The Human Intimacy Podcast

In this thought-provoking episode of the Human Intimacy Podcast, Dr. Kevin Skinner and MaryAnn Michaelis explore the powerful impact of the words we use in our relationships. From misunderstood terms like gaslighting, addiction, and defensiveness to therapeutic concepts like parts work, triggers, and intimacy, they unpack what these words really mean and why clarity matters.

Drawing from decades of clinical experience, Dr. Skinner explains how language—used consciously or not—can either create emotional safety or reinforce shame and confusion. MaryAnn adds vivid examples of how common phrases and labels can trigger strong emotional responses, especially when they’ve been used harmfully in the past.

The episode invites listeners to be more intentional about their communication—pausing to clarify meanings, owning emotional experiences instead of blaming others, and understanding the deeper messages behind the words. Listeners will come away with a richer appreciation of how language shapes healing, self-awareness, and human connection.

Richard C. Schwartz, Internal Family Systems Therapy — foundational model for understanding "parts" of the self

Brené Brown — referenced for her work on shame and how addiction is often about numbing and disconnection

Key books: The Gifts of Imperfection, Daring Greatly

Malcolm Gladwell, Blink: The Power of Thinking Without Thinking — explains unconscious decision-making and rapid intuitive responses

Gavin de Becker, The Gift of Fear — explores how intuition and implicit memory keep us safe

Joseph LeDoux — neuroscientist referenced for research on the brain’s fear pathways and emotional processing (notably how we feel before we think)

Dr. Kevin Skinner

Treating Trauma from Sexual Betrayal

PTSD Assessment for Betrayed Partners

Denial and Blame Scale (early scale now recognized as assessing gaslighting behaviors)

Seven Types of Intimacy course — mentioned in the discussion on redefining intimacy beyond sex

Podcast Episode: Making Love and Other Non-Sexual Activities (December 2024 / January 2025)

Grieving What Was—and What Wasn't: Finding Meaning in Loss

In this deeply moving episode of the Human Intimacy Podcast, Dr. Kevin Skinner and MaryAnn Michaelis explore the often-unspoken grief that arises not only from death but from lost experiences, missed relationships, betrayal, and the life we thought we would have. Together, they discuss how grief shows up in unexpected ways—through sadness, anxiety, depression, and even numbness—and why it's essential to give it language, space, and presence.

From betrayal trauma to the ache of unmet childhood needs, Dr. Skinner and MaryAnn reflect on how grief is not something we simply get over, but something that transforms us. They invite listeners to “buffalo up,” facing the emotional storms head-on to lessen their long-term impact and discover the healing that can come from being seen, supported, and present with our pain.

This episode affirms that grief is both individual and shared—and through empathy, ritual, and support, we can move from suffering to strength. Whether you're mourning a loved one, a lost relationship, or simply the life you didn’t get to live, this conversation offers tools, language, and hope.

Dr. Edith Eger – The Choice

Grieving for what happened and for what didn’t happen.

Dr. Elizabeth Kübler-Ross – Five Stages of Grief

Originally developed for death-related grief, but elements show up in all forms of loss.

"Buffalo vs. Cow" Metaphor – Facing emotional storms head-on instead of running from them to shorten their impact.

Ted Wiard – Burbles of Emotion (from grief training at Willow House)

Describes grief as emotional bubbles that unexpectedly surface.

Grief Rituals – Writing, symbolic goodbyes, or creating new experiences to process loss.

Suicide & Crisis Lifeline (U.S.): 📞 988 – For anyone in crisis or supporting someone in distress.

We grieve both what happened and what never did—and both types deserve space.

Grief often shows up disguised as anxiety, depression, or numbness.

Healing begins by naming our losses and making space to feel them.

Support from others—through presence, not solutions—is essential in the grieving process.

Transformation and post-traumatic growth are possible. Grief changes us, and often, it refines us.

Self-Leadership:

The Roadmap to Healing, Hope, and Deeper Intimacy

In this episode of the Human Intimacy Podcast, Dr. Kevin Skinner and MaryAnn Michaelis reflect on Marianne’s powerful experience presenting at the ITAP (International Institute of Trauma and Addiction Professionals) Conference, where she introduced a healing-intensive approach combining Frazier’s Dissociative Table and Accelerated Resolution Therapy (ART). Together, they explore the theme of self-leadership—what it means to take ownership of your healing journey and to navigate pain, trauma, and emotional disconnection with intention and insight.

They dive into the importance of understanding our internal parts, drawing from Richard Schwartz’s Internal Family Systems (IFS) and his concept of “No Bad Parts.” Listeners are guided to reflect on their emotional patterns, discover the unmet needs behind their actions, and learn how to respond to their emotions with compassion rather than reactivity. The conversation emphasizes that true self-leadership is not about perfection, but about authenticity, congruency, and ultimately, the ability to show up more fully in our most important relationships.

Whether you're healing from betrayal, navigating relationship challenges, or seeking personal growth, this episode offers practical insights and encouragement to help you reconnect with yourself and others.

Key Topics Covered:

The role of self-leadership in trauma recovery and personal transformation

Using the Dissociative Table and ART in a one-day intensive model

Internal Family Systems and understanding our emotional “parts”

The difference between insight and action in behavior change

How trauma can lead to emotional reactivity and how to regulate it

Why connection is the ultimate goal of healing and self-mastery

The importance of giving yourself permission to pause and prioritize healing

Resources Mentioned:

Frazier’s Dissociative Table Technique – A tool to identify internal parts and unresolved trauma

Accelerated Resolution Therapy (ART) – A trauma-informed approach for rapid emotional processing

Internal Family Systems (IFS) by Richard Schwartz

Book: No Bad Parts by Dr. Richard C. Schwartz

Seven Habits of Highly Effective People by Stephen R. Covey (reference to “Sharpen the Saw”)

Loving-Kindness Meditation – A mindfulness practice focused on compassion for self and others

Emotionally Focused Therapy (EFT) – Insights on unmet needs and attachment ruptures in couples

Quote from C.S. Lewis – “There are no ordinary people. You have never talked to a mere mortal.”

Listener Takeaway:

The Lens of Betrayal:

Relearning How to See the Ones We Love

In this thought-provoking episode of the Human Intimacy Podcast, Dr. Kevin Skinner and MaryAnn Michaelis explore how betrayal changes the way we see the people closest to us. When trust is broken, our brain naturally shifts into self-protection, filtering our perception through trauma, pain, and fear. Dr. Skinner shares personal stories and clinical insights to illuminate how resentment, grief, and disconnection can cloud our ability to see others clearly. Together, they discuss how healing requires slowing down, grounding the nervous system, and re-engaging the prefrontal cortex to ask deeper questions: Who is this person now? Am I ready to see them anew? The episode encourages listeners to examine their own emotional filters, make space for grief, and learn to see others—and themselves—with compassion, clarity, and maturity. This conversation offers hope, not through rushed reconnection, but through the power of perception and presence.

Reflective Questions to Shift Perspective

“Who is my enemy?”

“What am I fighting for?”

“Am I ready to see this person in a new way?”

Neuroscience and Trauma Concepts

The amygdala’s role in trauma responses (fight, flight, freeze)

The prefrontal cortex as the seat of reflective, relational thinking

Trauma-informed perception: seeing through past filters

Therapeutic Tools and Concepts

Reflective Listening – Taught in the free course: Seven Essential Communication Skills

Bids for Connection – From Dr. John Gottman’s research

Back Pocket Technique – Practicing presence by temporarily setting aside your own perspective

Literary Inspiration

C.S. Lewis, The Weight of Glory:

“There are no ordinary people. You have never talked to a mere mortal…”

Related Upcoming Topics

When Your Partner Won’t Open Up

The Fear of Being Seen

Consent, Communication, and the Core of Intimacy

They examine how past trauma, cultural expectations, sexual addiction, and desire discrepancies can distort intimacy, leaving one or both partners feeling used, unsafe, or unheard. With honesty and compassion, Dr. Skinner and MaryAnn emphasize the importance of open communication, healthy boundaries, and attunement between partners.

Listeners are encouraged to assess their current sexual dynamics, initiate mature conversations about their needs, and repair harm where consent may have been ignored or unclear. Whether you're in recovery from betrayal or simply looking to build deeper intimacy, this episode offers a vital framework for healing and connection.

Resources Mentioned in the Episode:

"Talking to Strangers" by Malcolm Gladwell – Particularly the chapter on consent, alcohol, and impaired decision-making

"Tea and Consent" YouTube video (British version) – A visual and accessible explanation of consent

Research on Sexual Desire Discrepancies – Highlighting how mismatched sexual desire impacts relational satisfaction

Brett Williams' "Same Team" Framework – A tool for shifting relational conflict toward shared problem-solving

Concepts from betrayal trauma therapy – Including the importance of informed, voluntary participation and boundaries during sexual reintegration

Healing Body Image and Self-Perception After Betrayal

In this episode of the Human Intimacy Podcast, Dr. Kevin Skinner and MaryAnn Michaelis explore how early life experiences, cultural messaging, and exposure to media and pornography shape self-perception and body image—especially after betrayal. They discuss why betrayed partners often feel "not enough," and they share research shows that pornography harms both users’ and partners’ body image.  

The episode offers practical strategies for healing, including gratitude for the body’s functionality, redefining beauty beyond appearance, and reconnecting with the joyful, authentic self. This conversation invites listeners to free themselves from harmful comparisons and embrace their inherent worth.

Resources Discussed:

- Study: The Association of Pornography Use and Body Image Among Heterosexual and Sexual Minority Men (Archives of Sexual Behavior).

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Did you miss the First Annual Human Intimacy Conference? Session replays are now available. Click here and use this coupon code to get a 20% discount (Conf20). Watch Dr. Kevin Skinner, MaryAnn Michaelis, Karen Strange, Michelle Mays, Geoff Steurer, and many others as they discuss the healing and recovery process.

The Bravery of Letting Go:

A Deep Dive into Self-Forgiveness and Healing

The conversation addresses the role of shame as a perceived protector, the internal dialogue that keeps us stuck, and how self-forgiveness isn’t just an emotional release, but a physiological and relational turning point. Drawing from Internal Family Systems (IFS), systems theory, trauma research, and recovery work, Dr. Skinner and MaryAnn examine how embracing self-forgiveness leads to renewed self-trust, authentic change, and deeper connection.

Listeners are also introduced to somatic and spiritual tools for letting go of self-judgment and are encouraged to explore their capacity to receive love—not just give it. The message is clear: your healing matters, and you are worthy of moving forward.

Resources Mentioned:

- Internal Family Systems (IFS) – A therapeutic model exploring parts of the self, especially protective parts tied to shame and fear.  

The Shame We Carry:

Giving Voice to the Unspoken

Drawing from decades of clinical experience, research, and personal insights, they emphasize that healing begins when we give voice to the unspoken. Whether it’s through journaling, therapy, or a safe disclosure process, naming our shame and speaking our secrets out loud—especially in safe spaces—can free us from isolation, enhance emotional and physical health, and open the door to deeper connection.

Listeners will learn how shame manifests in the body, how to recognize its signals, and why expressive writing and safe vulnerability are powerful healing tools. The conversation also highlights how shame affects both betrayed partners and those who have acted out, and how couples can begin to talk honestly—when the timing and safety are right.

Key Topics Covered:

Resources & References Mentioned:

Takeaway Message: 

Shame thrives in silence. Healing begins when we find the courage and the safety to speak. Whether through writing, therapy, or trusted relationships, naming and voicing our hidden experiences gives us freedom, connection, and hope.

Forgiveness:

The Misunderstood Path to Healing and Human Intimacy

Together, they examine the common misconceptions surrounding forgiveness, such as equating it with blind trust or minimizing deep pain. They clarify the distinctions between love, trust, and forgiveness, and how rebuilding trust must be an intentional and ongoing process. 

Drawing from Janis Abrahms Spring’s framework in How Can I Forgive You?, they outline four types of forgiveness:

Through this lens, they highlight the importance of emotional honesty, boundaries, and the reparative dance between the one who was hurt and the one who caused harm.

MaryAnn also introduces a reflective visualization exercise called “The Field of Grace”, inviting listeners to explore how and when to release the emotional burdens they've been carrying. Both Dr. Skinner and MaryAnn compassionately affirm that forgiveness is a process—not a moment—and that true healing often comes in unexpected ways.

This episode is a must-listen for anyone navigating the difficult terrain of relational repair, self-awareness, or trauma recovery.

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References & Resources Mentioned

From Self-Deception to Self-Trust:

Honoring Emotions After Betrayal

In this deeply moving episode, Dr. Kevin Skinner and MaryAnn Michaels are joined by special guest Jennifer Johnson, a clinical mental health counselor and expert in betrayal trauma and sex addiction recovery. Together, they explore the nuanced concept of self-deception—not as a character flaw, but as a survival response often rooted in upbringing, family systems, and emotional safety.

They discuss how many betrayed partners struggle to trust their instincts and emotions, often minimizing their experiences or denying them altogether due to social conditioning, gaslighting, or fear of the truth. The conversation highlights the importance of self-awareness, emotional identification, and self-compassion as key steps toward healing and reclaiming authenticity.

Jennifer shares powerful insights on learning to honor emotions through body awareness, identifying internalized shame, and rediscovering one’s inherent worth. Dr. Skinner closes with a formula: Self-Compassion → Self-Trust = Authenticity—emphasizing that true intimacy begins with being real, both with ourselves and others.

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 📚 Recommended Resources:

1. Books Mentioned:

2. Therapeutic Models Discussed:

3. Conference Resource:

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 💬 Assignment for Listeners:

Then, gently practice offering yourself loving kindness—the "L" in Dan Siegel’s COAL model—especially if this has been hard in the past. As Jennifer said, “You can’t heal what you can’t feel.”