【聊了什么 The What】

当AI从工具变成武器，人类该如何自处？

2026年初，Claude被白宫封杀。这成了AI的公共形象的转折点。这件事让我们意识到，AI可能已经悄悄完成了它的成年礼：它不再只是一个技术话题，而是变成了一个政治问题、一个选边站的时刻。

在这期串台节目里，主播一闻和《美轮美换》的主播小华、硅谷投资人磊一起聊了：AI是如何从一个技术问题，变成最烫手的政治问题的。红线到底该由谁来画？当 Super PAC 开始用 AI 的钱打中期选举、当数据中心让红州蓝州的电价一起上涨、当美国公众对 AI 的反感度已经跌穿地板——AI 的“核弹时刻“到底是技术奇点，还是政治奇点？我们也顺便聊了聊中美在这件事上正在经历的两种截然不同的现实。

本期播客录制于4月初。

When AI Goes from Tool to Weapon, how do we find our footing?

In early 2026, Claude was blacklisted by the White House. It became a turning point for AI's public image — and a moment that made us realize AI may have quietly come of age. It's no longer just a tech topic; it's a political issue, a moment that demands you pick a side.

In this crossover episode, host Yiwen sits down with Xiaohua, host of The American Roulette, and Lei, a Silicon Valley investor, to unpack how AI went from a technical question to the most politically charged issue of the moment. Who gets to draw the red lines? When Super PACs start spending AI money to swing the midterms, when data centers push up electricity bills across red and blue states alike, when American public sentiment toward AI has fallen through the floor — is AI's "nuclear moment" a technological singularity, or a political one? We also get into the two starkly different realities the U.S. and China are living through on this front.

Recorded in early April.

【时间轴 The When】

03:06 Anthropic与五角大楼撕破脸：AI政治化的转折点

04:48 两条红线：大规模监控与全自主武器

07:41 立法真空下，商业公司被迫当仲裁者

10:33 硅谷政治转向与员工抗议的复活

14:33 Anthropic的商业账本：合同不如公众形象值钱

17:08 Dario vs Sam Altman：同一天两种结局

24:05 Super PAC对AI监管的冲突

30:30 AI好感度比ICE还低

32:35 中美两种现实：小龙虾与"温水煮青蛙"

38:19 数据中心、电价与NIMBY：AI恐惧的具象化

43:21 如果AI创造所有GDP，普通人还有筹码吗？

50:30 Bernie Sanders的Claude视频与左派的AI叙事

53:43 Token出海：中美AI的两种工业体系

03:06 Anthropic vs. the Pentagon: The Turning Point of AI's Politicization

04:48 Two Red Lines: Mass Surveillance and Fully Autonomous Weapons

07:41 In a Legislative Vacuum, Companies Are Forced to Arbitrate

10:33 Silicon Valley's Political Shift and the Return of Employee Protest

14:33 Anthropic's Business Math: Public Image Beats Government Contracts

17:08 Dario vs. Sam Altman: Two Outcomes on the Same Day

24:05 Super PACs Go to War Over AI Regulation

30:30 AI Polls Worse Than ICE

32:35 Two Realities: OpenClaw and the Slow-Boiling Frog

38:19 Data Centers, Electric Bills, and NIMBY: Where AI Fear Gets Real

43:21 If AI Creates All the GDP, What Leverage Do Ordinary People Have?

50:30 Bernie Sanders' Claude Video and the Left's AI Narrative

53:43 Tokens Go Global: Two Industrial Systems for AI

【我们是谁 Who We Are】

新新人类是一档由几个与互联网一起长大的新生代科技记者主持的播客，致力于站在中美交汇点上，解读全球科技潮流与人文的交织。

【支持我们 Please Support Us】

如果喜欢这期节目并愿意支持我们：

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【聊了什么 The What】

在这期节目中，我们邀请到了新生代作家 Yi-Ling Liu（刘亦灵），深入聊聊她刚刚出版的英文新书 The Wall Dancers: Searching for Freedom and Connection on the Chinese Internet。

亦灵是我们的老朋友，也是一位长期关注中国网络、文化及科技领域的自由撰稿人，曾为《纽约客》等媒体撰写相关文章。这本书对我们来说尤为特别——它是近年来为数不多以“人”为核心，而非聚焦于商业或地缘政治的、关于中国的英文非虚构作品。

书名中的核心隐喻是“戴着镣铐跳舞“，这是一个任何在中国互联网上有过亲身体验的人都不陌生的意象。西方媒体对中国互联网的叙事，往往侧重于其封闭性与禁锢感，而刘亦灵则选择透过个体的选择，去呈现中国光怪陆离互联网社群独特的韧性，戏剧张力，和无处不在的隐秘抵抗。

在中国特有的网络与科技环境中，她的观察跟随着几位极具代表性的角色：从曾经的微博审查员刘力朋、女权活动家吕频，到成都的说唱歌手Kafe.Hu、科幻作家陈楸帆，以及从警察转型为同志社交软件 CEO 的马保力。通过这些人的故事，串联起过去三十年中国互联网的激荡与变迁。

在香港出生长大，美国接受教育的亦灵在观察中国时有一种疏离而又颗粒度极高的写作风格。她到底怎么选中了这些主人公，又怎样完成了这部历时数年的大部头？在这本独特的大部头发布之际，中外互联网的变迁又让她有了哪些最新的反思？本期节目因为种种原因我们将只在墙外发布。这也是亦灵首次用中文接受采访——主播安蕤和马修将作为读者，同行和朋友进行发问。

In this episode, we are joined writer Yi-Ling Liu to talk in depth about her newly published English-language book, The Wall Dancers: Searching for Freedom and Connection on the Chinese Internet.

Yi-Ling is an old friend of the show and a longtime freelance writer focused on China’s internet, culture, and technology, with work published in outlets including The New Yorker. This book feels especially important to us because it is one of the few recent English-language nonfiction books about China that places people, rather than business or geopolitics, at its center.

The book’s central metaphor is “dancing in shackles,” an image that is immediately familiar to anyone with lived experience of the Chinese internet. Western media narratives about China’s online world often emphasize its closedness and sense of constraint. Yi-Ling, by contrast, chooses to focus on individual choices, revealing the resilience, dramatic tension, and ever-present undercurrents of quiet resistance within China’s strange and dazzling online communities.

Within China’s highly specific internet and technological environment, her reporting follows several deeply representative figures: former Weibo censor Liu Lipeng, feminist activist Lü Pin, Chengdu rapper Kafe.Hu, science fiction writer Chen Qiufan, and Ma Baoli, a former police officer who later became the CEO of a gay social networking app. Through their stories, she traces the turbulence and transformation of China’s internet over the past three decades.

Born and raised in Hong Kong and educated in the United States, Yi-Ling brings to her observations on China a writing style that is both detached and richly textured. How did she choose these protagonists, and how did she complete this sweeping work over the course of several years? Now that this distinctive book has been published, how have recent changes in both Chinese and global internet culture shaped her latest reflections? For various reasons, this episode will only be released outside the Great Firewall. It is also Yi-Ling’s first time being interviewed in Chinese. Hosts Anrui and Matthew join the conversation as readers, peers, and friends.

【时间轴 The When】

【我们是谁 Who We Are】

新新人类是一档由几个与互联网一起长大的新生代科技记者主持的播客，致力于站在中美交汇点上，解读全球科技潮流与人文的交织。

【支持我们 Please Support Us】

如果喜欢这期节目并愿意支持我们：

If you like our show and want to support us, please consider the following:

【聊了什么 The What】

洋抖难民入住小红书一年之后，美国年轻人又整上新活，想直接变成中国人了？从喝热水、学中文，到穿唐装、追中国短剧，越来越多美国年轻人开始说自己正处在 “a very Chinese time of my life”。这个被称作Chinamaxxing的网络趋势，是文化认同的转变，还是一场抽象时代的玩梗狂欢？在这期播客里，我们拆解了这个趋势的来源和传播，以及它背后的反叛情绪。

当中国从被高度符号化的他者，变成好玩、无厘头、被重新想象的文化标签，这种变化意味着什么？作为中国人，看着大家突然想成为我们，又是一种怎样复杂的感受？和我们一起，聊聊互联网时代的中国高光时刻。

A year after the so-called “TikTok refugees” moved into Xiaohongshu, American internet culture has found a new twist — this time, young Americans want to “become Chinese.” From drinking hot water and learning Mandarin on Duolingo to wearing the Adidas Tang jackets and binge-watching Chinese dramas, more and more are saying they are living through “a very Chinese time of my life.” This online trend, known as Chinamaxxing, raises a question: is this a genuine shift in cultural identity, or just another wave of absurdist internet play? In this episode, we unpack where the trend came from, how it spread, and the rebellious energy behind it.

As China shifts from a highly politicized “other” to something playful, ironic, and newly reimagined online, what does that change really mean? And as Chinese people, how do we feel watching others suddenly want to “become us”? Proud, annoyed, amused — or something more complicated? Join us as we explore this internet-age Chinese high-glow moment.

【时间轴 The When】

【我们是谁 Who We Are】

新新人类是一档由几个与互联网一起长大的新生代科技记者主持的播客，致力于站在中美交汇点上，解读全球科技潮流与人文的交织。

【拓展链接 The Links】

WIRED: Why Everyone Is Suddenly in a ‘Very Chinese Time’ in Their Lives

【支持我们 Please Support Us】

如果喜欢这期节目并愿意支持我们：

If you like our show and want to support us, please consider the following:

【重要的事放在前面说】

2026 年，「新新人类」希望能和大家展开更多深度交流。除了播客，我们也在筹备一些线上或者线下的活动。

如果你感兴趣参与我们的活动，请填写这份问卷留下您的邮箱，方便我们活动组织起来之后联系到您！

【聊了什么 The What】

下滑，下滑，咦，这个视频有点意思，但好像又有点不对头，难道是AI？？

随着人工智能生成视频技术的日新月异，新新人类的主播们每天都浪费了大量刷手机的时间用于分辨某个视频是不是AI生成的。不得不承认，从几年前生成的六根指头的手和鬼画符一般的文字，到现在以假乱真的后院蹦床兔兔和偷快递监控，AI视频的质量在不断提升，我们对它的认识也不得不更新换代。

这一期节目我们请来了Coco来做嘉宾，曾经在谷歌工作的她现在是AI视频生成平台和社区OpenArt的CEO。我们既聊了AI技术本身的飞速发展，也聊了作为社交媒体用户的我们如何看待当下遍布全网的AI视频。Coco说，她觉得AI视频生成的技术会成为让任何人都可以当网红的平权工具，那如果拍视频和剪视频的技术不再是刚需，什么才会是下一代的头部网红的核心竞争力？

Scroll, scroll…huh, this video is kind of interesting, but something feels off…Is it AI??

【时间轴 The When】

【我们是谁 Who We Are】

新新人类是一档由几个与互联网一起长大的新生代科技记者主持的播客，致力于站在中美交汇点上，解读全球科技潮流与人文的交织。

【拓展链接 The Links】

【支持我们 Please Support Us】

如果喜欢这期节目并愿意支持我们：

【聊了什么 The What】

从扫腿舞到“宝宝上车啦”，从《万物生》到《溯》，最近只要刷过短视频，基本都被这几首团播神曲洗脑过。和传统的单人直播不一样，团播把帅哥美女放在同一个画面里，一起跳舞、互动、PK，更像一档随时在直播的偶像综艺。

从这期节目开始，我们想要和大家多聊聊我们三个共同关注到的互联网现象。第一次尝试，就从团播为什么这么火聊起。主播怎么被训练和安排，观众为什么愿意持续打赏，平台规则又在其中起到了什么作用？我们也会聊到团播和日韩偶像选秀之间的相似之处，以及“养成系”粉丝关系在直播间里是怎么被放大的。通过团播，或许我们能看到的是，在经济下行、注意力经济当道的大背景下，亲密感和陪伴感是否被赋予了新的意义。

From leg-sweep dances to catchphrases like “Baby, hop on,” and from All Things Grow to Backflow (N.B. all of these are too Chinese to translate), anyone who’s scrolled through short-video apps lately has likely had these group-streaming hits stuck in their head. Unlike traditional solo livestreams, group streaming features multiple attractive hosts in the same frame—dancing together, interacting, and competing in real-time—feeling more like an idol variety show that never goes off air.

【时间轴 The When】

【我们是谁 Who We Are】

新新人类是一档由几个与互联网一起长大的新生代科技记者主持的播客，致力于站在中美交汇点上，解读全球科技潮流与人文的交织。

【拓展链接 The Links】

【支持我们 Please Support Us】

如果喜欢这期节目并愿意支持我们：

【聊了什么 The What】

大家好，我是从火人节回来的一闻，我已经蜕变了（不是。

从黑石城回来的那一天，我在新新人类群聊里说：“朋友们，不幸的消息：这大概是我这辈子过的最棒的一周。”

在诸多主流叙事中，每年八月底在美国内华达州举办的火人节（Burning Man），就是一场放任自由主义（Libertarianism）的精英狂欢。我过去也因为它和硅谷之间的精神与文化纽带，对它有过先入为主的成见。而如果你告诉去年的我，我会在沙漠里坚持八天不洗澡，我一定不会相信。但事实上，在这一周里，我放声痛哭过，也开怀大笑过。我在燃烧的熊熊烈火中，看到了让灵魂为之颤栗的景象。在狂风暴雨之间，我也感受到了人与人之间最简单、真诚和美好的联系。这一切，都彻底改变了我对火人节的印象。

但在我们聊黑石城的魔幻与灵性的同时，我们也不可避免的要提到这场起源于嬉皮士精神的活动在逐渐主流化、现代化的过程中所经历的变化。在这期播客中，我们探讨了资本主义逻辑之下“假期”的概念，与建立乌托邦所需要的经济成本。安蕤也分享了她所经历的一次位于黑山的生活实验，引发了我们对于社群建构的探讨。为什么这些精神实验总有一个截止日期？在控制变量环境下，人与人之间的善意，又是否能被带回现实世界？

Hi everyone, this is Yiwen reporting back from Burning Man.

The day I returned from Black Rock City, I wrote in our Pixel Perfect group chat: “Friends, I regret to report that this may actually be the best week of my life.” In mainstream narratives, Burning Man — held every late August in Nevada’s desert — is often seen as an elitist playground for libertarianists. I used to think the same, especially because of its deep cultural and spiritual ties with Silicon Valley. And if you had told me last year that I’d spend eight days in the desert without showering, I would never have believed you. Yet over that week, I cried my eyes out, laughed until my stomach hurt, and stood before burning flames that made my soul tremble. In the middle of storms and rain, I also felt the most simple, genuine, and beautiful forms of human connection. All of this completely changed my view of Burning Man.

But alongside the magic and spirituality of Black Rock City, we can’t avoid talking about how this countercultural gathering — rooted in hippie ideals — has evolved as it’s become more mainstream and modernized. In this episode, we explore the idea of “vacation” under capitalism and the economic cost of creating utopias. Anrui also shares her experience living in a temporary community during Zuzalu, which sparked our discussion on intentional community building. Why do these social experiments always have an expiration date? And in a controlled environment, can the kindness people show each other actually be carried back into the real world?

【时间轴 The When】

【我们是谁 Who We Are】

新新人类是一档由几个与互联网一起长大的新生代科技记者主持的播客，致力于站在中美交汇点上，解读全球科技潮流与人文的交织。

【支持我们 Please Support Us】

如果喜欢这期节目并愿意支持我们：

If you like our show and want to support us, please consider the following:

【聊了什么 The What】

他是 1997 年出生的硅谷新贵，28 岁就坐上了 Meta 首席 AI 官的位置。Alexandr Wang 从 MIT 辍学创业，到打造独角兽 Scale AI，一路高歌猛进。但相比履历，他的性格更耐人寻味：既是奥赛极客，又是派对常客；他不仅在硅谷的人脉网络中游刃有余，还在更为传统、精英的华盛顿为公司争取来了国防合同。同时，他也提出了争议极大的MEI（能力、卓越、智慧）招聘原则——这究竟是出于真心，还是精心的权力游戏？

本期，我们请到了Scale AI早期员工小蒋，透过第一手经历，聊聊这位“机会主义者”如何在极客与政客之间切换，在硅谷风口中找到属于自己的位置。

更正：节目中提到Meta Superintelligence Labs更名为TBD Lab，根据最新报道，TBD Lab是Meta Superintelligence Labs的一个部门

He is a rising star of Silicon Valley, born in 1997 and already serving as Meta’s Chief AI Officer at just 28. From dropping out of MIT to founding the unicorn Scale AI, Alexandr Wang’s ascent has been nothing short of meteoric. But beyond the dazzling résumé, his personality is far more intriguing: both an Olympiad geek and a party regular; equally adept at navigating Silicon Valley’s social networks and lobbying the more traditional, elite circles of Washington to secure defense contracts. He also introduced the highly controversial MEI (Merit, Excellence, Intelligence) hiring principle—was this a genuine belief, or a calculated power play?

In this episode, we’re joined by Xiao Jiang, an early employee of Scale AI, who shares first-hand stories about how this “opportunist” moves fluidly between geeks and politicians, carving out his place at the very heart of Silicon Valley’s AI boom.

Correction: The program mentioned that Meta Superintelligence Labs was renamed to TBD Lab. According to the latest reports, TBD Lab is a division of Meta Superintelligence Labs.

【购票链接 The Link】

【时间轴 The When】

【我们是谁 Who We Are】

新新人类是一档由几个与互联网一起长大的新生代科技记者主持的播客，致力于站在中美交汇点上，解读全球科技潮流与人文的交织。

【拓展链接 The Links】

【支持我们 Please Support Us】

如果喜欢这期节目并愿意支持我们：

If you like our show and want to support us, please consider the following:

【聊了什么The What】

当你的Twitter feed成精，会拍出一部怎样的电影？答案就是HBO的新电影《Mountainhead》。

本期节目，我们和疲惫娇娃和美轮美换共同畅聊这部《继承之战》导演的最新力作。雪山豪宅里的四个科技巨头，一边俯瞰着因自家AI而陷入动荡的世界，一边上演着堪比现实硅谷大佬群聊的扯皮与交锋。为什么说这部电影像是“All-in Podcast”成了精？四个主角如何分别对应现实中的硅谷大佬们？当硅谷tech bro提起“有效加速主义”（E/acc）、创始人主权（Founder Sovereignty）与“大教堂”（The Cathedral）黑话时，他们到底在说什么？改变世界的宏愿如何一步步成为“想当皇帝”的委婉表达？如何用第一性原理重新发明公交车？

What kind of movie would your Twitter feed make if it came to life?

In this episode, we team up with our friends at 疲惫娇娃CyberPink and 美轮美换 American Roulette to dive into the latest work by the director of Succession. Set in a luxurious alpine mansion, the film follows four tech moguls as they gaze down at a world spiraling into chaos—thanks to their own AI creations—while engaging in arguments and power plays that feel eerily reminiscent of a real-life Silicon Valley group chat. Why does this film feel like the All-In Podcast personified? Which of the four characters map onto real-world tech titans? And when these Silicon Valley tech bros throw around buzzwords like "Effective Accelerationism (E/acc)," "Founder Sovereignty," and "The Cathedral"—what are they really talking about? How do lofty ambitions to "change the world" morph into thinly veiled power grabs? And what does it mean to reinvent public transportation from first principles?

【时间轴 The When】

【拓展链接 The Links】

【我们是谁 Who We Are】

新新人类是一档由几个与互联网一起长大的新生代科技记者主持的播客，致力于站在中美交汇点上，解读全球科技潮流与人文的交织。

【支持我们 Please Support Us】

如果喜欢这期节目并愿意支持我们：

If you like our show and want to support us, please consider the following:

【聊了什么 The What】

在这期节目中，新新人类探讨了硅谷文化的右转现象，重点关注了一个显著征兆："恶德信号"。

如果说 Virtue Signaling 是将"政治正确"公开展示，并在硅谷的右转浪潮中遭到反噬，那么 Vice Signaling ——恶德信号—— 则是高举"我不善良，但真实"的旗帜。在加速主义笼罩下的硅谷，"理性崇拜"、恶德展示和"赛博雄性"已成为主流文化。节目通过分析特朗普、马斯克、Mark Zuckerberg 的 bad-boy makeover，Bryan Johnson刻意营造的"吸血鬼"式的biohacking，以及基因编辑狂人贺建奎在X平台的表演，深入解读了当代硅谷的时代情绪。另外和大家说一句：这期节目是六月份录制的，很多事件都经历了变化，这些变化也在默默证实这期节目当中我们讨论到的"恶德信号"的现象。

In this episode, Pixel Perfect discusses Silicon Valley's rightward cultural shift, focusing on a notable phenomenon: "vice signaling."

While virtue signaling is about publicly displaying "political correctness" - which has faced backlash amid Silicon Valley's rightward wave - vice signaling raises the banner of "I'm not virtuous, but I'm authentic." Under the shadow of effective accelerationism (e/acc), Silicon Valley's mainstream culture has become dominated by rationality worship, vice signaling, and cyber masculinity. The show provides an in-depth analysis of the contemporary Silicon Valley zeitgeist through examining Trump, Musk, and Mark Zuckerberg's bad-boy makeover, Bryan Johnson's deliberately cultivated "vampire-like" biohacking, and gene-editing maverick He Jiankui's performances on X platform.

【时间轴 The When】

00:02:39 主播抛出 Vice Signaling 概念

00:19:47 Mark Zuckerberg：从书呆子程序员到金链子的 180° 转弯

00:22:08 Bryan Johnson：吸血鬼式长生实验与 “Don’t Die” 哲学

00:28:14 雄性文化 & 贺建奎：当疯狂科学家遇上社媒表演，贺建奎 X 自导 “反派叙事”

00:50:02 Peter Thiel: Vice Signaling 投资教父现身

01:09:46 旧金山那些充满黑话的广告牌：恶德展示的平台、只跟 AI 圈内人说话

01:14:25 有效加速主义的乌托邦

00:02:39 Hosts introduce the concept of Vice Signaling

00:19:47 Mark Zuckerberg: A 180° turn from nerdy programmer to gold chain wearer

00:22:08 Bryan Johnson: Vampire-like longevity experiments and the "Don't Die" philosophy

00:28:14 Masculinity Culture & He Jiankui: When mad scientists meet social media performance, He Jiankui's self-directed "villain narrative"

00:50:02 Peter Thiel: The godfather of Vice Signaling appears

01:09:46 San Francisco's cryptic billboards: A platform for displaying vices, speaking only to AI insiders

01:14:25 The utopia of effective accelerationism

【我们是谁 Who We Are】

新新人类是一档由几个与互联网一起长大的新生代科技记者主持的播客，致力于站在中美交汇点上，解读全球科技潮流与人文的交织。

【拓展链接 The Links】

Meet Cathy Tie, Bride of “China’s Frankenstein”: The creator of CRISPR babies is flirting again with infamy, this time through a mysterious alliance with an Internet-savvy entrepreneur.

The Wink from Tech Billboards: From Elizabeth Holmes's haunting return to AI-jargon and vice-signaling, Bay Area billboards have become a coded language for a tech world in flux

Genes for Memes: He Jiankui and gene editing fantasies

【支持我们 Please Support Us】

【聊了什么 The What】

上一期聊中国工厂背后的全球化逆流打开了几位主播的话匣子，身处在动荡、多变的当下，我们越来越多看到同龄的新新人类开始陷入怀旧的情绪：从小时候观看奥运会和世博会的懵懂的激动，到互联网如何打开我们探索世界的大门，那个时代好像有一种开放、灿烂、向全世界问好的基调。朴树在千禧年写下“穿新衣吧，剪新发型呀。轻松一下，Windows 98”，却在2017年把这首歌改写成“时光不再，已不是我们的世界。它早已物是人非，让人崩溃意冷心灰”，去看看这两首歌的评论区，你就会看到大家都能感受到同样的集体情绪。

【时间轴 The When】

【我们是谁 Who We Are】

新新人类是一档由几个与互联网一起长大的新生代科技记者主持的播客，致力于站在中美交汇点上，解读全球科技潮流与人文的交织。

【拓展链接 The Links】

【支持我们 Please Support Us】

如果喜欢这期节目并愿意支持我们：