close associate of Pope Francis who has duel U.S. and Peruvian citizenship and spent more than half his career as a missionary in Peru--will offer a strong moral and theological stance against abuses of power and stand for the dignity of all, particularly immigrants and the poor. We also noted the potential political implications of Pope Leo XIV's appointment, particularly his recent rebuke of J.D. Vance’s distortion of Catholic theology related to “the order of loves” (Ordo Amoris), which Vance attempted to use to justify the Trump administration’s anti-immigrant rhetoric and policies. “JD Vance is wrong,” Prevost posted on his X account. “Jesus doesn’t ask us to rank our love for others.”

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The Convocation Unscripted team—three historians and a sociologist who study religion in America—launched this podcast the spring before the 2024 election. After Trump’s election we stepped up the frequency, with a commitment to providing weekly research, analysis, and insights through Trump’s first 100 days. In this capstone episode, we reflect on the results of a new PRRI poll, which illuminates the yawning racial and religious divides in America that Trump has exploited during his rise to power, with a focus on the white Christians (principally white evangelical Protestants but also majorities of white non-evangelical Protestants and white Catholics) who put Trump into the White House and who continue to provide support and moral cover for even his most unlawful, cruel, and racist policies. But we also note some hopeful signs. At 100 days, Trump’s approval rating is underwater and lower than any other president not named Trump at this stage in his term since World War II. Most Americans oppose his harsh plans like militarized internment camps for undocumented immigrants, tariffs, and most see through the farce of his so-called “Anti-Christian Bias Task Force.” And a slim majority also now believe Trump is a dangerous dictator whose power should be limited before he destroys American democracy. We also reflect on the ways particularly white Christians who see the dangers Trump represents to our faith and nation can speak out in our churches and local communities.

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On this episode, the Convocation Unscripted team reflects on Pope Francis's impact on the Catholic Church and the world. The participants reflect on Francis's unconventional approach to the papacy, including his choice of name, simple lifestyle, and compassionate focus on the poor and marginalized. They highlight his efforts to make the Church more inclusive, particularly towards LGBTQ+ individuals and immigrants. In the second half of the conversation, the team draws attention to a DOJ press release summarizing the first meeting of the Trump's Anti-Christian Bias Task Force, arguing that it misrepresents Christianity and distorts facts to claim persecution. They analyze specific examples from the press release, such as fines against Christian universities for lying to students or failing to report sexual assaults, which are distorted and presented as anti-Christian bias.

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This week Jews are observing the eight days of Passover, while Christians are observing Holy Week leading up to Easter Sunday. In this episode, The Convocation Unscripted team (minus Jemar who is on the road) discuss the parallels between the crucifixion of Jesus and the current political moment, particularly the abduction and disappearance of Kilmar Abrega Garcia without due process. We express concern about the lack of action from Congress resisting Trump’s attacks on the rule of law and democratic norms and the need to move beyond partisanship to save our democracy. On the Democratic side of the aisle, we express frustration that most have been reluctant to act beyond the normal expectations of their office; but we give thankful shout outs to senators Cory Booker, Chris Van Holland, AOC, Bernie Sanders for their actions. On the Republican side, we acknowledge and appreciate Sen. Lisa Murkowski’s recent confession of fear for her own safety, but we also note that if just four sitting Republican senators would even temporarily side with the 45 Democratic and 2 Independent senators, they could stop the worst of Trump’s actions and halt our nation’s slide into fascism.

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