The Resilient Recruiter

Have you ever wondered how a top-performing recruiter becomes a firm owner? Katharine Wilcox, President of Resource Mosaic, shares her journey. After joining the firm in 2011, Katharine took over the business in 2022.

In this episode, she discusses her transition from director to owner, her challenges and the strategies that drove her success in executive search. Whether you’re a recruiter considering firm ownership or looking to boost your performance, Katharine’s insights on building trust, hustling, and executing in the competitive world of accounting and finance recruitment are not to be missed. 

With a background in entertainment and accounting, Katharine boasts a proven track record of connecting top talent with growth opportunities. Katharine is a member of the Pinnacle Society, a fantastic group of recruiters who are among the top producers in the United States.

Episode Outline and Highlights

 

• [01:58] Katharine’s background in a talent agency and how she went into recruiting.
• [06:47] Discussion on how Katharine transitioned from being a director to becoming a business owner.
• [19:43] Building teams that drive company growth.
• [25:36] What is the secret to building trust with your clients and candidates?
• [32:25] Why Katharine loves MPC marketing and her process.
• [39:54] Initiating conversations with hard-to-reach roles.
• [47:04] What a support team looks like for big billers.
• [50:11] Quick Q&A on Katharine’s operational structure and business model.
• [52:55] Katharine reveals the biggest challenges she had to face as a recruiter.

 

Three Key Elements When Building Effective Teams to Drive Company Growth

 

One key highlight in my conversation with Katharine is how she builds trust with clients and candidates when building teams in key projects. She fondly recalls how her first hires eventually became CEO and CFO, which makes her extremely proud. “So if I get a certain number, hey, we're looking for these, I just have to go find that soft skills, that personality, that desire, that career drive, whatever it is that they're looking for that will help drive the company's growth and change and hopefully last for a really long time.”

 

Katharine shared three critical elements when building an effective team that drives the company’s growth: 

 

1. Building trust - she emphasized the importance of understanding client needs and having honest conversations.
2. Hustle - Katharine encourages showing up every day and committing to the craft..
3. Delivery & Execution - Katharine values getting the job done quickly and efficiently.

 

She concluded, “ But, yeah, it's, that combination of trust and hustle, delivery and execution is just such an important piece to what we do on a daily basis.”

 

Initiating Conversations with Hard-to-Reach Roles

 

Some recruiters struggle to reach hard-to-reach roles, such as CEOs and portfolio owners. This may only sometimes be the case for Katharine. When we discussed her approach to MPC Marketing, I learned that it enables her to connect with key roles like board members and CEOs. She shared a few tips on how she does this.

 

She shared that the caliber of talent will always get you the conversation. She thinks working with good talent (MPC) is important as it will likely get people interested. But this is not enough; you also need to get creative in getting your talent information across. She shared her conversation style to build trust, including using her personality and being genuine. 

 

The other thing is the mindset. As we all know, doing campaigns is also a volume game. Katharine is very much aware of this: “A lot of people are never going to answer my phone or answer my calls. And I don't take offense to it. Some people are just not going to like me. Right. They're not going to want to work with me. I'm okay with that. So. But I'm going to keep trying. And you never know. Maybe I'll break through at some point.”

 

Katharine Reveals Her Biggest Challenge

 

I love stories of resilient recruiters, so I had to hear about Katharine's biggest challenges in her career. Most successful recruiters face the biggest challenges, and we can pick up nuggets of wisdom from their experience.

 

She shared how they were knocked out during COVID-19, but that did not stop her from working. She kept on talking to people, marketing candidates, and positioning herself. “So that was, you know, getting. Having the ability to continue to make those calls and show up, even though you're hearing no for six, seven, eight months? It was hard.”

 

What motivated her to stay in the game and keep pushing? “It was simple. I just knew any day could be the day to make that break. Eventually. I knew the dam was going to break. Right. I knew that people had hiring needs. I knew that people were looking for jobs or were not happy in their current roles. And I just knew that if I showed up every single day and did what I do, that at some point it was going to pay off.”

 

Our Sponsor

This podcast is proudly sponsored by i-intro 

 

i-intro® is an end-to-end retained recruitment platform. Their technology and methodology allow recruiters to differentiate themselves from the competition, win more retained business, bigger fees, and increase their billings. Their software combined with world-class training enables you to transition from transactional, contingency recruiter to consultative, retained recruiter. Instead of being perceived as a “me too” vendor, you’ll be positioned as a “me only” solutions provider. Be sure to mention Mark Whitby or The Resilient Recruiter. Book your free, no-obligation consultation here: https://recruitmentcoach.com/retained

 

Katharine Wilcox Bio and Contact Info

 

Katharine Wilcox, President of Resource Mosaic, brings a unique blend of expertise and leadership to the world of executive search. With a background spanning from entertainment to accounting and finance, Katharine has a proven track record of connecting top talent with opportunities for growth.

 

Katharine joined Resource Mosaic in 2011 after 6 years with the Lucas Group as a Senior Partner on the accounting/finance executive search team in Atlanta. In 2022, she took on additional responsibilities and ownership of the firm as President.

 

At Resource Mosaic, Katharine specializes in recruiting exceptional accounting and finance professionals across the Southeast, while also supporting clients' leadership needs in various functions, including HR, operations, legal, and sales/marketing. Her approach is rooted in navigating complex challenges, identifying hard-to-find talent, and aligning leadership with business objectives. She is passionate about connecting talent and driving growth for companies in Atlanta and across the Southeast.

 

Beyond her professional achievements, Katharine can be found chasing around her 6-year old twins and serves on the Board of the Atlanta BeltLine Partnership, working to create a more connected and vibrant city. Originally from San Diego, she graduated from UCLA in 1999 with a degree in communication studies.

 

• Katharine on LinkedIn
• Resource Mosaic website link

 

People and Resources Mentioned

• Monte Merz on LinkedIn
• Nate Zimmerman on LinkedIn
• Jen Meyer on LinkedIn
• The Pinnacle Society

Connect with Mark Whitby

• Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call
• Mark on LinkedIn, 
• Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby
• Mark on Facebook
• Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach

 

Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter

If you’ve been enjoying the podcast, please take two minutes to leave a review. Your review is greatly appreciated because it helps us attract a bigger audience and help more recruiters.

Multi-hire team-build projects can be profitable if strategized clearly and executed effectively. Where do you find opportunities to engage in multi-hire team-build projects? What should be your main areas of focus for successfully implementing? Our guest, Paul Press, is here to give insights! 

 

Paul is the Managing Partner and Founder of Press & Associates, a leading executive search firm specializing in recruiting top technology talent for private equity firms and their portfolio companies. Before founding Press & Associates, Paul Press built a well-rounded career with experience in an executive search firm and an in-house talent acquisition position.

 

In this episode, you will hear valuable insights into leveraging experience as an in-house recruiter, applying MPC marketing strategies, and successfully navigating the complexities of multi-hire team-build projects.

 

Episode Outline and Highlights

 

03:25 Paul’s recruiting backstory and how he launched his own firm.

06:37 Learnings from working in-house translating to running his own agency.

12:30 When to consider hiring a third-party recruiter from an in-house recruitment perspective.

18:35 Transitioning to Private Equity expertise.

23:11 Two main areas on winning multi-hire team build projects.

35:59 The risks of handling large-sized projects and how to mitigate them.

40:15 Paul shares the story of his $450k fee and MPC strategy discussion.

51:47 What Paul’s MPC marketing strategy looks like.

58:04 Upcoming exciting times for Paul and Press Associates acquisition.

 

Leveraging Experience as an In-House Recruiter

 

Before founding Press & Associates, Paul built a well-rounded career in an executive search firm and an in-house talent acquisition position. He has always aspired to set up his own agency, and this experience was a stepping stone that gave him a complete perspective on what a successful search firm should look like.

 

Paul gave his insights and compared the approach from an in-house to an agency perspective. He emphasized the value of building and nurturing relationships on the in-house side while investing heavily in business development on the other. From an in-house perspective, I also wanted to know the primary considerations when hiring a third-party recruiter. Who are the most successful ones? What companies really did poorly? Paul gave his answer: 

 

“I would say the biggest thing is the ones who took the time to be personalized, to make a very human approach and connection, and who were very empathetic; those were the ones that really stood out. It's amazing how transparent people's approaches are and how easy it is to tell when there's an email sequencing campaign going on, with an email coming out to you every kind of two or three … So it is very easy to tell kind of what's being automated, what's actual human touch and who are people that want to be in it for the long run versus, hey, I've got my monthly targets to hear.”

 

Two Areas of Focus to Win Multi-Hire Team Build Projects 

 

A key topic Paul and I discussed is his success in doing multi-hire team-build projects. The main takeaway is this: multi-hire team build results from placing a key executive. By ensuring that great relationships are built and the best experience for the executive is provided, a potential opportunity to then build out the team underneath them will likely happen.

 

This idea came about based on Paul’s previous in-house experience. “I'd say it kind of goes back to lessons learned when I went in-house and was building those relationships and understanding the big picture behind those hires and what those companies were trying to achieve. And that, combined with the private equity space, really kind of mesh well together.”

 

Paul shared two main areas of focus to be successful in this approach:

 

1. Communication - “It's certainly a communication game. In multi-hire campaigns, there are usually multiple hiring managers. So you got to figure out each individual style of communication, building relationships with those people.”
2. Project Management - making sure you're implementing your standard procedures in terms of market mapping, talent pipelining, and going through your own internal processes.

 

Paul also shared the most common challenges you will experience in multi-hire team-build projects and the steps they took to mitigate them.

 

MPC Strategy Resulting to a $450k Fee

 

An achievement Paul shared with me is how he was able to make a placement with a $450k fee. He made a placement using the MPC (Most Placeable Candidate) marketing approach. Many recruiters will find this part of our conversation relatable because although this may be familiar to many recruiters, some will tell you that you can’t apply MPC marketing to executive recruitment. 

 

We discussed Paul’s mindset on this strategy, and he shared how he executes it. We discussed proactive candidate representation and effective KPIs, such as making 5 introductions daily.  We also agreed on this critical point: the goal is not to place the candidate. The goal is primarily to get your foot in the door to start a conversation, demonstrate the caliber of your network and the people you represent, and come to them with interesting ideas that could bring value to their business.

 

Our Sponsor

 

This podcast is proudly sponsored by i-intro 

 

i-intro® is an end-to-end retained recruitment platform. Their technology and methodology allow recruiters to differentiate themselves from the competition, win more retained business, bigger fees, and increase their billings. Their software combined with world-class training enables you to transition from transactional, contingency recruiter to consultative, retained recruiter. Instead of being perceived as a “me too” vendor, you’ll be positioned as a “me only” solutions provider. Be sure to mention Mark Whitby or The Resilient Recruiter. Book your free, no-obligation consultation here: https://recruitmentcoach.com/retained

 

Paul Press Bio and Contact Info

 

Paul is the Managing Partner and Founder of Press & Associates. Paul started Press & Associates in 2016 with the goal of building the number one search firm hiring technology talent for Private Equity firms and their portfolio companies. Since its inception, Paul has built close and long-lasting partnerships with numerous globally renowned private equity firms, helping them make key hires in their value creation team and numerous c-suite appointments across their portfolio companies - all within the technology function.

 

Prior to founding Press & Associates, Paul built a well-rounded career in executive search working for a boutique search firm (Mackinnon Bruce), one of the largest talent acquisition firms in the world (Hays), as well as an in-house talent acquisition position with Murphy Oil looking after hiring key positions across North America.

 

Paul has a BA (Hons) in Managing Performance from the University of Leeds and is accredited by the Institute of Retrained Search.

 

• Paul on LinkedIn
• Press and Associates website link
• Press and Associates on YouTube
• Press and Associates on X (Twitter)
• Press and Associates on Facebook
• Press and Associates on Instagram

 

People and Resources Mentioned

 

• How Clients Buy, by Tom McMakin & Doug Fletcher
• Loxo 
• Dripify
• Rob White of Tempting Talent on LinkedIn

 

Connect with Mark Whitby

• Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call
• Mark on LinkedIn, 
• Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby
• Mark on Facebook
• Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach

 

Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter

If you’ve been enjoying the podcast, please take two minutes to leave a review. Your review is greatly appreciated because it helps us attract a bigger audience and help more recruiters.

Multi-hire team-build projects can be profitable if strategized clearly and executed effectively. Where do you find opportunities to engage in multi-hire team-build projects? What should be your main areas of focus for successfully implementing? Our guest, Paul Press, is here to give insights! 

 

Paul is the Managing Partner and Founder of Press & Associates, a leading executive search firm specializing in recruiting top technology talent for private equity firms and their portfolio companies. Before founding Press & Associates, Paul Press built a well-rounded career with experience in an executive search firm and an in-house talent acquisition position.

 

In this episode, you will hear valuable insights into leveraging experience as an in-house recruiter, applying MPC marketing strategies, and successfully navigating the complexities of multi-hire team-build projects.

 

Episode Outline and Highlights

 

03:25 Paul’s recruiting backstory and how he launched his own firm.

06:37 Learnings from working in-house translating to running his own agency.

12:30 When to consider hiring a third-party recruiter from an in-house recruitment perspective.

18:35 Transitioning to Private Equity expertise.

23:11 Two main areas on winning multi-hire team build projects.

35:59 The risks of handling large-sized projects and how to mitigate them.

40:15 Paul shares the story of his $450k fee and MPC strategy discussion.

51:47 What Paul’s MPC marketing strategy looks like.

58:04 Upcoming exciting times for Paul and Press Associates acquisition.

 

Leveraging Experience as an In-House Recruiter

 

Before founding Press & Associates, Paul built a well-rounded career in an executive search firm and an in-house talent acquisition position. He has always aspired to set up his own agency, and this experience was a stepping stone that gave him a complete perspective on what a successful search firm should look like.

 

Paul gave his insights and compared the approach from an in-house to an agency perspective. He emphasized the value of building and nurturing relationships on the in-house side while investing heavily in business development on the other. From an in-house perspective, I also wanted to know the primary considerations when hiring a third-party recruiter. Who are the most successful ones? What companies really did poorly? Paul gave his answer: 

 

“I would say the biggest thing is the ones who took the time to be personalized, to make a very human approach and connection, and who were very empathetic; those were the ones that really stood out. It's amazing how transparent people's approaches are and how easy it is to tell when there's an email sequencing campaign going on, with an email coming out to you every kind of two or three … So it is very easy to tell kind of what's being automated, what's actual human touch and who are people that want to be in it for the long run versus, hey, I've got my monthly targets to hear.”

 

Two Areas of Focus to Win Multi-Hire Team Build Projects 

 

A key topic Paul and I discussed is his success in doing multi-hire team-build projects. The main takeaway is this: multi-hire team build results from placing a key executive. By ensuring that great relationships are built and the best experience for the executive is provided, a potential opportunity to then build out the team underneath them will likely happen.

 

This idea came about based on Paul’s previous in-house experience. “I'd say it kind of goes back to lessons learned when I went in-house and was building those relationships and understanding the big picture behind those hires and what those companies were trying to achieve. And that, combined with the private equity space, really kind of mesh well together.”

 

Paul shared two main areas of focus to be successful in this approach:

 

1. Communication - “It's certainly a communication game. In multi-hire campaigns, there are usually multiple hiring managers. So you got to figure out each individual style of communication, building relationships with those people.”
2. Project Management - making sure you're implementing your standard procedures in terms of market mapping, talent pipelining, and going through your own internal processes.

 

Paul also shared the most common challenges you will experience in multi-hire team-build projects and the steps they took to mitigate them.

 

MPC Strategy Resulting to a $450k Fee

 

An achievement Paul shared with me is how he was able to make a placement with a $450k fee. He made a placement using the MPC (Most Placeable Candidate) marketing approach. Many recruiters will find this part of our conversation relatable because although this may be familiar to many recruiters, some will tell you that you can’t apply MPC marketing to executive recruitment. 

 

We discussed Paul’s mindset on this strategy, and he shared how he executes it. We discussed proactive candidate representation and effective KPIs, such as making 5 introductions daily.  We also agreed on this critical point: the goal is not to place the candidate. The goal is primarily to get your foot in the door to start a conversation, demonstrate the caliber of your network and the people you represent, and come to them with interesting ideas that could bring value to their business.

 

Our Sponsor

 

This podcast is proudly sponsored by i-intro 

 

i-intro® is an end-to-end retained recruitment platform. Their technology and methodology allow recruiters to differentiate themselves from the competition, win more retained business, bigger fees, and increase their billings. Their software combined with world-class training enables you to transition from transactional, contingency recruiter to consultative, retained recruiter. Instead of being perceived as a “me too” vendor, you’ll be positioned as a “me only” solutions provider. Be sure to mention Mark Whitby or The Resilient Recruiter. Book your free, no-obligation consultation here: https://recruitmentcoach.com/retained

 

Paul Press Bio and Contact Info

 

Paul is the Managing Partner and Founder of Press & Associates. Paul started Press & Associates in 2016 with the goal of building the number one search firm hiring technology talent for Private Equity firms and their portfolio companies. Since its inception, Paul has built close and long-lasting partnerships with numerous globally renowned private equity firms, helping them make key hires in their value creation team and numerous c-suite appointments across their portfolio companies - all within the technology function.

 

Prior to founding Press & Associates, Paul built a well-rounded career in executive search working for a boutique search firm (Mackinnon Bruce), one of the largest talent acquisition firms in the world (Hays), as well as an in-house talent acquisition position with Murphy Oil looking after hiring key positions across North America.

 

Paul has a BA (Hons) in Managing Performance from the University of Leeds and is accredited by the Institute of Retrained Search.

 

• Paul on LinkedIn
• Press and Associates website link
• Press and Associates on YouTube
• Press and Associates on X (Twitter)
• Press and Associates on Facebook
• Press and Associates on Instagram

 

People and Resources Mentioned

 

• How Clients Buy, by Tom McMakin & Doug Fletcher
• Loxo 
• Dripify
• Rob White of Tempting Talent on LinkedIn

 

Connect with Mark Whitby

• Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call
• Mark on LinkedIn, 
• Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby
• Mark on Facebook
• Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach

 

Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter

If you’ve been enjoying the podcast, please take two minutes to leave a review. Your review is greatly appreciated because it helps us attract a bigger audience and help more recruiters.

Helen joined us three years ago to share how to attract 70% more diverse talent by leveraging DEI - diversity, equity and inclusion. This time, she returns as a special guest to share an amazing feat - the platform she co-founded, Diversely.io, has just been recently acquired. This means more sourcing and recruitment firms can now access the platform, meaning more recruiters and sourcing firms can embed DEI in their hiring process.

What fascinates me more is Helen’s strategies and lessons learned from exiting Diversely.io. She shared strategies and things she would have done differently, which I am sure many of us will also learn from. Overall, Helen believes that the key to success is following a purpose-driven business model.

Helen McGuire is an exited founder, author, advisor, mother, podcast host and DEI changemaker. 

Helen is a leading figure in DEI and business strategy and is renowned for her impactful initiatives. She founded Hopscotch. work, the first women's careers platform in the Middle East and Asia, and her journey led to the creation of Diversely.io, a groundbreaking AI platform acquired by The Access Group in 2023.

 

As the host of The D&Igest podcast and author of the upcoming book  'The Female Scale', Helen's expertise extends to coaching female founders and advocating for purposeful businesses globally. 

 

Episode Outline and Highlights

 

• [02:50] Helen shares updates on Diversely.io’s acquisition by the Access Group.
• [08:54] What barriers do entrepreneurs with diverse backgrounds face when starting a business?
• [13:00] Encouraging more women to take the entrepreneurial leap.
• [17:33] Walkthrough on Diversely.io’s exit process and how a purpose-driven business model made it happen.
• [30:00] Things that Helen would have done differently when undergoing acquisition.
• [38:31] Teaser on Helen’s new book, The Female Scale.

 

Embedding DEI Into the Business Strategy

 

Diversity, equity, and inclusion are critical in the hiring process. This is essential because it is the right thing to do and a strategic business decision that can lead to more innovative and successful organizations.

 

I had Helen as a guest three years ago, and I am fascinated by her current position on championing DEI in the recruitment industry. She is a great example of an astounding business leader who advocates equity and opportunity for lesser-represented groups.  As a female founder, you will hear insightful perspectives on how underrepresentation affects certain groups and how to empower more women to launch their own businesses.

 

She is about to finish a new book, The Female Scale, which will provide insights on this issue. “It's not written specifically for women, but it's written with a very female lens. You know, the challenges that you encounter as a woman setting up a business, and there are, you know, so many female-led businesses, startups, smaller businesses out there.”

 

In this episode, Helen shared an astounding feat: They could exit Diversely.io, an end-to-end hiring platform that uses tech to reduce bias in businesses' hiring processes. By being acquired, she believes this platform will be more accessible to a much larger audience of sourcing and recruitment firms.

 

Learnings on Being Acquired and Exit Strategies

 

As a business owner, you may relate with me if you are also fascinated with stories of how exits and acquisitions work. I wanted Helen to walk me through what was involved in their acquisition process. She shared detailed stories of how it started, what was expected, and what happened. She also shared curve balls and how their expertise and networks played major roles in making the exit happen.

 

In hindsight, here are some learnings that Helen shared if you ever plan to exit or scale your business:

 

• Be more prepared for the level of due diligence you must go through.
• Be well-organized: ensuring all relevant agreements and data sheets are in one place.
• Invest in good lawyers and accountants - they are absolute lifesavers.

 

What resonated with me the most was Helen’s idea of the exit. It has always been purpose-driven.

 

“And you have to kind of, so when you're thinking about selling your business, it's not just about what I need from it as a dollar value. What can I also achieve off the back of that? What does that give me as a founder, as someone who's going on this journey?”

 

Building a Purpose-Driven Business Model

 

Building a business, especially focusing on recruiting and sourcing, is not always profit-focused. The vision and mission statements need to be clear, as the impact we can have on people can be life-changing. 

 

This aligns with what Helen believes when creating a purpose-driven business model. This is how she described it: 

 

“And it wasn't all about the dollar value. I think when you set up a purpose-driven business, it's very important to keep profit and profitability in mind because it's hard to create impact without that. It's not sustainable as a business or as an idea. But equally, you've got to balance it with, you know, what am I doing here to solve this problem, and how can I solve this problem? And we would have taken another god knows how many years to try and get to the scale that…”

 

When Helen co-founded Diversely.io, it was to solve her own frustrations as a female in a male-dominated industry. Her purpose was clear from the start - to help women and under-represented groups gain fair opportunities. This purpose-driven business model contributes well to her current successes and future aspirations.

 

Our Sponsor

 

This podcast is proudly sponsored by i-intro 

 

i-intro® is an end-to-end retained recruitment platform. Their technology and methodology allow recruiters to differentiate themselves from the competition, win more retained business, bigger fees, and increase their billings. Their software combined with world-class training enables you to transition from transactional, contingency recruiter to consultative, retained recruiter. Instead of being perceived as a “me too” vendor, you’ll be positioned as a “me only” solutions provider. Be sure to mention Mark Whitby or The Resilient Recruiter. Book your free, no-obligation consultation here: https://recruitmentcoach.com/retained

 

Helen McGuire Bio and Contact Info

 

Founded the first women’s careers platform in the Middle East and Asia—Hopscotch.work—in  2015, Helen has won numerous industry awards for her work and led part of UN Women’s efforts to increase gender representation in the UAE. 

 

To scale the impact of her mission beyond gender, Helen joined the tech start-up accelerator Antler in January 2020 with a vision to conquer the issues around DEI in the workplace through the use of technology.  Diversely.io was that solution; a multi-awarded global AI-driven platform built alongside her co-founder,  Hayley Bakker, and with the support of industry investors over four years. One of the world’s leading software companies, The Access Group, acquired the platform for an undisclosed amount in 2023 and continues to be integrated across its portfolio. 

 

As host of The D&Igest podcast, Helen now utilises her formidable communications skills to give those who are making a difference in the global DEI space a voice. Professionally, she focuses on ensuring DEI is at the forefront of business strategy and coaches female founders on holistic business strategy. Her first book - ‘The Female Scale’ - is due in 2024, and she speaks and advises globally on the topic of DEI and creating purposeful businesses. 

 

A communications professional of twenty years, Helen began her career in London, achieving her dream  role at BBC Radio 1 in her early twenties, going on to produce, DJ and present for the music industry in over 

 

• Helen on LinkedIn
• The D&Igest Podcast link

 

People and Resources Mentioned

 

• The Access Group website link 
• Justin McGuire on LinkedIn

 

Related Podcast You Might Enjoy

 

• TRR#57 Diversity as a Differentiator – How Recruiters Can Attract 70% More Diverse Talent, with Helen McGuire

 

Connect with Mark Whitby

• Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call
• Mark on LinkedIn, 
• Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby
• Mark on Facebook
• Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach

 

Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter

If you’ve been enjoying the podcast, please take two minutes to leave a review. Your review is greatly appreciated because it helps us attract a bigger audience and help more recruiters.

 

Measuring your company's economic influence drives self-motivation and is a powerful tool for marketing and business development. Jennifer Meyer of Govig Executive Search joins us in this episode to give insight on using specific metrics to measure your economic impact and how you can communicate it with potential clients.

 

Jen has a lifetime cash-in of $20M over her 26 years in the industry. She’s the SVP of Strategic Partnerships at Govig & Associates, where she’s at the helm of business development. She leads the overall team of 27 recruiters, actively front-facing with clients and playing a significant role in surpassing $14M in results.

 

Jen’s recruitment efforts have been vital in assisting small to mid-size firms, particularly those under private equity, to double in size. Jen’s placements have contributed to an economic impact exceeding $1B.

 

Episode Outline and Highlights

 

• [01:51] Jen’s start in the recruitment industry as a college intern.
• [10:09] Differentiating techniques in communication and business development.
• [19:06] “Speak to them in their language”
• [28:02] Training your team to apply the TSI (Targeted Sales Information) approach.
• [40:00] How to quantify your economic impact.
• [50:41] A boutique recruitment firm’s differentiators against the bigger organizations.
• [54:53] Discussion on team development strategies.
• [59:18] Jen’s take on work and life harmony.

 

Quantifying the Economic Impact of Your Recruitment Business

 

Measuring your company’s economic impact can be significantly beneficial for at least two reasons. The first one is self-motivation; knowing how you contribute to the broader economy can positively impact and fulfill. The second one is on the marketing and business development side. It can help potential clients understand the bigger value you will bring to their organization. 

 

Jen shared how she is able to track her placement’s economic contribution using specific metrics. Her placements overall have contributed to more than $1B in economic impact. She shared their formula: “We always talk about the size of our billings or our business in relation to what were invoicing or what our split was in relation to cash in. But we really should be talking about the salaries of the people that we place, you know, if you were going to relate it that way…Yeah, it does go beyond that, though, where you are at the, you know, again, at the basic level, you are affecting the person, and you're affecting the hiring manager. So that could be a times two, right?”

 

Here is a takeaway: Start trying to calculate the individual impact you're having in the world, particularly the positive impact you're having for your clients, and try to quantify that. If you have the appetite, even go back in history and try to work it out. But even just starting right now, try and figure out what difference you're making because that's really motivating!

 

Differentiating in the Business Development Side

 

A key topic I wanted to discuss with Jen is how she is able to differentiate, especially on the client acquisition and business development side of things. Jen has always been consistently recognized as a top performer in her career. I wanted to pick her brains on her approach when it comes to communicating with potential leads and candidates, and she surely did not disappoint. Jen revealed specific tips and verbiage that you may want also to use. Here are some key takeaways:

 

• Focus on authenticity and listening more by asking curious questions.
• Avoid typical questions like “Can I help you?” or “How are you doing?”
• Use power phrases such as “Are you in a place where you can talk confidentially?” or “I’ve only got a minute” instead of “Have you got a minute?”
• The effective use of body language.

 

She explained, “Whether you're 30 minutes into the business or you're 30 years into the business, everybody is saying the same thing and overcoming objections in the same way. So what can you do that just sounds different? You know what I mean? And I think if you think about it from a perspective of what that person is going to hear based on their world helps you...And so if you speak to them in their language, they get it.”

 

You will also hear Jen’s insights on developing her team to elevate their levels on the business development side, which is quite similar to the TSI (Targeted Sales Information) approach.

 

Team Development Strategies as a Billing Manager

 

A billing manager is a critical and challenging role in a recruitment firm. The role entails ensuring individual profitability while leading your team to do the same. Jen has been passionate about mentoring and developing her people, so I wanted to hear her methods in helping her team be successful. Jen elaborated on the following topics:

 

• Consistent deskside training.
• Real-time feedback and call reviews.
• The importance of teaching structure.
• Listening for opportunities in candidate interviews.
• Using a checklist.

 

Our Sponsor

 

This podcast is proudly sponsored by i-intro 

 

i-intro® is an end-to-end retained recruitment platform. Their technology and methodology allow recruiters to differentiate themselves from the competition, win more retained business, bigger fees, and increase their billings. Their software combined with world-class training enables you to transition from transactional, contingency recruiter to consultative, retained recruiter. Instead of being perceived as a “me too” vendor, you’ll be positioned as a “me only” solutions provider. Be sure to mention Mark Whitby or The Resilient Recruiter. Book your free, no-obligation consultation here: https://recruitmentcoach.com/retained

 

Jennifer Meyer Bio and Contact Info

 

Over the past 26 years, Jen has been a guiding force, significantly influencing numerous organizations and professionals. She has generated over $20M in cumulative cash-in, contributing to an economic impact exceeding $1B. This remarkable achievement includes the highest fee, which is over $300k. Currently serving as the SVP of Strategic Partnerships at Govig & Associates, Jen plays a crucial role in propelling the company forward. She's at the helm of business development and leads the overall team of 27 recruiters, actively front-facing with clients and playing a significant role in surpassing $14M in results.

 

Jen's professional journey began with a 6-year tenure at an MRI office, where she consistently ranked in the top 10% among approximately 5000 recruiters at that time. She then co-founded North Coast ExecuSearch, Inc., where she served as a billing manager for 14 years, maintaining a position in the top 50 out of 750 offices worldwide. Jen's recruitment efforts have been vital in assisting small to mid-size firms, particularly those under private equity, to not only meet but also exceed their growth objectives, with several doubling in size and achieving revenues over $1 billion.

 

Jen’s work ethic is not driven by the desire for accolades but by a deep-seated passion for mentorship and forging lasting relationships. She believes in the collective improvement of the industry, emphasizing the importance of recognizing recruiters as valuable consultants and ensuring they are compensated fairly for their expertise. Her remarkable career is enhanced with numerous accolades, including her 24-time recognition as a "Pacesetter" Award Winner, her induction into the Hall of Fame and The Ring of Honor within the MRINetwork, and receiving the prestigious Alan R. Schonberg Lifetime Achievement Award for her revenue contributions and character and her acceptance to the Pinnacle Society over a year ago.  Not to mention she is very active in a commitment to community service, most recently acting as the President of the MRINetwork Charitable Foundation, where she led the board to raise money for Shriners Hospitals for Children.

 

As Jennifer shares her insights, her quiet confidence, impressive achievements, and unwavering dedication to talent development serve as a powerful reminder of the influence we can all have in shaping the futures of many.

 

• Jen on LinkedIn
• Govig Executive Search website link
• Govig on Facebook

 

People and Resources Mentioned

 

• Katherine Jerald on LinkedIn
• Brent Orsuga on LinkedIn
• Crelate

 

Related Podcast You Might Enjoy

 

• TRR#178 Top Producing Recruiter Reveals How to Win and Develop Key Accounts, with Katherine Jerald
• TRR#218 How Grit and Determination Fueled a $2M Recruitment Firm’s Success, with Brent Orsuga

 

Connect with Mark Whitby

• Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call
• Mark on LinkedIn
• Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby
• Mark on Facebook
• Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach

 

Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter

If you’ve been enjoying the podcast, please take two minutes to leave a review. Your review is greatly appreciated because it helps us attract a bigger audience and help more recruiters.

Starting a recruitment business from scratch demands dedication, planning, and an aggressive approach to networking and client acquisition. You will also need a massive differentiator - and our special guest in this episode shared his approach to how he grew his search firm to more than $2M from scratch! 

 

We are joined by Brent Orsuga. In this episode, Brent highlighted the importance of deep client relationships, strategic matchmaking, and staying motivated by setting high goals and continuously driving growth.

 

Brent Orsuga is the Founder of Pinnacle Growth Advisors, a headhunting and talent advisory firm solely dedicated to the Supply Chain and Logistics industry.  Brent comes from 22 years of recruiting and 15 solely in Logistics. Brent helps companies, from startups to Billion-dollar companies, find the best people possible. Pinnacle Growth Advisors has won numerous awards over the past 10 years, including the INC 5000 fastest-growing companies. 

 

Episode Outline and Highlights

 

• [02:09] How Brent got into recruiting 22 years ago.
• [04:48] Why does Brent consider himself a Talent Advisor rather than a Recruiter?
• [08:43] How to “know the best seat in the house” - understanding your client via face-to-face visits.
• [16:04] Brent’s story of building networks of relationships when he was only starting in the business.
• [24:57] Mindset and Motivation: How having a chip on your shoulder pushes Brent forward.
• [30:48] Daily routine discussion - Why Brent wakes up at 3:30 am to start his day
• [37:00] Brent shares insights on the outputs and inputs that matter.
• [40:33] How Brent used visualization techniques to lead his company to the Inc. 5000.
• [46:30] The reason behind Brent’s passion for Supply Chain and Logistics.
• [51:49] Brent shares excellent advice on not spreading yourself too thin and other success factors.

How Brent Started from Zero and Won the Confidence of Clients

 

Brent shared a fascinating story of how he got into the recruitment business and started his firm with no plan B or option of failing. He was initially a candidate who transitioned to becoming a recruiter, and making the most of his training eventually led him to be a successful search firm founder. As much as his origin story can be relatable to many recruiters who aspire to become business owners, one key topic that will resonate with many of our listeners is building relationships. 

Brent strongly believes that building relationships is one of their business priorities. One of the biggest challenges he had to overcome was starting from zero and having no clients, candidates, or relationships to leverage. How he figured it out can be summarized on the following pointers:

• Performance / Numbers - “The best testimonial is results.” Brent emphasized how results speak for themselves.
• “Go up the elevator and pay your dues.” Brent elaborated on his analogy of how showing results leads to more confidence.
• Mindset and Grit—His desire to win and his inspiration from his wife and kid pushed him to deliver results, eventually creating more business relationships.

 

Applying the Talent Advisor Approach as a Recruiter

 

On the topic of being a partner rather than a vendor, Brent shared insightful ways in which he is able to build relationships with clients and candidates. “One of the biggest pet peeves that I have in recruiting is I feel like a lot of people are selling or pitching without knowing enough about the person or the company,” he explained.

 

Brent places high value on knowing clients and candidates on a deep level. He recommends visiting client offices in person to understand the layout, environment, and how the workplace generally feels. In his analogy, you can only describe how great a restaurant is after eating there. In his words, “So it allows me to come from a completely different lens and angle so that when I'm putting you in front of a company, it's not random, it's strategic.”

 

This approach enables him to be a talent advisor rather than a generic recruitment firm. It gives him the advantage of painting a really clear picture of what his candidates are walking into, which is a massive separator from his competitors.

 

Mindset and Grit - Brent Shares His Key to Success

 

Overall, what really fascinates me in this conversation with Brent is his grit, mindset, and daily routines. He has a very competitive mindset—to the point where he is even able to use a chip on his shoulder as a driver for success. He wakes up every day at 3:30 a.m., goes to the gym at 4, prepares breakfast for his kids at 6, and goes to the office at 7!

 

To start his day, he would listen to a 13-minute clip by Les Brown:”What I'm doing is I'm getting my mindset into a very positive motivated state. Intentionally. This is not random.” He then shared how his days look when it comes to making every day intentional and purposeful.

 

Brent also shared how he measures inputs and outputs, how he leads his team, and what culture he fosters for Pinnacle Growth. His consistent actions led to remarkable milestones for his firm, including being included in INC 5000’s Fastest Growing Companies.

 

Our Sponsor

 

This podcast is proudly sponsored by i-intro 

 

i-intro® is an end-to-end retained recruitment platform. Their technology and methodology allow recruiters to differentiate themselves from the competition, win more retained business, bigger fees, and increase their billings. Their software combined with world-class training enables you to transition from transactional, contingency recruiter to consultative, retained recruiter. Instead of being perceived as a “me too” vendor, you’ll be positioned as a “me only” solutions provider. Be sure to mention Mark Whitby or The Resilient Recruiter. Book your free, no-obligation consultation here: https://recruitmentcoach.com/retained

 

Brent Orsuga Bio and Contact Info

 

Brent is the Founder of Pinnacle Growth Advisors, a headhunting and talent advisory firm solely dedicated to the Supply Chain and Logistics industry. Brent comes from 22 years of recruiting and 15 solely in the Logistics space. Brent helps companies from startups to Billion dollar companies find the best people possible.  Pinnacle Growth Advisors has won numerous awards over the past 10 years including the INC 5000 for fastest growing companies.

 

• Brent on LinkedIn
• Pinnacle Growth Advisors website link
• Pinnacle Growth on Facebook
• Pinnacle Growth on Instagram

 

People and Resources Mentioned

 

• Jeremy Jenson on LinkedIn

 

Related Podcast You Might Enjoy

 

• TRR#217 How to Elevate Your Recruitment Firm to $12M with Effective Lead Generation, with Jeremy Jenson

 

Connect with Mark Whitby

• Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call
• Mark on LinkedIn
• Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby
• Mark on Facebook
• Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach

 

Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter

If you’ve been enjoying the podcast, please take two minutes to leave a review. Your review is greatly appreciated because it helps us attract a bigger audience and help more recruiters.

 

Top-of-the-funnel lead-generation activities are a critical ingredient for a successful recruitment business. How do you strategize your lead generation to stand out in this age where all your competitors are probably doing the same thing you are doing? 

We are really lucky to be joined in this episode by Jeremy Jenson, the founder and CEO of Encore Search Partners, the largest privately owned executive search firm based in Houston, Texas. Before starting his recruitment firm, Jeremy used to run a lead generation company for different businesses such as recruitment and search firms.

You will hear Jeremy’s insights and strategy on lead generation activities and how he transitioned into becoming the recruitment business owner of a $12M search firm. 

Episode Outline and Highlights

• [01:50] How Jeremy got into recruiting.
• [05:36] Business milestones - Overcoming adversity, rebranding, and hiring someone with more technical expertise.
• [13:02] Why recruitment business owners should hire and do things with others.
• [25:49] How EOS (Entrepreneur Operating System) can impact your business.
• [35:25] Jeremy’s insights on Lead Generation as a core strength.
• [45:10] Encore Search’s seven core values.
• [53:38] What made Encore Search win Best Place to Work in the Houston Business Journal?

 

From a Lead Generation Firm to a Recruitment Business - Jeremy’s Story

 

Jeremy’s story on what led him to the recruitment industry is fascinating. He started a lead generation company in 2010 - and upon realizing that more than half of his client base was sourcing and staffing businesses, he transitioned into putting up his recruitment business. His claim to fame was in lead generation, where he was the main lead generator, regularly feeding senior recruiters with leads. 

 

His business grew and was billing a million in the third year when market and economic difficulty struck. He had to make a pivotal decision whether to shut his business and be a full-time employee or to keep on going. You will hear how his decision to stay in business paid off, and how implementing strategies to go national and hiring other senior leaders contributed to their growth. 

 

I think many of our listeners can relate to what Jeremy went through. Starting your own recruitment business is not easy - you can get to the point where you are making 100k to zero in a month. Jeremy’s inspiring thought process and decision-making can inspire our recruitment firm owners who are going through the same ordeal.

 

The Pillars of Lead Generation

 

Jeremy’s transition from a lead-generation specialist to a recruitment business owner shows us the critical role of top-of-the-funnel lead-generation activities in business success. He shared insights on what makes lead generation his key strength. Here are the two pillars:

 

• Content - he emphasized the importance of proper story-telling. “Because if you can induce an emotion from your audience, that creates resonance. I don't think that our audience wants to see five tips on how to make your resume more marketable.”
• Email Marketing - he shared why it is important to utilize new tools and platforms to reach as many as possible. “And so we try to constantly look for new, innovative ways to steal market share.”

 

• Digital Marketing - Hiring a digital marketing coordinator to enhance brand loyalty and utilizing various platforms can significantly increase community engagement and brand building.

 

Having Structure in Place Means Sustainable Growth

 

Jeremy is a subject matter expert on EOS - Entrepreneurial Operating System. We discussed how a clear and consistent structure contributed to their business growth. He also touched upon the value of embedding core values to overcome big challenges they had to face by the time their business was growing. 

 

He shared how excellence, resilience, gratitude, professionalism, coachable attitude, meticulousness, and competitiveness are deeply ingrained in daily operations, fostering culture through practices like core value spotlights during meetings. He also talked about transparency, and how it made their company a Best Place to Work award recipient in the Houston Business Journal. 

 

Our Sponsor

 

This podcast is proudly sponsored by i-intro 

 

i-intro® is an end-to-end retained recruitment platform. Their technology and methodology allow recruiters to differentiate themselves from the competition, win more retained business, bigger fees, and increase their billings. Their software combined with world-class training enables you to transition from transactional, contingency recruiter to consultative, retained recruiter. Instead of being perceived as a “me too” vendor, you’ll be positioned as a “me only” solutions provider. Be sure to mention Mark Whitby or The Resilient Recruiter. Book your free, no-obligation consultation here: https://recruitmentcoach.com/retained.

 

Jeremy Jenson Bio and Contact Info

 

Jeremy Jenson is the Founder & CEO of Encore Search Partners. Jeremy is a subject matter expert on The Entrepreneurial Operating System and prides himself on building Houston’s largest privately-held Executive Search firm on the back of his seven Core Values: Excellence, Resilience, Gratitude, Professionalism, Coachable, Meticulous, and Competitive. In his free time, he enjoys spending time with friends & his 3 sons. He is also a member of the Entrepreneurs’ Organization, a global co-op of over 17,000 entrepreneurs, worldwide.

 

• Jeremy on LinkedIn
• Encore Search Partners website link
• Jeremy on Instagram
• Path to Success podcast link

 

People and Resources Mentioned

 

• Who Not How, by Dan Sullivan
• Traction: Get a Grip on Your Business, by Gino Wickman
• Rocket Fuel, by Gino Wickman

 

Connect with Mark Whitby

• Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call
• Mark on LinkedIn 
• Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby
• Mark on Facebook
• Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach

 

Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter

 

If you’ve been enjoying the podcast, please take two minutes to leave a review. Your review is greatly appreciated because it helps us attract a bigger audience and help more recruiters.

 

Being a high biller requires a combination of hard work, skills, and strategies. But what does it really take?

My special guest, David Bradley, is a 29-year veteran who averaged $750k in annual billings his entire career! In this episode, David shares the strategies and mindset that make him a very effective recruiter! On top of that, David also manages high-volume accounts with a team of 60 headhunters. If you are a recruitment leader like David, you will find insightful takes on how he manages KPIs and how they drive a culture that is geared towards performance.

In 2009, David helped start Movement. He is a partner with Movement and has been an instrumental part in helping the firm grow from 3 to 65 plus headhunters over the past 14 years.

Movement has 5 brick and mortar offices across the United States.

Episode Outline and Highlights

• [02:29] How David got into the recruiting business.
• [07:14] Top recruiter secrets & grinding on a 10-5-2 formula.
• [10:32] Structuring daily activities & time management best practices.
• [17:52] You need to get three critical pieces of information when speaking with a candidate.
• [24:26] The foundation of what makes David a successful recruiter.
• [26:50] Movement’s culture and mission.
• [34:30] Striking the balance when managing your team’s KPI.
• [37:40] Retaining the momentum in 2024 - key to continuous growth and eight-figure billings.
• [45:20] How Movement’s owners play different roles?
• [52:29] David’s future growth plans.

 

What it Takes to Be a Top Recruiter

What does it take to become a top recruiter? It certainly involves grind and hard work. David’s 29-year experience provides him with a credible perspective on what it takes to be successful. This also gives him an advantage as a recruitment leader - his capabilities are a testament to how his team has been performing. Below are the critical topics that David and I discussed:

 

• 10-5-2 Formula
• Being cognizant of your time
• Planning ahead of your phone time
• Mindset

 

If you are listening, as a recruiter or recruitment leader, David's insights are inspiring!

 

The Foundation of Being a Successful Recruiter

 

Being consistently successful in a long time requires more than hard work. There is something else and David generously shared his secret sauce:

 

“So I think having that gratitude, understanding that we get to talk to people for a living and have just an incredible life, incredible income opportunity, incredible balance, we can manage our life any way we want it… And I think that fuels getting up in the morning and saying, you know what? This is gonna be another great day. It's gonna be a great year. It's gonna be a great month. Well, if it's not been a great month, next month's gonna be great. So having that sort of mindset, I think, is really, and factor a lot of fun into this.”

 

This fantastic mindset is an invisible but highly influential factor that determines your success as a recruiter or recruitment business owner. Possessing a positive mindset enables us to navigate the favorable and unfavorable changes we encounter with resilience.

 

The Keys to Continuous Growth and Eight-Figure BIllings

 

David shares how Movement produced $20M in billings around 2022-23. It was a great year for them post-Covid, and the systems and frameworks they had at the time enabled them to retain the momentum even when things appear to slow down in 2024. I wanted to pick David’s brains on the culture and systems they have in place, given that not many recruiting firms get above 8 figures. 

 

My takeaway is how they emphasise creating and enabling a culture geared towards high performance.  They have annual trips for the top 10% of producers, on top of regular social activities and loyalty bonus programs. They also have annual meetings where they fly everyone in, including their staff’s spouses. Doing so contributes to relationship-building and as David said, “an essential part of the culture.”

 

David also discussed their profit-sharing scheme. What I also loved was his insights on managing KPIs while not micromanaging everything.

Our Sponsor

This podcast is proudly sponsored by i-intro 

i-intro® is an end-to-end retained recruitment platform. Their technology and methodology allow recruiters to differentiate themselves from the competition, win more retained business, bigger fees, and increase their billings. Their software combined with world-class training enables you to transition from transactional, contingency recruiter to consultative, retained recruiter. Instead of being perceived as a “me too” vendor, you’ll be positioned as a “me only” solutions provider. Be sure to mention Mark Whitby or The Resilient Recruiter. Book your free, no-obligation consultation here: https://recruitmentcoach.com/retained

 

David Bradley Bio and Contact Info

 

David is a 29-year veteran of the headhunting business. David stumbled into the business in 1995 when he was working with a headhunter to help him find a sales job. The tables got turned and David actually got hired as a headhunter. He spent the next 16 years working for Spherion. He enjoyed success right from the beginning. He billed $175K in year 1 and the following year billed close to $400K and he never looked back from there.

 

In 2009, he left Spherion (later known as Ranstad) to help start Movement. He is a partner with Movement and has been an instrumental part in helping the firm grow from 3 to 65 plus headhunters over the past 14 years. Movement has 5 brick and mortar offices across the United States.

 

* He has been a leading producer at Movement with 750+ placements since 2009 with the most placements in the firm's history (Personal billings of $1.3M in 2023, $1.1M in 2022, and averaged $750K+ in billings throughout his career)

* He manages high-volume accounts with a team of 60 headhunters

* He has helped mentor aspiring headhunters into the business.

* He has completed over 2500 placements throughout his career.

* Member of Pinnacle Society since 2023.

* David holds an MBA from Franciscan University.

 

David has been married to his lovely wife for 32 years and has 5 grown children (ages 17 to 31) He is an avid hockey player and resides with his family in Clarkston, MI.

 

• David on LinkedIn
• David on Facebook
• David on X (Twitter) @jdavidbradley
• David on YouTube
• Movement Search website link

 

People and Resources Mentioned

 

• Pinnacle Society website link

 

Connect with Mark Whitby

• Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call
• Mark on LinkedIn, 
• Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby
• Mark on Facebook
• Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach

 

Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter

 

If you’ve been enjoying the podcast, please take two minutes to leave a review. Your review is greatly appreciated because it helps us attract a bigger audience and help more recruiters.

In the evolving recruitment landscape where LinkedIn and ChatGPT dominate the conversation, one tool stands resilient: the humble phone call. 

Is cold calling still a critical part of your recruitment and selling process? Can you be a successful modern recruiter while making zero cold calls?

I am thrilled to be joined by a veteran and successful recruiter, Danny Cahill. You will enjoy his insights based on his decades-long expertise in recruitment approach with a spotlight on the importance of using the phone for cold calls. 

Danny started his recruiting career right out of college at Hobson Associates. He became its rookie of the year and went on to become a top producer and the general manager by the age of 26. At 27, he bought the company and built it into one of the country's largest search firms. Danny was the educational chairperson of the Pinnacle Society, 75 of the highest achievers in the industry.

Episode Outline and Highlights

• [02:12] “Phone: Friend or Foe?” – insights on Danny’s talk at the last Pinnacle Society Summit.
• [09:50] Recalling the good old cold calling days.
• [13:08] Approaching the current landscape of a 5% call response rate.
• [22:09] Why must modern recruiters understand and maximize the phone's power?
• [32:33] “The phone call is a birthday card.” - Danny explains why effort toward candidates and clients can be a strong differentiator.
• [39:35] Can you be a successful recruiter nowadays without making phone calls?
• [45:39] Flipping the order – why the phone should come before email.
• [52:40] Thoughts and insights on AI.

 

How Veteran Recruiters Should Approach the Current Industry Landscape

 

I have known Danny for decades - he is a legendary recruiter and you can just imagine my delight when I had the chance to meet him in person at a Pinnacle Society conference last year. We discussed the talk he gave about using old-school cold-calling. Danny believes that using the phone is a critical skill for recruiters, especially before the advent of the internet. We recalled how exciting it was to not know in detail who you would be talking to, how skillful you should be when carrying conversations, and of course, going through gatekeepers before reaching your actual target.

 

But the landscape now changed. On average, you will only reach 5% of your prospects by phone. Danny believes that although it should be a combination of tools and platforms, making phone calls is more relevant than ever, as it can be a differentiator. This is how Danny puts it: 

 

“If this helps you with your identity crisis, the thing that made you great is going to be more important than ever because you're not someone who just makes phone calls. The phone is your conduit to who you are, which is a storyteller, a persuader, an enabler of aspiration. We sell dreams. That's what we do. And companies are going to always use us. If you have a level of contact and subject matter expertise so that I feel like you can get candidates I can't get in a faster way.”

 

Flipping the Order – Why the Phone Should Come Before Email

 

On Hobson Associates’ website, you will see the line “We’re Always Available to You. By Phone. Online. Or in person.” This is aligned with how Danny wants the order in which their recruiters would reach out to prospects via phone before mail. I tried to pick Danny’s brain for this approach, and he explained the logic. 

 

“Yeah, well, because I think the phone has some real advantages and it is direct. You know, people often say, well, email is faster. Oh, no, it's not. I see email exchanges all the time between clients.”

 

Danny also emphasized that the phone has some power to engage with prospects. “The power of the pause; the power of someone sighing. The thing about text, is that young people like text, because text can be filtered, text can be edited, right? You can wait and you can make a draft of it. Whereas with the phone, you can't skim a phone call. Right. You're on it. You're on the hot seat.”

 

Can You Be a Successful Recruiter With Zero Cold Calls?

We have members of our coaching group who are not really into making cold calls. We see recruiters who are making consistent placements without making a single cold call. With the power of LinkedIn, Social Media platforms, & AI, you can do a lot of business development that can translate to end-to-end sourcing and placements. The question is, can you be a successful recruiter without making cold calls?

 

Danny shared a fact from SourceWhale: 60% of meetings come from the phone call. It may not be the primary way of reaching prospects anymore, but possessing the skill of doing cold calls is a critical part of becoming a successful recruiter. But of course, Danny pointed out that there are so many ways of doing business. Those who can make it work without the need to do cold calls should keep doing what they are doing.

 

Our Sponsor

 

This podcast is proudly sponsored by i-intro 

 

i-intro® is an end-to-end retained recruitment platform. Their technology and methodology allow recruiters to differentiate themselves from the competition, win more retained business, bigger fees, and increase their billings. Their software combined with world-class training enables you to transition from transactional, contingency recruiter to consultative, retained recruiter. Instead of being perceived as a “me too” vendor, you’ll be positioned as a “me only” solutions provider. Be sure to mention Mark Whitby or The Resilient Recruiter. Book your free, no-obligation consultation here: https://recruitmentcoach.com/retained

 

Danny Cahill Bio and Contact Info

 

Danny Cahill started at Hobson Associates right out of college. He became its Rookie of the Year, top producer, and general manager by the age of 26. At 27 he bought the company and built it into one of the country's largest search firms specializing in Software Sales, Bio-Tech Sales, and Industrial Sales talent. He is the only industry “guru” that runs a search firm every day. He does what you do.

 

He was the Educational Chairperson of the Pinnacle Society, 75 of the highest achievers in the industry, and he still personally mentors many members. He also owns and runs AccordingToDanny.com, an online training and mentoring company dedicated to enhancing the skills and jumpstarting the spirits of recruiters worldwide. His keynote presentations have made him one of the most sought-after speakers in the country.

 

He was elected to the NAPS Hall of Fame in 2006 and also received the Dave Knutson Lifetime Achievement Award. HireAbility overwhelmingly voted him the industry’s most popular speaker. AccordingToDanny.com was awarded “Best-In-Class” for Training Excellence from MRINetwork.

 

In his other life, as a playwright, he has had works produced off-Broadway and won both the Maxwell Anderson and the CAB Theatre Award for playwrights. He has written for CBS Television, Muscle and Fitness Magazine, as well as numerous magazines. He received his Master’s Degree in Literature from Wesleyan University and believes salespeople enjoy the world's only job security.  Danny’s book, “Harper’s Rules”, a business novel/parable, which of course features a headhunter, won the 2011 Axiom Award for Best Business Parable. His screenplay, “Breakpoint” was optioned by Dialogue Pictures, and his new memoir, "Aging Disgracefully" is available now in bookstores and on Kindle.

 

• Danny on LinkedIn
• Hobson Associates website link
• Harper’s Rules by Danny Cahill
• How to Quit Golf (and Get Your Life Back) by Danny Cahill

 

People and Resources Mentioned

 

• Pinnacle Society website link
• Alex Elliott on LinkedIn
• Nate Zimmerman on LinkedIn

 

Related Podcast You Might Enjoy

 

• TRR#181 The 4 Core Sales Processes that Drive an Effective Client Acquisition Strategy, with Alex Elliott
• TRR#202 Top Private Equity Recruiter Reveals How He Built a $1,000,000 Practice, with Nate Zimmerman

 

Connect with Mark Whitby

• Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call
• Mark on LinkedIn, 
• Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby
• Mark on Facebook
• Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach

 

Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter

 

If you’ve been enjoying the podcast, please take two minutes to leave a review. Your review is greatly appreciated because it helps us attract a bigger audience and help more recruiters.

 

Building a scalable recruitment business that operates seamlessly even without recruiters' direct involvement should not be just a dream—but a tangible goal. Balraj's achievement with Envision Education serves as a testament to what can be accomplished through strategic planning and execution.

Today’s episode explores how recruiters can build high-performing teams and a scalable business with a special guest, Balraj Guraya. As the founder and director of Envision Education, Balraj has not only grown the company into a high-performing team of 23 individuals but also strategically positioned himself to focus solely on scaling the business by replacing himself in the hands-on role in 2022

Tune in to gain valuable insights from Balraj's unique approach and what's working and not in building a scalable business that can thrive even when the founder isn't in the driver's seat.

Episode Outline And Highlights

• [01:46] Why Balraj got into recruitment and started Envision Education 
• [05:20] How Balraj began his business and how things worked in the first year
• [08:07] The biggest challenges Balraj encountered before building a team
• [12:04] The key milestones of growing a team from 2 to 23 people 
• [15:06] How to structure the interview process and get the right people onboard
• [22:37] Ways to structure your team and create an excellent candidate journey 
• [20:45] Steps to building a recruitment business that runs without you 
• [33:20] What contributes to creating a high-energy environment  
• [44:23] How to hire right and create a smooth transition into your culture
• [48:28] The key to building successful business partnerships with Rec2Rec 
• [55:42] What candidate's journey is all about, and how it works 
• [59:11] How to design, roll out, and improve processes for scale 
• [01:02:04] Tip to conquer staff turnover and self-doubt as a business owner

How to Become a Manager and a Leader and Build Confidence in Your Effectiveness

During our discussion, Balraj and I discussed his recruitment strategies at Envision Education. Founded in 2014, Envision Education addresses staffing shortages in Primary, Secondary, and Special Schools across London and the home counties. Balraj's vision has led Envision Education to become a high-performing team of 23 individuals. His journey includes transitioning from a hands-on role as a builder in 2022 to focus on scaling the business.

 

Balraj shares six key principles for recruiters aspiring to become effective managers and leaders in their business. 

 

1. Self-motivation: As a recruiter, Balraj shares that you have to be very self-motivated and have the drive, energy, and focus to grow your business in the beginning to build a strong foundation for growth and expansion.
2. Be consistent: Balraj emphasizes maintaining a steady workflow and understanding that success takes time and effort. It’s not going to be an overnight achievement. So be consistent, produce the right quality and quantity of activity, and stay motivated. 
3. Willingness to make mistakes: Recruitment takes work. It takes resilience, courage, and a willingness to put yourself out there, try uncomfortable things, make mistakes, and embrace them as learning opportunities.
4. Get the right people on board: Balraj emphasizes the pivotal role of team composition in driving success. He explains the importance of recruiting people who align with the company's values and attributes and possess the necessary skills to contribute meaningfully to the team's objectives. Having the right people on board is a game changer. It’s the difference between success and failure.
5. Structure your team: Structuring allows individuals to maximize their strengths and enhance overall performance. According to Balraj, structuring your team will help the team keep up and improve your turnover.  
6. Coaching and development. Balraj highlights the importance of ongoing coaching and development in building a great team. Rather than solely focusing on placements, he emphasizes sharing knowledge and nurturing talent within the organization.

 

Ultimately, running a business transcends mere profitability; it represents a journey of personal development and collective growth—the continuous evolution of oneself and the team.

Steps to Building a Recruitment Business That Runs Without You

 

Balraj shares invaluable insights into transitioning a recruitment business from a one-person 360 operation to a structured departmental setup, effectively replacing oneself in key roles. The key to this evolution lies in making strategic and sometimes costly decisions, recognizing that letting go of control is essential for scalability. Central to this process is: 

 

1. Finding some key people you can trust: Find people you can trust, people who treat your business as more than just a job and are excited about helping your business succeed. They are the backbone of your business, embodying a commitment to its success beyond personal gain.
2. Have some high performers who you are consistently billing. Nurturing a cadre of high performers is critical for sustaining momentum and driving growth. These individuals excel in their roles and embody the energy and drive necessary to propel the business forward, even in the absence of its founder.
3. Design a structured, clear career ladder: According to Balraj, this is one of the best things you can do within your business as a recruiter. Designing and implementing a structured career ladder from the outset provides clarity and direction for employees within the organization. The framework creates professional development and instills a sense of purpose and belonging among the team.
4. Create a high-energy environment: Creating a vibrant, high-energy environment is key to enhancing engagement and cohesion within the team. Balraj emphasizes the need for regular team briefs and goal-setting sessions to align everyone with the company's vision and objectives. 
5. Appreciation: Show appreciation not just to the sales team making the placements but to everyone, including the compliance team and the resource team. They are important in the work they do. Appreciation for all reinforces the value of every team member's contribution.
6. Work on what is most important: Balraj's "4 Ds" approach—Do, Defer, Delegate, Delete—provides a framework for delegating tasks and freeing up time to focus on strategic initiatives. Investing in the sales team and expanding recruitment consultant roles are essential steps before relinquishing direct involvement in day-to-day operations.
7. Develop processes: designing and implementing processes is indispensable for scalability. Balraj advocates for hiring or partnering with individuals possessing complementary operations skills to ensure the efficient execution of tasks and the seamless functioning of the business.

 

Scaling a recruitment business beyond the founder's requires strategic planning, delegation, talent cultivation, and process optimization. Embracing these principles paves the way for scale, sustainable growth, and long-term success. 

 

Our Sponsor

 

This podcast is proudly sponsored by i-intro 

 

i-intro® is an end-to-end retained recruitment platform. Their technology and methodology allow recruiters to differentiate themselves from the competition, win more retained business, bigger fees, and increase their billings. Their software, combined with world-class training, enables you to transition from transactional, contingency recruiter to consultative, retained recruiter. Instead of being perceived as a “me too” vendor, you’ll be positioned as a “me only” solutions provider. Be sure to mention Mark Whitby or The Resilient Recruiter. Book your free, no-obligation consultation here: https://recruitmentcoach.com/retained

 

Balraj Guraya Bio and Contact Info

 

Balraj is the founder and director of Envision Education, a recruitment firm he established in 2014 to address staffing shortages in schools across London and the home counties particularly within special needs education. Barlaj has grown Envision education to a high performing team of 23 people and was able to replace himself as a builder in 2022 so he can concentrate on scaling the business.

 

• Balraj on LinkedIn
• Envision Education Website link 

Resources and People Mentioned

• Ravi Tangri on LinkedIn

Connect with Mark Whitby

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• Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach

 

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