The IT Experts Podcast

Neil is not someone who talks theory without having walked the walk. With over 30 years in the IT industry, including seven and a half years running a highly successful MSP in the East Midlands, Neil has experienced the highs, the challenges, and the pivotal moments that make all the difference when scaling a business. His MSP grew to around 300 clients, a 35-strong team, and was turning over close to £5 million by the time he exited earlier this year. Now through MSP Clarity, Neil helps other MSP owners gain the direction and focus they need to grow and scale effectively.

We dig into the lessons Neil wishes he had applied earlier and the big shifts that brought the most impact. One of his strongest messages is the need to define your offering early and price it with structure. Too many MSPs start with finger-in-the-air pricing, lose track as clients scale, and fail to set clear rate cards. Neil also stresses the value of building your brand and tone of voice early, getting clear on who you serve, why you serve them, and how you communicate that. He is adamant that MSP Marketing is not about vague "we do IT" messages or chasing every business with a computer, but about being specific and showing genuine understanding of your target market. In his case, focusing on accountants and solicitors played to his team's strengths and created a reputation that brought in higher quality leads.

We explore the pitfalls MSPs fall into, including relying solely on referrals, neglecting their websites, using fear-based tactics, overpromising and underdelivering, spamming LinkedIn messages, and failing to follow up leads consistently. Neil explains why traditional marketing often fails for MSPs, and why the key is building a long-term journey for prospects with consistent, value-adding touch points. The most successful MSP Marketing is about staying visible and relevant over time, understanding that some prospects will take months or even years to convert. He also highlights the importance of making the most of your existing client base, tracking what products or services they are not yet buying from you, and approaching them with solutions that genuinely improve their business.

We then move into Neil's top do's for MSP Marketing, starting with defining your ideal client profile and focusing on business outcomes rather than tech specs. He champions the use of case studies and testimonials as powerful social proof, creating helpful educational content to empower clients, and leveraging tools like local SEO and Google Business profiles to make it easier for people to find and trust you. He is a big believer in building strong referral and partner programmes, using LinkedIn for consistent outreach and brand building, and nurturing leads with purposeful email sequences that move them closer to a decision. Throughout, Neil emphasises the need to track the metrics that matter and to align marketing with your sales process so that what is promised is delivered exactly as expected.

What comes through clearly in this conversation is that good MSP Marketing is not about gimmicks or quick wins. It is about clarity, consistency, and doing the basics exceptionally well. Neil's advice is to know your market, communicate clearly, keep showing up, and make every client interaction a demonstration of the value you bring. His three closing tips are to use a whitespace matrix to uncover quick wins with your current clients, niche down to the sectors you enjoy and excel in, and simply keep doing the job you are paid to do better than the competition.

Whether you are just starting to build your marketing strategy or you are looking to refine and scale what is already working, this episode is packed with practical tips you can apply straight away. Neil Shaw's experience and straight-talking approach make it a must-listen for any MSP owner serious about creating marketing that actually delivers results. If you are ready to cut through the noise and focus on what really works in MSP Marketing, this conversation will give you the clarity and confidence to make it happen.

Reach out to Neil Shaw by sending him an email at [email protected] or connect with him on LinkedIn by clicking HERE.

Make sure to check out our Ultimate MSP Growth Guide, a free guide that walks you through a proven process to take your MSP from stuck to scalable, without working even more hours. It's 44 pages rammed with advice, insights and inspiration to help you decide what support is available to you now if you want to grow and scale your business. Click HERE to get your copy.

Connect on LinkedIn HERE with Ian and also with Stuart by clicking this LINK

And when you're ready to take the next step in growing your MSP, come and take the Scale with Confidence MSP Mastery Quiz. In just three minutes, you'll get a 360-degree scan of your MSP and identify the one or two tactics that could help you find more time, engage & align your people and generate more leads.

OR

To join our amazing Facebook Group of over 400 MSPs where we are helping you Scale Up with Confidence, then click HERE

Until next time, look after yourself and I'll catch up with you soon!

From the outset, we explored the pressures and mental blocks that many MSP owners face when trying to scale their business. Mark spoke openly about the fears that hold MSP leaders back, especially those "little voices" in our heads that tell us to stick with what we know. These ingrained habits often stem from childhood or past experiences and can sneak into the way we lead, even if they no longer serve us. Mark shared a great story about how, despite knowing it made little sense, he still puts his teacup away upside down because that's the way his nan did it. This idea of unconscious habits translates directly into MSP businesses. Far too many business owners find themselves stuck in ways of working simply because "it's always been done that way." This can be a huge barrier to scale.

Mark opened up about his own journey as an MSP owner, and the shift he had to make from being the technical doer to becoming a real leader. He described how easy it is to fall into the trap of thinking you have to control everything, which is often rooted in ego. It takes real self-awareness to admit you cannot do everything yourself if you want your MSP to scale. Mark recommended reading "Ego is the Enemy" to anyone in a leadership position. He pointed out that while confidence gets you started, ego can hold you back, especially when it comes to recruiting and trusting new team members. If you want to scale your MSP, you need to learn to delegate, trust your team, and stop micromanaging. It is only when you truly let go and empower others that the business can scale without you being the bottleneck.

One of the major breakthroughs Mark discussed was the moment he realised that rapid staff turnover was blocking his ability to scale. After the instability of COVID, Mark's MSP was not set up for sustainable monthly recurring revenue, and this created a lot of stress and financial pressure. When he looked back 18 months ago, he saw that the key to unlocking scale was not charging ahead with sales or new projects, but actually slowing down and building a solid foundation with the right people, processes, and a strong people-first culture.

Mark stressed the importance of getting clear on your vision, mission, and values as an MSP. He explained that staff retention and engagement skyrocketed when he invested time in making these principles central to his business. He shared how regular "staff rhythm and review" sessions became a game changer. Instead of the old three-month probation, new staff now get a six-month induction and then join quarterly reviews that align with company objectives. Every team member knows how their work supports the bigger picture. Mark has seen first-hand how this level of clarity helps an MSP scale faster, because the team are all moving in the same direction and feel valued.

Another powerful tip was the need for welfare checks and genuine care for staff wellbeing. Mark talked about introducing regular check-ins, recognising when someone is struggling, and creating a safe environment for people to speak up. This shift away from the old "get on with it" mentality, which so many MSP owners grew up with, allows team members to bring their best selves to work and prevents issues from growing in the background. A happy, motivated team is the heartbeat of any MSP, and looking after your people is one of the fastest ways to scale.

Throughout the episode, we discussed how letting go of old habits and beliefs, trusting your team, and investing in leadership development are all non-negotiable for any MSP owner wanting to scale. Mark's story shows that real scale happens when you slow down, review the bottlenecks in your business, and then deliberately build systems and accountability around them. He shared examples of how this approach improved everything from customer satisfaction to quotation processing, quality control, and ultimately staff retention. The result is not only a more productive business, but one that people genuinely want to be part of.

We wrapped up with Mark's three top tips for any MSP owner ready to begin their own journey to scale. First, find someone you respect to give honest feedback on your leadership style and be willing to listen. Second, have vulnerable, open conversations with your team and do not be afraid to make tough decisions if the fit is not right. Third, make your workplace enjoyable, people-centred, and share the vision with everyone. Mark's journey is proof that slowing down is not a sign of weakness, but the fastest way to truly scale your MSP. His story reminds us all that when you look after your people, build great systems, and keep your ego in check, scaling your MSP becomes not just possible, but inevitable.

Make sure to check out our Ultimate MSP Growth Guide, a free guide that walks you through a proven process to take your MSP from stuck to scalable, without working even more hours. It's 44 pages rammed with advice, insights and inspiration to help you decide what support is available to you now if you want to grow and scale your business. Click HERE to get your copy.

Connect on LinkedIn HERE with Ian and also with Stuart by clicking this LINK

And when you're ready to take the next step in growing your MSP, come and take the Scale with Confidence MSP Mastery Quiz. In just three minutes, you'll get a 360-degree scan of your MSP and identify the one or two tactics that could help you find more time, engage & align your people and generate more leads.

OR

To join our amazing Facebook Group of over 400 MSPs where we are helping you Scale Up with Confidence, then click HERE

Until next time, look after yourself and I'll catch up with you soon!

Helen Sanders brings over 25 years' experience in recruitment, working closely with MSPs and tech businesses both in the UK and the US. Helen has built her reputation on helping owner-managed businesses move from frantic, last-minute hires to building confident, structured recruitment processes that allow owners to grow their teams with purpose and clarity. Her passion is helping business owners become great at hiring and creating environments where both owners and new recruits enjoy the process and stay for the long term.

One of the biggest problems we see in the MSP world is the temptation to bring in someone who can do a bit of everything. This "Swiss Army knife" mentality can seem appealing when the team is small and the need is urgent, but as Helen Sanders shares, it often leads to burnout, lack of clarity, and a team culture where people end up firefighting rather than thriving. Panic hiring is all too common and often ends in tears, both for the owner and the team. Helen is a firm believer that you are always better off taking your time, defining exactly who you need, and being prepared to wait for the right person.

Helen Sanders emphasises the importance of hiring for the person first, and the skills second. The strongest MSPs are those that are crystal clear on their culture, their values, and the kind of learning mindset they want in every team member. Helen's advice is to look for people who are hungry to learn, who are actively seeking out new skills, and who naturally fit the business's way of doing things. The technical requirements are important, but these can be trained if you get the values fit right. If you build a team of the right people, the skills and roles will take care of themselves as the business grows.

Another key insight Helen Sanders shared is the idea of always being on the lookout for talent, even if you are not actively recruiting. Rather than collecting CVs and waiting until you are desperate for a new hire, she recommends building relationships, keeping a warm list of potential candidates, and treating these relationships in the same way you nurture prospects in your sales pipeline. By keeping in touch and offering value, even when there is no job available, you position your MSP as a place people want to work, and you make it much easier to hire well when the need arises.

The conversation also explored how recruitment is no different from client onboarding. Helen Sanders points out that too many MSPs invest heavily in client experience, but then neglect the onboarding and experience of their new team members. This can result in a disconnect between what was promised in the recruitment process and what is delivered on day one. Helen recommends building a robust, people-first onboarding process that starts before the new hire arrives and continues throughout their career with you. This not only sets the tone for a great working relationship but also encourages new team members to refer others, strengthening your recruitment pipeline for the future.

Building trust throughout the hiring process is vital. As Helen Sanders highlights, trust is created through multiple touchpoints and involving the wider team in the process. This could mean inviting potential hires to informal team coffees, shadowing days, or non-interview meetings to see how they interact with the culture and values of the business. It takes the pressure off the traditional interview format and allows both sides to get a genuine feel for each other. Helen also shared that showing vulnerability as a business owner and being open about the journey can make a huge difference in attracting the right people.

We finished the episode reflecting on the importance of succession planning and building a business that does not rely solely on the owner. Helen Sanders offered practical advice on creating a deliberate, step-by-step plan for removing yourself from day-to-day roles over a three-year period, focusing on spinning fewer plates, and empowering others to step up. This is the key to building a scalable and sellable MSP, where the value lies in the team and the systems rather than the founder.

Connect with Helen Sanders through her LinkedIn profile by clicking HERE or send her an email directly at [email protected]

Make sure to check out our Ultimate MSP Growth Guide, a free guide that walks you through a proven process to take your MSP from stuck to scalable, without working even more hours. It's 44 pages rammed with advice, insights and inspiration to help you decide what support is available to you now if you want to grow and scale your business. Click HERE to get your copy.

Connect on LinkedIn HERE with Ian and also with Stuart by clicking this LINK

And when you're ready to take the next step in growing your MSP, come and take the Scale with Confidence MSP Mastery Quiz. In just three minutes, you'll get a 360-degree scan of your MSP and identify the one or two tactics that could help you find more time, engage & align your people and generate more leads.

OR

To join our amazing Facebook Group of over 400 MSPs where we are helping you Scale Up with Confidence, then click HERE

Until next time, look after yourself and I'll catch up with you soon!

Graham Stead knows a thing or two about MSPs. He ran his own for over 20 years before selling it in 2016, and since then he's been leading sales and marketing teams and helping other MSP owners make better decisions, build stronger habits and get more sales. It was great to hear his story and experience, but more importantly, we unpacked the very specific actions MSPs can take to improve their sales performance by changing what they do every day.

One of the first standout moments in our conversation was when I asked Graham the number one thing MSPs need to do to get more sales. Without hesitation, he said, change their behaviour. Not build a pipeline, not sort out their marketing. Change their behaviour. And that really stuck with me. Because as Graham explained, it's not about what happens at the end of the sales process, it's what happens every day, every week, in the run up to that conversation. He used a brilliant analogy with Usain Bolt. Bolt doesn't win because he sprints the final 2 metres the hardest. He wins because of the four years of training, nutrition and planning that lead up to that 10 second race. And it's exactly the same in MSP sales.

Graham Stead shared some incredibly valuable insights around time management. One of his most powerful tools is something he calls the cookbook. A simple weekly spreadsheet where you track your sales activities. It sounds basic, but most MSPs who try it realise they are doing far less outreach and demand creation than they thought. And it's that consistency, those small daily actions, that create real momentum. Whether that's reaching out to a client contact, following up with a lead or booking a new meeting, it all adds up. Graham reminded us that building this habit might only start with 15 minutes a day. But it needs to be done consistently, and it needs to be protected. If something gets in the way, double up the following day. That's how new habits stick.

We also talked about the importance of linking your sales behaviour to your bigger goals. If you're not clear on your personal why, whether that's retiring well, supporting your family or simply building a business you're proud of, it becomes far too easy to skip the sales work and stay in your comfort zone. Graham Stead was very clear here. Connect your daily activity to your future goals and the motivation to do the work becomes far stronger.

The episode also covered four powerful sales habits that every MSP should adopt. The first was the demand creation habit. This is about creating conversations and building relationships, not just waiting for inbound leads. Graham gave some practical examples of how expanding your contact base within existing clients can lead to real value. If you're only speaking to the MD, you're missing opportunities with heads of department who have their own tech needs and budgets.

The second was the qualification habit. Time is your most valuable resource, so stop chasing poor fits. Graham shared the mindset shift of looking for reasons not to work with a prospect, respectfully and early. That simple shift can protect your time and help you focus on the right opportunities.

The third was the effective questioning habit. Better questions lead to bigger orders. But it's not only about what you ask, it's about learning from each conversation. Graham Stead encouraged us to create a bank of useful questions, review sales calls and continuously improve. Whether the deal was won or lost, there's always a lesson.

And finally, the agreed next steps habit. Sales momentum comes from clarity and commitment. Every meeting needs a clear purpose, a next step and an action plan. Graham also highlighted the importance of accountability. Whether it's a colleague, coach or peer, having someone to hold you to your habits can make all the difference.

This was one of those episodes that really brings together mindset and action. Graham Stead didn't talk in theory. He brought practical, easy-to-implement habits that make a measurable difference in sales performance. If you're an MSP owner stuck in the weeds, finding it hard to build a consistent pipeline or frustrated with unpredictable sales, this episode will give you the tools to get back in control.

You can connect with Graham Stead on LinkedIn by clicking HERE, and follow his updates from Growth Habits and book an advisory call if you want more tailored advice on changing your own sales behaviour.

Make sure to check out our Ultimate MSP Growth Guide, a free guide that walks you through a proven process to take your MSP from stuck to scalable, without working even more hours. It's 44 pages rammed with advice, insights and inspiration to help you decide what support is available to you now if you want to grow and scale your business. Click HERE to get your copy.

Connect on LinkedIn HERE with Ian and also with Stuart by clicking this LINK

And when you're ready to take the next step in growing your MSP, come and take the Scale with Confidence MSP Mastery Quiz. In just three minutes, you'll get a 360-degree scan of your MSP and identify the one or two tactics that could help you find more time, engage & align your people and generate more leads.

OR

To join our amazing Facebook Group of over 400 MSPs where we are helping you Scale Up with Confidence, then click HERE

Until next time, look after yourself and I'll catch up with you soon!

Ali Stewart has worked with hundreds of businesses, including many MSPs, guiding individuals and teams to make leadership a way of life, not a job title. She explains that leadership is not something you do now and again. It is a consistent, ongoing commitment to developing people and helping them unlock their potential. This is especially important for MSPs, where many business owners are technical by background and find themselves needing to evolve into leaders as the business grows. You start as a doer, then become a manager, and before long, the success of your MSP depends on your ability to lead, delegate and inspire others.

During our chat, Ali shared a powerful distinction that really stuck with me. Managers light a fire beneath. Leaders light a fire within. It sums up the difference perfectly. Managing is about task and control. Leading is about vision, belief and unlocking the greatness in others. That is a mindset shift every ambitious MSP owner needs to make. It is not about being in charge. It is about empowering others to step up.

Ali also walked us through her four-step leadership process which starts with visioning. And if you are an MSP leader who is waiting for someone to give you a vision, think again. You need to create one for yourself and your team. It does not need to be grand or complex, but it does need to answer the question: why are we here and where are we heading?

Once that is in place, it becomes about consistency, communication and mobilising your people. That means being crystal clear on expectations and diagnosing performance challenges early. The third stage of Ali's framework is all about development. Investing time and energy in people and helping them grow. And finally, the fourth stage is about letting go. That is where many MSP leaders get stuck.

We both agreed that one of the biggest hurdles for MSPs trying to move from manager to leader is their inability to stop doing the task. They have grown their business by being in the weeds, and now they need to build a team that can run it without them. It is uncomfortable. It feels risky. But the truth is, you cannot lead if you will not let go. And if you are the bottleneck in your MSP, it is time to acknowledge it and do something about it.

Ali Stewart offered a key insight for aspiring leaders in MSPs. Do not wait to be given the title or the role. Start acting like the leader you want to become. Model the behaviours of people you admire. Learn the skills. Invest in yourself. And be willing to go through the journey of change and development. Leadership is not about being the most capable technically. It is about being the person who brings out the best in others. It is about consistency, clarity and courage.

We also explored what high-performing teams really look like. And again, the message was clear. If your team is doing well today, that is great. But if you want them to stay high performing, you need to keep investing in them. That means regular reviews, proper recognition, meaningful conversations and showing up as a leader who cares.

Recognition, as Ali reminded us, is one of the most powerful tools in your leadership toolkit. And it is free. A sincere thank you, a moment of appreciation, and showing people they are seen and valued can have a bigger impact than any bonus or pay rise.

This episode is a must-listen for any MSP owner or senior team member who wants to create a business that works without them. If you are stuck in delivery, firefighting daily issues, or finding it hard to trust your team to take over, this conversation will help you see what needs to change. Ali Stewart has worked with hundreds of MSPs to help them make these transitions successfully, and the insights she shares here are packed with value and inspiration.

As ever, the key is to follow the process. Step out of the weeds. Develop your people. Create the space to think. And lead from the front.

If you want to learn more about her work and how she is helping MSPs and business leaders build stronger, people-first cultures, head to https://www.linkedin.com/company/ali-stewart-&-co/. There is so much more to learn from her and the tools she has developed. Or you can also connect with Ali Stewart through her LinkedIn by clicking HERE.

Make sure to check out our Ultimate MSP Growth Guide, a free guide that walks you through a proven process to take your MSP from stuck to scalable, without working even more hours. It's 44 pages rammed with advice, insights and inspiration to help you decide what support is available to you now if you want to grow and scale your business. Click HERE to get your copy.

Connect on LinkedIn HERE with Ian and also with Stuart by clicking this LINK

And when you're ready to take the next step in growing your MSP, come and take the Scale with Confidence MSP Mastery Quiz. In just three minutes, you'll get a 360-degree scan of your MSP and identify the one or two tactics that could help you find more time, engage & align your people and generate more leads.

OR

To join our amazing Facebook Group of over 400 MSPs where we are helping you Scale Up with Confidence, then click HERE

Until next time, look after yourself and I'll catch up with you soon!

Scott Riley has worked with MSPs for over six years, helping them tighten up their security practices and take real control of their 365 tenancies. In this episode, be prepared for the shift in mindset that Scott encourages. The idea that you are too small or not interesting enough to be a target is no longer valid. The reality is that attackers are not selective. They cast a wide net. If your MSP gets breached, the damage can extend far beyond email. Your PSA, RMM, partner centre, licence platforms, password vaults, and all client environments are at risk.

Scott Riley explains that token theft is one of the most common attack methods in play right now. A stolen login token can allow someone to log in as you without being challenged. If your global admin account is tied to your day-to-day login, the attacker has immediate access to your critical systems. Many MSPs still store MFA tokens inside password managers alongside usernames and passwords. It might seem convenient, but it undermines the whole point of multi-factor authentication.

We explore the emotional and financial consequences of a breach. Scott shares a real-life case where criminals sat silently inside a business email system, watching communication styles and eventually mimicking the MD's tone to authorise fraudulent payments. The losses started small but escalated quickly. These attacks are personal and targeted. For a small business, losing six thousand pounds can be the difference between making payroll and laying people off.

Scott stresses the importance of making this real for clients. He talks about positioning cybersecurity not as a technical need but as a business-critical risk conversation. Instead of relying on fear or jargon, help clients picture the consequences. What would happen if they were locked out of systems, lost money, or lost their reputation? Clients need to be educated through impact-based questions and examples they can relate to.

We also cover the responsibility that MSPs carry themselves. Cybersecurity starts with you. It must be owned by the business and led from the top. While the technical work can be delegated, the responsibility cannot be passed on. Regular reviews, clear security standards, and the discipline to follow them are essential. Inside Agent, Scott's platform, helps MSPs quickly assess their Microsoft 365 environments and bring them up to best practice. It gives a live compliance score, offers guided fixes, and creates ongoing visibility. It is designed to simplify the process, not complicate it.

We discuss why compliance frameworks such as Cyber Essentials Plus should be a minimum standard, and how the upcoming UK Cybersecurity and Resilience Bill is going to push MSPs to meet new legal requirements. With MSPs being seen as part of critical national infrastructure, business owners need to ensure that their internal environments are secure and compliant, not just their clients' systems.

Scott Riley shares clear recommendations for securing 365 tenants. These include using hardware MFA tokens, enforcing location and device-based access policies, reviewing and removing unused app integrations, ensuring third parties such as accountants or offshore VAs have the right restrictions in place, and stopping the use of global admin accounts for daily operations. He encourages every MSP to sit with their team regularly and walk through breach scenarios to build internal clarity and confidence.

The message is simple. Know where you are exposed. Fix what needs to be fixed. Get independent validation to confirm it. This episode is full of practical, plain-speaking advice that any MSP can follow. Scott Riley brings clarity, urgency, and support to an area that often gets ignored or pushed to the bottom of the list. If you want to protect your business, your team, and your clients, this episode is the reminder you need to act today. Thank you, Scott, for bringing such clear value to this conversation.

Connect with Scott Riley on his LinkedIn profile by clicking HERE. Or you can also find out more about Inside Agent by clicking HERE.

Make sure to check out our Ultimate MSP Growth Guide HERE, and remember that the help is out there. You just have to go get it.

Connect on LinkedIn HERE with Ian and also with Stuart by clicking this LINK

And when you're ready to take the next step in growing your MSP, come and take the Scale with Confidence MSP Mastery Quiz. In just three minutes, you'll get a 360-degree scan of your MSP and identify the one or two tactics that could help you find more time, engage & align your people, and generate more leads.

OR

To join our amazing Facebook Group of over 400 MSPs where we are helping you Scale Up with Confidence, then click HERE

Until next time, look after yourself, and I'll catch up with you soon!

We begin with a simple truth. If you want to attract and retain A players in your MSP, you need to lead like one. Many business owners want highly engaged, proactive team members who take ownership and drive the business forward. Yet when that energy is missing, the first step is not to blame the team but to reflect on your own leadership. Julie and I explore how your team's performance is often a direct reflection of the environment you've created. A Players don't arrive fully formed. They grow in the right conditions.

Julie introduces a practical framework that breaks down team behaviour into three causes. One, they can't do the job. This may be down to a lack of skill or confidence. Two, they won't do the job. This points to a relationship issue or something deeper going on beneath the surface. Three, they don't do the job because they haven't bought into the direction or they are unclear about it. All of these are leadership challenges. When leaders understand this, they unlock the ability to re-engage and develop every person in their team.

Throughout the conversation, Julie explains how leaders can assess their teams with this model and then take action. We talk about how engagement is driven by three things. Clear communication. The right skills and confidence. And strong working relationships. If any of these are missing, even a capable and motivated person can start to disengage. The key is to be proactive. Think about each team member, where they are on this scale, and what you need to do to help them move forward.

One of the strongest moments in this episode comes when Julie challenges the idea that someone is an A player by nature. Instead, she explains that high engagement comes when people know where they are going, feel connected to their leader, and feel capable in their role. Without those three factors in place, even great people can drift. As leaders, we have the responsibility to create that environment. When we do, people step up.

We share a real example from one of our MSP leaders who believed their team was underperforming. When we applied the framework, it became clear the team were not unmotivated, they were unclear. Direction had not been shared clearly. Conversations had been rushed or avoided. Once that changed, people became more engaged and started contributing ideas and driving projects forward. This is what happens when leadership becomes intentional.

Julie finishes with a powerful reminder. A players thrive under A leaders. If you want to create a business full of energy, momentum and ownership, it begins with how you show up every day. Your words. Your clarity. Your consistency. And your ability to see what each person needs to perform at their best. This is where real team growth begins.

This episode is full of practical guidance for MSP owners who are ready to shift how they lead and create a more engaged team. It will help you reflect on how you lead, how you communicate, and how you support others to become more confident, committed and capable.

Connect on LinkedIn HERE with Ian and also with Stuart by clicking this LINK

And when you're ready to take the next step in growing your MSP, come and take the Scale with Confidence MSP Mastery Quiz. In just three minutes, you'll get a 360-degree scan of your MSP and identify the one or two tactics that could help you find more time, engage & align your people and generate more leads.

OR

To join our amazing Facebook Group of over 400 MSPs where we are helping you Scale Up with Confidence, then click HERE

Until next time, look after yourself and I'll catch up with you soon!

This particular intensive was all about amplifying capacity, a key pillar of the Scale with Confidence model. Our focus this time centred around team performance – the challenges, the frameworks, and the mindset shifts needed to build a business that works for you, not because of you. What made this event stand out wasn't just the content or the planning, but the incredible maturity and vulnerability in the room. Stuart and I both reflected on how far our clients have come. These are no longer just MSPs doing the work but these are serious business leaders taking deliberate steps to lead their teams, grow with intention, and remove themselves as the bottleneck.

We officially launched the Team Performance Playbook, which brings together the years of leadership, team dynamics and people development work we've done into a structured journey. The playbook is not just theory. It's being delivered as a series of monthly implementation sessions where owners and their teams can apply the models in real time. Whether it's operational performance, account management or sales, the aim is the same: raise the maturity of your business so you can progress towards that Owner Not Needed state.

Julie Hutchison shared how powerful it was to see clients asking bigger, bolder questions, questions that show they're not just thinking as technicians or managers, but as real leaders. The Playbook helps them understand how to actually lead, how to shape environments for success, have meaningful conversations, and inspire performance. Importantly, this is not a one-time training but a strategic and structured support journey designed to drive consistent implementation and behavioural change.

Clare Elliot reflected on how far the finance conversations have come. A few years ago, many MSPs were avoiding their numbers. Now, they're leaning in, getting clarity, and most importantly, taking action. Clare delivered our Transform Your Profits framework back in January, and it's now running as a monthly workstream. Owners and finance teams are attending these sessions together, focusing on one step at a time, and building financial literacy and confidence along the way. It's not just about knowing your numbers but about making better decisions and growing profitably. One client said he would never have had the courage to raise his prices if it weren't for the Growth Hub. That one decision alone added £20,000 to his bottom line.

We also revisited the ICE framework, a powerful tool to help owners prioritise, delegate and make better use of their time. What made this session so striking is that many had seen it before, but they hadn't fully used it. Once they applied it, the difference was immediate. Teams began respecting each other's time more, productivity improved, and the sense of calm, focused progress returned. It wasn't a new shiny idea. It was an existing framework, finally implemented with purpose. That's what we're all about.

The energy from the room was palpable. As I shared my own personal vision and some of my journey, the response was humbling. People resonated, connected, and offered support in ways I hadn't expected. That's the power of this community – not just learning, but belonging. We heard clients say they'd never experienced anything like it, that they felt safe enough to open up, to ask for help, to share their struggles. And in that environment, real growth happens.

Whether it's through our leadership development programmes like Future Leaders, or our team and finance workstreams, we are seeing the ripple effect of what happens when MSP owners stop firefighting and start leading. If this episode has struck a chord, or if you've been wondering what support is right for you now that you've decided to grow, just reach out to us. We'd love to help.

Connect on LinkedIn HERE with Ian and also with Stuart by clicking this LINK

And when you're ready to take the next step in growing your MSP, come and take the Scale with Confidence MSP Mastery Quiz. In just three minutes, you'll get a 360-degree scan of your MSP and identify the one or two tactics that could help you find more time, engage & align your people and generate more leads.

OR

To join our amazing Facebook Group of over 400 MSPs where we are helping you Scale Up with Confidence, then click HERE

Until next time, look after yourself and I'll catch up with you soon!

Ken Roulston, a veteran of the IT industry and now self-proclaimed M&A addict, returns to share his deep insights and experience from building a £17 million MSP business through a series of successful acquisitions. Across this episode, we unpack the exact mindset, processes and practical steps MSP owners need to take when considering buying another MSP. Ken's journey is not just theory, it's real-world experience gained from multiple acquisitions, integration challenges and building long-term value. And trust me, his perspective is gold.

We kick off the conversation by tackling the question so many MSP owners wrestle with – why would you want to buy another MSP? For many, the idea of borrowing money or taking on risk can feel overwhelming. But Ken reframes this beautifully, explaining that when your objective is to create real business value, something that stands alone and can eventually be sold, you must be willing to embrace a growth mindset and strategic risk. Organic growth has its place, but when you're looking to significantly scale your revenue, EBITDA and ultimately the value of your MSP, M&A can be the most effective route.

One of Ken's standout messages is that your business must be in good enough shape to sell before you consider buying. That's not just about the exit. It's about having the structure, systems and leadership in place so that you're investable. If you need to raise funds or secure backing, you're going to have to 'sell' your vision and demonstrate operational excellence to potential lenders or partners. So, getting your house in order is step one.

As we move through the episode, Ken shares powerful guidance on how to actually find the right MSP to buy. This isn't just about browsing listings with brokers, although they can play a role, but it's about leveraging networks, building relationships, and even tapping into clever routes like speaking with accountants of potential sellers to warm up a conversation. This is classic Roulston thinking – practical, strategic, and with an eye on long-term alignment.

Once you've identified a potential business, the next challenge is due diligence. And here Ken lays out a clear and compelling four-pillar framework that every MSP owner should follow: strategic fit, technical alignment, financial value and cultural compatibility. That last one, culture, is too often overlooked, but as Ken reminds us, it can be the difference between a smooth integration and a complete disaster. Due diligence, especially on the legal and financial side, is not an area to cut corners. Ken strongly recommends using experts where needed and, especially for your first acquisition, working with someone who has been through it before.

Integration is the final hurdle and arguably the most critical. Buying a business is one thing. Making it work long term is another. Ken talks through how to communicate with your new clients and team, manage expectations, and ensure you are seen as a trustworthy, capable new owner. That first 3–6 months post-acquisition is where you earn loyalty or lose it. The 80/20 rule applies here, focus your energy where it counts. Show up for key clients. Reassure your top staff. And most importantly, don't disappear from your existing business while you do it.

Throughout the episode, Ken Roulston and I also discuss how your role as the business owner must evolve during this process. You will be required to step into a more strategic role, but you can't do that unless your leadership team is rock solid. This means that scaling through M&A is as much about internal readiness as it is about spotting external opportunities.

As we wrap up this trilogy, Ken shares three final pieces of advice: set a long-term value target for your MSP, be realistic about the size of the business you acquire first and be open to using debt to fund the right deal. With the right plan and guidance, M&A can be the fastest way to grow your MSP and build something truly valuable.

If this episode has got you thinking about your next move, check out the resources at MSPM&A.com, where Ken and our good friend Mark Copeman have put together a treasure trove of insights, including an eight-hour video programme and even a matchmaking service for buyers and sellers.

If you've only just joined us for this episode, make sure you go back and catch up on Part 1 – The Foundations and Part 2 – Preparing to Sell Your MSP. They set the groundwork for everything we've covered here and are packed with practical insights to help you understand the full M&A journey. Whether you're buying, selling, or just getting your head around what's possible, these episodes will give you the clarity and confidence to take the next step.

Connect with Ken Roulston on his LinkedIn HERE and learn more about his MSP M&A through their website HERE

Connect on LinkedIn HERE with Ian and also with Stuart by clicking this LINK

And when you're ready to take the next step in growing your MSP, come and take the Scale with Confidence MSP Mastery Quiz. In just three minutes, you'll get a 360-degree scan of your MSP and identify the one or two tactics that could help you find more time, engage & align your people and generate more leads.

OR

To join our amazing Facebook Group of over 400 MSPs where we are helping you Scale Up with Confidence, then click HERE

Until next time, look after yourself and I'll catch up with you soon!

Ken Roulston brings his decades of industry experience to the table and together we explore what it really takes to get your MSP into a position where it's not only ready to be sold, but where it attracts the right buyer and achieves a fair valuation.

Ken Roulston has walked the talk. He built his own MSP from the ground up, completed six acquisitions over 12 years and ultimately sold the business in 2023 for a healthy multiple, leaving behind a highly efficient and well-oiled operation. Throughout this episode, Ken shares what truly drives value in an MSP and why EBITDA is king when it comes to valuation. We get into the weeds of what EBITDA really is, the difference between profit, EBITDA and adjusted EBITDA, and how small tweaks in your operation today can make a big difference to your valuation tomorrow.

One of the key takeaways from Ken Roulston in this episode is that profitability is only half the picture. Buyers are also looking at recurring revenue, the quality of contracts with your clients, the efficiency of your operations and how professionally the business is run. We talk about the reality that many MSPs face – thinking their business is worth more than it actually is – and how things like weak client contracts or high client concentration can be red flags to buyers. Ken explains how buyers look for signs of consistency and professionalism, including documented processes, clean accounts, staff contracts and a good track record of customer retention. If your MSP is being run informally or too heavily reliant on you as the owner, that's going to limit your options when it comes to selling.

We also touch on the age-old debate about outsourced service desks. Is it a red flag for buyers or a smart operational choice? Ken shares how outsourcing can actually be a strategic advantage if done correctly, particularly in a tight labour market where skilled engineers are hard to find. In his case, the buyer saw the outsourced helpdesk as an opportunity and adopted it post-acquisition, demonstrating that the model itself isn't the issue, it's how efficiently it runs.

Throughout the conversation, we continue to reinforce the concept of owner not needed. If your MSP can't function without you, it's not a business. It's a job. And buyers don't want to buy your job. They want a systemised, well-governed, and self-sustaining business. So whether you're working five days a week in the weeds or you've managed to reduce your time to just one day a week, the goal is to build a business that can stand on its own two feet.

Ken also shares his thoughts on selecting the right buyer, and why it's not always about choosing the highest bidder. Culture fit matters, especially if there's an earnout or deferred payment involved. If the acquiring company doesn't align with your values or runs the business poorly post-acquisition, it could not only damage your legacy but also impact your final payout. We talk openly about deal structures, what buyers are looking for, and the importance of preparation, patience and compromise. Selling an MSP is not a six-week sprint. It's a strategic process that requires you to get your house in order and present a credible, investable business.

To round off the show, Ken gives us a glimpse into the MSP M&A training course he's delivering with Mark Copeman, which goes into even more detail than we could cover in this three-part series. There's also mention of an upcoming confidential matchmaking service for buyers and sellers, which is being developed as part of their wider initiative to support MSPs through this complex journey.

So, if you're an MSP owner who is thinking about selling in the next year or two, or even if you're just curious about what your exit could look like, this episode is essential listening. Get ready to take notes, challenge your assumptions and most importantly, take action. M&A is a serious step, but with the right preparation and support, it can be one of the most rewarding chapters in your business journey.

This is the second of three episodes in our M&A Mastery series with Ken Roulston, so if you haven't already, make sure you catch part one where we lay the groundwork and share Ken's incredible story. And next week, we'll be diving into the buying process to wrap up the trilogy with even more insights on what's happening in the M&A world for MSPs.

Connect with Ken Roulston on his LinkedIn HERE and learn more about his MSP M&A through their website HERE

Connect on LinkedIn HERE with Ian and also with Stuart by clicking this LINK

And when you're ready to take the next step in growing your MSP, come and take the Scale with Confidence MSP Mastery Quiz. In just three minutes, you'll get a 360-degree scan of your MSP and identify the one or two tactics that could help you find more time, engage & align your people and generate more leads.

OR

To join our amazing Facebook Group of over 400 MSPs where we are helping you Scale Up with Confidence, then click HERE

Until next time, look after yourself and I'll catch up with you soon!