In this eye-opening conversation, Ross Rosenberg is joined by psychotherapist and author Chelsey Cole to explore why traditional codependency frameworks — including Codependency Anonymous — may actually be doing more harm than good. 

Together they unpack the crucial difference between grandiose and vulnerable narcissists, how childhood experiences with narcissistic parents create the Relationship Template that drives adults straight into toxic partnerships, and why CoDA's Step One amounts to institutional gaslighting by framing the codependent as the one with a control problem. 

Ross also explains the origins of the term "codependency" and why Self-Love Deficit Disorder is a far more accurate and empowering lens for healing. Chelsey shares her own journey — from narcissistic relationships to founding her Rewired for Resilience program — and the three phases of recovery she outlines in her book If I'd Only Known. 

If you've ever wondered why you keep attracting the wrong people, no matter how hard you try, this conversation will give you the missing piece.

Chelsey Brooke Cole is a licensed psychotherapist, Certified Partner Trauma Therapist, and best-selling author of If Only I'd Known! She specializes in narcissistic abuse and complex trauma, and is the host of Restoring Resilience podcast and creator of Rewired for Resilience. Her work has been featured in USA Today, HuffPost, and Psychology Today, and she supports thousands of survivors daily through her speaking, writing, and healing programs.

Support the show

ABOUT ROSS ROSENBERG 
Ross Rosenberg, M.Ed., LCPC, CADC, is a psychotherapist, educator, expert witness, and celebrated author. He is also a global thought leader and clinical expert in codependency, trauma, pathological narcissism, narcissistic abuse, and addictions.

Ross's pioneering contributions to codependency have provided sweeping theoretical and practical updates and developed a treatment program that permanently resolves the issue. Ross has been featured on national TV and radio and is a regular radio and podcast guest. 

In addition, he has traveled the world, giving his one-of-a-kind keynote presentations and educational workshops. His global impact is best illustrated by his YouTube channel, with 30 million views and 297,000 subscribers, and the sale of 190,000 Human Magnet Syndrome books published in 12 languages. In 2013, Ross created The Self-Love Recovery Institute, a hub for his personal development, workshops, professional training, retreats, other programs, and services.

Learn more at www.SelfLoveRecovery.com. 

Facebook.com/TheCodependencyCure) 
Instagram (@rossrosenberg_slri) 
Twitter (@RossRosenberg1) 
and now…TikTok! (@RossRosenberg1)