Panicogenic Relaxation: Why You Feel Anxious When Feeling Calm

You're finally feeling better. The anxiety has lifted. You're relaxed and calm for the first time in months or even years. So why does that feel so weird? And why are you suddenly anxious about feeling calm?

In this episode, Drew and Josh explore "panicogenic relaxation". This is a common experience in anxiety disorder recovery where feeling normal, neutral, or relaxed can trigger concern or even high anxiety and panic. When you've been anxious for so long, that heightened state becomes your predictable default. The absence of anxiety can feel unfamiliar, strange, or even threatening.

In this episode, we discuss:

• Why feeling calm or relaxed can feel uncomfortable or even scary during recovery
• How your brain's scanning mechanisms continue even when you're no longer anxious
• Why anxiety becomes a "predictable pillar" after long periods of struggle
• The importance of practicing being relaxed, not just practicing being anxious
• How the shock-attention-resistance cycle continues even when you're feeling better
• Why all emotional states - including calm - need to be permissible
• How to recognize when you're still checking and monitoring even during neutral states

We also share inspiring "Did It Anyway" stories from the community, including someone who kept pushing through fatigue to go to new places, and another who took their first step away from 13 years of self-medication.

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Struggling with worry and rumination that you feel you can't stop or control? Check out ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Worry and Rumination Explained⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, a two hour pre-recorded workshop produced by Josh and Drew. The workshop takes a deep dive into the mechanics of worrying and ruminating, offering some helpful ways to approach the seemingly unsolvable problem of trying to solve seemingly unsolvable problems.

When anxiety and its relentless inner critic take hold, one of the most profound losses is the belief and trust in your own capability. In this episode, Drew and Josh explore how to rebuild self-trust after anxiety disorders erode your confidence in handling life's challenges.

The conversation centers on stories from listeners who confronted their worst-case scenarios—from emergency medical situations while struggling with agoraphobia and panic disorder, to managing health anxiety during actual illness, to facing feared social situations despite OCD. Each story illustrates a crucial truth: the anticipation is almost always worse than the actual experience, and we're far more capable than anxiety tells us we are.

The guys discuss why simply deciding to believe in yourself doesn't work, and what actually does: the unglamorous, minute-by-minute work of doing the scary things anyway. They examine how anxiety functions like a conspiracy theory about yourself, predicting catastrophic outcomes that rarely materialize. The hosts also explore how well-meaning but misguided advice to avoid difficult situations or regulate away uncomfortable feelings can actually undermine self-belief rather than restore it.

This episode emphasizes that rebuilding confidence isn't about making anxiety disappear—it's about discovering through lived experience that you can handle difficult emotions, uncomfortable sensations, and challenging situations. The path back to self-belief requires compassion, patience, and a willingness to challenge the loud but ultimately unreliable predictions of fear and doubt.

Grounded in acceptance and commitment therapy (ACT) and mindfulness-based approaches, this conversation offers a realistic, evidence-based perspective on recovery that honors both the difficulty of the journey and the resilience we all possess.

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Want to ask us questions, share your wins, or get more information about Josh, Drew, and the Disordered podcast? Send us an email or leave a voicemail on our website.

In this episode, Drew and Josh explore the powerful role of the internal critic—affectionately named "Craig"—in maintaining anxiety disorders and interfering with recovery. They discuss how this nagging inner voice criticizes, questions, and doubts us, often telling us we're doing things wrong or that we'll never be who we hope to be.

Let's examine where Craig the Critic comes from, including family dynamics, conditional affection, societal pressures, and social media comparisons. The episode explains how this critical voice drives us toward impossible standards and fuels the "should" statements that keep us stuck: "You should be feeling this," "You should be better by now," or "You should be like everyone else."

The guys discuss how Craig the Critic shows up across different anxiety presentations—from OCD to agoraphobia to panic disorder—and how this voice can block the learning that happens during exposure work. They explore how the internal critic constantly demands we fix, control, and change our anxiety rather than learning to respond differently to it.

A key theme in this episode is compassion as the antidote to self-criticism, how moving toward what matters to us—guided by our values rather than Craig's demands—helps us break free from the cycle of criticism and avoidance. We're also tackling the common misconception that we need harsh self-criticism to keep us in check, when in reality, it often keeps us trapped in disordered patterns.

The episode features inspiring "Did It Anyway" stories from listeners who faced their fears despite Craig's objections, including someone starting a new job, another taking their children on challenging outings, and a future firefighter who completed a demanding physical fitness test while experiencing panic symptoms.

Topics Covered:

• Understanding the internal critic and where it originates
• How self-criticism maintains anxiety disorders
• The difference between helpful self-evaluation and destructive criticism
• Why comparing yourself to your "pre-anxious" self backfires
• The role of compassion in anxiety recovery
• How Craig the Critic interferes with exposure work and learning
• Practical ways to recognize and respond differently to the critical voice

This episode may be particularly helpful for those who struggle with perfectionism, harsh self-judgment, or feeling like they're failing at recovery.

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Want a way to ask questions about this episode or interact with other Disordered listeners?  The Disordered app is nearing release! ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Visit our home page and get on our mailing list for more information..

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Struggling with worry and rumination that you feel you can't stop or control? Check out ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Worry and Rumination Explained⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, a two hour pre-recorded workshop produced by Josh and Drew. The workshop takes a deep dive into the mechanics of worrying and ruminating, offering some helpful ways to approach the seemingly unsolvable problem of trying to solve seemingly unsolvable problems.

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In this episode of Disordered, Drew and Josh tackle one of the most frightening anxiety symptoms: air hunger - that terrifying feeling that you can't get a deep enough breath or fully fill your lungs.

Drew and Josh draw from both their clinical expertise and personal recovery experiences to explain why this sensation happens, why trying to "fix" your breathing often makes things worse, and how the compulsive need to control your breath can actually create the problem you're trying to solve.

They explore how air hunger connects to stress, anxiety disorders, and OCD, discussing why breathing techniques and breath work - while potentially helpful for general stress - can become problematic compulsions when you're dealing with disordered anxiety. The hosts emphasize a key principle: there's a critical difference between feeling like you can't breathe and actually not being able to breathe.

The episode includes inspiring "Did It Anyway" stories from listeners who faced their fears - from pushing through panic during a music gig, to driving 40 minutes despite intense anxiety, to confronting her OCD fears, and a transformation from being unable to stay in a room alone to enjoying solo time at home.

Drew and Josh offer practical guidance rooted in acceptance-based approaches: get out of your own way, let your body regulate itself naturally, and resist the urge to constantly check, control, or perfect your breathing. As they remind listeners, your body has successfully kept you breathing your entire life - it doesn't need micromanagement now.

Topics covered:

• What air hunger is and why it happens
• The connection between stress, anxiety, and breathing sensations
• Why breathing techniques can become compulsions
• The role of interoceptive exposure in treatment
• How to respond when you notice air hunger (hint: not by trying to control it)
• Why sleep proves your body knows how to breathe on its own

Whether you're experiencing air hunger yourself or supporting someone who is, this episode offers a compassionate, reality-based approach to one of anxiety's most unsettling symptoms.

One of the most common questions we hear from people working through anxiety disorders and OCD is: "How long is this going to take?" In this episode, Drew and Josh tackle the timeline question head-on—but probably not in the way you're expecting.

We explore why asking "how long until I recover?" might be the wrong question, and why shifting to "how long until I'm desensitized?" can be a game-changer in how you approach your anxiety journey. We discuss the reality that there's no universal timeline, no magic number of weeks, and why that's actually okay.

In this episode:

• Why the concept of "recovery" as a finish line may not be helpful for anxiety disorders
• The difference between recovery and desensitization
• How urgency and pressure can actually slow your progress
• Why some people seem to progress faster than others (and why that doesn't matter)
• The role of self-compassion, patience, and realistic expectations
• Why hard days are a normal part of the process—even after significant progress
• How perfectionism and the need for certainty can keep you stuck

We also share inspiring "Did It Anyway" stories from listeners who are moving forward with their lives—traveling, attending events, and even jumping into mosh pits—alongside their anxiety, not waiting for it to disappear first.

Whether you're struggling with panic disorder, agoraphobia, OCD, health anxiety, or other anxiety disorders, this episode offers a realistic, compassionate perspective on what it means to make progress and why the journey looks different for everyone.

---

Want a way to ask questions about this episode or interact with us and other Disordered listeners?  The Disordered app is nearing release! ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Visit our home page and get on our mailing list for more information..

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Struggling with worry and rumination that you feel you can't stop or control? Check out ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Worry and Rumination Explained⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, a two hour pre-recorded workshop produced by Josh and Drew. The workshop takes a deep dive into the mechanics of worrying and ruminating, offering some helpful ways to approach the seemingly unsolvable problem of trying to solve seemingly unsolvable problems.

-----

Want to ask us questions, share your wins, or get more information about Josh, Drew, and the Disordered podcast? Send us an email or leave a voicemail on our website.

Can your focus on getting better actually make things worse? In this episode, we explore what happens when the recovery process itself becomes an obsession - coining the term "Recovery OCD" to describe the fixation many people develop around their anxiety recovery journey.

We dig into the counterintuitive reality that constantly checking "Am I recovered yet?" or "Am I doing this right?" can actually signal to your brain that anxiety is still something urgent and important to monitor. When recovery becomes the thing you're obsessing about, complete with checking behaviors, rumination, and compulsive information-seeking, you may have fallen into this particular trap.

What we cover:

• The obsessive-compulsive patterns that can emerge around recovery
• Why asking "Am I recovered?" might mean you've answered your own question
• How metrics and comparisons can feed the recovery obsession
• The difference between recovery as a state versus recovery as function
• Why uncertainty tolerance is the real skill being developed
• Practical ways to recognize when you've become obsessed with recovery itself

Key insights:

• Recovery isn't about reaching a perfect state - it's about building distress tolerance skills
• The more you fixate on recovery, the more you're teaching your brain that anxiety matters
• Real progress often looks boring and unmeasurable
• Sometimes the question "Am I recovered?" isn't the right question to ask

We also share inspiring "Did It Anyway" stories from listeners who demonstrate what it really looks like to move forward while uncertain, anxious, and imperfect - including someone who performed on stage despite a massive adrenaline flood and another who went to a Pokemon card convention while experiencing depersonalization.

This episode challenges common assumptions about what recovery should look and feel like, offering a more realistic and sustainable approach to anxiety recovery that doesn't require constant self-monitoring or perfect emotional states.

The content in this episode aligns with evidence-based, third-wave therapeutic approaches including Acceptance and Commitment Therapy (ACT) and mindfulness-based treatments for anxiety disorders.

---

Want a way to ask questions about this episode or interact with other Disordered listeners?  The Disordered app is nearing release! ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Visit our home page and get on our mailing list for more information..

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Struggling with worry and rumination that you feel you can't stop or control? Check out ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Worry and Rumination Explained⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, a two hour pre-recorded workshop produced by Josh and Drew. The workshop takes a deep dive into the mechanics of worrying and ruminating, offering some helpful ways to approach the seemingly unsolvable problem of trying to solve seemingly unsolvable problems.

-----

Want to ask us questions, share your wins, or get more information about Josh, Drew, and the Disordered podcast? Send us an email or leave a voicemail on our website.

How do you handle anxiety when the news feels overwhelming?

With constant exposure to current events, political tensions, and global crises through social media and traditional news sources, it's no wonder many people with anxiety disorders find themselves struggling.

This week on Disordered we're talking about the complex relationship between news consumption and anxiety, discussing when avoidance might be helpful versus when it could be problematic. You'll hear about the difference between primary anxiety (normal human responses to disturbing events) and secondary anxiety (fear of your own internal experiences).

Key topics covered:

• Why we weren't designed for constant exposure to triggering content
• The nuanced difference between protecting your mental health and avoidance behaviors
• How news consumption can trigger OCD themes and intrusive thoughts
• The importance of metacognitive awareness in making decisions about news consumption
• Compassion fatigue and the reality of having finite emotional resources
• Practical strategies for finding balance in staying informed vs. protecting your wellbeing

Listener highlights:

• A powerful "Did It Anyway" story about overcoming religious scrupulosity OCD
• Another inspiring update about relationship OCD recovery
• A thoughtful question about wedding anxiety and planning major life events while managing panic disorder

Whether you're someone who doom-scrolls for hours or completely avoids the news, this episode offers a balanced, reality-based approach to navigating current events without letting anxiety make the decisions for you. We emphasize that there's no one-size-fits-all answer – it's about developing the awareness to know why you're making the choices you're making.

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The Disordered Guide to Health Anxiety is almost ready! We're in the editing and cover design phase, shooting for publication before the holidays arrive. Pop over to disordered.fm to get on our email list so you'll know when the book is released.

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Struggling with worry and rumination that you feel you can't stop or control? Check out ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Worry and Rumination Explained⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, a two hour pre-recorded workshop produced by Josh and Drew. The workshop takes a deep dive into the mechanics of worrying and ruminating, offering some helpful ways to approach the seemingly unsolvable problem of trying to solve seemingly unsolvable problems.

-----

Want to ask us questions, share your wins, or get more information about Josh, Drew, and the Disordered podcast? Send us an email or voicemail on our website.

Welcome to another inspiring round of "Did It Anyway" stories, where we celebrate real wins from our community members who chose to move forward despite their anxiety.

In this episode, Drew and Josh share powerful listener stories that illustrate a fundamental truth about anxiety recovery: you can take meaningful action even when you feel scared, uncertain, or overwhelmed. From someone driving to the gym after a panic attack at work, to a listener climbing a boulder wall despite intense fear, to another person attending a job interview while experiencing physical symptoms - these stories show what's possible when we stop waiting for anxiety to disappear before we live our lives.

You'll hear about:

• Breaking the pattern of retreating when anxiety shows up
• Navigating workplace anxiety while still showing up professionally
• Taking on new challenges like rock climbing and learning musical instruments
• Attending job interviews despite panic symptoms
• Managing health anxiety during an actual medical situation
• The difference between an "acceptable bubble" and true recovery

These aren't stories of people who suddenly felt better - they're accounts of individuals who learned they could be capable and engaged with their lives even when anxiety was present. Each story demonstrates core principles from acceptance-based approaches: willful tolerance of difficult emotions, psychological flexibility, and values-driven action.

Whether you're just starting your recovery journey or you've been working on anxiety for years, these real-world examples offer hope and practical inspiration. They remind us that recovery isn't about eliminating anxiety - it's about reclaiming your ability to do what matters to you, regardless of how you feel in the moment.

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Disordered Roundtables are here! Think of it as "Disordered Live", a way for members of our audience to spend time with us in an intimate virtual setting (attendance is limited) to engage in real time sharing and discussion on specific anxiety disorder and recovery topics. To be notified when new Disordered Roundtable sessions are scheduled, ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠visit our homepage and get on our mailing list⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠.

---

Struggling with worry and rumination that you feel you can't stop or control? Check out ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Worry and Rumination Explained⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, a two hour pre-recorded workshop produced by Josh and Drew. The workshop takes a deep dive into the mechanics of worrying and ruminating, offering some helpful ways to approach the seemingly unsolvable problem of trying to solve seemingly unsolvable problems.

-----

Want to ask us questions, share your wins, or get more information about Josh, Drew, and the Disordered podcast? Send us an email or voicemail on our website.

In this essential episode, Drew and Josh are joined by Dr. Birthe Macdonald, a psychologist and neuroscience researcher who's become a vital voice in combating mental health misinformation on social media. The conversation tackles the overwhelming sea of questionable advice that anxious people encounter online, from vagus nerve stimulation devices to "nervous system regulation" quick fixes.

Dr. Macdonald shares her journey from neuroscience researcher to science communicator, sparked by sponsored ads for electrical vagus nerve stimulators that made bold claims without solid evidence. The trio explores why these pseudoscientific approaches are particularly appealing to people struggling with anxiety disorders – and why they can actually be harmful.

Key topics include:

• The dangerous appeal of "one thing" solutions that promise instant relief
• Why sponsored vagus nerve stimulation devices and similar products exploit vulnerable people
• How social media algorithms amplify misinformation while evidence-based content gets overlooked
• Red flags to watch for when consuming mental health content online
• The difference between what we know about how the brain works versus being able to "work" the brain directly
• Why ChatGPT and AI can become problematic reassurance-seeking tools for people with anxiety
• How to become a more critical consumer of pop psychology content

The conversation doesn't dismiss that some techniques may provide temporary relief, but emphasizes understanding why they work (often through distraction rather than magical nervous system manipulation) and recognizing when they become compulsive behaviors that maintain anxiety in the long run.

This episode serves as both a reality check and a guide for navigating the complex landscape of mental health information online, helping listeners distinguish between evidence-based approaches and appealing but potentially harmful quick fixes.

Find Birthe Online:

• https://www.instagram.com/dr.birthe.macdonald/
• https://www.birthemacdonald.com
• https://substack.com/@drbirthemacdonald

---

Disordered Roundtables are here! Think of it as "Disordered Live", a way for members of our audience to spend time with us in an intimate virtual setting (attendance is limited) to engage in real time sharing and discussion on specific anxiety disorder and recovery topics. To be notified when new Disordered Roundtable sessions are scheduled, ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠visit our homepage and get on our mailing list⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠.

---

Struggling with worry and rumination that you feel you can't stop or control? Check out ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Worry and Rumination Explained⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, a two hour pre-recorded workshop produced by Josh and Drew. The workshop takes a deep dive into the mechanics of worrying and ruminating, offering some helpful ways to approach the seemingly unsolvable problem of trying to solve seemingly unsolvable problems.

-----

Want to ask us questions, share your wins, or get more information about Josh, Drew, and the Disordered podcast? Send us an email or voicemail on our website.

In this episode, we explore how the language we use to describe our anxiety experiences can either fuel our struggles or support our recovery. We examine the difference between helpful and unhelpful ways of talking about panic attacks, intrusive thoughts, and anxiety symptoms.

We discuss why saying "it feels like I'm dying" versus "I'm experiencing intense physical sensations" can dramatically impact your recovery journey. We challenge common phrases like "sit with it," "just ignore it," and "regulate yourself," offering more accurate and useful alternatives.

We also address the importance of changing how others around you talk about your anxiety, and we introduce a memorable analogy: treating your anxiety disorder like an ex you're pretending to ignore at a party - acknowledging it's there without giving it center stage.

This episode features inspiring "Did it Anyway" stories from listeners who did what they didn't think they were cable of doing, along with the usual dose of humor.

We conclude with practical advice for responding to tinnitus-related anxiety, emphasizing how attention and resistance amplify symptoms, while acceptance allows the brain's natural filtering system to work.

Timestamps:

08:30 - Why "it feels like" is the most problematic phrase in anxiety recovery
16:45 - The difference between "soul-crushing panic attack" and "intense adrenaline rush"
23:45 - How compulsive commentary differs from detached awareness
28:15 - Why saying "just sit with it" can be misleading
32:20 - The "anxiety as your ex" analogy that will change how you think about ignoring symptoms
37:15 - Inspiring "Did it Anyway" story about grandparent anxiety recovery
38:45 - Comprehensive tinnitus and anxiety management advice