Relationship Matters

In this episode, Katie talks with Yuri Morikawa, a CRR Global faculty member based in Japan and Rebecca Hou, a CRR Global faculty member based in China, about ORSC in Asian culture. For International Coaching Week, the duo offered an impactful virtual workshop on empowering deep democracy in organizations with Asian Culture which included both Chinese and Japanese Participants. This episode continues their exploration and looks at some of their practices and experiences from working in organizations with Asian culture. This conversation covers a range of topics, including: 

• The differences that show up when using ORSC in Asian organizations
• Challenges around Deep Democracy in Asian culture
• The impact of Deep Democracy in their personal systems
• Systems Inspired Parenting
• Ways to empower ORSC in Asian culture.

Yuri Morikawa has been an active player in the professional coaching field since 2004. She has trained and coached more than 1000 of leaders and coaches globally from various backgrounds, such as corporate executives, NGO leaders, business owners, independent professionals, and dream seekers of their own.  Prior to her career in coaching, Yuri worked as a management consultant specializing in organizational and leadership development for 13 years. After being a trainer for Coaching Training Institute (CTI) for 8 years, she launched the Organizational and Relationship Systems Coaching (ORSC) Program in Japan and founded CRR Japan in 2009.  Currently, she is a global faculty member of CRR Global, developing professional organizational coaches around the world, such as in Japan, China, Singapore, South Africa, and Australia. She is passionate about bringing her professional experience to the bigger social context and works extensively with NGOs in Social Sectors such as the Kamonohashi Project supporting survivor leaders of human trafficking issues in India and Asia Rural Institute, educating organic farming, and developing servant leadership for rural leaders in Asia and Africa.

Rebecca Hou is an ICF Master Certified Coach, Executive/Leadership Coach and Training Consultant. She is also a faculty member and Front of the Room Leader at CTI and CRR Global. She leads professional coaching certification programs: including Co-Active Coaching, ORSC, Neuroscience Consciousness & Transformational Coaching. She is also a mentor coach, supervisor, and examiner for certification coach students. Her major focus areas are one-to-one leadership coaching, team coaching and the design and delivery of training workshops. Rebecca used to work for Siemens Management Institute for four years. During her service, she worked with internal clients of different business sectors from Industry, Energy, and Healthcare, as well as cross-business sectors. Prior to this, Rebecca worked for IWNC, a multi-national training company, for 11 years. During that period, she maintained contact with a portfolio of clients and worked with them on the design and delivery of programs.


For over 20 years, CRR Global has accompanied leaders, teams, and practitioners on their journey to build stronger relationships by focusing on the relationship itself, not only the individuals occupying it. This leads to a community of changemakers around the world. Supported by a global network of Faculty and Partners, we connect, inspire, and equip change agents to shift systems, one relationship at a time

We believe Relationship Matters, from humanity to nature, to the larger whole. 

Season 5 is here! Get excited about 20 news episodes where podcast host Katie Churchman engages in meaningful conversations with an amazing lineup of guests from our global community of systems thinkers.

Click here to watch the video.

We believe Relationship Matters, from humanity to nature to the larger whole.

#relationshipmatters #crrglobal #relationshionshiomatterspodcast #orsc #orscer #systemscoaching #systemsinspiredleadership #teamcoaching

In this episode, Katie is talking with Bill Donaldson, Doris Saouma, and Michella Welstead about ORSC Coaching Circles, a community-led Worldwork initiative. ORSC Coaching Circles are 100% led and run by a community of change agents from around the world. They embrace the RSI Principles and welcome all ORSC practitioners to fill a role and ultimately evolve the larger world system we are part of. Throughout this conversation, they discuss:

• The inspiration behind ORSC coaching circles
• How they work
• Their high dream for the initiative
• The importance of Worldwork

Getting in touch: ORSC Coaching Circles are open to those who've completed training on ORSC tools and would like to come together with others to experience and practice the tools in a safe and supportive environment.  To be added to the monthly announcements or find out more information, please click here or email [email protected]. 

Bill Donaldson is a husband to Amy, father to Katie and Greg, and grandfather to Nathaniel, living in Charleston, SC. Bill is passionate about making people’s lives better through his leadership in Business Transformation and Team Coaching. He is passionate about women's allyship with a goal to impact 100K women to retain or re-join the STEM workforce. Bill is an ICF ACC certified coach and a Gold Tier #IamRemarkable facilitator. 

Doris Saouma supports leaders and organizations in defining and living their legacy while building better workplaces, cultures, and countries. She works with leaders globally in various sectors, including private banks, central banks, consulting firms, hedge funds, sovereign funds, private equities, trading agencies, pharma companies, insurance companies, as well as governmental and non-governmental organizations. Her work experience ranges from supporting individual leaders in developing their leadership skills and upgrading their careers to accompanying teams in collaborating for higher impact.

Michella Welstead grew up in Australia and now calls the Netherlands home. She comes from a background in data management and data-driven transformation. Along the way, she’s seen firsthand how critical team dynamics are to organizational success. She now incorporates ORSC coaching tools in her work in agile transformations to help individuals, teams, and organizations unleash their creativity, embrace collaboration, and transition towards improved performance.


For over 20 years, CRR Global has accompanied leaders, teams, and practitioners on their journey to build stronger relationships by focusing on the relationship itself, not only the individuals occupying it. This leads to a community of changemakers around the world. Supported by a global network of Faculty and Partners, we connect, inspire, and equip change agents to shift systems, one relationship at a time

We believe Relationship Matters, from humanity to nature, to the larger whole.

In this episode, Katie talks with Judy van Zon and Katherine Starks about the ORSC™ certification program. Judy is currently Director of Certification at CRR Global, and Kathie is a recent alumnus of the program. The ORSC Certification program is a unique and comprehensive eight-month program with extensive practice and online study designed to produce the best ORSC practitioners in the world! Throughout this conversation, we discuss what makes the program so unique, the intentions and outcomes of the course, edge crossing, the practicalities of the course, the impact of world work, and much more.

For more information on the ORSC Certification Program, please click here.

Judy van Zon helps her clients better connect to their own inner wisdom and power. In her team coaching, Judy believes that working with the ORSC model is a very powerful way to build bridges in relationships. It goes far beyond familiar skills like empathy and active listening. It offers a whole new way of looking at people and how we live and work together. Her focus is on working with corporate leaders and teams. Training others in this allows her to spread this energy throughout the world. She also applies her skills to roles like facilitating and mentoring. For the last 25 years, she has lived and worked in six countries on three continents, the last 3.5 years in India and the region around. She is now back in the Netherlands and is CRR Global's current Director of Certification. Judy speaks Dutch, English, German, Spanish, and French. With a master’s in business administration, her professional career started in the commercial operations of an international consumer goods company. 

Katherine Starks has spent most of her career in financial services, the last 15 years in senior leadership positions. This experience laid the groundwork for a natural progression to the next stage: coaching and mentoring other professionals so that they too can find their path and passion in life. Kathie’s coaching journey began during her years in the corporate world, first becoming an ICF Certified Co-Active Coach and later embarking on her ORSC journey just as she pursued her final and most challenging role as CEO and Branch Manager of the Bank of New York Mellon in Frankfurt. At the beginning of 2022, Kathie left the corporate world so that she could dedicate all her time and energy into pursuing her dream of coaching successful teams and fulfilled leaders.


For over 20 years, CRR Global has accompanied leaders, teams, and practitioners on their journey to build stronger relationships by focusing on the relationship itself, not only the individuals occupying it. This leads to a community of changemakers around the world. Supported by a global network of Faculty and Partners, we connect, inspire, and equip change agents to shift systems, one relationship at a time

We believe Relationship Matters, from humanity to nature, to the larger whole.

In the final episode of season 4, Katie talks with Kiki Kesseler about vulnerability in relationship. Across this conversation, we discuss:

• How does vulnerability show up in relationship? 
• Patterns in relationship
• Expressing what you need
• Owning “I don’t know” as a pathway into vulnerability
• Choosing to be vulnerable
• The impact of control and the value of playfulness

Kiki Kessler is a CRR Global faculty member for both courses and the certification programme. Kiki believes that the value of working with teams, individuals, and relationships lies in the balance between revealing to the clients what is trying to happen and educating them on how to self-manage similar issues in the future for a more positive and productive relationship. Kiki focuses on people development and brings 20+ years of experience in cultural diversity, coaching, training, and team management across various industries, with corporate roles in Sales & Marketing, Business Development, and Training. She specializes in team development, conflict resolution, leadership skills, and systemic coaching. She is known to create a trusted atmosphere of positive energy that encourages the client to align, communicate, learn, and implement changed behavior. With clear education and the use of practical tools, Kiki inspires a can-do spirit among leaders. Her strength lies in combining coaching and training skills to enable growth. Originally from The Netherlands, she speaks Dutch, English, and German. Her cross-cultural experience was established through living in Austria, the United States, Germany and the UAE over the past 18 years, working within culturally diverse environments, organizations and teams. After a four-month adventurous drive from Dubai back to the Netherlands, Kiki and her family are now based close to Utrecht, The Netherlands.


For over 20 years, CRR Global has accompanied leaders, teams, and practitioners on their journey to build stronger relationships by focusing on the relationship itself, not only the individuals occupying it. This leads to a community of changemakers around the world. Supported by a global network of Faculty and Partners, we connect, inspire, and equip change agents to shift systems, one relationship at a time

We believe Relationship Matters, from humanity to nature, to the larger whole.

Across these 3 episodes, Katie talks with Michelle Davis, faculty member and Director of Systemic Equity Initiatives at CRR Global, about supporting systemic equity. As humans, we have diversity – we think differently and hold different perspectives and ideas – that’s what makes us unique and different and should be celebrated. Once we start to create fear based on those differences - we begin to dehumanize groups of people and lock them out of opportunities. This 3-part series builds along the lines of the 3-levels of intelligence (Emotional Intelligence EQ, Social Intelligence SI and Relationship System Intelligence RSI). If you've not already listened to parts 1 and 2, we'd highly recommend listening to both of those episodes first. In part 3, Katie and Michelle look through the lens of Relationship System Intelligence. Topics include:

• Looking through the lens of relationship
• The importance of integrating systemic equity into the bones of an organization
• The power of the coach approach 
• Socialised storytelling and choosing to create a different reality
• Privilege and power structures 

Michelle Davis is a faculty member and Director of Systemic Equity Initiatives at CRR Global. Michelle’s professional journey has included a season of providing therapy, as a licensed professional counselor, to the most vulnerable among us; a season of developing and delivering experiential learning events that challenge and disrupt the status quo when the status quo no longer serves; and currently, a season providing leadership coaching as a certified organization and relationship systems coach and leading diversity, equity and inclusion efforts as a professor and director. In her work at the University of Colorado and previous experience working with systemic racism in other university systems, Michelle was the principal developer of a coaching program focused on Race Intelligence (RQ(™)). This program seeks to increase Race Intelligence by guiding others to increase their capacity to lean into discomfort with the intention of becoming aware of race and racism and its influence on oneself, others, and societal institutions; and use this increased intelligence or awareness consciously to dismantle intrapersonal mindsets, behaviors, and systemic representations of racism.  Michelle earned her master’s degree in counselling at the University of Nebraska at Omaha and, as well as being an ORSC-certified coach, is a Licensed Professional Counselor, a trained Co-Active Coach, and a Certified Dare to Lead Facilitator.


For over 20 years, CRR Global has accompanied leaders, teams, and practitioners on their journey to build stronger relationships by focusing on the relationship itself, not only the individuals occupying it. This leads to a community of changemakers around the world. Supported by a global network of Faculty and Partners, we connect, inspire, and equip change agents to shift systems, one relationship at a time

We believe Relationship Matters, from humanity to nature, to the larger whole.

Across these 3 episodes, Katie talks with Michelle Davis, faculty member and Director of Systemic Equity Initiatives at CRR Global, about supporting systemic equity. As humans, we have diversity – we think differently and hold different perspectives and ideas – that’s what makes us unique and different and should be celebrated. Once we start to create fear based on those differences - we begin to dehumanize groups of people and lock them out of opportunities. This 3-part series builds along the lines of the 3-levels of intelligence (Emotional Intelligence EQ, Social Intelligence SI and Relationship System Intelligence RSI). If you've not already listened to it already, do check-out part 1 first; what's mine to do? In part 2, Katie and Michelle look at social intelligence. Topics include:

• Right Relationship and working for the power of me and you
• The stories and beliefs that shape our reality
• Breaking down divisions and doing the work together
• What's mine to do and how can I actually do it?
• Sharing opportunities

Michelle Davis is a faculty member and Director of Systemic Equity Initiatives at CRR Global. Michelle’s professional journey has included a season of providing therapy, as a licensed professional counselor, to the most vulnerable among us; a season of developing and delivering experiential learning events that challenge and disrupt the status quo when the status quo no longer serves; and currently, a season providing leadership coaching as a certified organization and relationship systems coach and leading diversity, equity and inclusion efforts as a professor and director. In her work at the University of Colorado and previous experience working with systemic racism in other university systems, Michelle was the principal developer of a coaching program focused on Race Intelligence (RQ(™)). This program seeks to increase Race Intelligence by guiding others to increase their capacity to lean into discomfort with the intention of becoming aware of race and racism and its influence on oneself, others, and societal institutions; and use this increased intelligence or awareness consciously to dismantle intrapersonal mindsets, behaviors, and systemic representations of racism.  Michelle earned her master’s degree in counselling at the University of Nebraska at Omaha and, as well as being an ORSC-certified coach, is a Licensed Professional Counselor, a trained Co-Active Coach, and a Certified Dare to Lead Facilitator.


For over 20 years, CRR Global has accompanied leaders, teams, and practitioners on their journey to build stronger relationships by focusing on the relationship itself, not only the individuals occupying it. This leads to a community of changemakers around the world. Supported by a global network of Faculty and Partners, we connect, inspire, and equip change agents to shift systems, one relationship at a time

We believe Relationship Matters, from humanity to nature, to the larger whole.

Across these 3 episodes, Katie talks with Michelle Davis, faculty member and Director of Systemic Equity Initiatives at CRR Global, about supporting systemic equity. As humans, we have diversity – we think differently, hold different perspectives and ideas – that’s what makes us unique and different and should be celebrated. Once we start to create fear based upon those differences - we begin to dehumanize groups of people and lock them out of opportunities. This 3-part series builds along the lines of the 3-levels of intelligence (Emotional Intelligence EQ, Social Intelligence SI and Relationship System Intelligence RSI). In part 1, Katie and Michelle look at system 1, the me system and what's mine to do in relation to supporting systemic equity. Topics include:

• Why supporting systemic equity starts with the self: how can we see where we are blind?
• Slowing down and getting curious about our unconscious drivers
• The impact of fear
• Getting to know the true nature of who we are.
• Making the unconscious conscious so that we can be more at choice around our reactions

Michelle Davis is a faculty member and Director of Systemic Equity Initiatives at CRR Global. Michelle’s professional journey has included a season of providing therapy, as a licensed professional counselor, to the most vulnerable among us; a season of developing and delivering experiential learning events that challenge and disrupt the status quo when the status quo no longer serves; and currently, a season providing leadership coaching as a certified organization and relationship systems coach and leading diversity, equity and inclusion efforts as a professor and director. In her work at the University of Colorado and previous experience working with systemic racism in other university systems, Michelle was the principal developer of a coaching program focused on Race Intelligence (RQ(™)). This program seeks to increase Race Intelligence by guiding others to increase their capacity to lean into discomfort with the intention of becoming aware of race and racism and its influence on oneself, others, and societal institutions; and use this increased intelligence or awareness consciously to dismantle intrapersonal mindsets, behaviors, and systemic representations of racism.  Michelle earned her master’s degree in counselling at the University of Nebraska at Omaha and, as well as being an ORSC-certified coach, is a Licensed Professional Counselor, a trained Co-Active Coach, and a Certified Dare to Lead Facilitator.


For over 20 years, CRR Global has accompanied leaders, teams, and practitioners on their journey to build stronger relationships by focusing on the relationship itself, not only the individuals occupying it. This leads to a community of changemakers around the world. Supported by a global network of Faculty and Partners, we connect, inspire, and equip change agents to shift systems, one relationship at a time

We believe Relationship Matters, from humanity to nature, to the larger whole.

In this episode, Katie talks with Mike Holton, COO and faculty member at CRR Global, about the importance of building belonging in our relationships. Across this conversation they discuss: 

• Belonging as a form of acceptance
• The individual work that we can only do together
• Making the unconscious conscious
• Learning how to bring more belonging to our relationship with ourselves

Mike Holton has a lifelong passion for working with and developing leaders across the globe. Alongside his roles at CRR Global, Mike has spent a career working to develop organizational capabilities within the Global 2000.  In the coaching field, he has worked as an agile, leadership, couples, team, and organizational coach.  Over the last few years, he has transitioned his focus to working with clients in the space of Trauma. The most important role Mike plays is being a husband and a father of four amazing children. This role has shaped him and continues to develop him as a person today.

For over 20 years, CRR Global has accompanied leaders, teams, and practitioners on their journey to build stronger relationships by focusing on the relationship itself, not only the individuals occupying it. This leads to a community of changemakers around the world. Supported by a global network of Faculty and Partners, we connect, inspire, and equip change agents to shift systems, one relationship at a time

We believe Relationship Matters, from humanity to nature, to the larger whole.

This is episode 3 in a 3-part series on team coaching with team coach and CRR Global faculty member Martin Klaver. In episode 3, Katie and Martin discuss how to support clients in integrating the learnings. Across the conversation, they discuss:

• How to weave integration throughout a team coaching engagement
• Trusting and harnessing the wisdom of the team
• Understanding that integration is the team’s responsibility
• Celebrating small wins
• Focusing on results as opposed to the process.

Martin Klaver is an experienced team coach and faculty member at CRR Global. He is enthusiastic about group dynamics and believes guiding systems in these dynamics and making patterns and potential aware is beautiful and rewarding work. Martin designs and supervises many Management Development processes where personal development (IQ and EQ), relationships with others (SQ) and relationships with systems (RSI) are fundamental. Fun, experimental and essence are themes that you can recognize in his methods.

Martin has a master’s degree in Business Administration and extensive work experience in HR and organizational development at various organizations. Based in the Netherlands, Martin facilitates with his team a diversity of organizations and leaders in their development. The purpose of his company is to bring more balance in the world. They focus to create an atmosphere of possibility in which the system can evolve into what is needed.


For over 20 years, CRR Global has accompanied leaders, teams, and practitioners on their journey to build stronger relationships by focusing on the relationship itself, not only the individuals occupying it. This leads to a community of changemakers around the world. Supported by a global network of Faculty and Partners, we connect, inspire, and equip change agents to shift systems, one relationship at a time

We believe Relationship Matters, from humanity to nature, to the larger whole.