Latter Day Struggles
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Latter Day Struggles episodes

  • 44: On Skepticism of Having Your Children Baptized

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    In this episode Valerie and Nathan tackle an excellent and challenging question from one of you listeners regarding how to handle their child's upcoming 8th birthday and eligibility to be baptized into the LDS church.  

    Many parents feel positively confused...wanting to integrate the "good stuff" of this faith tradition into their homes and family life while also wanting to be cautious about how, what, and when to teach their children in ways that reflect their own newly developing (and more complicated) understanding of the church.

    In short--none of us wants to set our children up for a faith and trust crisis down the road.  Val and Nathan break down several thoughts about this topic and offer advice that they wished someone had shared with them when their kids were younger!  

    Please rate and review this podcast and SHARE it!


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    33 min
  • 43: Mormon Women's History & the ERA: A Case of Subservience Over Conscience

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    In this episode Valerie walks you through a historic tragedy to demonstrate what happens when a community is trained to obey authority over honoring common sense, conscience, and sound judgment.  

    Valerie takes you back to the 1970s and recounts LDS church headquarter's handling of the national Equal Rights Amendment [ERA] and how large numbers of church members gladly relinquished their own wisdom and judgement in the service of loyalty to the institution.  

    After tracing these fascinating events, Valerie shares several thoughts about what this cautionary tale can teach us about the dangers of a society that struggles cultivating in its membership spiritual discernment, psychological freedom, and agency to act according to conscience.  

    Even when earnest authority figures sincerely feel that they are protecting us by assuming the role of collective conscience governing personal, spiritual, and political choices, it is always our divine right and responsibility to own our own sacred consciences and act accordingly.

    Book referenced in this episode

    • The Mormon Hierarchy: Extensions of Power, by D. Michael Quinn 

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    47 min
  • 42: Why Humans & Latter-day Saints are Lulled by the Status Quo

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    In this episode Nathan and Valerie break down some research called the "Systems Justification Theory" that shines a light on why most people choose the status quo over the hard work of challenging the systems we know need reformation. 

    The theory highlights four key reasons why we cling to status quo: 

    1. We feel reassured by the familiarity of our own institutional mess and will suffer in silence before deciding to manage the discomfort of pushing back
    2. In the face of outside threat, we salute. Institutions sometimes heighten a sense of outside threat to engender loyalty. 
    3. We are wired to find safety in belonging to a tribe
    4. We hope and wish for better days ahead.  We try to believe that this problem is just temporary.  

    Books referenced in this episode:

    • The Art of Insubordination: How to Dissent and Defy Effectively, by Todd B. Kashdan, PhD


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    28 min
  • 41: On Paranoia, Misdirected Worship & Image Management

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    Series Title: Diagnosing Spiritual Abuse [Part III of III]

    Nathan and Valerie break down 3 more indicators of a system (church or family) that is struggling on some level with spiritual abuse. The scholarship used in this episode comes from non-Latter-Day Saint researchers looking at religious systems in general and pointing out specific features of the churches that tend to perpetuate the most unrighteous dominion.

    The 3 points that they cover in this episode are as follows:

    1. A culture of paranoia:  Where doctrine and practice focuses on how others do not understand and will not understand until they become part of the group. This also includes a culture referring to "the world" as dangerous and something to be feared.  
    2. Misplaced loyalty:  A hyper-focus on loyalty to the institution and its leaders instead of the true focus being on Jesus Christ and his atonement.
    3. Secretiveness: A culture that is very concerned with managing its image and therefore has many layers of security to protect it from "the world". These secrets are often justified by leadership who holds a condescending view of the laity, feeling that they wouldn't understand.

    Val and Nathan do not view systems struggling with spiritual abuse as intentionally malicious, but rather they see these struggles typical of systems that operate under some level of fear. As we each better understand what spiritual abuse looks like, we can shine a light on these struggles and encourage our system to overcome these tendencies. Please share this episode!

    Articles/Book referenced: 

    • ⁠14 Signs of Spiritual Abuse, by Mark DeJesus⁠
    • ⁠The Subtle Power of Spiritual Abuse: Recognizing and Escaping Spiritual Manipulation and False Spiritual Authority Within the Church, by David Johnson and Jeff Van Vonderen


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    49 min
  • 40: On Overstepping on Personal Life Choices

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    Series Title: Diagnosing Spiritual Abuse [Part II of III]

    Nathan and Valerie break down 3 more indicators of a system (church or family) that is struggling on some level with spiritual abuse. The scholarship used in this episode comes from non-Latter-Day Saint researchers looking at religious systems in general and pointing out specific features of the churches that tend to perpetuate the most unrighteous dominion. 

    The 3 points that they cover in this episode are as follows: 

    1. Tendency for the institution to hover over personal decisions in the lives of the membership  
    2. Heavy financial expectations with minimal transparency or accountability about funds received  
    3. A general culture perpetuating the institution holding the "exclusive truth" from and about God.

    Please share this episode! 

    Articles/Book referenced: 

    • ⁠14 Signs of Spiritual Abuse, by Mark DeJesus⁠
    • ⁠The Subtle Power of Spiritual Abuse: Recognizing and Escaping Spiritual Manipulation and False Spiritual Authority Within the Church, by David Johnson and Jeff Van Vonderen


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    31 min
  • 39: On Accountability Struggles, Performance Focus, & Unspoken Rules

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    Series Title: Diagnosing Spiritual Abuse [Part I of III]

    Nathan and Valerie break down 9 consistent markers of spiritually abusive systems [family or churches]. The scholarship used in this episode comes from non-Latter-Day- Saint researchers looking at religious systems in general and pointing out the specific features of the churches that tend to perpetuate the most unrighteous dominion.

    The 3 points that they cover in this episode are as follows: 

    1. Heavy emphasis on charismatic leader who becomes the ultimate spokesperson on all spiritual issues. This includes tactics that minimize the humanity of the leadership body and maximize of focus on the humanity of the membership, with little to no checks and balances amongst the leadership, and a leadership that is not representative of a cross-section of the membership.  
    2. Legalistic beliefs and accompanying focus on PERFORMANCE: right performance, enough performance, and the adequate measurement of performance.
    3. A system of unspoken rules that no compliant member articulates [due to fear of punishment], but everyone knows.  

    Articles/Book referenced: 

    • 14 Signs of Spiritual Abuse, by Mark DeJesus
    • The Subtle Power of Spiritual Abuse: Recognizing and Escaping Spiritual Manipulation and False Spiritual Authority Within the Church, by David Johnson and Jeff Van Vonderen


    Support the show

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    37 min
  • 38: Standing up Against Chicken Patriarchy

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    In this episode Valerie honors feminist writer Kynthia Taylor and unpacks an excerpt from her essay called "The Trouble with Chicken Patriarchy".  She follows up with thoughts on how as a therapist she sees the damage done to both men and women in the prescribed and deeply embedded gender roles that the church inherited in its 19th century inception and has in many ways expanded upon as the world has evolved in the opposite direction. 

    Val breaks down how the roles of provider, protector, and presider creates guilt and shame in some men whose lives do not unfold according this "check list" and how the mixed messages of the church (becoming more flexible in some ways with women's roles but not actually changing anything in the power structure of the church) creates confusion, frustration, and struggle in spiritually developing and socially conscious individuals of both genders.


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    38 min
  • 37: The Current Culture of Mandated Missionary Service

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    Join Valerie and Nathan as they break down a variety of missionary-service related topics, including the following: 

    1. What's with the hyper focus on missionary service of late?
    2. misdiagnosis of the problem
    3. Unrighteous dominion
    4. Thoughts on mission reform...offering those who serve more personal ownership of their mission experience as a place to grow psychologically and spiritually. 
    5. Thoughts on reform...realizing that the mission field is a major training ground for institutional and family-unit patriarchy where micro-aggressions are rampant, unacknowledged, and often defended. 


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    53 min
  • 36: On the Associated Press's Recent S*x Abuse Underreporting Article

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    In this episode, Valerie free-associates about her weekend spent reading, studying and thinking about the recent AP article regarding allegations that the LDS church is under-reporting sex abuse shared with ecclesiastical leader--protecting the predators at the expense of the victims.  

    While this is a complex issue and Valerie does not pretend to know many answers, as a trauma therapist and a mandated reporter herself, she poses many questions that she would love for "the church" to answer, to help her and others concerned better understand and feel that the church is not only explaining themselves, but more importantly, considering a change of policy to protect the vulnerable.  

    Article referenced in episode:

    • Arizona court upholds clergy privilege in child abuse case, by Michael Rezendes, Jason Dearen


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    26 min
  • 35: The Shadow of Joseph's Polygamy & its Ongoing Institutional Reverberations

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    Did you miss the AMAZING Sunstone Symposium 2022?  No worries!  In this episode you'll catch at least one lecture!  Join Valerie as she shares her session formally called "The Jungian Shadow and Mormon History" where she will cover:

    1. 1.  The meaning of the Jungian Shadow
    2. How we all try to DENY our personal shadows in creative ways that estrange us from owning and integrating our shadow parts
    3. A case study in shadow integration:  King David self confronts with the help of the prophet Nathan
    4. A case study in shadow non-integration:  Joseph Smith Jr. does not self confront (in spite of Oliver's attempts to be his "Nathan")
    5. How this unresolved shadow continues to haunt us as an institution today in the form of deep struggles around the issues of sexuality, patriarchy, and hard power
    6. What we can do to help our institution heal from this collective shadow.


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    1 hr 13 min

About Latter Day Struggles

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The Latter Day Struggles Podcast addresses beliefs and issues within the LDS faith that are challenging to talk about but vital to discuss for those trying to navigate their relationship in or…

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