Most retreat leaders aren’t just undercharging… they’re under-profiting. In this powerhouse episode of The Retreat Leaders Podcast, Shannon Jamail is joined by Leni Cavazos—event strategist, loyalty marketing expert, and former Ritz-Carlton powerhouse turned retreat business mentor.
Together, they unpack why up to 90% of retreats aren’t actually profitable—and how to shift that.
You’ll learn:
- Why retreat leaders must treat their business like a business (not a hobby)
- What loyalty marketing actually is (and how to start it from day one)
- The biggest pricing mistake even experienced leaders make
- Why your transformation container is worth way more than a fancy vacation
- How alumni can become your secret sales team
This episode is a must-listen for retreat leaders ready to stop surviving and start scaling.
🎁 Bonus: Leni shares how to get her free eBook on selling retreats to past clients.
About Leni:
Leni Cavazos is the leading authority on building 6-figure retreat businesses. With over 18 years in global marketing, brand strategy, and high-level event production, she’s behind the success of over 100 retreats worldwide. Leni teaches coaches and entrepreneurs how to scale with strategy, precision, and purpose—no guesswork, no fluff.
Free Offer: https://theretreatplanner.com/loyaltyebook
Loyalty on Repeat How to Sell Your Retreats With Past Clients Ebook
Connect with Leni: https://theretreatplanner.com/
The Retreat Leaders Podcast Resources and Links:
- Learn to Host Retreats
- Join our private Facebook Group
- Top 5 Marketing Tools Free Guide
- Get your legal docs for retreats
- Join Shannon in London
- Join our LinkedIn Group
- Apply to be a guest on our show
Thanks for tuning into the Retreat Leaders Podcast. Remember to subscribe for more insightful episodes, and visit our website for additional resources. Let’s create a vibrant retreat community together!
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Automatically Transcribed With Podsqueeze
Shannon 00:00:00 Welcome to the Retreat Leaders podcast, your sanctuary with retreat experts. Where we spill the tea on retreat success. Here we dive into crafting transformational guest experiences. Talk about how to avoid pitfalls and unlock marketing secrets. Whether you're a seasoned guru or a budding enthusiast, we've got the inside scoop for you. Join us as we learn how to flourish in this magical world of retreats. Welcome to or welcome back to the Retreat Leaders Podcast. This is Shannon, and today I'm so excited to have a fellow retreat professional on the podcast today. Our paths have definitely crossed in different ways, and now we get to connect in person, sort of. We'll say sort of because we are recording on zoom. But welcome, Lenny to the show.
Leni 00:00:45 Thank you so much for having me. Shannon, I'm so excited to be able to talk more about retreats.
Shannon 00:00:50 Me too. I mean, anytime I get to get with another professional and talk business, it's like, I don't know, Christmas. It's just so, so fun.
Shannon 00:00:58 So, This is Lenny Cavazos, and I want you to first just start off by telling us about yourself. What brought you to this space? I don't know, just a little bit about who you are.
Leni 00:01:08 Oh, yes. Of course. So I started actually in the space of events many, many, many years ago. I started when I was 16 years old working at events, and it was absolutely amazing. I love being in person with people because of the connection that you can create. And that led me actually to move to the Middle East. I was living in Dubai for six years, and I was working at the Ritz-Carlton, where I rebranded nine restaurants and the spa, and I made it snow in the desert. And it was absolutely wonderful. And one of the pieces that actually is going to be very big in our conversation today is loyalty marketing. So after I was at the Ritz-Carlton, I actually moved to Marriott's corporate office for Middle Eastern Africa, and I was working in a team that launched Marriott Bonvoy.
Leni 00:01:54 So for those who do not know what Marriott Bonvoy is, it's a loyalty program for people to who stay at Marriott hotels. Basically, the more you stay at their hotels, the more the rewards you get. From free breakfast to room upgrades to invitations to crazy, crazy events. And I was in charge of running some of those crazy, crazy events for loyal customers. So I hosted a dinner in front of the Giza pyramids, at dinner in the Summer Palace of the King of Saudi Arabia, and it was a private concert for Craig, David, you name it. But the main focus of this was really to create connection with our customers, because loyal customers spend 67% more than non loyal customers. Now, when the pandemic hit and everything changed, I was trapped in my apartment on the 52nd floor with a beautiful view, but I could not leave unless I had a permission slip from the police. And that was the moment where I decided I wanted to do something different. I was like, I do not want people making decisions for myself.
Leni 00:02:58 So I move myself back to Mexico, my hometown, and I actually started attending retreats. Right. So something that brings me, I guess, a little bit out of a lot of other retreat coaches into this space is that a lot of coaches started because they were hosting retreats, and then they start teaching how to host your own treats. My story was not like that. I started attending retreats that changed my life, and then I started creating connections with those retreat leaders. And there was this very specific retreat for women that I attended that literally changed who I was, my life. It got me to reconnect with my femininity. It was just beautiful. So at the end of the retreat, I asked them, so when is the next one I want to bring my mom, my friends. And they were like, no, we're not having a next one because we didn't even break even. How is this possible? You had 13 women at your retreat. And then I realized there was a big problem in the transformational world.
Leni 00:03:59 And because I. Yeah, you know what I'm talking about, right?
Shannon 00:04:04 Yes.
Leni 00:04:06 And then, because I am very curious, I couldn't help myself. And I started interviewing retreat leaders to figure out what was going on out there, to figure out what was the missing link from creating transformation, serving people, to actually running your retreats like a business?
Shannon 00:04:23 Yes.
Leni 00:04:25 Big, big difference. So after interviewing over 100 retreat leaders and I keep doing a lot of market research as I go, I've started this over five years ago. I can tell you that over 70% of retreat leaders do not profit from their retreats. And that's just so sad.
Shannon 00:04:41 I would guess, to be quite honest with you, that it's even higher than that. I really would, I would, I would guess it's closer to 80 or 90% based on the people that I talked to as well. So and it is it's absolutely to me it's devastating, but it's also such a disservice.
Leni 00:04:57 Yes, I always tell them, like, do you want to go back to your 9 to 5 job instead of actually doing what you're meant to be doing in the world, because you don't treat your business like a business and you treat it like a hobby, you know, I'm here to serve, and it doesn't matter if I don't make any money.
Leni 00:05:13 And the reality is that retreats takes so much time and effort and energy, and there's so transformational. Like people change their lives when they go to retreats. Why wouldn't you also profit from it?
Shannon 00:05:24 I totally, totally agree with you. this is you're speaking my language on so many levels. I struggle greatly with anybody who's in this industry and and saying, you know, that they're either a not making a profit, that they don't want to make a profit. That's somebody who just is like, okay, we're not even in the same we're not even in the same city, let alone, you know. Yeah, yeah. That's just not even whatever. because you do you get a lot of that language in this, in this business, in this industry of like profits are evil or money is evil or any kind of bullshit like that. I just don't play that game. but then the flip side of that part is they just don't know how to run a business, right? So there's the attitude and you can't fix attitude.
Shannon 00:06:07 They've got to figure that part out. They've got to do them inner work. They've got to figure out what their money obstacles are, whatever that is. The other part of it is they just don't know how to make a profit. And that can be fixed, right? That can be learned. That can be taught. and it sounds like that's something that you help people do.
Leni 00:06:25 Yeah. So for me, it's all about like like my core messaging is like sold out and profitable. And the reason it's like, and I don't even really, really like I'm not like your retreat does not need to be sold out to be profitable, but you do want to be able to sell. And a lot of people lack sales skills. And it doesn't mean that you need to have these more like phone marketing person getting angry at you because you don't buy from them, right? And we have a misconception that selling is an act of service and that you're taking away from people if you do not offer your services.
Shannon 00:07:03 Yeah, there's a lot of misconceptions about selling. and it's it's it's unfortunate, but it's fixable. as long as somebody is willing to open up their mindset, one of the things that you mentioned right at the beginning, and I know it's the topic that we really want to focus on today, because I think you and I could talk about things for hours and hours. but one of the main things that I'm really excited to chat about is loyalty marketing. And I know that you have a lot of experience in loyalty marketing. and I'm really passionate about it, so I'm super excited to delve into that part, which also aligns with sales, because there's absolutely a sales process in there. But let's talk about that. Talk to me about the importance of loyalty marketing and how it can really help you grow your business.
Leni 00:07:46 Well, first I would like to start by saying what loyalty marketing means for those who might not be aware of the concept because it's a very, very simple concept. Loyalty marketing is customer relationship management.
Leni 00:08:00 That's what it means. It's how you manage the relationships with your customers. So they want to come back. They want to buy from you again. At the end of the day, it's all about creating connections. It's about creating this rapport, building like know and trust. So they're like, if they have to decide, am I going to this retreat or this other retreat? It's a no brainer. So loyalty marketing is very, very powerful. And for me, it's my favorite type of marketing because it's all about building relationships. It's about nurturing those relationships that exist and not nurturing the future ones. Now, a lot of people might consider that loyalty marketing starts the moment they purchase something from you, and then you resell them. But for me, loyalty marketing starts from the moment someone becomes aware that you exist.
Shannon 00:08:54 Hey, retreat leaders, pause that retreat planning for just a second, because I've got something you do not want to miss. I'm headed to London this October to host a live event that's all about teaching you how to host a retreat that's not just transformational, but actually profitable.
Shannon 00:09:09 Imagine sipping tea or champagne with other like minded leaders while mapping out your next sold out retreat. It's happening at the gorgeous Waldorf Hilton in London. I'm spilling all the secrets from pricing to planning, marketing to mindset, and you'll walk away with a strategy you can actually use. No fluff, no BS, just results. So head to Retreat Mastermind training and come join me across the pond. That's interesting. I'm glad that we're bringing it up that way, because in my brain, loyalty marketing is nurturing the relationships I already have. So, for instance, I have what I call an alumni group. These are people who've all attended one of my retreats over the last 15 years. And so my alumni is like who I consider loyalty marketing. They've. But by the way, loyalty marketing can be whatever we decide it's going to be. But that's like for me, it's like my alumni, they get a special code, they get special extras, they get a special gift bag when they come. It's kind of like if you've ever been on a Disney cruise, you're your second cruise.
Shannon 00:10:12 You get like special things left on your bed, your third cruise you get it gets elevated each time you attend a cruise, like your goodies get elevated, your access gets elevated, everything gets elevated. And that's the kind of the same thing that we do for our alumni group is that it gets elevated. And then every other year we have an alumni only retreat like no one else can come unless you've been an alumni. And that is a pure party recognition. Surprises, like, it's just an absolute blast. and so that's where my brain went with loyalty marketing. So I'm really excited because I do understand, though, this concept of as soon as there's a connection point of any way. That also could be loyalty marketing.
Leni 00:10:51 Yes. So your regular way to see loyalty marketing would be they purchased, then they repurchased and they repurchased. And the more they purchased, the higher the benefits they get. And this is like the core concept in a way. And that's why there is a lot of memberships.
Leni 00:11:08 And then you get points, right. A loyalty marketing program that anyone can relate with is Starbucks, right? The more coffees you get, the more rewards you get. Right. You get free coffee and then more and more and more and more and more. So that is the way. But and that's the when the moment when you get I would say when someone repurchases from you like and we call it retention. Right. So when someone stays with you, that's for the moment where you see the benefits and reap the benefits of all your loyalty marketing efforts, but that does not mean that you do not begin the relationship and nurturing them to become loyal customers before that. The way. I don't know if you want to share something.
Shannon 00:11:49 No, no, I was just going to say I love that idea in that concept. Because as soon as they've had any kind of touchpoint, it is time to nurture that relationship.
Leni 00:11:57 Exactly. So I like to see it in a very simple way. So when someone becomes aware of us on a social media post, on an ad, on a podcast episode, we are creating a one sided relationship.
Leni 00:12:11 We're putting out content and that other person is consuming it. And then from that moment, they will decide if they like you or they don't. As simple as that. They're like, oh, I want to see more of this person or I'm not really that interested. So if you lose them from the beginning, then they're not your potential clients anymore. They left the pool, right? They left your funnel everything out. It's out of there, right? They're not in your space anymore. So nurturing loyalty, marketing from the beginning, even for people who do mini purchases, right? Like, I send sometimes private messages to people who buy like a product is $17. And I send messages to check. Hey, did you receive my my loyalty book? How was it? What was the biggest learning that you received? Sometimes people will answer, sometimes people won't. And it's okay. I don't do it because I'm expecting an answer. I am doing it because I'm building relationships from an e-book that is free, because I care about these people who want to host retreats, who want people to come back to the retreats, who want to have profitable retreats.
Leni 00:13:24 And because I care, I show up and I show up in different levels of proximity. Right? And this is and I know maybe I'm talking a little bit in the technical space sometimes. So for those who are you listening, I hope it's clear enough. But different layers of proximity, right? So when someone comes, let's say to your book they might get an email from you or your assistant. And that's kind of it. It stays in that's in that realm, right? That's the amount of proximity that you're getting with them. Then later on, if they buy one of your courses, right, one of your programs, then maybe they're in live zoom sessions with you. So they get at a different level of proximity. The relationship that you're building has more touchpoints. And then let's say someone then comes to your retreat. But because they were on your group program, then they get a one on one session with you. Shannon.
Shannon 00:14:22 Right.
Leni 00:14:22 And higher level of proximity and then on and on and on.
Leni 00:14:29 But we can begin our journey to create loyal customers from the beginning. For example, my podcast, How to Run Profitable Retreats. I have a lot of loyal customers that if I don't post an episode on the week, they will send me an email and be like, Laney, did something happen?
Shannon 00:14:48 I love that.
Leni 00:14:50 And it's because it's a one sided conversation that then becomes there is a place where they respond, but we do not want to start just nurturing relationships. Once they bought we want. Yeah, from the beginning.
Shannon 00:15:07 I totally, totally, totally love this. one of the things I've talked about on one of my previous shows was we spend a lot of time in this industry, marketing, marketing, being throwing a lot of content out. Well, hopefully you are. Hopefully you're throwing content out, and it's good content, and it's valuable content and it is speaking the language to the proper audience. So hopefully you're doing that. And then the retreat leader is thinking, well, that's selling.
Shannon 00:15:33 I just threw a bunch of information out. But it's not. That's marketing. Selling is anybody who's interacted with that information. You then follow up with them and you start what you're talking about, which is the the nurturing a relationship. It's this or as you will, loyalty marketing even. But it's really nurturing a relationship and it starts the minute there is a connection, a true connection. I also love that you said if they drop out, they're not your people. That's so important to me, Lenny, because I'm all about attracting the audience that you align with. And that's not everybody. Like, not everybody is going to listen to my podcast and be like, oh, that's the person I want to, you know, hear or be in the room with or whatever. Like, they're not they're not going to like how I talk or how I believe or, or how I run my business. That's okay. I want to attract the people who align with me. Maybe I challenge them. Challenging is fine, but alignment with that as well.
Shannon 00:16:30 And so I love that you're like some people will just drop off. We're not chasing the ones that are dropping off. I'm not a big believer of that. We don't go chasing people who are dropping off. That means it's not a fit. No problem. I wish them well on the next journey that they find the right fit with. but yeah, I love this whole concept of, you know, really making sure that we nurture that relationship at that first touch point. And I know for a fact and I know you know this too. It's not happening in our industry. We're just putting information out there and then doing nothing else with it, and then sitting back and going, well, my retreats not feeling.
Leni 00:17:07 Yes, like. But I posted on Facebook groups and no one replied to me.
Shannon 00:17:12 Yes, that.
Leni 00:17:15 Right. Yeah. Everyone talks about the, you know, the the post, the post and pray kind of thing. Right? And it is so important in these, in this industry to understand that we need to run our business like a business, like when I was going through a lot of these interviews, a lot of people were like, well, as long as it pays for my trip.
Shannon 00:17:35 Oh God, please don't say that.
Leni 00:17:38 I was like, what?
Shannon 00:17:40 No, I.
Leni 00:17:41 Just might as well just go on your trip on your own. Find the money somewhere else.
Shannon 00:17:45 Oh, my gosh, that's way less of a headache. That's way less work. And oh my gosh. Yeah. So this I get super, super worked up about because it does a disservice to everybody else in the industry who is wanting to make an impact and an income. And they can be done at the same time. They're not exclusive an impact and an income. And the transformation that you talked about that's happening on retreats. I'm not talking about a weekend vacation, which that's fine. Those are fun. I'm talking about a retreat where there is a promise. There's a promise that's going to be answered at the end of that retreat. A problem solved, a transformation is going to happen. Those are priceless. And they're worth a lot. They're worth your energy. They're worth your time. They're worth your experience.
Shannon 00:18:28 They're worth so many things. And people get it so confused and they think, well, it's just, you know, I only, you know, I'm at the retreat from these days to these days. And I get to travel. No no no no. It's so much more than even the time on the retreat. It's everything you've experienced in your life. All the education, all the experience that brought you to this point to host the retreat that also has value. And so, yeah, I get really worked up when people are like, well, I just hope it pays for my vacation or my trip. And I'm like, what the. We are not on the same page.
Leni 00:18:58 We're not. But like, there's a couple of things that I want to bring here into the conversation that you mentioned. First of all, I truly believe that you're not meant to be a cup of tea. You're meant to be a glass of champagne.
Shannon 00:19:10 That means you're not on.
Shannon 00:19:12 Hold on. You're speaking my language.
Shannon 00:19:14 I don't know if it'll show up because I have it all blocked out.
Shannon 00:19:17 But anyway, it's a it's a Veuve Clicquot.
Shannon 00:19:21 Bottle that's been custom painted for me that sits on my desk because that's been my favorite champagne for over ten years. And I might have butchered the name a little bit just now, but, that is like. I am a fine glass of champagne. So yes. Please continue.
Leni 00:19:37 I also have a big like, you know, the big, big bottles of champagne in my drawer. And it has a glass cover because it's it's specifically for once I reach a specific goal. So it's there.
Shannon 00:19:50 Waiting. Get it girl.
Leni 00:19:52 Yeah. So when we're not, when we're not trying to be liked by everyone because honestly, it's impossible. It's easier for us to understand. Where do we come from? Who do we serve? And this leads me to the space of, like, once where, like, there's a lot of, like, retreats that are a little bit on the generic side, let's call it like that.
Leni 00:20:13 And you're, I call it like swimming with sardines. You're a sardine and you're with a bunch of other sardines. So there's nothing that makes you stand out and make you different. And people want things that are different in their lives. And then because of that you can have retreats are very very specialized. So an example that is also very connected to what you mentioned about the value of attending a retreat. Right. Because the value and for me retreats are priceless. Because in one moment your life can change.
Shannon 00:20:46 Yeah.
Leni 00:20:47 It's really containers for deep, fast transformation.
Shannon 00:20:50 Yeah.
Leni 00:20:51 To use this example that I love using is if someone needs to get divorced in California, in average, you will spend $250,000 plus all the energy, the relationship, maybe the therapists. If you have kids, you know all this pieces. But if you actually went to a retreat that could save your marriage or make you have an amicable divorce so you don't spend $250,000, what is it worth to you? The the mindset of your kids, the having to go back out on dating, having to date again.
Leni 00:21:31 Right. What is it worth it. And I attended a couples retreat by myself. One was funny, and the reality is that it was a therapist, and it was all about relationships and couples. And they asked one of the attendees, right. The guy, why are you here? And he said, because this is cheaper than divorce. That's literally what he said. Guess what? They're still married. They had another kid and now they have, like, four kids. They're still married. This one retreat was worth saving and marriage. And we undervalue ourselves because we think that if we price ourselves slow, then people, more people will say yes. And the reality is that it costs you the same amount of money, effort and time to get one person to pay you $1,000, then $10,000. Now, I'm not saying just go and raise up your prices without any foundations, but really look inwards And it's not about your self-worth because your self-worth changes every day. One day I wake up and I feel amazing and I'm worth $3 million, and the next day I might not be in the same space.
Leni 00:22:39 So it's not about self-worth. It's about the worth of the work that you do. What are you an expert on? What can you do to help other people change their lives? Right. One big problem. One big solution. That's it. And then really running your business like a business and then maintaining and nurturing those relationships. And this brings us back to loyalty marketing. Because if someone comes to your retreat and then they don't get divorced, but then there is no connection, there is no follow up, there is no integration afterwards. Then all the effort, all the money that was paid for that retreat might be lost. So creating these spaces for connection. Like I can tell you, because I nurture my relationships with my clients. We know in the retreat space, not everyone is ready to host retreats at that moment in their journey. They might need certain things, you know, certain boxes to tick. They might need more confidence. They might need more expertise. But there is this dream, right? The dream of hosting a retreat.
Leni 00:23:48 But because I nurture my relationships and I bring loyalty marketing into every single thing that I do. Because for me, it's part of who I am. It's not. It's not even a separate concept. It's me. Right? I bring that into everything that I do. I get people who show up back in my space three years later and they're like, Now I'm ready to hire you. Now I'm ready to come to your retreat. Those clients would have been lost if I was just like, well, they don't want to buy.
Shannon 00:24:18 Yeah.
Shannon 00:24:20 Yeah. No, this is so good. This is really hitting on a lot of different things, but especially this loyalty piece of of really continuing that nurturing relationships. Listen, retreat leaders really nurturing that relationship that somebody has already attended one of your retreats especially. But like Lenny said, at any touch point, but these ones that have already attended your retreat, there's a thing called cost of acquisition. The cost of acquisition for this person now to attend with you or to rebook with you, is so low compared to getting someone to come on a retreat that hasn't been on a retreat.
Shannon 00:24:57 Not only that, but that person who's attended your retreat now is a form of marketing for your retreats, right? They're the ones that's going to share your retreats. They can, do a testimonial video. There's like, so many different ways they can leave a Google review or a Yelp review or Facebook review or whatever it is that you use, or all of them. but they are another tool in your marketing for you that you don't even have to pay for. It was already paid, right? It's already paid for. But the cost of acquisition for working with someone you've already worked with is minimal compared to attracting new business to come in, so it's kind of twofold. Lenny, what we're talking about here is, is nurturing that relationship. As soon as they start with you, whatever it is, it's a like it's a comment. It's a response, it's a DM. It's, you know, whatever a phone call, an email, whatever that is nurturing from that point on, unless they drop off, which is totally fine.
Shannon 00:25:53 And then also continuing that relationship, even after you've done business with with them in a very special and intentional way with those that have already done business with you. So I'm loving this so much and you can get so creative in so many ways.
Leni 00:26:09 Yes, like once we wrote 200 personalized cards for people who show up for our events. Guess what? I got emails saying thank you so much for this experience. Can I come next year?
Shannon 00:26:20 Okay, I have to tell a story. This is so funny. so my team and I, spent several weeks mailing out a tiny, tiny little cute card that inside the card had a, an intentional card with it and a little note. And I mailed it out to every one of my alumni. Okay. For the past 15 years, it took us weeks. I highly suggest before you do some shit like that, that you know what the dimensions are of your country, of what you're sending. Because I've lived in the US my whole life, and I didn't know that.
Shannon 00:26:56 It has to be a certain size. It cannot be too small like it has to be a certain size. And so I got hundreds of them returned. And I just laugh about it now because it was like Shannon and I did this whole video that I shared with my alumni. Like, if you didn't get this little card, it probably was returned to me. And it will be in your mailbox soon. But it was just so funny because it was like, I loved it. And the people that received it loved it. And yet, you know, I had to laugh at the fact that I didn't research it well enough. But the point being is you've got to nurture your people, like especially the ones that have shown up. You know, you really you really do. I have special events for mine. They get a special discount code. I don't do discounts. I'm not a discount person at all. But I do allow my alumni to have a special code just for them. For any of my future retreats.
Shannon 00:27:45 I do just I give them special gifts. It's just. It's just a thing. I kind of love how you talked about like the Starbucks thing, although we are all so much better than Starbucks. But, you know, it's that whole it's like a reward system, you know, you trust me with your time, which to me is even more valuable than money. But you trust me with your time. And each time you do that with me, I want to really help you, really help you see and feel how much that means to me and to reward you for that. And so I just love this whole concept of loyalty marketing, and I hope to hear from the audience on some ideas of what they do for loyalty marketing, whether it's for someone they haven't worked with or someone they have worked with because they're kind of two different tracks, but on similar, train tracks. and so I would love to hear about that. So, Lenny, I love this conversation. Thank you so much for coming on the show and sharing.
Leni 00:28:38 Oh, no, it's my pleasure. I really, truly believe that once we really create connections with people, nothing can stop us. And I love your story about, you know, sometimes like the little details. But imagine, like the people I receive, like Christmas cards from friends in the US every year. And then when I get them, I can't wait to see them. They have a little bit of like a letter that says what's been going on in the year for them. And every single year I'm just waiting for that card to show up in my mail because it creates this connection. It's about it's about caring for people. Yeah. And there's so many different ways and how what you how you can do it. And the last thing I would like to add here is like, I love that you brought cost of acquisition into the conversation because majority of the people in the coaching transformational space do not know their cost of acquiring a client. They think that having ads and what they cost to get their person to sign up from ads is the cost of acquisition.
Leni 00:29:40 And there's so many different layers, and we're going to like, keep that maybe for a different, separate conversation. But it's very important for people to understand that retention rates when it comes to retreats inside of the retreat, and that does not mean you tell them about your next retreat or your offer one minute before the retreat is over, you need to plan for it, right? There is a marketing and the psychology on the sales process while you do it, but the retention rate of people attending a retreat is between 50 to 70%. That is massive. They're already there. They're your captive audience. They just changed their lives. And you help them?
Shannon 00:30:22 Yep. Oh my gosh, I love this. I love it so much. Well, Lenny also has a free gift for you. She's got an e-book that is called Loyalty on Repeat How to Sell Your Retreats with Past Clients. So that link will be in the show notes. Please grab that e-book and also jump on her podcast, which will also be linked in the show notes.
Shannon 00:30:40 So. Lenny, thank you so much. We will definitely have to do a part two and dive more into business analytics. Some people might like their eyes might cross and they might break out in a sweat. But the truth is, is part of owning a business and running it as a business. And we are not here to play small. We are here to play big. So thanks again, Lenny. I so appreciate you.
Leni 00:31:00 Thank you for having me.
Shannon 00:31:03 Thanks for listening to The Retreat Leader's podcast. Learn more at the Retreat. Com. See you next time.
