We Can Do Hard Things

1. What is your Enneagram number–and how does this ancient wisdom explain WHY you do what you do? 

2. Why Glennon *really* didn’t want to accept her Enneagram number, and how she finally saw herself clearly in it. 

3. How the Enneagram helps Amanda have much more compassion for herself–and how she uses it to understand common patterns in her marriage. 

4. Glennon and Amanda use the Enneagram to dissect what is *actually* going on in their conflicts, and how to make each other feel seen and understood.

About Ashton:

Ashton Whitmoyer-Ober is an author, public speaker, Community Psychologist, and certified Enneagram educator. With a desire to see relationships strengthened and people empowered, she created Enneagram Ashton in early 2019. She is the author of Enneagram for Relationships, The Two of Us: A Three Year Couples Journal, and The Enneagram Made Simple.

IG: @enneagramashton

1. Brené and Barrett share their parenting strategy that Brené calls “the opposite of raising a child that’s full of shame.”

2. The family of origin roles that Brené (the Protector) and Barrett (the Peacekeeper) had to adjust in order to work together–and the two keys to working well with family.  

3. The ways in which a child who grows up living on eggshells becomes an adult who is fearful–and how that fear shows up differently for Brené, Barrett, Glennon, and Amanda.   

4. The hilarious moment when each sister confesses a secret that they fear the other believes about them–and we find out whether or not it’s true. 

5. How Brené and Barrett are walking through the grief of their mother’s sudden decline, and how they circle back when the stress of that grief makes them shitty to each other.  

About Brené: 

Dr. Brené Brown is a research professor at the University of Houston where she holds the Huffington Foundation Endowed Chair at The Graduate College of Social Work.She has spent the past two decades studying courage, vulnerability, shame, and empathy, is the author of six #1 New York Times bestsellers, and is the host of the weekly podcasts Unlocking Us and Dare to Lead. 

Brené’s books have been translated into more than 30 languages and titles include: Dare to Lead, Braving the Wilderness, Rising Strong, Daring Greatly, and The Gifts of Imperfection. Most recently Brené collaborated with Tarana Burke to co-edit You Are Your Best Thing: Vulnerability, Shame Resilience, and the Black Experience. 

In her latest #1 New York Times bestseller, ATLAS OF THE HEART, which has been adapted for television and now streaming on HBO Max, she takes us on a journey through eighty-seven of the emotions and experiences that define what it means to be human. 

Brené lives in Houston, Texas, with her husband, Steve. They have two children, Ellen and Charlie.

TW: @BreneBrown

IG: @BreneBrown

About Barrett: 

Barrett Guillen is Chief of Staff for Brené Brown Education and Research Group. With her team, Barrett supports both Brené and the organization by helping to prioritize competing demands, managing relationships, and building connective tissue and strategy across all business initiatives. Barrett holds bachelor’s and master’s degrees in Kinesiology from the University of Houston. After more than a decade in education in the Texas Panhandle, Barrett and her family moved back to the Houston area to join Brene’s team in making the world a braver place. Having the opportunity to work with her sisters every day has been one of the great joys of her life. Outside the office, you can find Barrett spending time with her family (immediate and extended), enjoying her daughter’s games, eating her husband’s famous burgers, floating in the water (any water!), or on the pickle ball court.

Jen Hatmaker is back with the new man in her life–actor, author, and activist Tyler Merritt–for a double date with Glennon and Abby discussing:  

1. How Jen and Tyler met, what first attracted Jen and Tyler to each other–and who made the first move.  

2. How not knowing any “dating rules” led Jen to jumpstart the “define the relationship” step.  

3. The triggers for Jen that led to an early relationship “wobble” and how Jen is navigating issues of trust and safety after her divorce. 

4. The joys and challenges of dating as two fully formed grown up adults. 

5. Jen, Tyler, Abby, and Glennon each share the one thing they love most about their partners. 

About Jen: 

Jen Hatmaker is the New York Times bestselling author of For the Love and Fierce, Free, and Full of Fire, along with twelve other books. She hosts the award-winning For the Love podcast, is the delighted curator of the Jen Hatmaker Book Club, and leader of a tightly knit online community where she reaches millions of people each week. Jen is a co-founder of Legacy Collective, a giving organization that grants millions of dollars toward sustainable projects around the world. She is a mom to five kids and lives happily just outside Austin, Texas.

To learn more about Jen, visit www.jenhatmaker.com.

TW: @JenHatmaker

IG: @jenhatmaker

About Tyler:

Tyler Merritt is a Nashville-based actor, activist, cancer survivor, founder of The Tyler Merritt Project, and author of "I TAKE MY COFFEE BLACK: REFLECTIONS ON TUPAC, MUSICAL THEATER, FAITH AND BEING BLACK IN AMERICA." Over the course of his career, Tyler has gained recognition through notable acting projects including "Kevin Probably Saves The World," "Outer Banks," and "The Outsider," as well as serving as the face of the worldwide teaching curriculum for The Gospel Project for Kids. Tyler Merritt made headlines with his 2018 viral video "Before You Call The Cops," which has been viewed by over 60 million people worldwide and appeared on Jimmy Kimmel Live. As a 6’2'' dreadlocked Black man living inAmerica, where racial injustices continue to plague our society, Tyler has emerged as a steadfast activist in the face of racism.

TW: @TTMProject

IG: @thetylermerrittproject

1. Jen describes the shock of losing her 26-year marriage overnight. 

2. How, looking back, Jen sees that she knew something was wrong in her relationship well before she “knew” something was wrong–and the moment she reached out to Glennon to share it for the first time.  

3. Why Jen’s friends told her she was a “human spotlight” and “cleanup crew” in her marriage–and the pain of realizing she was powerful in every role other than wife.  

4. How Jen convinced herself that her marriage was enough when in reality she felt like a pot of water slowly building to a boil. 

5. The common hell of being lonely inside of marriage–and why we won’t be fully honest with ourselves, our partners, or our friends about what we are most afraid of.  

About Jen: 

Jen Hatmaker is the New York Times bestselling author of For the Love and Fierce, Free, and Full of Fire, along with twelve other books. She hosts the award-winning For the Love podcast, is the delighted curator of the Jen Hatmaker Book Club, and leader of a tightly knit online community where she reaches millions of people each week. Jen is a co-founder of Legacy Collective, a giving organization that grants millions of dollars toward sustainable projects around the world. She is a mom to five kids and lives happily just outside Austin, Texas.

To learn more about Jen, visit www.jenhatmaker.com.

TW: @JenHatmaker

IG: @jenhatmaker

1. How to know if you are a “Bittersweet” type.

2. On “stabs of joy”—and why our joy is often accompanied by dread.

3. How to complete the cycle of sadness, in order to live with more joy.

4. Susan and Sister’s best relationship advice: That our longing for the perfect partner is not really about our partner.

5. Why Glennon thinks those who feel the ache are often those who fall into addiction.

About Susan:

Susan Cain is the author of the bestsellers Quiet Journal, Quiet Power: The Secret Strengths of Introverts, and Quiet: The Power of Introverts in A World That Can’t Stop Talking, which has been translated into 40 languages, spent seven years on the New York Times best seller list, and was named the #1 best book of the year by Fast Company magazine, which also named Cain one of its Most Creative People in Business. Her new masterpiece, Bittersweet: How Sorrow and Longing Make Us Whole, was published by Crown on April 5, 2022.

LinkedIn named Susan the 6th Top Influencer in the world. Susan partners with Malcolm Gladwell, Adam Grant and Dan Pink to curate the Next Big Idea Book Club. They donate all their proceeds to children’s literacy programs.

Her writing has appeared in The New York Times, The Atlantic, The Wall Street Journal, and many other publications. Her record-smashing TED talk has been viewed over 40 million times, and was named by Bill Gates one of his all-time favorite talks.

Cain has also spoken at Google, PIXAR, the U.S. Treasury, P&G, Harvard, and West Point. She received Harvard Law School’s Celebration Award for Thought Leadership, the Toastmasters International Golden Gavel Award for Communication and Leadership, and was named one of the world’s top 50 Leadership and Management Experts by Inc. Magazine. She is an honors graduate of Princeton and Harvard Law School. Visit Susan at susancain.net. 

TW: @susancain

IG: @susancainauthor

Glennon’s son, Chase, joins Glennon for a special conversation with his hero, author Ocean Vuong, to discuss:

1. Chase shares with Ocean the impact his work has had in his life–and Glennon thanks Ocean for helping mother her son.

2. What Ocean learned from his mother about how to navigate being an Asian boy in America–and Glennon’s recognition that she did not prepare Chase for the same realities.

3. Ocean’s new book, Time is a Mother, and why watching his own mother die gave Ocean a deep empathy and connection to every person.

4. His relationship to maleness–and why Ocean is interested in “staying and complicating” masculinity.

About Ocean:

Ocean Vuong, author of the critically acclaimed poetry collection Night Sky with Exit Wounds, and the New York Times bestselling novel On Earth We’re Briefly Gorgeous is a recipient of the 2019 MacArthur "Genius Grant" and the winner of the Whiting Award and the T. S. Eliot Prize. In Time Is a Mother, Ocean's newest poetry collection available now, he reckons with his mother’s death, embodying the paradox of sitting within grief while being determined to survive beyond it. His writings have been featured in The Atlantic, Harper's Magazine, The Nation, The New Republic, The New Yorker, and The New York Times. Born in Saigon, Vietnam, he currently lives in Northampton, Massachusetts.

IG: ocean_vuong

1. How to know when to dig deep–and when to quit digging. 

2. The greatest blocker of connection–and how to remove it.

3. How to handle our fear (without obsessively controlling our people and our environment).

4. Why we all deserve a standing ovation for navigating relationships over the past two years.  

About Brené: 

Dr. Brené Brown is a research professor at the University of Houston where she holds the Huffington Foundation Endowed Chair at The Graduate College of Social Work. She has spent the past two decades studying courage, vulnerability, shame, and empathy, is the author of six #1 New York Times bestsellers, and is the host of the weekly podcasts Unlocking Us and Dare to Lead. 

In her latest #1 New York Times bestseller, ATLAS OF THE HEART, which has been adapted for television and now streaming on HBO Max, she takes us on a journey through eighty-seven of the emotions and experiences that define what it means to be human. 

Brené’s books have been translated into more than 30 languages and titles include: Dare to Lead, Braving the Wilderness, Rising Strong, Daring Greatly, and The Gifts of Imperfection. Most recently Brené collaborated with Tarana Burke to co-edit You Are Your Best Thing: Vulnerability, Shame Resilience, and the Black Experience. 

Brené lives in Houston, Texas, with her husband, Steve. They have two children, Ellen and Charlie.

TW: @BreneBrown

IG: @BreneBrown

1. Why Hannah describes her later-in-life Autism Spectrum Disorder diagnosis as “an exfoliation of shame.”

2. How neurodiversity affects Hannah’s relationships–and how she connects to the world through what’s “interesting” instead of what’s “important.”

3. Hannah’s revolutionary commitment to stop using self-deprecating humor about her body, sexuality, and gender–and why we might all consider the same commitment.

4. Why it’s easier for Hannah to share her personal stories “in bulk” on stage instead of one-on-one.

5. What it takes for Hannah to prepare for conversations–like ours on We Can Do Hard Things.

About Hannah:

Tasmania’s own Hannah Gadsby stopped stand-up comedy in its tracks with her multi-award-winning show, Nanette. When it premiered on Netflix in 2018, it left audiences captivated by her blistering honesty and her singular ability to take them from rolling laughter to devastated silence. Its release and subsequent Emmy and Peabody wins took Nanette (and Hannah) to the world. Hannah’s difficult second album (which was also her eleventh solo show) was named Douglas after her dog. Hannah walked Douglas around the world, selling out the Royal Festival Hall in London, the Opera House in Sydney and the Kennedy Center in DC, a sit-down run in New York and shows across the US, Europe, Australia and New Zealand. Douglas covered Hannah’s autism diagnosis, moving beyond the trauma at the centre of Nanette and instead letting the world see the view from Hannah’s brain – one that sees the world differently but with breathtaking clarity. The show was an Emmy-nominated smash hit and is available throughout the world on Netflix, recorded in Los Angeles. 

Hannah Gadsby’s “overnight” success was more than ten years in the making, with her award-winning stand-up shows having been a fixture in festivals across Australia and the UK since 2009. She played a character called “Hannah” on the TV series Please Like Me and has hosted multiple art documentaries, inspired by her comedy art lectures. In 2022, Hannah’s first book Ten Steps to Nanette: A Memoir Situation was published by Ballantine, an imprint of Penguin Random House, in the United States, Atlantic in the UK, and Allen & Unwin in Australia.

Hannah has done plenty of other things over the course of more than a decade in comedy, but that will do for now.

IG: hannah_gadsby

TW: HannahGadsby

1. Why we’ve been sold a lie–and the truth that we actually get happier the older we get!

2. The two most important–and shocking–predictors of aging well.

3. Busting the most prevalent misconceptions and about getting older.

4. How believing the myths about aging literally harms our health and makes us more vulnerable to the fears we hold about aging.

5. Glennon paints a mental picture of her older self–and encourages the Pod Squad to do the same.

About Ashton: 

The author of This Chair Rocks: A Manifesto Against Ageism, Ashton Applewhite is a leading spokesperson for the emerging movement to raise awareness of ageism and to dismantle it. A co-founder of the Old School Anti-Ageism Clearinghouse, she has been recognized by the New York Times, the New Yorker, National Public Radio, and the American Society on Aging as an expert on ageism. Ashton has written for Harper’s, the Guardian, and the New York Times, blogs at This Chair Rocks, and is the voice of Yo, Is This Ageist? She speaks widely at venues that have ranged from colleges and symposia to the TED mainstage and the United Nations. In 2022 she appeared on HelpAgeUSA’s inaugural 60 Over 60 List and on Fe:maleOneZero’s first international edition of 40 over 40 – The World’s Most Inspiring Women.

Twitter: @thischairrocks

Instagram: @thischairrocks

1. How Glennon is using her 46th birthday as an intermission–to slow down and decide what to bring with her into Act 2.

2. The counterculture power of knowing what is enough, and letting ourselves go.

3. The way to transition from Role Living to Soul Living–and why Glennon has Joni Mitchell on repeat.

4. The real meaning of “crisis”–and the idea that living well now means reimagining everything we learned in the first half of life. 

5. Amanda’ s good news that if you don’t feel like Glennon does at this moment in life, it is very, very normal.