The Resilient Recruiter

Are you familiar with the term “ 4.0 Leaders”? If you are, then you understand the value of hiring such leaders in whichever niche you serve, especially in this age of the industrial revolution through artificial intelligence. 

I am excited to share this episode as we have a returning guest, the Rogue Recruiter, David Perry. We recorded this episode on his birthday. And you know that it will be an episode packed with exceptional expertise and behind-the-scenes stories from 35 years in executive recruitment.

David and I touched upon relevant topics such as building strategic, long-term client relationships and the art of placing the right candidates within a company's culture. We also covered how their project, workinsight.io, can change the current hiring landscape. Lastly, David shared his insight on what recruitment will look like and why hiring 4.0 leaders is a critical role of recruiters.

Episode Outline and Highlights

• [02:09] Pool Table Analogy - David reveals the strategy in his 35-year career in executive recruitment.
• [08:02] Pointers on pre-closing deals and establishing long-term client relationships.
• [19:22] “Executive Recruiting for Dummies” - Why David writes the questions and runs the candidate interview with their clients.
• [26:06] Educating your clients on the cost of a bad hire while quantifying your added value to their organization.
• [29:00] Be inspired and don’t give up: David shares his story about his early struggles in his recruitment career.
• [32:24] What is Workinsight.io and how can it be a game changer as a matching platform for candidates and employers?
• [52:18] Teaser on David’s new book - “Revolutions Need Leaders”
• [1:00:05] David shares why they send a 27-page proposal to their clients.
• [1:07:00] Book recommendations from David and why he never stops learning from others.

Strategize Your Recruitment Like a Pool Master

Before we recorded this episode, he had recently closed around 750K in fees. I wanted to get his insights on how he can consistently deliver in the industry for 35 years. 

If you are familiar with the game of pool or billiards, you will relate to David’s analogy about his strategies that keep him at the top of his game. He describes his approach, “You play pool, right? Most people and most recruiters are usually good for sinking a shot. Maybe a second one, okay, rarely a third one, yep. Rarely can someone clean the table. So this is how we think about search. We get a lot of inquiries to do work for companies… That's like playing pool. Before we do a deal we want to look down the table and go, okay, what's the next ball, what's the next ball, what's the next ball? And oftentimes we won't take a search because we can't see the next one.“

David elaborated on the following techniques:

1. Focusing on client relationships, investing time to understand their culture and what fits in their organization. Doing so can make placing three people with one company easier than three people with three different companies.
2. How to pre-close a deal through an intake call with the client via Zoom call that will lead to a face-to-face discussion.
3. Running the interview questions to the candidates, with the clients on the side.

Like me, you will admire David’s tenure and expertise and how he delivers his service to his clients. 

Democratizing the Job Search Process

David and I discussed their exciting website project: workinsight.io. Work Insight is a recruiting platform designed to be candidate-centric by allowing them to have a level of anonymity. The approach is inspired by dating sites, like Bumble or Tinder. The goal of the platform is to democratize recruitment - “This is designed to help people get the right role. That's why it's free. It's free for recruiters to use and post. It's free for job hunters to come and find jobs and post credentials. So we're trying to democratize the hiring that way. This way, smaller companies who've got a great idea can find people and do it themselves At the same time.”

There are at least two job search frustrations that the platform can solve:

Shortening the job search process: In the US, Davide mentioned that the average job search time is 38 weeks. Workinsight.io can enable a continuous opportunity flow, which will force employers to “be smarter and fairer with the candidates that they have, because now, all of a sudden, the whole market is fluid.”

Solving the “hired for skill, fired for fit” dilemma: As David mentioned, “We've known for four decades hired for skill, fired for fit. If we know this doesn't work and we know that the turnover rate stays at a steady 24%, why don't we fix that?” The platform has an upcoming feature that matches candidates to companies based on cultural fit, aiming to address the high turnover rates caused by mismatches in company culture. This service is available for English-speaking individuals across various roles, industries, and locations.

Having a Glimpse to the Future of Recruiting

I was also fortunate to get a teaser of David’s new book “Revolutions Need Leaders”  which addresses these revolutionary changes in recruitment and provides insight into the High Definition of Recruiting (HDR) methodology. David touched upon the impact of leaders like Sam Altman, whose leadership inspired loyalty and action from employees at OpenAI, exemplifying the power of what we term "4.0 leaders." These leaders focus on team success rather than individual achievements and are not easily found through traditional recruitment methods. We discuss strategies for identifying and engaging these elusive candidates, including using LinkedIn effectively for signaling and vetting prospects.

Our Sponsor

This podcast is proudly sponsored by i-intro 

i-intro® is an end-to-end retained recruitment platform. Their technology and methodology allow recruiters to differentiate themselves from the competition, win more retained business, bigger fees, and increase their billings. Their software combined with world-class training enables you to transition from transactional, contingency recruiter to consultative, retained recruiter. Instead of being perceived as a “me too” vendor, you’ll be positioned as a “me only” solutions provider. Be sure to mention Mark Whitby or The Resilient Recruiter. Book your free, no-obligation consultation here: https://recruitmentcoach.com/retained

David Perry Bio and Contact Info

David is a seasoned search professional and has completed more than 1500 projects and negotiated more than $400 million in salaries. He is a bestselling author and his books have been translated into French, Hungarian, Vietnamese, and Chinese.

David is a student of leadership and its effect on organizations ranging from private equity ventures to global technology corporations. David has built an extensive personal network of leading CEOs as well as up-and-coming future executives, permitting him to find the most qualified candidates to grow a company and increase stakeholder value. PMI’s Inside-Out Approach™ methodology allows clients to rapidly assess critical human qualities, track record, and leadership experience.

David is frequently quoted on trends and issues regarding executive search, recruiting, and HR in leading business publications including Daily Commercial News, The Wall Street Journal, Canadian Business, EETimes, BOMA Monthly, and HR Today, and appears regularly as an executive search and labor market analyst for CBC News World and CTV Television.

As HR Policy Advisor of the Canadian Advanced Technology Alliance (CATA), David has developed an extensive knowledge of leadership, innovation, and technology – like SMART Buildings. This ever-evolving expertise keeps him at the pulse of the most innovative and successful leaders. David recently served two terms on the board of Women in Communications and Technology. David is the past Chair of the Canadian Technology Human Resources Board and a board member of the Software Human Resource Council. He was chair/vice chair of South Hull Elementary School for fourteen years.

David graduated from McGill University in 1982 with a Bachelor of Arts degree in economics and industrial relations. As well, David is also a Commissioned Officer in the Canadian Reserve, where he graduated top in his class and was awarded the Sword of Honor by Brigadier General JB Dabros. He recently received the Queen Elizabeth II Diamond Jubilee Medal.

• David on LinkedIn
• David on X (Twitter) @RougeRecruter
• Perry-Marterl International website link

People and Resources Mentioned

• Read the First Chapter of “Revolutions Need Leaders” 
• Workinsight IO website link
• Executive Recruiting For Dummies - a book by David Perry and Mark Haluska
• The Win Without Pitching Manifesto

Related Podcast You Might Enjoy

• TRR#26 Canada Day Special: How the Rogue Recruiter Closed 1100 Searches, with David Perry

• Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call
• Mark on LinkedIn
• Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby
• Mark on Facebook
• Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach

Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter

In the fast-paced world of recruitment, you’re under constant pressure to deliver results for your clients and achieve sales targets. So what’s the secret to maintaining peak performance without burning out? 

In this episode of The Resilient Recruiter, our special guest, Scott Eastin, provides a fresh perspective on achieving sustainable, long-lasting success in recruitment. Drawing from his own successful career, having navigating many ups and downs, Scott emphasizes the pivotal relationship between prioritizing health and recruitment success. 

Scott is the Director of Eastin IT Security. Over the last 13 years established himself as a leading Microsoft Security consultant. He’s worked with major organizations such as Coca-Cola, American Express as well as state and local governments. For the last 5 years, he’s built an IT consulting and staffing firm winning high-value, long-term projects that generate recurring revenue.

In this episode, Scott unpacks his remarkable transition from being a software developer to becoming a successful recruiter. He divulges his four cornerstone strategies for business development. Most importantly, emphasizes why prioritizing physical health is a non-negotiable component in maintaining his overall productivity. 

Episode Outline and Highlights

• [02:25] Scott’s journey from being a software developer to a successful recruiter.
• [10:14] Insights on challenges when transitioning to a career in recruiting.
• [14:47] Sharing a story of how embracing an idea that was not done became a game-changer.
• [24:00] Scott’s Top 4 Business Development strategies
• [30:35] Hosting networking events - an effective way to engage with your community.
• [36:15] Comparison of consulting practice versus permanent direct hire models in the tech space.
• [44:36] Managing cash flow challenges in a consulting and IT staffing business.
• [54:40] Mindfulness, health and well-being.

The Advantages of a Consulting Business in the IT Space

Is it easier to manage an IT consulting business model versus a permanent direct hire practice? For Scott, having a consulting business model works well for him for the following reasons:

• Trusted Independent Contractors - He has already established a network of reliable independent contractors, which makes it easy to take in projects from his clients. 

• Long-term Contracts - Because of quality service delivery, he can secure long-term contracts that assure him six-digit revenues at the beginning of the year.

If you are running an executive search firm or permanent hire practice, you might want to consider exploring the option of a consulting or contract service as an additional revenue stream. Scott believes that this is a great time for such a business model:

“Quite frankly, if you look at the statistics that are coming out now, more and more people are interested in contracting and independent consulting work. I know I was reading an article from the staffing industry where I think they said literally 38% of the U.S. workforce has done some type of gig work.”

Of course, there are also challenges in this type of business model, such as cash flow management - sometimes you would have to pay your contractors before the client even pays you. Scott shared how he solves this.  He also elaborated on his approach to business development.

The 4 Cornerstones of Scott’s Business Development Strategy

Scott describes himself as a “reluctant salesman.” Before becoming a recruitment business owner, he had this preconceived notion about salespeople: “Selling is somewhat, maybe a dirty word for some people in the technical industry.” 

Part of his journey is getting over that mindset. Scott’s primary principle regarding selling and business development is “Great service, great people, and great value.” He shared four key pointers about this topic and elaborated on how this helps him to get continued repeat businesses:

1. Referrals - Scott’s mantra of great service, great people, and great value is the foundation of providing excellent services consistently. This leads to referrals and repeat businesses across his market and industry.
2. LinkedIn Visibility - Scott consistently posts content and videos on LinkedIn. 
3. BDR - Scott hired an experienced Business Development Representative part-time on a contract basis to make cold calls and set up sales appointments for him. 
4. Hosting meet-up events - this is something that Scott picked up from one of our guests in a previous episode, Steven Li, and he is thankful that he applied this approach.

Mindfulness, Health, and Well-Being

Being a one-man shop is not easy and can be stressful. Scott shared how he manages stress by prioritizing his health and consistently implementing healthy habits. 

“I learned my lesson over the years where when I did not take my fitness or health very seriously, I was not at my best.” 

Scott does P90X training, distance running, and regular functional gym sessions.  As a recruiter or business owner, prioritizing health is not only essential for your well-being, but it also contributes to a more productive, positive, and sustainable work environment. Scott shared, “I'm just so much stronger, so much fitter. And so it's one of those where it's very cliche to say health is your first wealth, but you know, no matter how much success you've got, if you don't have your health, it's not worth anything.”

Our Sponsor

This podcast is proudly sponsored by i-intro 

i-intro® is an end-to-end retained recruitment platform. Their technology and methodology allow recruiters to differentiate themselves from the competition, win more retained business, bigger fees, and increase their billings. Their software combined with world-class training enables you to transition from transactional, contingency recruiter to consultative, retained recruiter. Instead of being perceived as a “me too” vendor, you’ll be positioned as a “me only” solutions provider. Be sure to mention Mark Whitby or The Resilient Recruiter. Book your free, no-obligation consultation here: https://recruitmentcoach.com/retained

Scott Eastin Bio and Contact Info

Scott Eastin was a leading Microsoft security consultant for the last thirteen years.  Scott has worked with major organizations including Coca-Cola, American Express, and numerous other global firms as well as state and local governments.

Over the last five years, Scott has moved away from development and now spends most of his day helping the Microsoft business partner community find top-tier independent Azure consultants.  Scott’s network of Azure security consultants spans North America along with world-class talent from Central Europe.

Scott resides in Decatur, GA with his wife, two dogs, and two teenagers who he hopes will move out once they graduate.

• Scott on LinkedIn
• Eastin IT Security website link

People and Resources Mentioned

• Steven Li on LinkedIn
• Plamen Ivanoff on LinkedIn

Related Podcast You Might Enjoy

• TRR#175 How to Build Trust and Relationships at Scale by Hosting Meet-up Events, with Steven Li
• TRR#43 How to Transition From Contingency CV Supplier to Consultative Retained Recruiter, with Plamen Ivanoff

• Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call
• Mark on LinkedIn
• Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby
• Mark on Facebook
• Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach

Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter

The recruitment process is inherently human-centric, involving evaluating soft skills, cultural fit, and personal interactions. While AI can streamline specific tasks, it may struggle to assess these qualitative aspects effectively. As a recruitment business owner, how do you marry automation and artificial intelligence with a personal human touch?

My special guest, Christina Stroud, shares her insights and perspective about this subject. She has a unique approach to engaging with her clients and candidates while leveraging automation with a personalized human touch.

Christina is the founder and CEO of Group928. She’s a seasoned Human Resources professional with over 30 years of experience specializing in start-ups, acquisitions, and exits in private equity environments. The company has grown by 400% in just three short years from $125,000 in the first year to over $500,000 in 2023. This showcases her ability to build a client base from scratch, and design and implement sales and marketing strategies while continuing to exceed her client’s expectations.

Episode Outline and Highlights

• [01:57] Chrstina’s Transition from an HR professional to a recruitment business owner. Insights on how her HR experience played a role in her current success.
• [07:49] Nobody said it was easy - overcoming a challenging first year of entrepreneurial leap.
• [12:41] Growing the company to 400% - discussing two critical success factors. 
• [18:18] The importance of stepping out of your comfort zone
• [28:13] Leveraging AI & automation while applying a personal touch.
• [40:33] Launching her podcast and engaging with thought leaders.
• [48:01] The most significant challenges that Christina had to navigate
• [58:49] What is next for Christina and Group 928? 

An Entrepreneurial Leap is No Walk in the Park, But Undeniably Achievable

For many reasons, shifting from a recruiter to a business owner can be difficult. The risk and uncertainty, working long hours, and lack of security and benefits can deter many from the entrepreneurship journey. Overcoming these roadblocks is achievable - and Christina proved it is. This is how she described the first year of her entrepreneurial journey:

“It was hard. I, you know, that first year, it was hard for me emotionally. I had never stepped away from a regular paycheck. And so to go into owning my own business, not having a steady income or a check that gets directly deposited every other Friday was very nerve-wracking for me… It hurt my ego a little bit when I went two months without getting, uh, a paycheck, but then once I got my company started, uh, I was glad that I did and it made sense, but that transition, uh, is very hard for a lot of people and it was also hard because I had never done any type of sales or marketing or bringing in new clients.”

It was not a walk in the park, but Christina’s mindset and belief system helped her figure things out and pull things together. She revealed two critical factors that significantly contributed to her success.

Christina’s Two Critical Success Factors 

In three years, Christina grew her company by 400% from $125,000 in the first year to over $500,000 in 2023. This is an astonishing achievement, as companies usually plateau after reaching their first six digits. Christian shared two critical success factors:

1. Getting out of her comfort zone: “I had to take every little thing that needed to be done as a challenge. I did all the work myself. I was, you know, doing sourcing and interviewing and all the emails and communication. And that taught me a lot of new skills and things that I had to try and push myself to do that I hadn't done in a very, very long time”.  Christina shared how she had to learn technology and AI, start her podcast, and other new skills.

1. Leveraging automation for sales and marketing - this was also not easy for Christina because technology is also not her cup of tea. “Those people who know me know I have a technology dark cloud that follows me. It is a struggle wherever I go for whatever reason. And so to think that I would be using this as one of my main tools to try and find clients and at least start that initial relationship was very daunting.” 

Many can relate to the subject of automation and AI as it is a hot topic when it comes to balancing it with personalization and ingraining a human touch. Christina shares her best practices.

Utilizing AI and Automation with a Personalized Approach

Christina’s approach to personalization is her unique value proposition. She shared her process:

Research “And so when I went into my own business, I knew that's what I had specific target companies that I knew I wanted to work with. I had researched them. I had figured out where they were location-wise, and what the size of the company was. I started researching the CEOs and the head of HR and make sure they had the type of career and background of people that would be interested in working with recruiters whom they had a relationship with”

Personalized Communication “My communications were very personal. It wasn't, hey, here's what we do, here's what we can offer you, here's how I'm gonna change your life. It was a lot more of, here's what my other clients are seeing. You know, here's what I know about the market if it makes sense for us to have those conversations help you in the future, that would be great”

Going above and beyond  “We've also done gifts. So we went kind of old school. Remember at Christmas you used to get lots of plates of cookies and treats and stuff from vendors or at least I know HR folks do. I used to have a desk full of boxes of things from folks who wanted to work with our company. So now as a recruiter, I do that as well, but I don't do it at Christmas time.”

Leveraging AI and automation is indeed an effective way to market and engage with clients if infused with a personal human touch.

Our Sponsor

This podcast is proudly sponsored by i-intro 

i-intro® is an end-to-end retained recruitment platform. Their technology and methodology allow recruiters to differentiate themselves from the competition, win more retained business, bigger fees, and increase their billings. Their software combined with world-class training enables you to transition from transactional, contingency recruiter to consultative, retained recruiter. Instead of being perceived as a “me too” vendor, you’ll be positioned as a “me only” solutions provider. Be sure to mention Mark Whitby or The Resilient Recruiter. Book your free, no-obligation consultation here: https://recruitmentcoach.com/retained

Christina Stroud and Contact Info

Christina is the Owner and Co-Founder of Group928. She started her career at BMW Manufacturing where she progressed through multiple leadership positions across the Human Resources organization throughout her 14-year tenure with the company. The scope of her BMW experience spans US and International operations and includes positions in Recruiting, HR Operations, Change Management, and work as an HR Business Partner. Christina’s first exposure to a start-up business was with Venture Capital-backed Proterra, a high-growth green-industry manufacturer of vehicle power and charging solutions. At Proterra, Christina built and led the HR team and hired and developed the company's Executive team. From Proterra, Christina joined Day & Zimmerman, a $2.4 billion family-owned global construction company. While there she led an HR function responsible for four business units and instilled focus on making people strategy a competitive business advantage. Christina was recruited to Private Equity-owned Multi-Pack Solutions, a contract packaging company for medical devices, as head of the national Human Resources function. In 2017 Christina joined the 35-person executive recruiting firm Westport Intl as a Managing Director, the last position she held before co-founding Group928.

 Christina holds a bachelor's degree in Financial Management from the College of Business & Behavioral Science at Clemson University and a master's degree in Human Resources from Clemson University. She lives with her family just outside of Greenville, SC.

• Christina on LinkedIn
• Group 928 website link
• Manufacturing 365 podcast link

• Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call
• Mark on LinkedIn
• Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby
• Mark on Facebook
• Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach

Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter

With over a million dollars billed consecutively for the last two years, and career billings surpassing $6.6 million, Nate Zimmerman is a Senior Partner and Executive Recruiter at High Country Private Equity Search, based in Denver.

In this episode, Nate shares his journey from breaking into recruitment by cold-calling the firm owner to becoming the youngest Partner in the firm’s history. He breaks down the key milestones along the way from hitting $400K, to breaking 7-figures, to building a team.

Nate has distinguished himself in the competitive world of recruiting with his relentless focus on putting the relationship before the transaction. You’ll discover the work ethic, strategy, and mindset required to reach $1M in annual billings.

Episode Outline and Highlights

• [01:44] How Nate’s recruitment career began with a cold call.
• [09:15] Why Nate chose to specialize in Private Equity Executive Search.
• [10:33] Putting in the work early and laying the groundwork for future success.
• [15:06] Nate’s journey to becoming the youngest partner at High Country Private Equity Search.
• [22:20] Discussion on Nate’s approach to MPC Marketing.
• [26:33] Billing a million dollars for the first time.
• [35:54] Nate’s recruitment philosophy: “relationship before transaction.”
• [41:33] How Nate developed market mastery in his chosen niche
• [49:51] Juggling multiple priorities as a billing manager
• [55:24] Overcoming setbacks - what Nate learned from missing his billing goal in 2023.

Laying the Groundwork for Future Success

Nate’s success can be attributed to his work ethic and belief in investing time and effort to develop his skills. “Knowing the underlying fundamentals, that is what I focused on initially,” explained Nate. “How to recruit people, how to interview people, how to take a job order, how to get a job order. Those things you got to put in the time and effort.”

A major differentiator that Nate shared is how he makes the most of his time - “On the weekends, spend two to three hours, Saturday and Sunday, every weekend during the first couple of years into this industry doing that really basic research. It's contributing long-term to your market mastery. Every hour that you are spending… it's all going to pay dividends.”

He shared his typical day looking at job boards. He emphasized the importance of quality , leading to talk about his MPC and targeted marketing strategies. He also elaborated on his thought process and what is going on in his mind as he achieve his milestones. The important takeaways from this part of our conversation are the value of discipline, consistency, and having a clear vision to align your habits and processes in achieving your goals.

Billing A Million Dollars for the First Time

One of Nate’s significant milestones is when he billed a million dollars for the first time. I had to probe for what he did differently on top of his discipline in planning, allotting extra time to research, conducting weekly internal training, and so on. He successfully laid down his groundwork for success and meeting the seven-digit billing is an astonishing achievement. 

Here is what Nate had to say: “You always have to figure out, okay, who's going to be my honeypot next year? And if it's the same client as your best client multiple years in a row, I can assure you that's not going to continue, right? The fees stop coming. So that was a big thing. And frankly, a lot of that did come through referrals. I was very fortunate, but I've gotten to a point now where I'm realizing that, hey, that luck, that it's not forever. So you're gonna have to go out and make that luck next year. Go get that next big client. Don't wait for one of your clients that you're doing such a great job for. You deserve those referrals, but that doesn't mean they're gonna come.”

Deep-diving on this topic further, Nate also shared several important key factors to help recruiters and recruitment business owners meet their billing goals:

• Focusing on relationships first before doing transactions. Nate shared why he puts effort into meeting his clients face-to-face.
• Finding the best candidates and “living inside their heads”. For Nate, it means “to understand, their motivations, their family, you know, where they wanna be in five years. That's always the most important question. I tell candidates, look, you know, it's my job to give you an option and then it's your job to decide.”

Critical Learnings from 2023

It may sound like Nate has the Midas touch, where he turns everything he touches into gold. On the contrary, it was never a walk in the park. Nate even shared why they are currently at an inflection point this year because of a setback in terms of expected versus actual revenue. So I wanted to hear the learnings from his perspective that he is willing to share for the benefit of our listeners. Nate shared that even if the market is unpredictable and can be difficult, we should focus on the things we can control. He mentioned a few action items that they will implement, such as leveraging technology, doing roadshows, and setting up email campaigns. 

I admire Nate’s resilience this is a recurring topic in our coaching calls. Focusing on things you can control and influence is one of the many ways to make your recruitment business recession and future-proof.

Our Sponsor

This podcast is proudly sponsored by i-intro 

i-intro® is an end-to-end retained recruitment platform. Their technology and methodology allow recruiters to differentiate themselves from the competition, win more retained business, bigger fees, and increase their billings. Their software combined with world-class training enables you to transition from transactional, contingency recruiter to consultative, retained recruiter. Instead of being perceived as a “me too” vendor, you’ll be positioned as a “me only” solutions provider. Be sure to mention Mark Whitby or The Resilient Recruiter. Book your free, no-obligation consultation here: https://recruitmentcoach.com/retained

Nate Zimmerman Bio and Contact Info

Nate specializes in finding ultra-high-performing talent for private equity firms, real estate investment firms, asset managers, and family offices. Nate believes it’s fundamentally valuable, regardless of the search, to focus always on the relationship before the transaction. First and foremost, his mission is to deliver excellence to his clients and candidates and purposefully build long-term relationships that produce value for years.

• Nate on LinkedIn
• High Country Search Group website link

People and Resources Mentioned

• Pinnacle Society website link
• Atomic Habits by James Clear
• Interseller

Related Podcast You Might Enjoy

• TRR#59 How to Build a Multi-Million Dollar Team of Recruitment Rockstars, with Monte Merz

• Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call
• Mark on LinkedIn
• Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby
• Mark on Facebook
• Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach

Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter

This episode is not only special but also exceptional! We will not only be hearing from one or two guests, but you will also hear a panel interview featuring three special guests. Join me in this conversation with Joe Rice, Annie Colabella, and Matt Walsh. If these names ring a bell, it's because all three have graced our podcast as guests before and are esteemed members of the Pinnacle Society.

You will hear our discussions that will reveal the DNA of a million-dollar biller and key strategies that have contributed to their success, emphasizing the significance of delegation, consistency, and surrounding oneself with high-performing individuals.

Episode Outline and Highlights

• [03:10] Panelists introduction.
• [09:15] The DNA of a Million-Dollar Biller.
• [23:13] Practices and activities that will level up your team’s performance.
• [35:00] Investing in marketing while growing your business. 
• [43:10] Andrea’s advice on how to increase your billings over time.
• [49:06] Why do you do what you do? - the WHYs of top billers.
• [55:30] Best practices on business development.

The DNA of a Million-Dollar Biller

Our panelists are Pinnacle Society members because they are industry leaders. Each of them was invited to this podcast and they did not fail to share their thought processes that made them million-dollar billers. In the webinar, they discussed crucial success factors that many aspiring recruiters and owners of recruitment businesses can glean valuable insights from. I asked them this question: What are two or three specific things you would attribute your success to that enable you to consistently produce at that level?

Matt shared key elements: the power of delegation and strategies in growing his team. He invested in his marketing and hired marketing persons early on in the growth of his boutique firm. The other thing is he was able to set up his business so that the billers are only focused on the things that are revenue generating while a lot of the administration - the sourcing, and the scheduling of interviews is done for them.

Joe also revealed what makes him and his team great: accountability, resilience, the right mindset, and always looking for ways to improve. He told the story of how they were humbled in 2020 and why it is important to keep on going. Joe believes that leveraging technology can be a game-changer in maximizing productivity and revenue. He also shared the tech stack they are using in their business process.

Annie on the other hand, revealed that knowing when to say no is critical to business success. “Saying no to opportunities and walking away from searches when you know that they're impossible to fill or the client is just being unreasonable in terms of what they're looking for, or if they're just searches where you're up against multiple agencies.” She then shared innovative approaches to creative fee structures to give more options to their clients.  Overall, you will find that their solution-oriented mindset is what makes them successful.

Business Development Best Practices

In this webinar, a lot of viewers were throwing questions related to business development and what specific tactics each of the panelists was using. It does make sense to ask that question, after all, business development strategies contribute greatly to client engagement and revenue. Our panelists generously shared what they do. 

For Annie, old-school MPC (most placeable candidate) marketing has been a reliable strategy. On top of cold calls and emails, they embed video instructions for the candidates. What differentiates them is how they present their MPCs to the market. This is how Annie puts it, “Basically, in the industry that I'm in, there are new fund launches and funds that are raising assets and just, you know, mindfully tracking them, knowing that they may have new headcount due to new assets under management. “

Matt elaborated on their “three-bucket” strategy: using inbound leads, MPC marketing, and leveraging references. On the references part, Matt said something that I am sure will resonate with most recruiters and business owners: “I feel like recruiters so often like, oh, I don't want to do references and that's just such a time waste and they should be doing the references. But there is so much gold there. I mean, think about it. You are talking to the person who reports to the person you're trying to place like it's gold. Were they good, or were they better? Who else do you know? And then so references and BD through recruiting are the ones in the middle for the now, it's so cool and that's one of the strategies we're using I love it Fantastic BD through recruiting.”

Joe then shares their “two-purpose approach.” To summarize, Joe defines it this way: “The two-purpose approach is when you are reaching out to a candidate to recruit them for a job, but they also hire candidates that you might be able to place, and so we might say, Mark, I'm reaching out to you for two reasons.”

Which of these three do you think would work best for your recruitment business?

Why Do You Do What You Do? - the WHYs of top billers.

Understanding the WHY behind the success of our guests is important because it provides valuable insights into the principles, motivations, and strategies that contribute to their achievements. So I wanted to know why they do what they do.

For Matt, it is about impacting people’s lives. “When you talk about it, in changing lives which we're doing for me, it's not just changing a candidate's life by getting them a new job, or changing a client's life by getting them an amazing executive team so now they can focus on their kids. It's also our internal employees. We've had folks that they're running their firm.”

For Annie, it is her passion to love what she does. “I feel like just having a passion for being an executive recruitment and the matchmaking that we do has always been something I'm so grateful that I found very early on in my career. I am very good at what I do. I love being able to go to work every day knowing that I am doing something that I'm very skilled at, as well as impacting the people around me.”

I also admire Joe’s answer to the question: “I think I've learned to be grateful for this business and for everything that I've been blessed with... For me, it goes into the parable of the talent. We've all been given a set of talents and I believe that we're called to maximize those talents for good. “

Our Sponsor

This podcast is proudly sponsored by i-intro 

i-intro® is an end-to-end retained recruitment platform. Their technology and methodology allow recruiters to differentiate themselves from the competition, win more retained business, bigger fees, and increase their billings. Their software combined with world-class training enables you to transition from transactional, contingency recruiter to consultative, retained recruiter. Instead of being perceived as a “me too” vendor, you’ll be positioned as a “me only” solutions provider. Be sure to mention Mark Whitby or The Resilient Recruiter. Book your free, no-obligation consultation here: https://recruitmentcoach.com/retained

Andrea (Annie) Colabella Bio and Contact Info

Annie is a Johns Hopkins alumnus with bachelor’s and master’s degrees.  She has been recruiting since 2005, initially across all industries, and over the past decade with a focus on the investment management space. Her excellence in the industry is highlighted through her admittance into The Pinnacle Society, an influential group of industry-leading recruiters. She started her firebrand agency, Cardea Group, in 2009 focused on assisting private equity firms, hedge funds, venture capital funds, family offices, and traditional asset managers in staffing their non-investment functions. Andrea is also an active board member of several not-for-profits.

• Annie on LinkedIn
• The Cardea Group website link

Joe Rice Bio and Contact Info

Joe is a Managing Partner and Founder of Joseph David International (JDI), twice recognized by Forbes as one of the best executive recruiting firms in America. He is also a partner in MogulRecruiter, a technology platform that provides recruiting, booking, and talent solutions for service leaders. His recruiting career started in 2005 with Snelling Hospitality with a specialty in executive search, consulting, talent acquisition, and organizational leadership.

• Joe on LinkedIn
• Joseph David International (JDI) website link 

Matt Walsh Bio and Contact Info

Matt Walsh is the CEO, and Founder of Blue Signal, a multimillion-dollar, award-winning, Phoenix-based Recruitment Agency specializing in IT, IoT, Telecom, Wireless, Supply Chain, Food Production, Manufacturing, Healthcare, Accounting and finance, HR, and Emerging Tech.

Matt has over 15 years of experience in recruitment. Matt was born and raised in a small farm community in Illinois. He received his bachelor’s degree from Illinois State University and landed a job at Management Recruiters International in Chicago. At MRI, he won several awards. Matt left MRI in 2010 to consult and started Blue Signal in 2012.

• Matt on LinkedIn
• Blue Signal website link

People and Resources Mentioned

• Danny Cahill on LinkedIn
• Allan Fisher on LinkedIn
• Pinnacle Society
• We-Connect
• Interseller
• SourceWhale

Related Podcast You Might Enjoy

• TRR#76 Recruitment Marketing: How to Amplify Your Sales with Effective Marketing, with Matt Walsh 
• TRR#65 How to Build (or Rebuild) Your Recruitment Firm to 7-Figures From Scratch, with Joe Rice
• TRR#167 3 Simple Steps to Increase Your Billings from 6 to 7-Figures, with Andrea Colabella
• TRR#166 How to Bill $1,000,000 For Ten Years Straight and Grow a Successful Team, with Allan Fisher

• Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call
• Mark on LinkedIn
• Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby
• Mark on Facebook
• Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach

Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter

This episode celebrates the 200th episode of the Resilient Recruits Podcast with special guest, founder of Recruitment Coach, Mark Whitby. 

Mark is the founder of Recruitment Coach and one of the world's leading coaches for the global recruitment industry. Since 2001, he has trained over 10,000 recruiters in 34 countries. He's helped countless recruiters double or triple their billings in just 6-12 months, and business owners grow their companies 10x.

Mark shares his journey into recruitment, starting with a failed business venture that led him to discover his passion for sales. He then talks about his first job in recruitment and the hunger and drive that propelled him to success. Mark also reflects on the past four years of the podcast and the valuable insights he has gained from interviewing over 100 successful recruitment professionals.

Having worked closely with hundreds of recruiting, staffing, and search firms, Mark has unique insight into how the top-producing recruiters and fastest-growing companies operate. 

Episode Outline and Highlights

• [02:20] What led Mark to pursue a career in recruitment?
• [06:20] How hiring a professional coach impacted Mark’s performance.
• [14:01] The value of training when scaling your recruitment business - hear training solutions for growing teams.
• [17:44] Mark transitioned from a recruiter to a recruitment coach.
• [19:41] What has changed in the recruitment industry in the 22 years Mark has been coaching?
• [25:24] Key challenges and lessons that Mark experienced over the years.
• [38:17] Celebrating 200 episodes - What motivated Mark to start the Resilient Recruiter podcast?
• [44:47] What is Mark most proud of in his entrepreneurial career?

Hiring a Professional Coach Became a Game Changer

Mark told the story of how he started his own business at the young age of 19. Without any prior experience, it ended up failing but it also led him to discover his love for sales which eventually directed him to become a recruiter. 

His experience in his first recruitment job made him realize a critical challenge in the recruitment industry at that time: “So the first company I joined there was no training. It was like, or very little. There was a little bit of shadowing of people and like, but pretty much you just like you're in the bullpen and you had to sink or swim and just figure it out by looking at what other people were doing and copying them. But unfortunately, a lot of the people around me weren't very good or didn't know what they were doing either.”

Mark was then headhunted to join a larger recruitment firm of around 200 recruiters. Even though Mark was meeting his target and was in the middle of the leaderboard, he felt that he could still do way more. Mark hired a brilliant coach and this was a game-changer for Mark. 

“He helped me double my billings in about 90 days and my manager was like what the heck is going on? So that was such a transformative experience that it kind of planted the seed later for me to decide to become a coach myself.”

Mark's dual role as a recruiter and coachee laid the groundwork for discovering the secret sauce for aiding recruiters and business owners. For those venturing into recruitment business ownership, Mark's narrative is valuable in recognizing the pivotal role of training and coaching in the growth and scaling of your business.

Reflections on the Evolving Landscape of the Recruitment Industry Across Mark’s 22-Year Coaching Tenure

Mark also shared how the landscape of recruitment has changed over the last couple of decades that he has been recruiting. He remembers the day their key focus was cold calling, networking, and getting referrals. He also recalled his learnings when he lost 80% of his revenue overnight during the 2008-09 recession. 

Mark emphasized how embracing digital marketing became a pivotal move, leading to increased success post-recession. This also transitioned his key focus areas for training. As Mark said, “Originally when I was training people, it was how to self-retain, search, how to do business development, how to negotiate, you know how to close offers, all that kind of stuff right. And suddenly people could see what I was doing with marketing, with branding, with email marketing, and they're like, hey, could you help us to do that, because that looks like the way forward, right?”

This recollection underscores the importance of adapting to changing circumstances and highlights the importance of continuous learning and development.

Key Challenges and Lessons Learned

Mark also discussed the key challenges and lessons he had to go through over the years. He outlined several critical topics that resonate well with a lot of the listeners. Here are some takeaways:

1. The value of seeking mentors and role models.
2. The importance of digital marketing for solo recruiters and entrepreneurs.
3. Realizing that you cannot do everything by yourself - hire a team of virtual assistants.
4. Overcome the fear of hiring a full-time employee or partner to complement.
5. Appreciating the concept of “One plus one equals three.”

Mark then recalled how he started this podcast four years ago. Leanne and Mark discussed how this has impacted their clients and other recruiters who have ventured out to start their recruitment firms. 

What are Mark’s proudest coaching moments throughout the years? “So what I'm most proud of is the results that our clients obtain. It's kind of comparable to, for our listeners, when you make a placement and you really have that impact and you change someone's life for the better both the candidate, of course, in a better opportunity, but then the client company also benefits from that talent that you've brought to them. 

So the equivalent for us is when we're working with a client and they achieve incredible results whether it's shifting to retained search, whether it's launching a podcast, whether it's hiring a virtual assistant, and then that being such a life-changing thing, game-changing, to free up all that time and be able to accelerate your billing. So I live for those success stories. When, at the beginning of every coaching call, we start out with wins and everyone needs to share a win, something they've made progress on, something they've achieved since we last saw them. That's my favorite part of the week is hearing those wins from our members.”

Our Sponsor

This podcast is proudly sponsored by i-intro 

i-intro® is an end-to-end retained recruitment platform. Their technology and methodology allow recruiters to differentiate themselves from the competition, win more retained business, bigger fees, and increase their billings. Their software combined with world-class training enables you to transition from transactional, contingency recruiter to consultative, retained recruiter. Instead of being perceived as a “me too” vendor, you’ll be positioned as a “me only” solutions provider. Be sure to mention Mark Whitby or The Resilient Recruiter. Book your free, no-obligation consultation here: https://recruitmentcoach.com/retained

• Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call
• Mark on LinkedIn
• Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby
• Mark on Facebook
• Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach

Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter

In this episode, we delve into the intricacies of managing a remote team, a topic significantly relevant in today’s era where flexibility and adaptability are critical to success.

We are joined by Sam Brenner, owner of CRB Workforce, which is 100% remote. Sam and I discussed his strategies and actionable insights on how they build their high-performing culture in a remote setup. From leadership styles and collaborative check-ins to leveraging tech stack, you will hear Sam’s action points to thriving in the world of remote team management.

Guided by his motto, "The harder you work, the luckier you get," Sam is living proof of how determination and ambition lead to incredible outcomes. 

Sam launched his recruitment agency in 2018 from his apartment. Since then the business has grown rapidly to a team of 16 recruiting technology and marketing people across multiple sectors. 

Episode Outline and Highlights

• [01:03] From Commercial Real Estate to Recruiting.
• [07:49] Sam shares his fears and challenges of launching his recruitment firm in 2018.
• [16:22] How to create strong relationships with long-term contractors and consultants.
• [22:51] Staying resilient in dealing with multiple setbacks.
• [27:13] Building a sustainable culture in a remote working environment.
• [38:46] Investing in systems and processes to enhance collaboration in a remote setup.
• [42:30] Sam reveals their daily practices and activities to keep everyone engaged remotely.
• [51:25] Discussion on core values and how they translate to performance and culture.
• [57:40] Navigating the 2023 recruitment market.

Building Team Culture Remotely Through Collaboration Systems and Practices 

A common ground between me and Sam is that our businesses are operating 100% remotely. Managing a remote team can be challenging for some recruitment business owners, especially on the collaboration part. So Sam and I discussed their best practices on how they keep their team together, the systems they use, and the practices they do, in order to work collaboratively in a 100% remote setup.

• Leadership - Sam shared his leadership style that contributes to their culture and way of working. He emphasized the value of transparency - with him being an “open book.” He also elaborated on trust and the philosophy of “pushing your way in, don’t wait to be pulled in.”

• Collaborative Check-ins - Sam discussed their concept of Zoom check-ins for collaborative tasks and highlighted the value of investing in systems that promote communication and collaboration. We also talked about the importance of having clear agendas and keeping virtual meetings focused. Sam also shared their “Wednesday Walk Day” which well resonated with our team.

• Systems - Sam shared online platforms and applications that they use to collaborate such as Miro, Bullhorn, and Nectar.

Core Values That Translate to a Culture of Performance

Core values contribute to your recruitment firm's success as they cover your team’s culture and well-being, which translate to overall performance. With his team working 100% remotely, Sam believes that their core values play an important role in keeping their team together despite working in different time zones. He shared their organization’s core values:

• The Power of Attitude - “You know, just be in control and set your attitude, because it's one of the only things you can control.”

• Feedback - “Feedback is like a huge pillar for us, and so it's feedback, and it's giving effective feedback, taking feedback. So it's a two-way street, and that's one of the things that I lead with. I'm giving people feedback and I'm always asking for feedback, and so if someone sees something they don't like, they don't wallow in it.”

• Pressure - “I want people to face the pressure. I want people to run towards their legacy, like, not away from it. “

As a recruitment business owner, having values aligned with your vision and mission statement can strengthen your team’s bond and guide your organization’s decision-making. 

Resilience in Launching His Business and Navigating the Future of Recruitment

Sam and I also zoomed in on the challenges and struggles he had to overcome when launching his own business. He shared his transition from commercial real estate to recruitment, and how his strong sales background became a foundation for his success in recruiting. When he launched CRB in 2018, he had to endure a roller coaster of emotions and had to overcome his fear of failure. He also had to deal with a lawsuit that lasted for two and a half years. If you are a recruiter aspiring to build your own recruitment practice, you will be inspired by Sam’s early struggles as this led to his current success. 

We also talked about the 2023 market and how they are navigating this erratic recruitment market. We agreed that the most effective way to deal with it is to put ourselves in the best possible position to capture opportunities that will always be there.  The only way to do that is just to keep doing the right things, day in and day out.

Our Sponsor

This podcast is proudly sponsored by i-intro 

i-intro® is an end-to-end retained recruitment platform. Their technology and methodology allow recruiters to differentiate themselves from the competition, win more retained business, bigger fees, and increase their billings. Their software combined with world-class training enables you to transition from transactional, contingency recruiter to consultative, retained recruiter. Instead of being perceived as a “me too” vendor, you’ll be positioned as a “me only” solutions provider. Be sure to mention Mark Whitby or The Resilient Recruiter. Book your free, no-obligation consultation here: https://recruitmentcoach.com/retained

Sam Brenner Bio and Contact Info

Guided by his motto, "The harder you work, the luckier you get," Sam Brenner is living proof of how determination and ambition lead to incredible outcomes. His business journey started back in 2018 as a humble operation in his apartment. Now, the Founder and CEO of CRB Workforce, a rapidly growing recruitment agency, he’s turned his company into a force to be reckoned with, spanning the US and beyond. From startups to industry giants, CRB has served so many incredible businesses. 

Sam has achieved remarkable success and earned a prominent —and well-deserved—place in the business world. With over 20 years of experience and a passion for creating opportunities to better other people’s lives.

• Sam on LinkedIn
• CRB website link
• CRB on LinkedIn

People and Resources Mentioned

• Miro Board - Collaboration Tool
• Bullhorn 
• Nectar 
• Simon La Fosse on LinkedIn

Related Podcast You Might Enjoy

• TRR#116 How Treating People Well Delivers 30% Annual Revenue Growth for 15 Years, with Simon La Fosse
• TRR#47 How to Define Your Recruitment Company’s Culture, with Bretton Putter

• Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call
• Mark on LinkedIn
• Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby
• Mark on Facebook
• Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach

Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter

The past couple of years have shown an astonishing development in generative AI. Artificial Intelligence emerges as a transformative force, reshaping the landscape of recruiting by introducing unprecedented efficiencies, data-driven insights, and innovative solutions that promise to revolutionize the way organizations discover, engage, and hire top talent.

In this episode, we are in for a treat as one of the leading voices in AI and Data Science joins us to share unique perspectives and insights into the transformative effects of artificial intelligence on talent acquisition. Jon Krohn is a leading figure in the realm of artificial intelligence and machine learning. He’s the Co-Founder and Chief Data Scientist at Nebula.io, an intelligent Talent Acquisition platform.

He authored the book Deep Learning Illustrated, an instant #1 bestseller that was translated into seven languages. 

He is also the host of SuperDataScience, the data science industry’s most listened-to podcast. 

Jon is renowned for his compelling lectures, which he offers at leading universities and conferences, as well as via his award-winning YouTube channel. He holds a PhD from Oxford and has been publishing on machine learning in prominent academic journals since 2010.

Episode Outline and Highlights

• [03:11] Jon’s fascinating career milestones - from high-frequency trading and yoga to data science.
• [08:37] What led Jon into the world of talent acquisition?
• [17:10] Effectively applying generative AI into talent acquisition.
• [24:58] Generative AI’s other potential applications in automating the recruitment industry.
• [35:04] How close are we to getting generative AI to do excellent writing?
• [44:00] What makes Nebula’s methodology stand out from other AI platforms?
• [52:16] What will the next 3 - 5 years look like in terms of Generative AI applications to recruitment?
• [1:02:04] How AI platforms can elevate the human experience?

Artificial Intelligence in Talent Acquisition 

Jon shared his journey transitioning from high-frequency trader to yoga instructor to data scientist and co-founder of AI-driven talent acquisition platform Nebula.io.

He shared how this amazing platform leverages generative AI to help recruitment companies identify the best candidates in the least amount of time, which helps them to focus more on human connection in their workflow. This is how he explains it, “With nebula.io, you can type in ‘find me a data scientist in New York who specializes in machine learning,’ and we will take that small amount of natural language that you provided. We will apply the kinds of filters to the search automatically. So we'll apply a 50-mile radius around New York and we will generate some key information based on the small amount of information you provided.”

It doesn’t stop there because the results will be already curated based on each individual’s publicly available data to display ranking, potential compensation, and diversity. Their platform can also generate messages with information about the role, information about the candidate, and potentially information about the recruitment firm.

Jon explains that in the end, “You are making the final decision on whether a candidate is appropriate or not, but we're making the sourcing and messaging of candidates, the understanding of your searches and your candidates, as well as the engagement with your candidates, as simple and automated as possible so that you can focus, so the recruiters can focus on building relationships as opposed to just, you know, trying to find people and type out the messages.”

This is indeed phenomenal! Imagine what the future of recruitment will look like not only for recruiters but also for clients and candidates. In the long run, this can only enhance the end-to-end recruitment process experience across all stakeholders.

Artificial Intelligence in Recruitment Automation

Jon also described other ways Generative AI can impact the recruiter’s side of doing things. He mentioned several platforms that can automate interview scheduling and enhance the way recruiters can search their own databases. He mentioned how their semantic search feature can generate 10x more candidates than other platforms utilizing boolean search. He also mentioned a patented technology enabling candidate matching without incorporating historical biases against underrepresented groups. Of course, Jon and I discussed how close we are to having generative AI do very good writing.

Advancements in AI and Future Possibilities

How will AI impact the recruitment industry in the next three to five years?

Here is Jon’s response, “realistically, especially on the shorter timescales like three, five years, there isn't really any chance of recruitment being fully automated, and so what's going to happen is companies like Nebula and, of course, incumbents like LinkedIn are going to incorporate more and more automation, particularly generative AI, to automate the parts of your job. That can be so that things like sourcing candidates and stacking them in the right order drafting the initial message to them and drafting responses these things in three years I hope that most of your listeners are experiencing that kind of automation from platforms like Nebula in three years from now.”

Should recruiters worry that AI will take away most jobs in the industry? Highly unlikely. On the contrary, candidates and clients alike will always want human interaction. As Jon said, “Humans looking for a purpose in their work prefer to be speaking to a real human that they can meet with and get human advice from and context from.”

Our Sponsor

This podcast is proudly sponsored by i-intro 

i-intro® is an end-to-end retained recruitment platform. Their technology and methodology allow recruiters to differentiate themselves from the competition, win more retained business, bigger fees, and increase their billings. Their software combined with world-class training enables you to transition from transactional, contingency recruiter to consultative, retained recruiter. Instead of being perceived as a “me too” vendor, you’ll be positioned as a “me only” solutions provider. Be sure to mention Mark Whitby or The Resilient Recruiter. Book your free, no-obligation consultation here: https://recruitmentcoach.com/retained

Jon Krohn Bio and Contact Info

Dr. Jon Krohn is the Chief Data Scientist at Nebula, author of the bestselling book Deep Learning Illustrated, and host of the SuperDataScience podcast. Jon is renowned for his compelling lectures, which he offers in-person at Columbia University, New York University, and leading industry conferences.

• Jon on LinkedIn
• Jon’s website link
• Jon’s podcast, Super Data Science website link
• Nebula IO website link
• Jon on YouTube
• Deep Learning Illustrated book by Jon Krohn

People and Resources Mentioned

• Ed Donner on LinkedIn
• Steven Talbot on LinkedIn
• Flash Boys: A Wall Street Revolt Book by Michael Lewis
• Omnicon
• Github

Related Podcast You Might Enjoy

• TRR#52 The End of Jobs: Recruiting in the Age of Artificial Intelligence, with Jeff Wald

• Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call
• Mark on LinkedIn
• Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby
• Mark on Facebook
• Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach

Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter

Building a thriving recruitment business in the middle of a global pandemic may be unimaginable to most people, but not for Kyle Winterbottom.

Kyle’s strategy is clear and straightforward: give value, give value, give value! In this episode, Kyle uncovers the story of his journey into the recruitment industry and how the global crisis turned into a pathway of opportunity. 

Kyle is the Founder & CEO of Orbition Group, an award-winning talent solutions business. Based in Manchester, they focus exclusively on scaling Data, Analytics, and artificial intelligence teams across the UK, Europe, and the USA. 

Kyle is also the Founder/Host of the Driven by Data Community which is comprised of three components; The Roundtable, The Podcast, and The Mentorship. Kyle elaborated on his three proven long-term strategies for boosting engagement and building relationships

Episode Outline and Highlights

• [02:02] Launching a recruitment business during the height of the pandemic.
• [06:11] Community building and visibility to build brand awareness. 
• [10:23] Giving value through podcasting - should you start your own podcast?
• [17:02] Establishing commercial relationships.
• [24:26] How hosting live events can scale your business by demand.
• [34:43] Kyle talks about their Mentorship Programme and why it is the best long-term strategy.
• [41:57] Growing by demand vs. growing by design.
• [46:10] Revisiting business development strategies.

Give Value, Give Value, Give Value.

The pandemic can be perceived by many as not the best time to launch a business, but Kyle looked at it as the best time to kick off Orbition. His strategy is clear and straightforward: leverage content marketing and community building to build brand awareness. Give value first, and build relationships after.

“I guess that the whole premise was very simple. Just create a community of people who will ultimately be potential target customers and buying clients. Let's add a load of value to them and from there that'll create relationships. That then I guess the whole premise really is give value, give value, give value.”

Kyle elaborated on his strategies and you will find that there are three main takeaways:

• Content marketing and adding value to your ecosystem can lead to a snowball effect, where people will want to participate in your engagement activities.
• Prioritizing value adding to your market will generate not only visibility. It will position you as an expert and thought leader which gives you authority.
• It builds the best type of relationship - as your audience appreciates your contributions, you build a relationship that goes beyond the customer-vendor type.

Kyle shared his practices on how they continuously add value: via podcasting, live events, and mentorship programs.

Podcasting and Hosting Events

I was astonished when Kyle shared with me that 100% of their clients are through inbound marketing. I really wanted to pick his brains on their roadmap and the strategies they use. 

He shared that podcasting has been a really effective tool in engaging with their target audience. One of the reasons that it is really successful is because it invited guests who they find credible, people of influence and seniority within the marketplace who have something to share. Kyle also reminded the listeners that it can take time to really get engagement and ROI - so it is really important to be patient and consistent.

After the pandemic, Kyle and his team started hosting free live events. These events started to garner more demand than they could facilitate, so they had to find the right balance of content and format in order to scale these events. They get very positive feedback from those who participate in these live events. Kyle and his team are able to bring together Chief Data Officers to share best practices while networking with one another. 

Aside from the above engagement components, Kyle also discussed their mentorship program.

Deep Diving Into Their Mentorship Program 

“The mentorship program came from a place where I'm continually looking at what is the next thing that we can do for this community that adds value and how can we do something that also strategically aids the direction of the business”

Kyle shared what their mentorship program looks like and how it helps those starting their career in data analytics improve in technical and soft skills. Kyle also revealed that this is not something they are monetizing at the moment. He shared why: “It's more about the brand visibility and having that relationship, because I think for us, in all honesty, what we can earn from you know, charging for a mentorship program will be really insignificant in comparison to what we can earn off having that relationship with those people and obviously, what you know we're again think about the long game. “

This is indeed a wonderful approach to engagement and adding value to the community. If you think about it, the 300+ people joining their mentorship program become their brand ambassadors. Knowing that someday those who were mentored will eventually become decision makers and hiring managers, they will be future clients.

Our Sponsor

This podcast is proudly sponsored by i-intro 

i-intro® is an end-to-end retained recruitment platform. Their technology and methodology allow recruiters to differentiate themselves from the competition, win more retained business, bigger fees, and increase their billings. Their software combined with world-class training enables you to transition from transactional, contingency recruiter to consultative, retained recruiter. Instead of being perceived as a “me too” vendor, you’ll be positioned as a “me only” solutions provider. Be sure to mention Mark Whitby or The Resilient Recruiter. Book your free, no-obligation consultation here: https://recruitmentcoach.com/retained

Kyle Winterbottom Bio and Contact Info

Kyle is the founder and CEO of Orbition Group, an award-winning talent solutions business that operates exclusively within the Data and Analytics space across the UK, Europe, and USA. Kyle is also the Founder/Host of the Driven by Data Community which is composed of three components: Driven by Data: The Roundtable, Driven by Data: The Podcast, and Driven by Data: The Mentorship.

Kyle is also featured in the Data IQ 100 Most Influential People in Data for 2022 and 2023.

• Kyle on LinkedIn
• Orbition Group website link

People and Resources Mentioned

• Alex Cooke on LinkedIn

Related Podcast You Might Enjoy

• TRR#195 Recruitment Rhythms: How Human Connection Elevates You Above the Competition, with Alex Cooke 

• Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call
• Mark on LinkedIn
• Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby
• Mark on Facebook
• Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach

Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter

Ever find yourself hitting a brick wall when it comes to developing engaging content? Don't despair! 

Recently, I was invited as a guest speaker on the Retained Recruiter Show, which is a weekly LinkedIn live hosted by our good friends at i-Intro. The topic was How to Get More Clients with Content Marketing. i-Intro told me that this was one of the most popular live streams that they'd ever produced, and they've given me permission to share the recording with you on this podcast.

You will hear me discuss with James O’Brien and Jo Gregory strategies to effectively and consistently post original content and how it will attract your target audience. You will know how content marketing can position you as a trusted authority instead of being just a vendor.

Episode Outline and Highlights

• [03:52] How content marketing transformed many recruitment businesses.

• [06:05] Mark shares the easiest way to get started with content marketing.

• [10:00] Authenticity is the key - leveraging AI platforms while keeping it original.

• [15:11] How much time do you need to put aside for content marketing?

• [18:30] How long would you give it to see engagement results?

• [23:26] The powerful returns of consistently posting content and sharing to your community.

• [30:27] How to measure and track your ROI from content marketing?

What is Content Marketing?

As a recruiter, content marketing is critical to continuously engage with your audience and remain relevant to clients and candidates. So what is content marketing? Content marketing is a marketing strategy that involves creating and distributing valuable, relevant content to your target audience on a consistent basis. It might be education-based marketing. In essence, you're providing market insight and thought leadership that will benefit your clients and your candidates. 

An example is the consistent posting of original content on LinkedIn. This is the easiest way for people to get started with content marketing. There are three reasons:

1. This is a tool available for everybody, whether you are a small boutique search firm or an individual recruiter. 

2. There is guaranteed measurable ROI.

3. It is fun! You get positive feedback and engagement from your network and can spark conversations with people you are already connected.

From personal experience, I can tell you that content marketing can transform your business. Aside from building you an audience, consistent content original, and authentic content can build trust for you as an expert in your niche and a credible advisor.

Time and Results in Content Marketing

How much time do you need to put aside for content marketing? It really depends on how frequently you are going to post. The important step you take is to commit to a schedule. It is important to be consistent, so consider a schedule that you can sustain. If for example, you will post 3x a week or 12x a month: spending 20 minutes per post will only require you an hour a week to write or create that content.

How long would you need to take to see engagement results? This can be a tricky question. Content marketing is like going to the gym. You may not see immediate results, but for sure, you will get results! The important thing is consistency. Just like how you would approach any business development and marketing activity - you may not get immediate results but you will definitely get results! But by showing up consistently, you are giving yourself the opportunity to be in that right place at the right time and, more importantly, you're creating what we call top-of-mind awareness or TOMA.

Methods for Content Creation and Engagement

What is the best content to create engagement? Should you use videos, images, audio, or just text-only posts? There are pros and cons to all those things, and ideally, you will want to do a variety of them all.  

You just have to go out there and do it. No need to complicate things. You can record a video on your smartphone while with a client or your team. You may post images of the industry conference you are attending for your audience to recognize you as a person of authority in your field. 

How about leveraging AI like ChatGPT to create content? You can leverage generative AI and many other tools. But the key is to keep it authentic, original, and relatable to yourself. 

People and Resources Mentioned

• James O’Brien on LinkedIn

• Jo Gregory on LinkedIn

• Rich Rosen on LinkedIn

• ChatGPT

• Claude AI

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