Do you ever feel like no matter how much you explain yourself, your words just get turned against you? In this episode of Waking Up to Narcissism, Tony Overbay, LMFT, breaks down why explanations don’t lead to understanding with a narcissist—or with anyone who is deeply emotionally immature. Instead, they become what Tony calls an “attack surface”: the very fuel that allows the narcissist to twist, criticize, or position themselves as the victim.

Through a painfully familiar story of a wife trying to share her day and a husband who withdraws into silence, Tony unpacks:

• Why silence is a weapon for the narcissist—and why it spikes anxiety for the pathologically kind partner
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• How emotionally immature people thrive on friction and conflict rather than true connection
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• The cycle of narcissistic supply (idealization, devaluation, and discard) and how it shows up in daily interactions
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• The difference between secure attachment and antagonistic attachment
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• Five rules for protecting yourself and reducing “attack surfaces” in conversations
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If you’ve ever found yourself over-explaining, apologizing for things that weren’t your fault, or walking on eggshells to avoid conflict, this episode will help you recognize the patterns, reclaim your emotional energy, and begin to shift the dynamic.

Your kindness is a gift—but when explanations only make things worse, it’s time to understand why.

00:00 Introduction and Acknowledgements

00:52 Understanding Substack and Blogging

02:11 Disclaimer and Episode Overview

02:47 Narcissism in Relationships

07:25 The Real-Life Story Begins

11:39 Analyzing the Narcissistic Behavior

19:13 Secure Attachment vs. Narcissistic Attachment

25:58 The Concept of Attack Surface

35:18 The Silent Treatment: A Narcissist's Weapon

35:51 The Parasitic Dynamic in Narcissistic Relationships

39:20 The Narcissistic Supply Cycle

43:51 Codependency and Pathological Kindness

51:41 Strategies for Dealing with Narcissists

56:05 Breaking the Cycle: Reclaiming Your Power

01:01:32 The Importance of Documentation

01:07:57 Key Takeaways and Final Thoughts

Contact Tony at [email protected] to learn more about his Emotional Architects men's group.

And visit https://julie-dejesus.com/cruise to learn more about Tony and his friend Julie De Jesus's "I See You Living" cruise, a 5-night Western Caribbean Cruise from January 24-29, 2026 aboard the Royal Caribbean Cruise Line. 

To learn more about Tony's upcoming re-release of the Magnetic Marriage course, his Pathback Recovery course, and more, sign up for his newsletter through the link at https://linktr.ee/virtualcouch

Available NOW: Tony's "Magnetic Marriage Mini-Course" is only $25. https://magneticmarriage.mykajabi.com/magnetic-marriage-mini-course

You can learn more about Tony's pornography recovery program, The Path Back, by visiting http://pathbackrecovery.com

00:00 Introduction and Announcements

02:25 Personal Loss: The Passing of My Mom

03:44 Understanding the Role of a Therapist

06:05 A Story of Misunderstanding: My Mom Thought I Was a Doctor

15:10 A Therapist's Perspective on Grief

17:58 Conversation with Tricia Jameson: Grief and Grace

34:30 Exploring the Nature of Memory

35:54 Humor as a Coping Mechanism

38:59 Seeking Spiritual Experiences

42:07 Navigating Grief and Loss

48:26 Reflecting on Personal Growth

52:01 Supporting Others Through Grief

58:49 Concluding Thoughts and Farewell

Contact Tony at [email protected] to learn more about his Emotional Architects men's group.

And visit https://julie-dejesus.com/cruise to learn more about Tony and his friend Julie De Jesus's "I See You Living" cruise, a 5-night Western Caribbean Cruise from January 24-29, 2026 aboard the Royal Caribbean Cruise Line. 

To learn more about Tony's upcoming re-release of the Magnetic Marriage course, his Pathback Recovery course, and more, sign up for his newsletter through the link at https://linktr.ee/virtualcouch

Available NOW: Tony's "Magnetic Marriage Mini-Course" is only $25. https://magneticmarriage.mykajabi.com/magnetic-marriage-mini-course

You can learn more about Tony's pornography recovery program, The Path Back, by visiting http://pathbackrecovery.com

Would you rather be liked—or be true to yourself?

It sounds simple, but what happens when staying true to your values could cost you your job, your marriage, your faith community, or your friendships? In today’s episode of The Virtual Couch Presents, Tony Overbay, LMFT, dives into the real difference between character (the traits others see in us) and integrity (the alignment of our actions with our deepest values).

Through stories pulled from the legal world, faith communities, workplaces, friendships, and even the messy reality of parenting, Tony explores how external validation can pull us away from who we are—and how emotional maturity, self-determination, and values-based living bring us back home to ourselves.

You’ll hear about billion-dollar law firms making impossible choices, parents navigating the tension between community expectations and their child’s authenticity, and why even a heated debate over pizza sauce in a Hot Pocket can reveal where integrity really lives.

At the end of the episode, stay tuned for a short guided meditation to help you connect with your own values and discover how to live them out with integrity. And don’t miss the chance to grab a cheat sheet of this episode and Tony’s Values Exercise, a simple but powerful tool to help you start discovering who you truly are.

This is not about guilt or shame. It’s about curiosity, growth, and finding the courage to live with integrity—even when it costs you.

00:00 Welcome to the Virtual Couch

00:50 The Dilemma: Being Liked vs. Being True to Yourself

01:36 Exploring Character and Integrity

02:58 Upcoming Cruise and Workshops

04:04 Character vs. Integrity: Real-Life Examples

14:14 The Legal World: Integrity Under Pressure

33:21 Self-Determination Theory and Emotional Maturity

35:53 Intrinsic Motivation and Self-Determination Theory

36:56 Autonomy, Competence, and Relatedness

37:42 External Rewards and Burnout

38:39 Real-World Examples of Integrity

39:42 Sophia's Journey to Integrity

42:16 Daniel's Struggle with Values

45:12 Integrity in Different Contexts

58:06 Faith and Integrity

01:06:15 Guided Meditation: Coming Home to Your Values

Contact Tony at [email protected] to learn more about his Emotional Architects men's group.

And visit https://julie-dejesus.com/cruise to learn more about Tony and his friend Julie De Jesus's "I See You Living" cruise, a 5-night Western Caribbean Cruise from January 24-29, 2026 aboard the Royal Caribbean Cruise Line. 

To learn more about Tony's upcoming re-release of the Magnetic Marriage course, his Pathback Recovery course, and more, sign up for his newsletter through the link at https://linktr.ee/virtualcouch

Available NOW: Tony's "Magnetic Marriage Mini-Course" is only $25. https://magneticmarriage.mykajabi.com/magnetic-marriage-mini-course

You can learn more about Tony's pornography recovery program, The Path Back, by visiting http://pathbackrecovery.com

Have you ever tried to change someone’s mind—and watched them dig in even deeper? Or wondered why, even when you want to change your own beliefs, it feels like pushing against an invisible force? In this episode, Tony Overbay, LMFT, takes you on a journey that starts with a teenage quest for the perfect tan and ends with a powerful realization about how we construct our social realities. After sharing a personal story about undergoing a dramatic topical chemotherapy treatment for actinic keratosis, Tony reflects on how his temporarily altered appearance changed the way people interacted with him—and how it altered the way he saw himself.

This experience sets the stage for a breakdown of the groundbreaking Dartmouth scar study, which revealed that the belief that you’re being judged can actually create that experience—regardless of reality. From there, Tony dives into the science of confirmation bias: how our brains are wired to seek out information that supports what we already believe, and how this cognitive shortcut influences everything from politics and religion to parenting and marriage. You’ll hear real-life examples, client stories (with details changed for confidentiality), and powerful metaphors that unpack why belief change is so hard—and why it’s also essential for personal growth, emotional maturity, and deeper human connection.

00:00 The Quest for the Perfect Tan

00:35 A Dermatologist's Warning

01:33 The Chemotherapy Cream Experience

02:27 Social Reactions to Visible Differences

05:20 The Dartmouth Scar Study

06:24 The Power of Perception

15:25 Confirmation Bias in Action

32:47 Interpreting Neutral Events

33:04 Religion and Coincidences

33:34 Selective Memory in Parenting and Beyond

34:58 Confirmation Bias in Action

36:23 Client Story: Recognizing Bias

40:32 Vaccine Hesitancy and Confirmation Bias

44:58 The Scar Study and Confirmation Bias

54:56 Evolutionary Roots of Belief Protection

57:33 Modern Challenges and Professional Competence

01:01:49 Conclusion and Listener Engagement

Contact Tony at [email protected] to learn more about his Emotional Architects men's group.

And visit https://julie-dejesus.com/cruise to learn more about Tony and his friend Julie De Jesus's "I See You Living" cruise, a 5-night Western Caribbean Cruise from January 24-29, 2026 aboard the Royal Caribbean Cruise Line. 

What if an entire generation is emotionally stuck in childhood—and doesn't even know it?

In this compelling guest appearance on The Steph and Craig Show, Tony dives deep into what he calls "the emotional immaturity epidemic" that's quietly sabotaging relationships everywhere.

Discover the hidden patterns that keep adults reacting like children: black-and-white thinking that destroys nuance, magical thinking that avoids reality, and the exhausting habit of managing everyone else's emotions instead of allowing people to have their own experiences. Through real-life examples and practical insights, you'll learn to recognize these childhood survival strategies that have become adult relationship roadblocks.

Whether you're the people-pleaser who can't say no, the perfectionist who fears vulnerability, or the controller trying to manage everyone's feelings, this conversation offers eye-opening insights into how these patterns formed—and more importantly, how to outgrow them.

What you'll discover: • Why emotional reasoning ("I feel it, so it must be true") sabotages relationships • How childhood adaptations become adult limitations

• Practical tools for recognizing your own emotional immaturity patterns • Actionable strategies for developing genuine emotional maturity

Ready to stop reacting from your inner child and start responding from your wise adult self? This episode will show you exactly where to begin.

Find The Steph and Craig Show at stephandcraig.co

00:00 Introduction and Episode Overview

00:34 Guest Introduction: Steph and Craig

02:22 Emotional Immaturity Epidemic

04:18 Therapy Insights and Personal Anecdotes

05:24 Interview Begins: Revisiting Past Conversations

06:52 Emotional Weight in Relationships

09:55 Understanding Emotional Immaturity

13:02 Inner Child and Emotional Development

27:35 Black and White Thinking in Relationships

30:55 Reflecting on Past Behaviors

31:53 The Power of Language in Relationships

33:07 Understanding Black or White Thinking

34:45 Magical Thinking and Emotional Maturity

43:12 Emotional Reasoning in Adults

58:46 Navigating Faith and Personal Validation

01:00:13 The Impact of External Validation on Self-Identity

01:00:42 The Role of Accountability and Magical Thinking

01:01:16 Spiritual Perspectives on Differentiation

01:02:37 Emotional Boundaries and Responsibility

01:04:35 Navigating Emotional Charges in Relationships

01:06:48 The Journey of Emotional Maturity

01:11:30 Mind Reading and Assumptions in Relationships

01:16:10 The Continuous Learning Process

01:23:31 The Importance of Emotional Maturity

01:26:05 Final Thoughts and Call to Action

Contact Tony at [email protected] to learn more about his Emotional Architects men's group.

And visit https://julie-dejesus.com/cruise to learn more about Tony and his friend Julie De Jesus's "I See You Living" cruise, a 5-night Western Caribbean Cruise from January 24-29, 2026 aboard the Royal Caribbean Cruise Line. 

Are you truly being curious—or just trying to win the argument? Tony explores the difference between genuine curiosity and performative questions, sharing real-life examples and tools to help you respond with emotional maturity, not reactivity. Learn how curiosity can transform your relationships.

00:00 Introduction and Host Background

01:42 Understanding Performative vs. Genuine Curiosity

02:04 A Personal Story About Curiosity

08:50 The Importance of Genuine Curiosity in Relationships

19:10 Self-Regulation and Emotional Maturity

24:18 Promoting Genuine Curiosity in Parenting

26:17 The Role of Humility in Curiosity

29:41 Healthy Ego vs. Defensive Narcissism

35:03 The Neuroscience of Decision Making and Emotions

37:06 The Power of Slowing Down

37:36 Understanding Emotions: Primary, Secondary, and Instrumental

41:02 Exploring Anger in Relationships

42:48 Trusting Your Gut and Emotional Reasoning

45:41 Addressing Men's Emotional Immaturity

48:55 Real-Life Examples of Genuine Curiosity

53:42 Parenting with Curiosity

55:09 Curiosity in Marriage and Workplace

59:47 Acceptance and Commitment Therapy Tools

01:02:15 Four Pillars of a Connected Conversation

01:05:20 Final Thoughts and Takeaways

Contact Tony at [email protected] to learn more about his Emotional Architects men's group.

And visit https://julie-dejesus.com/cruise to learn more about Tony and his friend Julie De Jesus's "I See You Living" cruise, a 5-night Western Caribbean Cruise from January 24-29, 2026 aboard the Royal Caribbean Cruise Line. 

How many times have you been told you were too sensitive? Or accused of overreacting? Maybe you’ve heard things like, “It’s not a big deal,” “You need to calm down,” or “It was just a joke—why are you making this such a thing?” And each time, you questioned yourself. Was it really that bad? Were you imagining things? Because on their own, the comments, the criticisms, the passive-aggressive digs might seem small—hardly worth mentioning. But they kept happening. Over and over. Until you stopped trusting your own perception. That’s the nature of death by 1,000 cuts. It’s not the severity of one moment—it’s the slow, relentless erosion of your sense of self, done quietly enough that you begin to doubt whether you’re even bleeding at all.

In this ninth edition of the Death by 1,000 Cuts series, Tony Overbay, LMFT, dives even deeper into the subtle ways being in a relationship with the narcissist, or emotionally immature, erodes your sense of self, one dismissive comment, one double standard, one guilt trip at a time. Tony explains how this isn’t just about pain. It’s about power.

You’ll hear real stories from real people who’ve endured the emotional whiplash, the rewritten history, and the gaslighting—and who are waking up to their self-worth. He explores what happens when those who were meant to love us chip away at our confidence, and what it means to finally stop apologizing for noticing.

And Tony shares how to recognize eventually, and then celebrate the resilience of those who are still standing, not just after 1,000 cuts, but after every life they had to rebuild.

If you’ve ever felt like you were the only one keeping score of the damage—or the only one still fighting to heal—this episode is for you.

00:00 A True Story Begins

00:20 The Number Nine Debate

01:28 Mark's Research and Sarah's Reaction

03:17 The Argument Escalates

05:24 Mark's Apology and Internal Struggle

06:11 Mark's Conversation with Jim

07:05 Introduction to Death by a Thousand Cuts

08:58 Understanding Emotional Abuse

11:08 Listener's Email on Validation

14:45 Financial Control in Divorce

19:21 Emotional Betrayal in Vulnerability

22:44 The Car Disagreement

32:17 Emotional Immaturity and Self-Sufficiency

34:00 The Weaponization of Humor

37:27 The Impact of Passive-Aggressive Comments

47:38 Control and Manipulation in Relationships

50:31 Emotional Triangulation and Rewriting Narratives

54:57 Healing and Moving Forward

57:59 Mindfulness Prompt: The Cut and the Healing

What if the very strategies that saved you as a child are now sabotaging your adult relationships?

In Part 2 of Tony's series on emotional immaturity, discover why your most persistent relationship struggles aren't character flaws—they're outdated survival software still running in the background of your life.

Through the powerful ACT metaphor of "The Man in the Hole," you'll understand why working harder with familiar emotional tools only digs you deeper into relationship problems. When someone offers you a ladder out of your patterns, why do you keep trying to dig with it instead? This episode reveals how to recognize when it's time to put down the shovel of old coping strategies and climb toward something completely different.

Meet the clients who've made this transformation: the chronic fixer who learned to ask "what do you need from me?" instead of immediately solving, the humor-deflector who shocked a room into silence by sharing something real, and the lifelong people-pleaser whose hands shook as she said "no" for the first time—and discovered her marriage actually got stronger.

You'll explore Terry Real's revolutionary insight that childhood adaptations become adult roadblocks, learn the art of re-parenting yourself with compassion instead of criticism, and discover why emotional maturity isn't about never falling into old patterns—it's about recognizing when you're there and having new tools to respond.

Whether you struggle with hypervigilance, perfectionism, control issues, or people-pleasing tendencies, this episode offers a shame-free framework for honoring your inner child's brilliant survival strategies while empowering your adult self to take the lead. Because growth isn't about eliminating your protective parts—it's about expanding your repertoire of responses and choosing consciously instead of reacting automatically.

Ready to stop digging and start climbing? Your ladder awaits.

00:00 Introduction and Recap

01:23 The Story of Tyler

03:53 Tyler's Realization and Therapy

09:39 Acceptance and Commitment Therapy Metaphor

15:46 Revisiting Emotional Immaturity

19:30 Reparenting Yourself

25:05 Examples of Reparenting in Action

29:00 Exploring Emotional Immaturity Traits

40:54 Recognizing and Validating Emotions

42:47 Dependence on External Validation

48:54 Taking Ownership and Accountability

51:49 Mind Reading and Communication

01:03:55 Hypervigilance and Emotional Containment

01:07:12 Perfectionism and Control

01:11:49 Integration and Emotional Maturity

01:15:57 Real-Life Examples of Emotional Growth

01:22:05 The Journey of Emotional Maturity

Are you constantly trying to please your mother but never feeling good enough? Do you take responsibility for her emotional well-being? If you've ever found yourself stuck in these patterns, this episode is essential listening — and men, don't skip this one! Host Tony Overbay discovered he might have a little "Good Daughter Syndrome" himself.

In this illuminating conversation, psychotherapist Katherine Fabrizio https://daughtersrising.info/ shares her 35 years of experience working with daughters of difficult mothers, including her own journey breaking away from practicing therapy alongside her controlling mother. With refreshing candor and hard-earned wisdom, Katherine reveals:

• The four psychological traps that keep "good daughters" stuck: the never good enough trap, the guilt trap, the self-doubt trap, and the mixed message trap
• Why setting even small boundaries can provide crucial data about your relationship
• How to break free without it being a "zero-sum game" where someone must lose
• Why your mother's narcissistic defenses will protect her, even when you start setting boundaries
• The paralyzing internal conflict of feeling selfish when you differentiate from mom
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With multiple awards, including Gold Medalist for Parenting & Relationships from The Global Book Awards, Katherine's book "The Good Daughter Syndrome" offers hope to those caught in these destructive dynamics.

Whether you identify as a "good daughter" or simply want to understand the complex mother-daughter relationship, this conversation provides actionable insights for reclaiming your sovereignty and building a life that truly belongs to you.

"When you wake up and realize you've been ceding your sovereignty to somebody else... it's incredibly empowering." - Katherine Fabrizio

00:00 Introduction and Announcements

01:35 Emotional Immaturity Epidemic

03:32 The Good Daughter Syndrome

08:12 Interview with Catherine Fabrizio

11:03 Catherine's Personal Journey

17:37 Understanding Narcissistic Dynamics

26:40 Setting Boundaries with Narcissistic Mothers

27:35 The Never Good Enough Trap

28:40 The Guilt Trap

29:11 Navigating Divorce and Co-Parenting

33:54 The Self-Doubt Trap

38:59 The Mixed Message Trap

46:23 Empowerment and Differentiation

48:53 Conclusion and Resources

Ever wondered why your brilliant mind can solve complex problems at work but completely breaks down during relationship conflicts? That's because those emotional reactions that feel so instinctive aren't flaws—they're actually genius survival strategies that once kept you safe. In this transformative episode, we explore how black-and-white thinking, mind-reading expectations, and external validation seeking were perfect childhood adaptations that have now become relationship roadblocks. Through the groundbreaking insight that behaviors which perfectly served us in childhood often become the very patterns that sabotage our adult relationships, you'll finally understand why you keep falling into familiar emotional patterns despite your best intentions.

This isn't just another episode about relationship struggles—it's a compassionate roadmap for emotional growth that honors both your wounded inner child and your emerging adult self. You'll discover how to recognize when you're in an emotional "hole" and why continuing to dig with familiar tools only takes you deeper. Most importantly, you'll learn how to pass the baton from your protective inner child to your capable adult self without shame or judgment. Whether you struggle with people-pleasing, emotional flooding, perfectionism, or control issues, this episode offers a strength-based approach to transform these patterns into mature responses that will revolutionize your relationships and bring a profound sense of internal peace.

00:00 Introduction and Episode Overview

00:23 Listener Email: Mark's Story

01:41 Understanding Emotional Immaturity

04:47 Exploring the Emotional Maturity Spectrum

08:47 Introducing the Emotional Architects Group

09:29 Narcissistic Personality Disorder vs. Emotional Immaturity

11:08 Dinner with Daniel: A Narcissistic Narrative

15:47 Stages of Emotional Maturity

26:18 Childhood Behaviors in Adult Bodies

32:45 Understanding Emotional Blueprints

33:07 Re-parenting with Compassion

33:32 Therapeutic Insights from Fiction

34:23 Frozen Moments and Adult Relationships

35:16 Childhood Adaptations in Adult Life

36:17 Exploring Childlike Behaviors in Adults

36:57 Navigating Emotional Development

41:34 Black or White Thinking

44:43 Magical Thinking in Relationships

47:46 Emotional Reasoning and Codependency

52:32 External Validation and Accountability

55:41 Mind Reading and Projection

01:01:32 Pattern Recognition and Familiarity

01:07:12 Path Toward Emotional Maturity

01:07:52 Conclusion and Next Steps