Out of Crazytown: Your Guide to Divorcing a Narcissist

What happens when choosing yourself costs you everything you once thought you had to hold onto?

In this episode of Out of Crazytown: Your Guide to Divorcing a Narcissist, Jackie sits down with therapist, speaker, and author Amy Watkins, whose new memoir, Performing Normal, explores the hidden cost of abandoning yourself to keep the peace, earn love, and maintain connection.

Amy shares her experience growing up as the scapegoat in an unhealthy family system where religion was weaponized, later finding herself in an abusive marriage, and eventually facing the devastating grief of losing relationships she deeply valued.

Together, Jackie and Amy explore the price of peace—what it can cost to finally stop participating in unhealthy dynamics, set boundaries, and choose yourself. They talk about the loneliness that often comes after leaving, why familiar patterns can feel like love, and how self-abandonment can quietly become a way of life.

But this conversation is also about what comes next: learning to trust yourself again, discovering who you are outside of survival mode, and realizing that healing may require you to stop performing and start living.

If you’ve ever wondered whether peace and joy are possible after losing people you love, this episode is a powerful reminder that your life does not end when you walk away. Sometimes, that is where it begins.

This episode is for educational purposes only and is not a substitute for legal, medical, or mental-health advice.

Amy's Instagram

Order Performing Normal

Amy's Linktree

Performing Normal on Amazon

What happens when you go through your own divorce and custody battle—and then become the kind of family law attorney you wish you’d had?

That’s part of what makes my guest, Hannah Hembree Bell, so refreshing. Hannah is the founder of Hembree Bell Law Firm in Texas, and she brings lived experience, practical advice, and plenty of Southern charm to the divorce process.

In this episode, Hannah answers some of the biggest questions people have when starting a divorce—from attorney’s fees, discovery, child support, and custody to getting your spouse out of the house, following court orders, prenups, and choosing the right attorney.

We also talk about Hannah’s mission to reimagine the divorce experience for women and the community she’s building through My Confident Divorce. And if you love her advice here, her Instagram is packed with more of it!

If you’re considering divorce, just getting started, or somewhere in the messy middle, this is a conversation you won’t want to miss.

Hannah's Website

Hannah's Podcast

Hannah's Instagram

This episode is for educational purposes only and is not intended as legal advice.

In this episode of Out of Crazytown: Your Guide to Divorcing a Narcissist, Jackie sits down with trauma therapist Jessica Dineen to talk about one of the hardest parts of healing after emotional abuse: learning to trust yourself again.

After gaslighting, post-separation abuse, or years of living in a high-conflict relationship, many survivors are left questioning their instincts, decisions, and even their own reality. Jessica explains why leaving doesn’t always feel like freedom, how trauma can keep the nervous system stuck in survival mode, and what can help rebuild self-trust.

They also explore EMDR, parts work, nervous system healing, and why recovery often begins when the focus shifts away from understanding the narcissist and back toward reconnecting with yourself.

OC Trauma Therapy Website

Jessica's Instagram

No Bad Parts - The Book

This podcast is for educational and informational purposes only and is not a substitute for legal, medical, or mental health advice.

What does it really mean to be the CEO of your own divorce?

In this episode, Jackie talks with Amy Polacko, divorce coach, award-winning journalist, domestic abuse survivor, co-author of FRAMED: Women in the Family Court Underworld, and host of the Girl, Wake Up! podcast.

Amy shares how her own high-conflict divorce led her to become an advocate for women and family-court reform, the mistakes she made along the way, and what she now helps her clients do differently.

They also discuss Amy’s article, inspired by Belle Burden’s memoir Strangers, which explores how wealth can complicate divorce, how financial dependence can create vulnerability, and why money does not always protect someone from coercion, control, or prolonged conflict.

You’ll hear practical insights on recognizing unhealthy patterns, becoming more financially aware, preparing strategically, and taking an active role in your own divorce without trying to manage everything alone.

Freedom Warrior Divorce Coaching - Amy Polacko

FRAMED: Women in the Family Court Underworld

Girl Wake Up! Podcast

Amy's article on Belle Burden's Amy's article on Belle Burden's Book: Strangers

Amy's Strong Savvy Women Support Group

This conversation is for educational purposes only and is not a substitute for legal, financial, medical, or mental-health advice.

Why is it so hard to leave a toxic relationship even when you know it's unhealthy?

And why does the confusion often continue long after it's over?

In this episode of Out of Crazytown, I'm joined by psychologist, author, and narcissistic abuse expert Dr. Kerry McAvoy to explore one of the most powerful concepts in abuse recovery: cognitive dissonance.

We discuss why intelligent, capable people become trapped in unhealthy relationships, how gaslighting and manipulation create profound self-doubt, and why survivors often feel torn between what they know to be true and what they desperately hope is true.

Together, we unpack the psychology behind narcissistic abuse, the mental fog that keeps so many people stuck, and the first steps toward rebuilding clarity, self-trust, and lasting freedom.

If you've ever wondered, "Why couldn't I just leave?" or "Why do I still question myself?" this conversation will help you understand that your experience wasn't a sign of weakness, it was the result of a very real psychological process.

• What cognitive dissonance is and why it keeps people stuck

Whether you're still in a toxic relationship, navigating the aftermath, or supporting someone who is, this episode offers insight, validation, and practical guidance for reclaiming your life.

Dr. McAvoy's Website

Break Free From Narcissistic Abuse-Podcast

Love You More-Book

Surviving To Thriving: A Six-Step Blueprint to Narcissistic Abuse Healing and Recovery

WINNING: Rewiring Your Brain and Reclaiming Your Life After Toxic Love

What is narcissistic abuse, really? And why is it so difficult to make sense of the behavior of a narcissist, especially during divorce?

In this episode, I sit down with licensed psychotherapist, speaker, and best-selling author Chelsey Brooke Cole to unpack the realities of narcissistic abuse and the lasting impact it can have on your identity, self-worth, and ability to trust yourself.

We discuss how a narcissist's need for control often escalates during divorce, the different types of narcissistic personalities, why survivors often blame themselves, and what it takes to rebuild confidence after years of manipulation, gaslighting, and emotional abuse. Chelsey also shares practical communication strategies for dealing with high-conflict personalities and offers guidance for protecting and supporting children when a narcissistic parent is involved.

In this episode, you'll learn:

Chelsey's Website

If Only I'd Known-Chelsey's Book

Restoring Resilience Podcast

WINNING-Jackie Miller's Book

In this episode, I sit down with Dana Skaggs, licensed psychological examiner and known as the Queen of Boundaries, to unpack why boundary dysfunction is often at the root of anxiety, burnout, and emotional exhaustion.

We talk about:

Why saying “no” can trigger panic

How narcissistic dynamics train you to over-function and keep the peace

The connection between trauma and weak or collapsing boundaries

Practical ways to set and defend boundaries during divorce

Dana also shares her personal experience navigating a toxic parent relationship and how learning to hold boundaries changed her life.

If you’re tired of being pulled in every direction and ready to reclaim your peace, this conversation will show you where to start.

Dana Skaggs Website

Phoenix & Flame Podcast

**DISCLAIMER:**  

THE INFORMATION PROVIDED IN THIS PODCAST IS FOR INFORMATIONAL PURPOSES ONLY AND SHOULD NOT BE CONSIDERED LEGAL ADVICE OR A SUBSTITUTE FOR THE GUIDANCE OF A LICENSED MENTAL HEALTH PROFESSIONAL. EACH INDIVIDUAL’S CIRCUMSTANCES ARE UNIQUE, AND ANYONE SEEKING LEGAL ADVICE SHOULD CONSULT A QUALIFIED ATTORNEY. IF YOU ARE IN NEED OF MENTAL HEALTH SUPPORT, PLEASE REACH OUT TO A LICENSED THERAPIST OR COUNSELOR.

High-conflict divorce isn’t just emotionally exhausting. It’s legally strategic.

In this episode, I sit down with seasoned family law attorney John Schorsch to unpack a hard truth: many people unintentionally damage their own case without realizing it.

We talk about the common ways parents sabotage themselves in custody battles, why overexplaining and reacting emotionally backfires, and what courts actually care about versus what clients think matters. We also dig into why labels like “narcissist” rarely help, how communication mistakes resurface later, and what “controlling the narrative” truly means in practice.

If you’re navigating a high-conflict ex, legal threats, or long custody battles, this episode will help you shift from reactive behavior to strategic decision-making.

Because in family court, winning isn’t loud.

It’s disciplined. And sometimes, the smartest move is saying less.

John Schorsch Website

**DISCLAIMER:**  

THE INFORMATION PROVIDED IN THIS PODCAST IS FOR INFORMATIONAL PURPOSES ONLY AND SHOULD NOT BE CONSIDERED LEGAL ADVICE OR A SUBSTITUTE FOR THE GUIDANCE OF A LICENSED MENTAL HEALTH PROFESSIONAL. EACH INDIVIDUAL’S CIRCUMSTANCES ARE UNIQUE, AND ANYONE SEEKING LEGAL ADVICE SHOULD CONSULT A QUALIFIED ATTORNEY. IF YOU ARE IN NEED OF MENTAL HEALTH SUPPORT, PLEASE REACH OUT TO A LICENSED THERAPIST OR COUNSELOR.

What does it take to truly win when you’re divorcing a narcissist? In this powerful episode of Out of Crazy Town, I sit down with Vicky Edwards—my longtime client and now dear friend—who went through one of the most intense divorce and custody battles I’ve witnessed. Vicky opens up about what really matters in family court, how to document everything, and the emotional toll of fighting someone who thrives on chaos. But more importantly, she shares how she reclaimed her peace, rebuilt her life, and found freedom on the other side of the madness. If you’re in the middle of your own high-conflict divorce, custody fight, or trying to break free from a toxic, narcissistic relationship… this episode is your guide.

✨ Topics We Cover:

What the court actually looks at in custody cases

📌 Subscribe for more real, raw conversations that help you navigate life after narcissistic abuse—and take your power back.

Jackie & Vicky Podcast

**DISCLAIMER:**  

THE INFORMATION PROVIDED IN THIS PODCAST IS FOR INFORMATIONAL PURPOSES ONLY AND SHOULD NOT BE CONSIDERED LEGAL ADVICE OR A SUBSTITUTE FOR THE GUIDANCE OF A LICENSED MENTAL HEALTH PROFESSIONAL. EACH INDIVIDUAL’S CIRCUMSTANCES ARE UNIQUE, AND ANYONE SEEKING LEGAL ADVICE SHOULD CONSULT A QUALIFIED ATTORNEY. IF YOU ARE IN NEED OF MENTAL HEALTH SUPPORT, PLEASE REACH OUT TO A LICENSED THERAPIST OR COUNSELOR.

In this episode, Jackie talks with Gianni Avalos, better known online as The Single Mom Attorney—a fierce Texas family law advocate who’s changing how single mothers experience the legal system.

Gianni’s journey from studying for the bar exam with a newborn to running a powerhouse firm built on compassion and advocacy is nothing short of inspiring. Together, Jackie and Gianni dive into what really happens inside the family court system, how mothers can protect themselves through knowledge, and why prioritizing a child’s well-being is the ultimate win in high-conflict co-parenting.

This episode is for every woman standing her ground in the courtroom and in life—proof that resilience and truth are stronger than intimidation and fear.

Avalos Family Trial Attorneys Website

TikTok Single Mom Attorney

Instagram Single Mom Attorney

YouTube Single Mom Attorney

**DISCLAIMER:**  

THE INFORMATION PROVIDED IN THIS PODCAST IS FOR INFORMATIONAL PURPOSES ONLY AND SHOULD NOT BE CONSIDERED LEGAL ADVICE OR A SUBSTITUTE FOR THE GUIDANCE OF A LICENSED MENTAL HEALTH PROFESSIONAL. EACH INDIVIDUAL’S CIRCUMSTANCES ARE UNIQUE, AND ANYONE SEEKING LEGAL ADVICE SHOULD CONSULT A QUALIFIED ATTORNEY. IF YOU ARE IN NEED OF MENTAL HEALTH SUPPORT, PLEASE REACH OUT TO A LICENSED THERAPIST OR COUNSELOR.