Disarming Leviathan Podcast

The Disarming Leviathan podcast returns with a new season focused on helping Christians navigate political discipleship and civic engagement in a polarized world.In this preview episode, host Caleb Campbell introduces upcoming guests—including Dr. Carmen Imes, Dr. Vince Bacote, and Joash Thomas—and outlines the season’s goal: equipping listeners to bear faithful witness to the Kingdom of God while loving their Christian nationalist neighbors, especially during the relational tensions of the holiday season. Check out the Ministry Leader’s Companion to Disarming Leviathan (now available with training videos). Use the code Levi25 for 20% off and a chance to win your very own Levi (the most disarming Leviathan around).Also, you are invited to the Communities of Flourishing conference in Phoenix on February 28, featuring speakers Malcolm Foley, Kit Danley, Linda Morris, David Swanson, and Skye Jethani. Buy your tickets by Dec 23rd to receive the Advent discount!

In this episode of Disarming Leviathan, biblical scholar Dr. Carmen Joy Imes joins Caleb Campbell to unpack her latest book, Becoming God’s Family: Why the Church Still Matters. Together, they explore how the Bible casts a radical vision of the church as a true spiritual family—one that defies the shallow belonging offered by partisan movements, nationalism, and consumer identity. Imes argues that the sibling language of the New Testament is not metaphorical but mission-critical: believers are called to live as brothers and sisters with real reciprocity, responsibility, and hospitality. She names the dangers of authoritarian leadership and culture war churches, while offering a better path—one where diverse believers share life, worship, and bread, even across political and class divides. Dr. Carmen Joy Imes:Dr. Carmen Joy Imes is Associate Professor of Old Testament at Biola University and a leading voice in biblical theology and public discipleship. She is the author of Bearing God’s Name, Being God’s Image, and her newest release, Becoming God’s Family: Why the Church Still Matters (IVP, 2024). Her work traces major biblical themes through Scripture to address contemporary challenges facing the church, including isolation, authoritarianism, and political idolatry. Dr. Imes also produces weekly content on her YouTube series Torah Tuesday, writes on Substack, and speaks widely at churches, conferences, and seminaries.

In this special crossover episode, Caleb joins a conversation with scholars Paul D. Miller, David Koyzis, and Michael W. Austin to help the church understand and respond to Christian Nationalism.

Together they unpack what Christian Nationalism is, how it differs from patriotism, and why it poses serious challenges to the gospel’s witness. They also explore related topics like Abraham Kuyper’s sphere sovereignty, the Seven Mountain Mandate, and natural law, offering clarity for pastors, lay leaders, and everyday believers seeking faithful civic engagement.

Co-hosted by the J29 Coalition, this episode serves as an “Evangelical’s Guide to American Christian Nationalism,” a practical primer for those wanting to move beyond fear and toward a political discipleship rooted in love of God and neighbor.

In this special episode, Caleb joins the team from Bodies Behind the Bus for a conversation about faith, justice, and compassion in the face of political division. Together, they share a joint fundraiser supporting a DACA recipient fighting to stay with their family in the U.S.

As we enter this season, we can be about the business of loving our neighbor through acts of service, generosity, and kindness. Please consider donating to ease the burden for an immigrant family with DACA status pursuing legal pathways to safety.

To donate and support the family mentioned in this episode, click here.

Over the next few weeks, the Disarming Leviathan Podcast will feature collaborative projects like this one, with new interviews launching in the new year.

Subscribe on Substack or visit disarmingleviathan.com to stay connected.

This is a rerelease of an earlier episode.

Stay tuned to the Disarming Leviathan Podcast. New Episodes coming in a few weeks!

Get full access to Disarming Leviathan: Missionary to Christian Nationalists at disarmingleviathan.substack.com/subscribe

This is a rerelease of an earlier episode.

Stay tuned to the Disarming Leviathan Podcast. New Episodes coming in a few weeks!

Get full access to Disarming Leviathan: Missionary to Christian Nationalists at disarmingleviathan.substack.com/subscribe

In this episode, Phil Herndon examines how purveyors of American Christian Nationalism leverage the emotions of their audiences to gain allegiance, power, and money.

This episode will not only help you recognize when your loved ones are experiencing emotions like rage, anxiety, and fear, but also provide you with practical tools for fostering peaceful, constructive conversations.

About Phil

Phil uses a dynamic approach to help his clients recover their hearts and redeem their stories. His therapeutic approach is grounded in the Spiritual Root System™, and is informed by the work of Irvin Yalom, Curt Thompson, Dan Siegel, and Dan Allender. He also integrates perspectives from Judeo-Christian traditions, existential philosophy, and pastoral care. Phil works with individuals who have lost their way through addiction, anxiety, depression, struggles with spirituality, or burnout to walk them through the tumultuous and scary times that are so common to the human experience.

Phil worked in the trucking business through college and after college until finally realizing his true passion was helping people walk through difficulties and heartache. He completed graduate school in 1992 with a Master of Arts degree in counseling and religious education.

He served as a pastor in Texas for 15 years until joining the Center for Professional Excellence in 2005 where he served as Clinical Director until 2020. Phil became the Clinical Director and co-owner of (what is now) River Tree in 2020 and loves his role in developing, encouraging, and equipping the staff as they walk with people through their life journeys.

This is a rerelease of an earlier episode.

Stay tuned to the Disarming Leviathan Podcast. New Episodes coming in a few weeks!

Get full access to Disarming Leviathan: Missionary to Christian Nationalists at disarmingleviathan.substack.com/subscribe

In this episode of Disarming Leviathan, Caleb Campbell speaks with Holly Berkley Fletcher about her journey from missionary kid in Kenya to CIA analyst to outspoken critic of Christian nationalism. Holly reflects on her evangelical upbringing, her experiences with authoritarian regimes, and how the language of faith is often weaponized to serve political power. The conversation dives into her personal reckoning with evangelicalism, the ethical challenges of public service, and her fierce commitment to democracy, justice, and telling the truth—even when it's costly.

About Holly: Holly Berkley Fletcher is a writer, historian, and former CIA analyst who brings a unique voice to conversations about faith, politics, and public life. Raised as a missionary kid in Kenya and trained as an American historian, Holly spent nearly two decades working as an Africa analyst for the CIA. She now writes at the intersection of theology, democracy, and justice, contributing regularly to The Bulwark and her Substack, A Zebra Without Stripes. Her forthcoming book, The Missionary Kids, explores the personal and political legacy of evangelical missions and what it means to grow up in a faith tradition grappling with power.

Caleb joins Dr. Jemar Tisby for a joint podcast that explores the history of American Christian Nationalism and the church and ways that we can engage those who are imbibing this harmful ideology.

About Jemar TisbyJemar Tisby (BA, University of Notre Dame; MDiv, Reformed Theological Seminary) s the New York Times bestselling author of The Color of Compromise and the award-winning How to Fight Racism. He is a historian who studies race, religion, and social movements, and serves as a professor at Simmons College of Kentucky, a historically Black college. He is also the founder of The Witness, Inc. an organization dedicated to Black uplift from a Christian perspective. He has written for national news outlets such as The Atlantic, the Washington Post, and the Religion News Service. He has offered television commentary on CNN and is frequently called upon to provide expert insight on current events related to race and Christianity. He has spoken nationwide at colleges, universities, and other organizations.

About Caleb CampbellPastor Campbell graduated Summa Cum Laude with a Master of Arts in Ministry from Phoenix Seminary in 2015. Caleb is currently a doctoral student at Fuller Theological Seminary. He has served at Desert Springs Bible Church, in Phoenix, AZ since 2006, serving as Lead Pastor since 2015. He also serves on the board of United Pastors of Arizona, is the state-wide regional director of the Surge Network, and is one of the founders of the J29 Coalition. He has spoken at events hosted by Acts 29, the African American Christian Clergy Coalition, American Values Coalition, Surge Network, Grand Canyon University, Converge Arizona, Young Life, and Phoenix Seminary

Matthew D. Taylor stops by the pod to discuss the recent rise of independent charismatic leaders promoting American Christian Nationalism. Matt helps us understand some of the movement’s more prominent […]

The post The Rise of Charismatic Christian Nationalism w/ Matthew D. Taylor first appeared on Disarming Leviathan.

This is a rerelease of an earlier episode.

Stay tuned to the Disarming Leviathan Podcast. New Episodes coming in a few weeks!

Get full access to Disarming Leviathan: Missionary to Christian Nationalists at disarmingleviathan.substack.com/subscribe

Dr. Katharine Hayhoe shares her experience as a climate scientist and gives some practical coaching on how we can cultivate healthy conversations with friends and family with whom we fundamentally disagree.

About Katharine

Katharine Hayhoe is a climate scientist and chief scientist for The Nature Conservancy. She is also the Endowed Professor in Public Policy and Public Law and Paul W. Horn Distinguished Professor at Texas Tech University.

She has been named a United Nations Champion of the Earth and one of Time’s 100 Most Influential People, and serves as the climate ambassador for the World Evangelical Alliance. Katharine was a lead author for the US Second, Third, and Fourth National Climate Assessments, hosts the PBS digital series Global Weirding, and has written for The New York Times.

Her TED Talk “The Most Important Thing You Can Do to Fight Climate Change: Talk About It” has been viewed over 5 million times. She has a BSc in physics and astronomy from the University of Toronto and an MS and a PhD in atmospheric science from the University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign.